What Should Happen To The Person/s That Sells Guns Illegally

[Slade3200]

To people like this violent thug killer, Devin Patrick Kelley, that viciously murders multiple people in cold blood for no reason whatsoever?

Let’s say your uncle dies and leaves you his guns. Your not a big gun guy and you don’t see a reason to keep all of them so you tell some of your buddies that you’d be willing to sell some of them. One of your friends says he’d love to buy one.... how do you think you should have to go about selling him the gun?

This is a sincere question...

A sincere answer

IMO any person selling a gun who wants to obey the laws regarding sales to those who are ineligible to buy a firearm should broker the deal via a licensed FFL dealer.

In most cases the FFL dealer will only charge a nominal fee to perform the check

I have never sold any firearms that I own but if I was going to I would broker the sale in the manner described above and have the buyer pick up the tab for the background check

Is that the legal process? If I want to sell a gun to a buddy I need to go to a gun store and ask them to broker the deal?

If he just gave me cash and I gave him the gun what kind of penalty would we be facing if we got caught?

If they're really a buddy, you should know if they are eligible to own a gun. If you don't know, maybe they're not that good of a buddy.


.

Eligible as in not having a criminal record? Yeah, assuming you know that, and that is the case then is it all good to do a private deal?

 

[NYcarbineer]

If you read through this thread...

Is it time to abolish all gun laws and allow everyone to open carry?

...you'll find that there is a disturbingly large contingent of nuts here on USMB who don't believe there should be any such thing as an illegal gun sale.

Name them.

lol, are you suffering a bout of illiteracy? Read the fucking thread.

I don’t see anyone calling for no gun restrictions at all, are some dumb binary robot that can’t see many positions, just two. You are one dumb idiot, thanks for reenforcing it.

Is it time to abolish all gun laws and allow everyone to open carry?

Read the question in the thread title and then read the answer in post number 3,

and then come back and tell me why you either lied, or can't read.

 

[OKTexas]

A sincere answer

IMO any person selling a gun who wants to obey the laws regarding sales to those who are ineligible to buy a firearm should broker the deal via a licensed FFL dealer.

In most cases the FFL dealer will only charge a nominal fee to perform the check

I have never sold any firearms that I own but if I was going to I would broker the sale in the manner described above and have the buyer pick up the tab for the background check

Is that the legal process? If I want to sell a gun to a buddy I need to go to a gun store and ask them to broker the deal?

If he just gave me cash and I gave him the gun what kind of penalty would we be facing if we got caught?

If they're really a buddy, you should know if they are eligible to own a gun. If you don't know, maybe they're not that good of a buddy.


.

A private seller in Texas has no legal obligation to know if the person he is selling a gun to is legally eligible to own a gun.

And, I don't know anyone who would sell to a total stranger. I guess there are a few people who might, I never have. Of course I've only sold one gun in my life and it was to a guy I worked with and knew very well. BTW, it a violation of federal law to knowingly sell a gun to a person who is not eligible to have it. If I were to sell a gun today, I would make the exchange at the local police dept and tell the buyer they will check his ID on NCIC. If the buyer is hinkey they'll most likely back out. Responsible gun owners take precautions.


.

The law is for irresponsible gun owners.

Could you be more ambiguous? Which of the millions of laws are you talking about?


.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Is that the legal process? If I want to sell a gun to a buddy I need to go to a gun store and ask them to broker the deal?

If he just gave me cash and I gave him the gun what kind of penalty would we be facing if we got caught?

If they're really a buddy, you should know if they are eligible to own a gun. If you don't know, maybe they're not that good of a buddy.


.

A private seller in Texas has no legal obligation to know if the person he is selling a gun to is legally eligible to own a gun.

And, I don't know anyone who would sell to a total stranger. I guess there are a few people who might, I never have. Of course I've only sold one gun in my life and it was to a guy I worked with and knew very well. BTW, it a violation of federal law to knowingly sell a gun to a person who is not eligible to have it. If I were to sell a gun today, I would make the exchange at the local police dept and tell the buyer they will check his ID on NCIC. If the buyer is hinkey they'll most likely back out. Responsible gun owners take precautions.


.

The law is for irresponsible gun owners.

Could you be more ambiguous? Which of the millions of laws are you talking about?


.

The law that expands background checks to private sale, aka, the law that Republicans, and YOU, don't want.

 

[OKTexas]

To people like this violent thug killer, Devin Patrick Kelley, that viciously murders multiple people in cold blood for no reason whatsoever?

Let’s say your uncle dies and leaves you his guns. Your not a big gun guy and you don’t see a reason to keep all of them so you tell some of your buddies that you’d be willing to sell some of them. One of your friends says he’d love to buy one.... how do you think you should have to go about selling him the gun?

This is a sincere question...

A sincere answer

IMO any person selling a gun who wants to obey the laws regarding sales to those who are ineligible to buy a firearm should broker the deal via a licensed FFL dealer.

In most cases the FFL dealer will only charge a nominal fee to perform the check

I have never sold any firearms that I own but if I was going to I would broker the sale in the manner described above and have the buyer pick up the tab for the background check

Is that the legal process? If I want to sell a gun to a buddy I need to go to a gun store and ask them to broker the deal?

If he just gave me cash and I gave him the gun what kind of penalty would we be facing if we got caught?

If they're really a buddy, you should know if they are eligible to own a gun. If you don't know, maybe they're not that good of a buddy.


.

Eligible as in not having a criminal record? Yeah, assuming you know that, and that is the case then is it all good to do a private deal?

It's good enough for the FFLs, why not private sales?


.

 

[Slade3200]

Let’s say your uncle dies and leaves you his guns. Your not a big gun guy and you don’t see a reason to keep all of them so you tell some of your buddies that you’d be willing to sell some of them. One of your friends says he’d love to buy one.... how do you think you should have to go about selling him the gun?

This is a sincere question...

A sincere answer

IMO any person selling a gun who wants to obey the laws regarding sales to those who are ineligible to buy a firearm should broker the deal via a licensed FFL dealer.

In most cases the FFL dealer will only charge a nominal fee to perform the check

I have never sold any firearms that I own but if I was going to I would broker the sale in the manner described above and have the buyer pick up the tab for the background check

Is that the legal process? If I want to sell a gun to a buddy I need to go to a gun store and ask them to broker the deal?

If he just gave me cash and I gave him the gun what kind of penalty would we be facing if we got caught?

If they're really a buddy, you should know if they are eligible to own a gun. If you don't know, maybe they're not that good of a buddy.


.

Eligible as in not having a criminal record? Yeah, assuming you know that, and that is the case then is it all good to do a private deal?

It's good enough for the FFLs, why not private sales?


.

I don’t know, I’m just asking questions at this point. I have not researched the subject. My first instinct is, I’d personally like to be able to sell a gun to a friend without it being a crazy hard or expensive process

 

[OKTexas]

If they're really a buddy, you should know if they are eligible to own a gun. If you don't know, maybe they're not that good of a buddy.


.

A private seller in Texas has no legal obligation to know if the person he is selling a gun to is legally eligible to own a gun.

And, I don't know anyone who would sell to a total stranger. I guess there are a few people who might, I never have. Of course I've only sold one gun in my life and it was to a guy I worked with and knew very well. BTW, it a violation of federal law to knowingly sell a gun to a person who is not eligible to have it. If I were to sell a gun today, I would make the exchange at the local police dept and tell the buyer they will check his ID on NCIC. If the buyer is hinkey they'll most likely back out. Responsible gun owners take precautions.


.

The law is for irresponsible gun owners.

Could you be more ambiguous? Which of the millions of laws are you talking about?


.

The law that expands background checks to private sale, aka, the law that Republicans, and YOU, don't want.

Are you going to give me and every employer, private investigator and anyone else that can come up with your full name and birth date access to NICS?


.

 

[tyroneweaver]

To people like this violent thug killer, Devin Patrick Kelley, that viciously murders multiple people in cold blood for no reason whatsoever?

Probably the same thing that happens to someone who sells uranium illegally

 

[DrLove]

To people like this violent thug killer, Devin Patrick Kelley, that viciously murders multiple people in cold blood for no reason whatsoever?

They should be hung by the balls if they do so knowingly. With Devin Patrick Kelly, apparently he got away with lying about at least two felony convictions.

But it's possible that at either the military and/or the authorities in Texas did not report this info to the Feds.

I'm in wait & see mode

 

[OKTexas]

A sincere answer

IMO any person selling a gun who wants to obey the laws regarding sales to those who are ineligible to buy a firearm should broker the deal via a licensed FFL dealer.

In most cases the FFL dealer will only charge a nominal fee to perform the check

I have never sold any firearms that I own but if I was going to I would broker the sale in the manner described above and have the buyer pick up the tab for the background check

Is that the legal process? If I want to sell a gun to a buddy I need to go to a gun store and ask them to broker the deal?

If he just gave me cash and I gave him the gun what kind of penalty would we be facing if we got caught?

If they're really a buddy, you should know if they are eligible to own a gun. If you don't know, maybe they're not that good of a buddy.


.

Eligible as in not having a criminal record? Yeah, assuming you know that, and that is the case then is it all good to do a private deal?

It's good enough for the FFLs, why not private sales?


.

I don’t know, I’m just asking questions at this point. I have not researched the subject. My first instinct is, I’d personally like to be able to sell a gun to a friend without it being a crazy hard or expensive process

Exactly, the only way to enforce background checks on private sales it to have a federal registry on every gun in the country. There are about 500 million firearms in private hands at this time and the federal courts say a felon CAN NOT be prosecuted for failing to register a firearm, because they would be incriminating themselves. Are you going to require law abiding citizens to do things a felon can't be required to do? That's exactly where the left is wanting to take this issue.


.

 

[Lewdog]

If someone sells a gun illegally, they should lose their right to sell guns for the rest of their lives, they should forfeit all the guns they have, and they should lose their ability to own guns... on top of a fine. Putting them in jail isn't going change things but make it worse for the innocent people in their family.

If you lock up a husband and father you are punishing the whole family...

If they are selling guns illegally and you take away their right to sell guns legally, you have taken nothing away. They will still sell illegally and will still own guns illegally. You are in a sense saying, do nothing. You really think that will work?

You'd be amazed how many people change their direction in life when they are given a second chance. And I didn't just say to take away their rights to sell guns. I said to take away their right to OWN guns as well.

 

[Slade3200]

Is that the legal process? If I want to sell a gun to a buddy I need to go to a gun store and ask them to broker the deal?

If he just gave me cash and I gave him the gun what kind of penalty would we be facing if we got caught?

If they're really a buddy, you should know if they are eligible to own a gun. If you don't know, maybe they're not that good of a buddy.


.

Eligible as in not having a criminal record? Yeah, assuming you know that, and that is the case then is it all good to do a private deal?

It's good enough for the FFLs, why not private sales?


.

I don’t know, I’m just asking questions at this point. I have not researched the subject. My first instinct is, I’d personally like to be able to sell a gun to a friend without it being a crazy hard or expensive process

Exactly, the only way to enforce background checks on private sales it to have a federal registry on every gun in the country. There are about 500 million firearms in private hands at this time and the federal courts say a felon CAN NOT be prosecuted for failing to register a firearm, because they would be incriminating themselves. Are you going to require law abiding citizens to do things a felon can't be required to do? That's exactly where the left is wanting to take this issue.


.

And this is where we may differ but I don’t think a registry is such a bad idea. With the way tech is now a days it could be a quick and easy thing

 

[g5000]

If someone sells a gun illegally, they should lose their right to sell guns for the rest of their lives, they should forfeit all the guns they have, and they should lose their ability to own guns... on top of a fine. Putting them in jail isn't going change things but make it worse for the innocent people in their family.

If you lock up a husband and father you are punishing the whole family...

Husbands and fathers and mothers and daughters and sons were killed yesterday.

So fuck your "if you lock up a husband and father" bullshit.

 

[g5000]

In April 2016, Kelley purchased the Ruger AR-556 rifle he allegedly used in the shooting from a store in San Antonio, Texas, a law enforcement official said. There was no disqualifying information in the background check conducted as required for the purchase, a law enforcement official told CNN.
At one point, the shooter tried to get a license to carry a gun in Texas but was denied by the state, Abbott said, citing the director of Texas' Department of Public Safety.

Texas gunman's in-laws frequented church where 26 people were killed - CNN


"There was no disqualifying information in the background check conducted as required for the purchase".

Shoddy reporting. One can't tell from that ambiguous wording if a federal background check was done by the store owner and nothing popped out of the computer, or if Kelley filled out the paperwork and lied on it.


Just to add to the confusion:

Kelley purchased the Ruger AR-556 rifle in April 2016 from an Academy Sports & Outdoors store in San Antonio, a law enforcement official told CNN.
When Kelley filled out the background check paperwork at the store, he checked the box to indicate he didn't have disqualifying criminal history, the official said. He listed an address in Colorado Springs, Colorado when he bought the rifle, the official said.

Devin Kelley: What we know about Texas church shooting suspect - CNN

Military members dishonorably discharged cannot legally purchase a gun, but Kelley's bad-conduct discharge falls just short of that mark.

Texas governor says the church shooter should not have had access to a gun

 

[g5000]

If the store owner did a background check and nothing came back out of the computer to tell him to deny the sale, then something is broken in the system.

We cannot assume the store owner violated the law just yet.

 

[OKTexas]

If they're really a buddy, you should know if they are eligible to own a gun. If you don't know, maybe they're not that good of a buddy.


.

Eligible as in not having a criminal record? Yeah, assuming you know that, and that is the case then is it all good to do a private deal?

It's good enough for the FFLs, why not private sales?


.

I don’t know, I’m just asking questions at this point. I have not researched the subject. My first instinct is, I’d personally like to be able to sell a gun to a friend without it being a crazy hard or expensive process

Exactly, the only way to enforce background checks on private sales it to have a federal registry on every gun in the country. There are about 500 million firearms in private hands at this time and the federal courts say a felon CAN NOT be prosecuted for failing to register a firearm, because they would be incriminating themselves. Are you going to require law abiding citizens to do things a felon can't be required to do? That's exactly where the left is wanting to take this issue.


.

And this is where we may differ but I don’t think a registry is such a bad idea. With the way tech is now a days it could be a quick and easy thing

So you have no problem being required to do something illegal owners can't be required to do. Registration won't be free, transfers won't be free, yet criminals can do anything they want and not spend a dime. I have a big problem with that.


.

 

[beagle9]

A sincere answer

IMO any person selling a gun who wants to obey the laws regarding sales to those who are ineligible to buy a firearm should broker the deal via a licensed FFL dealer.

In most cases the FFL dealer will only charge a nominal fee to perform the check

I have never sold any firearms that I own but if I was going to I would broker the sale in the manner described above and have the buyer pick up the tab for the background check

Is that the legal process? If I want to sell a gun to a buddy I need to go to a gun store and ask them to broker the deal?

If he just gave me cash and I gave him the gun what kind of penalty would we be facing if we got caught?

If they're really a buddy, you should know if they are eligible to own a gun. If you don't know, maybe they're not that good of a buddy.


.

Eligible as in not having a criminal record? Yeah, assuming you know that, and that is the case then is it all good to do a private deal?

It's good enough for the FFLs, why not private sales?


.

I don’t know, I’m just asking questions at this point. I have not researched the subject. My first instinct is, I’d personally like to be able to sell a gun to a friend without it being a crazy hard or expensive process

. The way guns (mainly assault rifles), are being abused now by humans, it should be a painful process to sell a gun to a so called friend without going through a process of some sort. The process of moving guns should be rigorous. I mean a friend if desperate enough, would take advantage of the friendship if higher stakes are involved.

 

[OKTexas]

In April 2016, Kelley purchased the Ruger AR-556 rifle he allegedly used in the shooting from a store in San Antonio, Texas, a law enforcement official said. There was no disqualifying information in the background check conducted as required for the purchase, a law enforcement official told CNN.
At one point, the shooter tried to get a license to carry a gun in Texas but was denied by the state, Abbott said, citing the director of Texas' Department of Public Safety.

Texas gunman's in-laws frequented church where 26 people were killed - CNN


"There was no disqualifying information in the background check conducted as required for the purchase".

Shoddy reporting. One can't tell from that ambiguous wording if a federal background check was done by the store owner and nothing popped out of the computer, or if Kelley filled out the paperwork and lied on it.


Just to add to the confusion:

Kelley purchased the Ruger AR-556 rifle in April 2016 from an Academy Sports & Outdoors store in San Antonio, a law enforcement official told CNN.
When Kelley filled out the background check paperwork at the store, he checked the box to indicate he didn't have disqualifying criminal history, the official said. He listed an address in Colorado Springs, Colorado when he bought the rifle, the official said.

Devin Kelley: What we know about Texas church shooting suspect - CNN

Military members dishonorably discharged cannot legally purchase a gun, but Kelley's bad-conduct discharge falls just short of that mark.

Texas governor says the church shooter should not have had access to a gun

He was convicted in the AF of domestic violence and spent a year in jail, so he had to have lied on the background check form. The AF also has some responsibility for not reporting the conviction to NICS.


.

 

[Lewdog]

If someone sells a gun illegally, they should lose their right to sell guns for the rest of their lives, they should forfeit all the guns they have, and they should lose their ability to own guns... on top of a fine. Putting them in jail isn't going change things but make it worse for the innocent people in their family.

If you lock up a husband and father you are punishing the whole family...

Husbands and fathers and mothers and daughters and sons were killed yesterday.

So fuck your "if you lock up a husband and father" bullshit.

You should pay attention to the entire conversation before getting emotional over a post you take out of context.

 

[g5000]

A private seller in Texas has no legal obligation to know if the person he is selling a gun to is legally eligible to own a gun.

And, I don't know anyone who would sell to a total stranger. I guess there are a few people who might, I never have. Of course I've only sold one gun in my life and it was to a guy I worked with and knew very well. BTW, it a violation of federal law to knowingly sell a gun to a person who is not eligible to have it. If I were to sell a gun today, I would make the exchange at the local police dept and tell the buyer they will check his ID on NCIC. If the buyer is hinkey they'll most likely back out. Responsible gun owners take precautions.


.

The law is for irresponsible gun owners.

Could you be more ambiguous? Which of the millions of laws are you talking about?


.

The law that expands background checks to private sale, aka, the law that Republicans, and YOU, don't want.

Are you going to give me and every employer, private investigator and anyone else that can come up with your full name and birth date access to NICS?


.

If you want to sell a gun to a "buddy", there is no reason the two of you can't go to the nearest gun retailer and have them do a background check on your "buddy".