What human cost is acceptable in controling illegal immigration?

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

When you look up "child smuggling" - you get "child trafficking" defined as:

Trafficking of children (aka "Child Labor" and "Child Exploitation) is a form of human trafficking and is defined as the "recruitment, transportation, transfer, harboring, and/or receipt" of a child for the purpose of slavery, forced labor and exploitation.[1]:Article 3 (c) This definition is substantially wider than the same document's definition of "trafficking in persons".[1]:Article 3 (a) Children may also be trafficked for the purpose of adoption.

Illegal immigrants traveling with their own children are not trafficking in children.

Hmmmmm....

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

A person using his/her child as a shield against a government taking legal action to deport that person is EXPLOITATION. Taking that child with is illegal, and therefore trafficking and smuggling.

Take that sympathy bullshit and blow it out your America-hating, communist asses. IT IS SMUGGLING/TRAFFICKING!!!

 

[koshergrl]

Eight immigrant children were released to human traffickers who pretended to be *familiy*.

“These kids, regardless of their immigration status, deserve to be treated properly, not abused or trafficked,” Portman said in the subcommittee. “This is all about accountability.”

"“If you smuggle an illegal alien across the border, then we’ll prosecute you. … If you’re smuggling a child, then we’re going to prosecute you, and that child will be separated from you, probably, as required by law. If you don’t want your child separated, then don’t bring them across the border illegally. It’s not our fault that somebody does that.”

The U.S. lost track of 1,475 immigrant children last year. Here’s why people are outraged now.

 

[Toro]

Parents taking their kids across borders are now “child smugglers.”

 

[ph3iron]

Jeff Sessions and Donald Trump:

"If you are smuggling a child then we will prosecute you, and that child will be separated from you as required by law," Attorney General Jeff Sessions said Monday at a law enforcement conference in Scottsdale, Arizona. "If you don't like that, then don't smuggle children over our border."

Administration officials explained that the goal of the program is 100 percent prosecution of all who enter the U.S. illegally. When adults are prosecuted and jailed, their children will be separated from them, just as would happen for a U.S. citizen convicted and jailed.​

Anguish at Southwest border as more immigrant children are separated from parents

The Trump administration's willingness to take children from their parents has raised concerns about how far authorities should go to stem unauthorized border crossings and what human cost is acceptable in the name of border security and immigration control.

"There is something terrible happening here that Americans would not support if they understood it," said F. Scott McCown, director of the Children’s Rights Clinic at the University of Texas at Austin School of Law.​

I don't care how much you hate illegal immigrants this is EVIL. You are punishing the children. It's abhorrant and wrong and inexcusable. I hope they rot in hell for this. 700 children so far have been seperated from the only family they know and lost to our often incompetent and mismanaged child care system. I fail to see how any parent could support actions like these.

When parents are held for prosecution, their children are turned over to the Office of Refugee Resettlement, part of the Department of Health and Human Services. The children are then designated as "unaccompanied minors," and the government tries to connect them to family members who are already in the U.S. Until then, children wait in shelters or are sent to federally contracted foster homes, often without parents being told exactly where they are, immigration advocates said.

It may soon become even more difficult to place children with relatives. The Department of Homeland Security is proposing immigration checks be done on all people in a household who may take in these "unaccompanied" children, which means relatives who are undocumented may be less likely to come forward.

In the meantime, space in shelters and foster homes is limited; The Washington Post reported the administration plans to open facilities at military bases to house some of the separated children.​

How many?
A few million in a country of 350 million?
Omg

 

[ph3iron]

Jeff Sessions and Donald Trump:

"If you are smuggling a child then we will prosecute you, and that child will be separated from you as required by law," Attorney General Jeff Sessions said Monday at a law enforcement conference in Scottsdale, Arizona. "If you don't like that, then don't smuggle children over our border."

Administration officials explained that the goal of the program is 100 percent prosecution of all who enter the U.S. illegally. When adults are prosecuted and jailed, their children will be separated from them, just as would happen for a U.S. citizen convicted and jailed.​

Anguish at Southwest border as more immigrant children are separated from parents

The Trump administration's willingness to take children from their parents has raised concerns about how far authorities should go to stem unauthorized border crossings and what human cost is acceptable in the name of border security and immigration control.

"There is something terrible happening here that Americans would not support if they understood it," said F. Scott McCown, director of the Children’s Rights Clinic at the University of Texas at Austin School of Law.​

I don't care how much you hate illegal immigrants this is EVIL. You are punishing the children. It's abhorrant and wrong and inexcusable. I hope they rot in hell for this. 700 children so far have been seperated from the only family they know and lost to our often incompetent and mismanaged child care system. I fail to see how any parent could support actions like these.

When parents are held for prosecution, their children are turned over to the Office of Refugee Resettlement, part of the Department of Health and Human Services. The children are then designated as "unaccompanied minors," and the government tries to connect them to family members who are already in the U.S. Until then, children wait in shelters or are sent to federally contracted foster homes, often without parents being told exactly where they are, immigration advocates said.

It may soon become even more difficult to place children with relatives. The Department of Homeland Security is proposing immigration checks be done on all people in a household who may take in these "unaccompanied" children, which means relatives who are undocumented may be less likely to come forward.

In the meantime, space in shelters and foster homes is limited; The Washington Post reported the administration plans to open facilities at military bases to house some of the separated children.​

How many?
A few million in a country of 350 million?
Omg

I think immigrants have always been the smartest and aggressive of people
Always been that way

 

[ph3iron]

No illegal aliens-children or otherwise-should be allowed to stay. Zero tolerance. End of story.

And which christianchurch do you go to?
Mr old white fart sucking off commie benefits

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

Parents taking their kids across borders are now “child smugglers.”

Correct.

They have always been child smugglers.

To Smuggle:

• convey (someone or something) somewhere secretly and illicitly.

https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1.....0...1.1.64.psy-ab..0.1.183....0.ijKEIr1frGo
Definition of SMUGGLE
the definition of smuggle

 

[Cecilie1200]

Now that the hysterical leftists have screamed over the headlines and what they THINK the stories under them said, tossed in about a million suppositions stated as fact, screamed over THEM, and otherwise pitched a blue hissy fit over any and every thing that they could possibly pretend was happening, how about we take a calm, reasoned look at the facts and the other side of the story.

(If you're planning to be "outraged" over the "biased" source, please remember that we started this furor over the blind belief in a story titled "Anguish at the Southwest Border", and piss off.)

Separating Kids at Border: The Truth | National Review

For the longest time, illegal immigration was driven by single males from Mexico. Over the last decade, the flow has shifted to women, children, and family units from Central America. This poses challenges we haven’t confronted before and has made what once were relatively minor wrinkles in the law loom very large.

Oh, look. An actual, reality-based motive for the policy change that the left didn't even bother to look for or consider, because it was so much more fun to just leap wildly to the conclusion that it's "hate", and "racism", and "eeeeeevil".

The Trump administration isn’t changing the rules that pertain to separating an adult from the child. Those remain the same. Separation happens only if officials find that the adult is falsely claiming to be the child’s parent, or is a threat to the child, or is put into criminal proceedings.

So basically, everything the leftists here have based their caterwauling on has been false, either through a complete ignorance of the concept of finding the facts, or through flat-out lying. No one is suddenly "ripping children away from their parents at the border", and we actually ARE talking about adults who are being incarcerated.

It’s the last that is operative here. The past practice had been to give a free pass to an adult who is part of a family unit. The new Trump policy is to prosecute all adults. The idea is to send a signal that we are serious about our laws and to create a deterrent against re-entry. (Illegal entry is a misdemeanor, illegal re-entry a felony.)

Again, no one is doing anything different with the children than they ever have. Children have ALWAYS been placed into some sort of state care when their parents/guardians are taken into custody. The change has been in what happens to the adults. Instead of being allowed to callously and cold-bloodedly use their children as human shields to protect themselves from the consequences of their law-breaking choices, the adults are getting the same results as any other criminal: get arrested, get jailed, get prosecuted.

When a migrant is prosecuted for illegal entry, he or she is taken into custody by the U.S. Marshals. In no circumstance anywhere in the U.S. do the marshals care for the children of people they take into custody. The child is taken into the custody of HHS, who cares for them at temporary shelters.

The criminal proceedings are exceptionally short, assuming there is no aggravating factor such as a prior illegal entity or another crime. The migrants generally plead guilty, and they are then sentenced to time served, typically all in the same day, although practices vary along the border. After this, they are returned to the custody of ICE.

And hey, last time I checked, the Constitution guarantees a right to a speedy trial, and you don't get much frigging speedier than "all in the same day", so yay for respecting rights.

If the adult then wants to go home, in keeping with the expedited order of removal that is issued as a matter of course, it’s relatively simple. The adult should be reunited quickly with his or her child, and the family returned home as a unit. In this scenario, there’s only a very brief separation.

So no more overblown vapors about "terrorizing the children, the trauma!" I sincerely doubt one day in a shelter is wigging them out any more than the process of sneaking across the border did. And once again, the primary responsibility for the mental and emotional well-being of the child belongs to the parent, who decided to drag them along on this whole crazy crime deal in the hopes of using them to protect themselves.

Where it becomes much more of an issue is if the adult files an asylum claim. In that scenario, the adults are almost certainly going to be detained longer than the government is allowed to hold their children.

That’s because of something called the Flores Consent Decree from 1997. It says that unaccompanied children can be held only 20 days. A ruling by the Ninth Circuit extended this 20-day limit to children who come as part of family units. So even if we want to hold a family unit together, we are forbidden from doing so.

Oh, look. Actual laws, on the books long before Trump showed up, which must be and are observed. It's almost like the Trump administration isn't just going off half-cocked and making up "eeeevil" shit on the fly, but actually working within the legal system largely promulgated by YOU LEFTISTS.

The clock ticking on the time the government can hold a child will almost always run out before an asylum claim is settled. The migrant is allowed ten days to seek an attorney, and there may be continuances or other complications.

This creates the choice of either releasing the adults and children together into the country pending the ajudication of the asylum claim, or holding the adults and releasing the children. If the adult is held, HHS places the child with a responsible party in the U.S., ideally a relative (migrants are likely to have family and friends here).

So what it looks like is that the government has been bending over backward to try to accommodate and care for these children being dragged here as law-breaking tools by their parents, only to have the parents use those kids to manipulate the system even further. Kinda makes the new policy look like a reasonable compromise between protecting the kids AND protecting the country, doesn't it?

Even if Flores didn’t exist, the government would be very constrained in how many family units it can accommodate. ICE has only about 3,000 family spaces in shelters. It is also limited in its overall space at the border, which is overwhelmed by the ongoing influx. This means that — whatever the Trump administration would prefer to do — many adults are still swiftly released.

Oh, but why not just release ALL the adults who have brought their handy little human shields along, "for the chirren", you ask? Turns out, the government is actually trying to help the adults while also doing their jobs.

Even if Flores didn’t exist, the government would be very constrained in how many family units it can accommodate. ICE has only about 3,000 family spaces in shelters. It is also limited in its overall space at the border, which is overwhelmed by the ongoing influx. This means that — whatever the Trump administration would prefer to do — many adults are still swiftly released.

And then there's the part that the adults were aiming for the first place, the main reason they brought the kids along to be used.

Second, if an adult is released while the claim is pending, the chances of ever finding that person again once he or she is in the country are dicey, to say the least. It is tantamount to allowing the migrant to live here, no matter what the merits of the case.

So no, I'm going to say the "human cost" of housing kids in a temporary shelter for a whole day, or with relatives or a with a family for longer, when it is THEIR OWN PARENTS who started this and who choose to extend the whole process, is not going to lose me any sleep, particularly when it's the exact same "human cost" that we pay for prosecuting ANYONE for a crime, if that person has happened to procreate prior to breaking the law.

A few points about all this:

1) Family units can go home quickly. The option that both honors our laws and keeps family units together is a swift return home after prosecution. But immigrant advocates hate it because they want the migrants to stay in the United States. How you view this question will depend a lot on how you view the motivation of the migrants (and how seriously you take our laws and our border).

2) There’s a better way to claim asylum. Every indication is that the migrant flow to the United States is discretionary. It nearly dried up at the beginning of the Trump administration when migrants believed that they had no chance of getting into the United States. Now, it is going in earnest again because the message got out that, despite the rhetoric, the policy at the border hasn’t changed. This strongly suggests that the flow overwhelmingly consists of economic migrants who would prefer to live in the United States, rather than victims of persecution in their home country who have no option but to get out.

Even if a migrant does have a credible fear of persecution, there is a legitimate way to pursue that claim, and it does not involve entering the United States illegally. First, such people should make their asylum claim in the first country where they feel safe, i.e., Mexico or some other country they are traversing to get here. Second, if for some reason they are threatened everywhere but the United States, they should show up at a port of entry and make their claim there rather than crossing the border illegally.

3) There is a significant moral cost to not enforcing the border. There is obviously a moral cost to separating a parent from a child and almost everyone would prefer not to do it. But, under current policy and with the current resources, the only practical alternative is letting family units who show up at the border live in the country for the duration. Not only does this make a mockery of our laws, it creates an incentive for people to keep bringing children with them.

Needless to say, children should not be making this journey that is fraught with peril. But there is now a premium on bringing children because of how we have handled these cases. They are considered chits.

So obviously, we are ALREADY caring more about the well-being of these children than their own damned parents do. We are not obligated to "care" even more, to the point where we sacrifice our own country - and our own children who reside in it and who will have to grow up to deal with the aftermath of disastrous immigration policies - for the bleeding hearts of a bunch of people too stupid to find out what they're outraged about before they start screaming.

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

How about the unnecessary separation of children from their parents?

How about the unnecessary smuggling of those children into the U.S. to begin with? How about the unnecessary separation of children from their criminal parents who go to jail?

 

[Cecilie1200]

They may consider themselves fortunate; at least, until the present day.


They may consider themselves fortunate; at least, until the present day.


True. However, their parents are now being processed as criminals under 8 U.S. Code § 1325 ( Improper entry by alien ). Suspects do not have rights for joint housing.


Until the present day. Now, adult Illegal Alien trespassers are being evaluated for both criminal and civil charges under 8 U.S. Code § 1325, which says, in part:

(a) Improper time or place; avoidance of examination or inspection; misrepresentation and concealment of facts:
Any alien who (1) enters or attempts to enter the United States at any time or place other than as designated by immigration officers, or (2) eludes examination or inspection by immigration officers, or (3) attempts to enter or obtains entry to the United States by a willfully false or misleading representation or the willful concealment of a material fact, shall, for the first commission of any such offense, be fined under title 18 or imprisoned not more than 6 months, or both, and, for a subsequent commission of any such offense, be fined under title 18, or imprisoned not more than 2 years, or both.​

(b) Improper time or place; civil penalties:
Any alien who is apprehended while entering (or attempting to enter) the United States at a time or place other than as designated by immigration officers shall be subject to a civil penalty of—
(1) at least $50 and not more than $250 for each such entry (or attempted entry); or
2) twice the amount specified in paragraph (1) in the case of an alien who has been previously subject to a civil penalty under this subsection
Civil penalties under this subsection are in addition to, and not in lieu of, any criminal or other civil penalties that may be imposed.


​

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/8/1325​

Fixed.


Fixed.


Excellent tactic to reduce clutter in the Immigration Courts... phukking brilliant... and entirely voluntary.


Incorrect. This is tantamount to a Plea Bargain, which lets Illegal Alien criminal-trespass offenders off-the-hook cheaply and easily. Win-Win. Grand idea.

They are very welcome to undergo criminal-trespass hearings and trial if they choose. That's entirely up to them. Frankly, the US is letting them off the hook.


This is an incredibly brilliant move; cutting the Gordian Knot and telling Progressives to go phukk themselves on this topic.


Say what you will about the Imperial Cheeto, but the philosophical battle lines were drawn on this subject on November 8, 2016. You(r side) lost.

Perhaps when the concept pierces your thick skulls, that being seen standing alongside Illegal Aliens rather than your own fellow countrymen is "impolitic" and "unwise", you will have begun the long journey back towards political power and control of government. But you Lefties are not well-known for your adaptability and pragmatism.

...promising that they will be united with their children if they sign a voluntary deportation agreement

That is evil.

It's also purely a figment of your imagination, which means the evil is something inside you.

No. It isn't. I quoted it from the post above nitwit. Learn to read.

I DID read. I read you finding someone saying what you wanted to believe, and simply assuming that OF COURSE it was correct about what was happening, because that's ALSO what you want to believe.

Learn to think, lackwit.

Clearly your reading comprehension skills are smaller than your mouth. I merely quoted from the post. There is nothing there that I made up.

Clearly, YOUR reading comprehension skills are small enough to fit in a gnat's ear.

"I merely quoted the post." Yes, and the post remains NOTHING WHATSOEVER TO DO WITH THE TOPIC. It's just something you picked out randomly because it said what you wanted to hear.

And you continue to invent the whole "use the children to coerce the people to voluntarily deport" conspiracy right out of your own demented pseudo-brain.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Jeff Sessions and Donald Trump:

"If you are smuggling a child then we will prosecute you, and that child will be separated from you as required by law," Attorney General Jeff Sessions said Monday at a law enforcement conference in Scottsdale, Arizona. "If you don't like that, then don't smuggle children over our border."

Administration officials explained that the goal of the program is 100 percent prosecution of all who enter the U.S. illegally. When adults are prosecuted and jailed, their children will be separated from them, just as would happen for a U.S. citizen convicted and jailed.​

Anguish at Southwest border as more immigrant children are separated from parents

The Trump administration's willingness to take children from their parents has raised concerns about how far authorities should go to stem unauthorized border crossings and what human cost is acceptable in the name of border security and immigration control.

"There is something terrible happening here that Americans would not support if they understood it," said F. Scott McCown, director of the Children’s Rights Clinic at the University of Texas at Austin School of Law.​

I don't care how much you hate illegal immigrants this is EVIL. You are punishing the children. It's abhorrant and wrong and inexcusable. I hope they rot in hell for this. 700 children so far have been seperated from the only family they know and lost to our often incompetent and mismanaged child care system. I fail to see how any parent could support actions like these.

When parents are held for prosecution, their children are turned over to the Office of Refugee Resettlement, part of the Department of Health and Human Services. The children are then designated as "unaccompanied minors," and the government tries to connect them to family members who are already in the U.S. Until then, children wait in shelters or are sent to federally contracted foster homes, often without parents being told exactly where they are, immigration advocates said.

It may soon become even more difficult to place children with relatives. The Department of Homeland Security is proposing immigration checks be done on all people in a household who may take in these "unaccompanied" children, which means relatives who are undocumented may be less likely to come forward.

In the meantime, space in shelters and foster homes is limited; The Washington Post reported the administration plans to open facilities at military bases to house some of the separated children.​

How many?
A few million in a country of 350 million?
Omg

I think immigrants have always been the smartest and aggressive of people
Always been that way

First . . . stop with the sloppy language. There are immigrants, and then there are illegal immigrants. Two different groups of people, and two completely different issues.

Second, I don't see anything particularly smart about breaking the law, but that's just me. And aggressive is mostly not a positive trait, particularly when it's aimed at the aforementioned breaking the law.

 

[eagle1462010]

Many of these children are dragged away from their parents screaming on terror. All 3 definitions describe what you and Trump want. You really think you can replace their parents. They are put into a foster care system that already does not work.

Now you're just making shit up. It's not foster care. It's immigration detention. Where disease and bad guys can harm you... You want PRIVATE rooms with TVs and a fridge?

We want humane facilities for families while their status is determined. We already get the fact you are stupid.

Give us an example of a human facility of the size and scope and for the same types of *immigrants* that the left has invited to our border.

You know, facilities that will *hold* families safely while trying to figure out who the fuck they are and where they came from and whether or not they are murderers or rapists or terrorists on the run.

Let's see an example of the sort of facility you want us to emulate.

Pretty sure what BusyBee and Coyote have in mind would look like this.. But with a Welcome to America banner draped elegantly from the front Promenade.

Pretty sure you are wrong.

Opposing ripping away their children while they are awaiting a hearing is hardly equivalent to this and was not necessary before. There were adequate facilities that managed to keep families intact.

Wtf is wrong with people! Opposing this policy is now equivalent to wanting open borders and five star hotels for them? Illegal immigrants are now equated with murders and rapists?

This country has gon in a truly evil direction.

Having separate housing's for those detained is for their own protection. It is a liability if the children get harmed or raped being detained with adults awaiting a hearing.

If they were allowed to be detained together and something happened the left would be in arms of not protecting them.

Bottom line. The left want Catch and release which is the same as Welcome to America. Open borders. They don't show up for hearings under that policy and blend into the country.

Immigration is s numbers game. There are too many in plight South of the border to take them all in. The problem there is not OUR fault. These countries did it to themselves and expect us to take care of them for their own mistakes.

They need to retake their countries from the drug Lord's and stop the need to flee here.

This thread is identity politics now. Your evil BS. Sell that snake oil somewhere else

 

[eagle1462010]

What human cost is acceptable in controling illegal immigration?

You cannot consider "human cost" in controlling illegal immigration. A nation's borders must be controlled, enforced at any cost, otherwise you don't have a viable nation. As soon as you consider human cost, you defeat yourself by setting a threshold that now illegals know that if they go over, they will get in. Therefore, one cannot allow human cost to be a factor, indeed, the higher the cost the better, because as soon as illegals realize that the potential costs of entering far outweigh the potential benefits, THEY WILL STOP COMING.

Costs are always a factor and in a civilized society human costs matter. We could just act like ISIS and no doubt illegal immigration would come to a screeching halt.

Black and white reasoning. Cost is always a factor? If you or your child is drowning, is cost a factor? Is there a point you will stop trying to save yourself or your kid? You don't have to be ISIS to halt illegal aliens invading our borders, but merely be effective at stopping them so that they see the USA is no longer an option.

You can be VERY affective by acting like ISIS. No question they won't come. You can be VERY affective by implementing brutal measures. Like what is being done with this policy.

So where do you draw the line? Why is it OK to rip children from their parents while awaiting a hearing but not ok to shoot them at the border and put their heads on stakes? Because of cost?

We have had effective policies, a decrease in illegal immigration over time, popular support for increased border security, more rapid deportations of criminals and other measures. Why do we have to further and invoke more brutal measures?

And please, let's stop pretending that ALL these parents are human traffickers trafficking children. That's a pathetic excuse for this policy when immigration inforcement has ALWAYS had the leeway to remove children when they suspect the parents are not the parents. People are now pretending they are trying to prevent human trafficking as a way of supporting a punative and brutal policy against ALL illegal immigrants.

To compare us to ISIS is laughable. To compare the two to drug cartels they run from wouldn't be ,

There men need to arm up and send the drug cartels to hell. Then there would be no reason to run

 

[toobfreak]

What human cost is acceptable in controling illegal immigration?

You cannot consider "human cost" in controlling illegal immigration. A nation's borders must be controlled, enforced at any cost, otherwise you don't have a viable nation. As soon as you consider human cost, you defeat yourself by setting a threshold that now illegals know that if they go over, they will get in. Therefore, one cannot allow human cost to be a factor, indeed, the higher the cost the better, because as soon as illegals realize that the potential costs of entering far outweigh the potential benefits, THEY WILL STOP COMING.

Costs are always a factor and in a civilized society human costs matter. We could just act like ISIS and no doubt illegal immigration would come to a screeching halt.

Black and white reasoning. Cost is always a factor? If you or your child is drowning, is cost a factor? Is there a point you will stop trying to save yourself or your kid? You don't have to be ISIS to halt illegal aliens invading our borders, but merely be effective at stopping them so that they see the USA is no longer an option.

You can be VERY affective by acting like ISIS. No question they won't come. You can be VERY affective by implementing brutal measures. Like what is being done with this policy.

So where do you draw the line? Why is it OK to rip children from their parents while awaiting a hearing but not ok to shoot them at the border and put their heads on stakes? Because of cost?

We have had effective policies, a decrease in illegal immigration over time, popular support for increased border security, more rapid deportations of criminals and other measures. Why do we have to further and invoke more brutal measures?

And please, let's stop pretending that ALL these parents are human traffickers trafficking children. That's a pathetic excuse for this policy when immigration inforcement has ALWAYS had the leeway to remove children when they suspect the parents are not the parents. People are now pretending they are trying to prevent human trafficking as a way of supporting a punative and brutal policy against ALL illegal immigrants.

I don't know why parents and kids are being separated. But brutality? If you want to see brutality, go try invading the border of North Korea, Russia or Iran and get caught. Then talk to me. Sorry, I just do not have any patience for invaders. Let the USA take care of its own people first. That we are feeding, housing and caring for all these unwanted people we didn't ask for instead of outright shooting them in the head right at the border is all the magnanimity I care to share. If it still isn't good enough, let them go south and invade Nicaragua or Honduras instead. The USA can't keep being the blanket solution to all of the rest of the world's failings and problems forever and ever.

 

[Flopper]

Now you're just making shit up. It's not foster care. It's immigration detention. Where disease and bad guys can harm you... You want PRIVATE rooms with TVs and a fridge?

We want humane facilities for families while their status is determined. We already get the fact you are stupid.

Give us an example of a human facility of the size and scope and for the same types of *immigrants* that the left has invited to our border.

You know, facilities that will *hold* families safely while trying to figure out who the fuck they are and where they came from and whether or not they are murderers or rapists or terrorists on the run.

Let's see an example of the sort of facility you want us to emulate.

Pretty sure what BusyBee and Coyote have in mind would look like this.. But with a Welcome to America banner draped elegantly from the front Promenade.

Pretty sure you are wrong.

Opposing ripping away their children while they are awaiting a hearing is hardly equivalent to this and was not necessary before. There were adequate facilities that managed to keep families intact.

Wtf is wrong with people! Opposing this policy is now equivalent to wanting open borders and five star hotels for them? Illegal immigrants are now equated with murders and rapists?

This country has gon in a truly evil direction.

Having separate housing's for those detained is for their own protection. It is a liability if the children get harmed or raped being detained with adults awaiting a hearing.

If they were allowed to be detained together and something happened the left would be in arms of not protecting them.

Bottom line. The left want Catch and release which is the same as Welcome to America. Open borders. They don't show up for hearings under that policy and blend into the country.

Immigration is s numbers game. There are too many in plight South of the border to take them all in. The problem there is not OUR fault. These countries did it to themselves and expect us to take care of them for their own mistakes.

They need to retake their countries from the drug Lord's and stop the need to flee here.

This thread is identity politics now. Your evil BS. Sell that snake oil somewhere else

Eventually, we have to take a practically workable approach to illegal immigration. Deportation at best keeps the number of illegal immigrants from increasing. 80% of all deportees are captured within a short distance of the boarder. The other 20% (internal deportations) come from the rest of the country. At the current rate that Trump is deporting, it will take between 150 and 230 years to deport all illegal immigrants. The actually time would probably be a lot longer because we will not always have a zealot such as Trump in the White House and a republican congress.

It's very unlikely that the wall across the Mexican boarder will be built. Trump has already shot down the idea of a wall that spans the boarder. His last word I heard was he was planning to build a wall in certainly places and upgrade fencing. However, even if the wall is build, this may not significantly reduce illegal immigration. If we are successful in reducing Southern boarder crossings, we have to consider our other boarders. We have nearly 100,000 miles of boarder including our shoreline and the Canadian boarder. which are largely unguarded compared to our southern boarder. As crossing our Southern boarder get's harder, people will turn to other alternatives which will not be as costly as you might think.

One thing rarely mentioned is cost. Using ICE's on cost figures, the cost per deportee in 2016 is $10,854. Best estimates are that there are 12 million illegal immigrants in the country. If you do the math, you will see that comes out to over 120 billion dollars. To that we have to add the 12 billion/yr. in Social Security illegal immigrants pay that they will never draw plus income tax paid and sales tax. Then there is additional cost to get our crops picked, custodial services, landscaping, etc.

 

[eagle1462010]

We want humane facilities for families while their status is determined. We already get the fact you are stupid.

Give us an example of a human facility of the size and scope and for the same types of *immigrants* that the left has invited to our border.

You know, facilities that will *hold* families safely while trying to figure out who the fuck they are and where they came from and whether or not they are murderers or rapists or terrorists on the run.

Let's see an example of the sort of facility you want us to emulate.

Pretty sure what BusyBee and Coyote have in mind would look like this.. But with a Welcome to America banner draped elegantly from the front Promenade.

Pretty sure you are wrong.

Opposing ripping away their children while they are awaiting a hearing is hardly equivalent to this and was not necessary before. There were adequate facilities that managed to keep families intact.

Wtf is wrong with people! Opposing this policy is now equivalent to wanting open borders and five star hotels for them? Illegal immigrants are now equated with murders and rapists?

This country has gon in a truly evil direction.

Having separate housing's for those detained is for their own protection. It is a liability if the children get harmed or raped being detained with adults awaiting a hearing.

If they were allowed to be detained together and something happened the left would be in arms of not protecting them.

Bottom line. The left want Catch and release which is the same as Welcome to America. Open borders. They don't show up for hearings under that policy and blend into the country.

Immigration is s numbers game. There are too many in plight South of the border to take them all in. The problem there is not OUR fault. These countries did it to themselves and expect us to take care of them for their own mistakes.

They need to retake their countries from the drug Lord's and stop the need to flee here.

This thread is identity politics now. Your evil BS. Sell that snake oil somewhere else

Eventually, we have to take a practically workable approach to illegal immigration. Deportation at best keeps the number of illegal immigrants from increasing. 80% of all deportees are captured within a short distance of the boarder. The other 20% (internal deportations) come from the rest of the country. At the current rate that Trump is deporting, it will take between 150 and 230 years to deport all illegal immigrants. The actually time would probably be a lot longer because we will not always have a zealot such as Trump in the White House and a republican congress.

It's very unlikely that the wall across the Mexican boarder will be built. Trump has already shot down that idea of wall that spans the boarder. His last word I heard was he was planning to build a wall in certainly places and upgrade fencing. However, even if the wall is build, this may not significantly reduce illegal immigration. If we are successful in reducing Southern boarder crossings, we have to consider our other boarders. We have nearly 100,000 miles of boarder including our shoreline and the Canadian boarder. which are largely unguarded compared to our southern boarder. As crossing our Southern boarder get's harder, people will turn to other alternatives which will not be as costly as you might think.

One thing rarely mentioned is cost. Using ICE's on cost figures, the cost per deportee in 2016 is $10,854. Best estimates are that there are 12 million illegal immigrants in the country. If you do the math, you will see that comes out to over 120 billion dollars. To that we have to add the 12 billion/yr. in Social Security illegal immigrants pay that they will never draw plus income tax paid and sales tax. Then there is additional cost to get our crops picked, custodial services, landscaping, etc.

The cost of them staying is much higher. welfare schooling etc.

They detained 100 k in 2 months and that doesn't count the ones getting through. That adds close to a million more per year under Catch and Release.

That's not a viable option

 

[Vandalshandle]

I am fed up with illegal children crossing from Mexico through my back yard leaving a trail of lollipop sticks, and reeking of sour ball candy, while singing nursey rhymes in Spanish, and begging for tamales at my back door. They should all be rounded up and deported to Spain, or wherever the hell they come from. Most of them are Hillary voters, having been bribed with promises of free disposable diapers.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Pretty sure you are wrong.

Opposing ripping away their children while they are awaiting a hearing is hardly equivalent to this and was not necessary before. There were adequate facilities that managed to keep families intact.

And then you wonder why they keep coming? Bet you next time they will think of this before attempting to make another journey here.

 

[eagle1462010]

I am fed up with illegal children crossing from Mexico through my back yard leaving a trail of lollipop sticks, and reeking of sour ball candy, while singing nursey rhymes in Spanish, and begging for tamales at my back door. They should all be rounded up and deported to Spain, or wherever the hell they come from. Most of them are Hillary voters, having been bribed with promises of free disposable diapers.

Then you pay for them. Not the tax payers who want our border secure.

You want Catch and release and Amnesty for all. We don't. It's that simple.

Play the you are Mother Terisa to someone else.