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If there's one country the world shouldn't trust with that stockpile of weapons, it would the country that has bombed and strafed 10 countries in the past 20 years..
I sometimes think we should have the keys taken away for a month or two..
Especially with the complete absence of ingenuity that our leaders have shown on Syria.
I don't have a problem with USA or Israel having these weapons.
I have a big problem with some crazy Middle Eastern Regimes having them.
Not surprised you have no problems with the US or Israel blowing up the world. What Hypocrisy!
I don't have a problem with USA or Israel having these weapons.
I have a big problem with some crazy Middle Eastern Regimes having them.
Not surprised you have no problems with the US or Israel blowing up the world. What Hypocrisy!
The problem is that crazed Middle Eastern Islamists and terrorists already have access or could gain access to these weapons and you can see the result! they are already slaughtering each other with them!
Unfortunately, your sympathies, as always, are with the terrorists and therefore you are not an objective commentator.
The hypocrisy lies in your one-sided view point, which always sympathises with the terrorists.
Not surprised you have no problems with the US or Israel blowing up the world. What Hypocrisy!
The problem is that crazed Middle Eastern Islamists and terrorists already have access or could gain access to these weapons and you can see the result! they are already slaughtering each other with them!
Unfortunately, your sympathies, as always, are with the terrorists and therefore you are not an objective commentator.
The hypocrisy lies in your one-sided view point, which always sympathises with the terrorists.
What I see is the US has caused suffering and death to millions with chemical weapons, and I do not see Syria or any other nation doing that.
you might learn a thing or two!
Why don't you prove which Syrian rebels tried to kill "their own people" before you wander off half-cocked into a star-spangled salute to the humanitarian consequences dioxins contributed to the heroic US invasion of South Vietnam?There is an enormous difference between suffering after-effects from a defoliant which is intended to kill plant-life, and using sarin-gas, which is intended to kill human life.
Did the United States know that Agent Orange (and Blue, and whatever) had a high toxicity rate and a high ultimate mortality rate, at the time of their use (1961-1971)?
Hell, we were using DDT here in the US for decades, until the government eventually discovered and confirmed its toxicity and long-term effects.
There is also an enormous difference in intent.
The US intended to kill-off jungle-growth and enemy crops.
The effects upon human beings took months or years to manifest in full.
The Syrians intended to kill-off their own rebellious people.
The effects upon human beings took mere seconds after contact.
That sort of faux analogy just won't cut it.
I don't have a problem with USA or Israel having these weapons.
I have a big problem with some crazy Middle Eastern Regimes having them.
Not surprised you have no problems with the US or Israel blowing up the world. What Hypocrisy!
The problem is that crazed Middle Eastern Islamists and terrorists already have access or could gain access to these weapons and you can see the result! they are already slaughtering each other with them!
Unfortunately, your sympathies, as always, are with the terrorists and therefore you are not an objective commentator.
The hypocrisy lies in your one-sided view point, which always sympathises with the terrorists.
"The fact nations and government officials may seemingly never be held responsible for their war crimes does not make them any less the war crimes they are..."
You still haven't provided any proof of the Assad Regime's barbaric use of Sarin nerve gas against its own people, why is that?Was Agent Orange classified as a Chemical Weapon, in violation of Treaty, at the time of its use (1961-1971)?"...The Chemical Weapons Treaty makes none of these distinctions, all it requires is using a chemical as a weapon against people. That is all it takes. And when people are hurt and killed in these substantial numbers we are addressing, they obviously have been targeted with chemical weapons."
After all, it was developed in the 1940s, and there was a good 18-28 years between the time of its development and early (and publicly-known) domestic usages and its first use as a foliage and crop-destroying agent, so the International Community had plenty of time in which to classify it as a Chemical Weapon...
Is Agent Orange classified as a Chemical Weapon today, officially, in the context of the Treaty?
And, as to 'targeting people', you are incorrect...
It can be proven that the US utilized the agent to clear-away jungle canopies and undergrowth that had been providing cover for enemy troop movements...
It can be proven that the US utilized the agent to damage or destroy enemy crops, as a strategic initiative...
Given that a great many of our own military personnel (veterans) were afflicted by illness attributable to that agent, and that the government, after some initial resistance in the 1970s and 1980s, is providing for the care of such afflicted individuals, at great expense, in order to set things right...
Given that the Vietnamese had initially claimed highly unrealistic figures for the number of people who died or were made ill, and, given that once those numbers had been brought down out of the clouds and verification procedures put into place that satisfied both sides, and given that the US government has been generous in its compensation for such victims, in order to set things right...
Something tells me that the use of Agent Orange - a herbicide that had been in use on a smaller scale since the middle 1940s - was not intended as a Chemical Attack upon People, rather, it was simply a mistake to use so potent a herbicide, because it might end-up harming people, as well...
I wonder if the same thing can be said about the Assad Regime, and sarin gas, and their motives, or, for that matter, their intention to compensate their victims and to provide for their care?
Yer beatin' a dead horse with this one, Sherri...
Trying to draw substantive equivalencies between US utilization of Agent Orange and the Assad Regime's use of sarin gas?
And, if your perspective is so doggone operative in the Real World, why have we not been serious and substantive charges of Treaty Violations by the United States, in the UN, etc., in connection with Agent Orange usage?
I'll tell you why...
Because those banging the drum loudest against the US in this matter are Russians and European and American Leftists...
And because formal charges would never get past first base in either the UN or the Hague...
The US might be able to squash proceedings or get a verdict overturned...
But the US cannot stop such charges being filed and publicized...
And I haven't seen any of THAT, either, although I could certainly have missed something over the years.
Why have such charges not been filed at that level?
Because those charges (that the US intentionally used Chemical Weapons against people) in the Vietnam-Agent Orange context are patently false...
The same (unintentional, because they did not understand all its after-effects) cannot be said of the Assad Regime, in its barbaric use of sarin nerve-gas against its own people...
No sale...
There is an enormous difference between suffering after-effects from a defoliant which is intended to kill plant-life, and using sarin-gas, which is intended to kill human life.
Did the United States know that Agent Orange (and Blue, and whatever) had a high toxicity rate and a high ultimate mortality rate, at the time of their use (1961-1971)?
Hell, we were using DDT here in the US for decades, until the government eventually discovered and confirmed its toxicity and long-term effects.
There is also an enormous difference in intent.
The US intended to kill-off jungle-growth and enemy crops.
The effects upon human beings took months or years to manifest in full.
The Syrians intended to kill-off their own rebellious people.
The effects upon human beings took mere seconds after contact.
That sort of faux analogy just won't cut it.
Why don't you prove which Syrian rebels tried to kill 'their own people' before you wander off half-cocked into a star-spangled salute to the humanitarian consequences...
Still haven't found proof of Assad's foreknowledge and intent to "kill his own people" with Sarin gas? Here's an easier one: Greatest purveyor of violence on the planet, Syria or USA?There is an enormous difference between suffering after-effects from a defoliant which is intended to kill plant-life, and using sarin-gas, which is intended to kill human life.
Did the United States know that Agent Orange (and Blue, and whatever) had a high toxicity rate and a high ultimate mortality rate, at the time of their use (1961-1971)?
Hell, we were using DDT here in the US for decades, until the government eventually discovered and confirmed its toxicity and long-term effects.
There is also an enormous difference in intent.
The US intended to kill-off jungle-growth and enemy crops.
The effects upon human beings took months or years to manifest in full.
The Syrians intended to kill-off their own rebellious people.
The effects upon human beings took mere seconds after contact.
That sort of faux analogy just won't cut it.
Why don't you prove which Syrian rebels tried to kill 'their own people' before you wander off half-cocked into a star-spangled salute to the humanitarian consequences...
Who said anything about Syrian Rebels?
I was talking about the Assad Regime.
As to 'star-spangled salute to the humanitarian consequences'...
I have no clue what you are trying to get-at...
I also have the sense that YOU have no clue what you are trying to get-at, either...
So it's all good...
As to dioxins in Vietnam...
Thank you for the link to the 'dioxin' write-up...
Very informative...
Now, tell us how...
1. this applies to the US utilization of Agent Orange in Vietnam
2. this proves that the US knew its long-term effects would prove so harmful.
3. this proves that the US intentionally used it as a long-term anti-personnel weapon rather than as a defoliant.
Because I'm just not seeing it.
Then again, I don't have your Rabid Anti-American Spleen to Vent, either...
Never mind dealing with you dodging some of the points raised earlier about Foreknowledge and Intent...
First, you ask me to produce proof that the Syrian Rebels used the gas..."...You still haven't provided any proof of the Assad Regime's barbaric use of Sarin nerve gas against its own people, why is that?"
I'm not so sure...First, you ask me to produce proof that the Syrian Rebels used the gas..."...You still haven't provided any proof of the Assad Regime's barbaric use of Sarin nerve gas against its own people, why is that?"
Next, you ask me to produce proof that the Syrian Government used the gas...
I have no proof for either...
Frankly, I'm not entirely convinced that the gas attacks even happened...
Our Administration sure-as-hell hasn't produced anything concrete and substantive to show us...
Whatever in the world makes you think that I believe otherwise?
We are both dealing in hypotheticals... I, in accusing the Syrian Regime of gassing its own people, as counterpoint to your own hypothetical, in accusing the US of intentionally deploying Agent Orange as an anti-personnel weapon rather than as a defoliant...
I have been operating all along under the impression that this (the two of us operating with hypotheticals) was glaringly obvious...
Perhaps I was wrong...
So tell us, Georgie Boy, how many times are you going to post the same article on these forums like you found gold. Instead of vomiting out the same stuff, start writing Letters to the Editors of all the local newspapers in the Los Angeles County and the surrounding counties giving your opinion and millions of people will be able to read you. Or is that effort too difficult for you and it is much easier and lazier for you to just post the same old stuff you find over and over?"Watching the propaganda effort underway in the West, especially the United States, it is Deja vu all over again.It's amusing how Georgie Boy entertains himself with these forums since there is nothing else going on in his life, but one would think that he would at least make the effort to send Letters to the Editors of his local newspapers since more people would see his stuff than on these forums. Here is one from the Los Angeles Daily News which you could answer Georgie Boy. You can call this letter writer a Slave to Obama and then see what responses you get. In fact, you can keep an eye out for all the Letters to the Editors in all the newspapers of Los Angeles County and have a good time spending the day answering those you feel like and millions of citizens will see your letters."Are You Ready to Go to War for Bibi Netanyahu and the Saudis?
By Larry Johnson on September 8, 2013 at 12:30 AM in Current Affairs
Strange bedfellows indeed. Bibi Netanyahu, with the full throated backing of the American Israeli Political Action Committee, and the Saudis have mounted an impressive, coordinated effort to push the United States into moving against Syria as a means of weakening Iran. Important to note, key Israeli intelligence and military leaders are against this.
Are you ready, Slave?
Are You Ready to Go to War for Bibi Netanyahu and the Saudis? : NO QUARTER USA NET
Let’s not forget Obama took out Osama bin Laden: Letters
Lets not forget Obama took out Osama bin LadenRe Nothing surprising about Obamas indecisiveness (Letters, Sept. 3):The anti-Obama letter writer who said there is nothing surprising about Obamas indecisiveness regarding Syria, and dismissed the president as nothing more than a community organizer, conveniently forgets one important fact. It was Obama who made the tough decision to take out Osama bin Laden...
"Following the Bush blueprint of repeating the mantra of Saddam, WMDs and 9-11 to justify going to war against Iraq, the Obama playbook is using the specter of dead children, WMDS in the hands of terrorists and Iran run amuck to try to scare the American public into doing the same stupid thing.
The Saudis and the Netanyahu crowd are pushing this desperate line and the Obama Administration is going along with the charade.
"Obama repeats this nonsense without pausing to acknowledge the absurd inconsistencies in his position. Take the WMD issue. At present, Syrias military retains tight control over the stockpiles of Chemical weapons.
"The rebels fighting the Syria Government have been kept at bay, so far. And Obamas solution? Degrade the Syrian military, which means a higher likelihood that those chemical weapons depots would fall into the hands of the Syria Islamic jihadists eager to oust Bashir Assad and create their own version Sharia rule.
"Yeah, thats a great plan."
Are You Ready to Go to War for Bibi Netanyahu and the Saudis? : NO QUARTER USA NET
UN rights council says Syria gas attack videos, photos fake: Russia. Russia says the United Nations Human Rights Council (HRC) has confirmed that the videos and photos purporting to show the victims of a chemical attack near the Syrian capital, Damascus, were fabricated. PressTV - UN rights council says Syria gas attack videos, photos fake: Russia
UN rights council says Syria gas attack videos, photos fake: Russia. Russia says the United Nations Human Rights Council (HRC) has confirmed that the videos and photos purporting to show the victims of a chemical attack near the Syrian capital, Damascus, were fabricated. PressTV - UN rights council says Syria gas attack videos, photos fake: Russia
Another source that you have used many times, "the group Human Rights Watch issued a report that said evidence strongly implies that Syrian government troops' firing of rockets containing a nerve agent into a Damascus suburb on August 21 that the U.S. said killed over 1,400 people...The report does not rely on ambiguous intercepted phone calls. It cites no shadowy intelligence gathering. Instead, HRW's experts take a close look at witness statements and photographs and video of the victims and -- above all -- the remains of the weapons that appear to have been used. The report includes a map that identifies two attack sites -- the rebel-held suburbs of Zamalka and Moadimiyeh. Each was hit with at least 4 to 8 rockets.
HRW experts have identified, from multiple pictures sent by local activists, two kinds of rockets. One kind -- 170mm or about 7 inches in diameter -- appears to have been used in all strikes on Zamalka. And another kind -- a much-larger 330 mm (about 15 inches around) -- in all the strikes on Moadimiyeh. This would suggest that two separate military units were involved, each firing a barrage of rockets."
Rights group's report offers compelling evidence of Syria chemical attack - CBS News
"Strange bedfellows indeed. Bibi Netanyahu, with the full throated backing of the American Israeli Political Action Committee, and the Saudis have mounted an impressive, coordinated effort to push the United States into moving against Syria as a means of weakening Iran. Important to note, key Israeli intelligence and military leaders are against this."So tell us, Georgie Boy, how many times are you going to post the same article on these forums like you found gold. Instead of vomiting out the same stuff, start writing Letters to the Editors of all the local newspapers in the Los Angeles County and the surrounding counties giving your opinion and millions of people will be able to read you. Or is that effort too difficult for you and it is much easier and lazier for you to just post the same old stuff you find over and over?"Watching the propaganda effort underway in the West, especially the United States, it is Deja vu all over again.It's amusing how Georgie Boy entertains himself with these forums since there is nothing else going on in his life, but one would think that he would at least make the effort to send Letters to the Editors of his local newspapers since more people would see his stuff than on these forums. Here is one from the Los Angeles Daily News which you could answer Georgie Boy. You can call this letter writer a Slave to Obama and then see what responses you get. In fact, you can keep an eye out for all the Letters to the Editors in all the newspapers of Los Angeles County and have a good time spending the day answering those you feel like and millions of citizens will see your letters.
Let’s not forget Obama took out Osama bin Laden: Letters
Lets not forget Obama took out Osama bin LadenRe Nothing surprising about Obamas indecisiveness (Letters, Sept. 3):The anti-Obama letter writer who said there is nothing surprising about Obamas indecisiveness regarding Syria, and dismissed the president as nothing more than a community organizer, conveniently forgets one important fact. It was Obama who made the tough decision to take out Osama bin Laden...
"Following the Bush blueprint of repeating the mantra of Saddam, WMDs and 9-11 to justify going to war against Iraq, the Obama playbook is using the specter of dead children, WMDS in the hands of terrorists and Iran run amuck to try to scare the American public into doing the same stupid thing.
The Saudis and the Netanyahu crowd are pushing this desperate line and the Obama Administration is going along with the charade.
"Obama repeats this nonsense without pausing to acknowledge the absurd inconsistencies in his position. Take the WMD issue. At present, Syrias military retains tight control over the stockpiles of Chemical weapons.
"The rebels fighting the Syria Government have been kept at bay, so far. And Obamas solution? Degrade the Syrian military, which means a higher likelihood that those chemical weapons depots would fall into the hands of the Syria Islamic jihadists eager to oust Bashir Assad and create their own version Sharia rule.
"Yeah, thats a great plan."
Are You Ready to Go to War for Bibi Netanyahu and the Saudis? : NO QUARTER USA NET
"Human Rights Watch echoes the conclusion of MIT experts that the large 330-mm rockets would have carried 50 to 60 liters of sarin.UN rights council says Syria gas attack videos, photos fake: Russia. Russia says the United Nations Human Rights Council (HRC) has confirmed that the videos and photos purporting to show the victims of a chemical attack near the Syrian capital, Damascus, were fabricated. PressTV - UN rights council says Syria gas attack videos, photos fake: Russia
Another source that you have used many times, "the group Human Rights Watch issued a report that said evidence strongly implies that Syrian government troops' firing of rockets containing a nerve agent into a Damascus suburb on August 21 that the U.S. said killed over 1,400 people...The report does not rely on ambiguous intercepted phone calls. It cites no shadowy intelligence gathering. Instead, HRW's experts take a close look at witness statements and photographs and video of the victims and -- above all -- the remains of the weapons that appear to have been used. The report includes a map that identifies two attack sites -- the rebel-held suburbs of Zamalka and Moadimiyeh. Each was hit with at least 4 to 8 rockets.
HRW experts have identified, from multiple pictures sent by local activists, two kinds of rockets. One kind -- 170mm or about 7 inches in diameter -- appears to have been used in all strikes on Zamalka. And another kind -- a much-larger 330 mm (about 15 inches around) -- in all the strikes on Moadimiyeh. This would suggest that two separate military units were involved, each firing a barrage of rockets."
Rights group's report offers compelling evidence of Syria chemical attack - CBS News
