When has socialism ever worked?

Venezuela is one of the least socialist countries in the world, and is the remnants of Spanish imperialism and colonialism.
The US also created a reactionary military elite in Venezuela.

The oil in Venezuela is not light sweet, but thick tar sands that is very hard to extract.
The US embargoes Venezuela, so they are having trouble getting broken equipment fixed.
There are many countries that produce oil extraction equipment and Venezuela is free to trade with all of them. Venezuela’s problem is that Chavez’s cronies Drove out the people who knew how to run the oil industry, then looted it for personal profit, and by simple incompetence ran it into the ground for more profits while refusing to maintain the infrastructure. Just because the USA won’t trade with a country doesn’t mean other countries won’t as well.
 
Socialism predates capitalism or currency.
When the primitive hunter/gatherer tribes sat down for dinner, they shared what ever any hunter was able to come up with.
That is socialism.
Socialism is the historic norm, and capitalism did not get invented until long after the switch to sedentary agriculture.
More often the strong members of the tribe got the choice pickings and the old or weak got what little the strong didn’t want. THAT is what socialism is. The lives of hunter-gatherers were nasty, brutish and short.
 
Yes they were or are. Yes the USSR was and China is communism exactly as Marx and Engels described. Communism is precisely about a totalitarian regime which is required by Marx/Engels for a a temporary but unspecified amount of time.
“From each according to his ability and to each according to his need”. Is the basic concept of both communism and socialism, neither will work with human beings because the ones willing to work eventually tire of support those not willing to work and stop working.
 
communism is very clear that it intends a classes society and the "withering away of the state". If you have ultra-wealthy people, and a state, then you dont have communism.
That’s the communist mantra, but in the history of the world, communist states have never even attempted to deliver. They always turn into nasty dictatorships. By its very nature government wants to control and the type of people attracted to government positions will never relinquish their power. On the contrary, they work very hard every day to expand it.
 
The problem with socialism and communism is the same - Someone has to decide how to split the spoils of labor. In a democratic society one could assume that the people would decide. In a democratic Republic it is decided both by the majority and minority. A republic protects against the majority running over the views of the minority. Either way Socialism and Communism both fail because once control is exerted over the spoils of the individual's labor input human behavior changes. The failure comes from the individual who feels as if they are producing more than what they are receiving for their toil. There is a wide distribution of output per individual based on their intelligence, physical characteristics, determination, motivation and many other factors. Those that feel they are not receiving the benefit of their labor in a fair trade will shut down and only produce that which they need. Productivity drops, shortages ensue and society collapses. Stalin, Mao and others believed that they could make societies that would prosper if they had control. They were wrong. They had no understanding of Human Nature.

Yes - there are many other factors - yes I cast a wide net on this but the point is the secondary, tertiary (and so on) effects have to take Human behavior into account. We are built to survive and we have not evolved into a Hive Mind because the nature of man's evolution is based on survival and individual effort. We will all be dead before we see the evolution of man change his behavior.

so for now - fuck socialism - it won't work

As an aside, socialism will work when man's labor is no longer necessary through automation. If we ever get to completely automated production that fulfills man's needs, then we will have had to move to a completely communistic society. In the meantime, man needs to move at an appropriate pace such that societal collapse doesn't occur.
You are talking about a “Star Trek universe” where anything desired and be produced at no cost or effort by a universal replicator and all needs and wants are easily fulfilled.
 
Democrats have become ardent supporters of socialism...just look at the collapse of USSR in 1989, and China? Is THAT a political model we want?
Neither the theoretical construct of socialism nor of capitalism has ever "worked" as a pure ideological system.

All the most advanced democracies, demonstrably, have succeeded based upon their pragmatic incorporation of the positive aspects of both.

Would the United States "work" better for Americans if socialistic programmes such as Social Security and Medicare had been defeated by rabid ideologues? How many Americans, in a frenzy of pure capitalistic zealotry, are demanding their repeal?

The House just passed a bill that augers such progress. It
  • reduces the cost of some prescription drugs
  • extends the child tax credit
  • provides universal pre-kindergarten for 3-and 4-year olds
  • allows four weeks of paid family and medical leave
  • builds affordable housing
  • expands Medicare coverage
  • creates "clean energy" jobs
In all those respects, it emulates the most advanced nations on earth in the proven formula for success.

What extant alternative paradigms might one aspire to?
 
The US has 15,500 golf courses. Germany 750 odd. Germans don't like golf.
I have a car but 90 per cent of the time use the great public transport we have. A good number of people I know much prefer public transport than a car.
Stop pulling stats out your arse and post some links with regards to apartments.
You must live in a place like NYC that grew up around mass transit. You are the only person I’ve ever heard say they have a “great public transport” system. People use them, but from what Ive seen they are crowded, smelly and uncomfortable. How do you transport multiple bags of groceries home? How do you transport anything large or heavy that you buy? The answer is that you don’t. You shop every day, or every second day for groceries and pay through the nose for deliveries for large or heavy things. Amazon is a godsend for people like you. When you go anywhere you have to transfer to multiple trains or buses which waste time.
 
...it could work for Post port upgrades. Several projects could be undertaken for case study purposes. Upgrading Postal facilities for economies of scale could provide proof of concept and metrics for further consideration.
 
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The knee-jerk proclamations of ideological simpletons aside, they'll just have to endure such popular programmes as Social Security and Medicare.
 
Neither the theoretical construct of socialism nor of capitalism has ever "worked" as a pure ideological system.

All the most advanced democracies, demonstrably, have succeeded based upon their pragmatic incorporation of the positive aspects of both.

Would the United States "work" better for Americans if socialistic programmes such as Social Security and Medicare had been defeated by rabid ideologues? How many Americans, in a frenzy of pure capitalistic zealotry, are demanding their repeal?

The House just passed a bill that augers such progress. It
  • reduces the cost of some prescription drugs
  • extends the child tax credit
  • provides universal pre-kindergarten for 3-and 4-year olds
  • allows four weeks of paid family and medical leave
  • builds affordable housing
  • expands Medicare coverage
  • creates "clean energy" jobs
In all those respects, it emulates the most advanced nations on earth in the proven formula for success.

What extant alternative paradigms might one aspire to?
That's just plain wrong. Of course pure capitalism works. The purer it is, the better it works. Of course, it doesn't provide all the goodies you want free of charge, but that wouldn't be capitalism.

"All the most advanced countries" were once far more capitalist than they are now. The more socialist they have gotten, the more fucked up they get and the poorer their economies perform. Socialism does not improve anything.
 
...it must work to upgrade postal operations and integrate them with port facilities to expedite operations.

The general Government has the inherent authority to make that happen under Constitutional law regarding US Postal operations.

Being able to scale up port operations to meet demand should be part of the design consideration for the general Government.

The postal service could then conveniently generate revenue for the public sector to help with operation costs and potentially help reduce any need for direct taxation of the People.

OMB could provide data for the economies of scale necessary to enable a cost basis for revenue generation.
 
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That's just plain wrong. Of course pure capitalism works. The purer it is, the better it works. Of course, it doesn't provide all the goodies you want free of charge, but that wouldn't be capitalism.

"All the most advanced countries" were once far more capitalist than they are now. The more socialist they have gotten, the more fucked up they get and the poorer their economies perform. Socialism does not improve anything.
I have accurately noted that all the most advanced nations on earth are democratic, pragmatic blends of capitalism and socialism.

If you can cite your ideal paradigm of an extant, successful, purely capitalistic, nation anywhere on earth, please name it. (A real nation, not some airy-fairy ideological fantasy.)

Your yearning for some idealized past - pre-Social Security, pre-Medicare - is noted. Laissez-faire exploiters of labor certainly contrived an exclusive "Golden Age" for an elite few, one of concentrated opulence, but progress then ensued.

Life expectancy of White males in the U.S. was 47 years in 1900, 33 for Black males. After a century of your socialistic predations, it had risen to 75 for White males, 68 for Black males.

If you need to bemoan that democratization as not being ideologically "pc", so be it.
 
Democrats have become ardent supporters of socialism...just look at the collapse of USSR in 1989, and China? Is THAT a political model we want?

That’s not the political model that’s being proposed.

The USSR in 1989 opposed private ownership. China still opposes private ownership of property by the working class.

Democrats are avowed capitalists, who believe in private ownership, and protection of personal property rights, as well as personal freedoms for ALL citizens.
 

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