When Were Universities Granted the Authority to Become a Judical Branch in Criminal Cases?

[Clementine]

Hey, Buddy, At Will Employment. You can get fired if the boss looks at you funny.

And you know what, you sign up for that when you agree to take their money.

Now, if you want to make it such that firing people without cause becomes really difficult, we have something for that. They are called "Unions". You know, those things guys on your side are trying to get rid of for the mortal fear that someone might still be pulling down a middle class wage somewhere.

Now, that said, no university is expelling a student unless they are on some pretty firm ground. After all, he could sue.

The reality is, 80% of campus rape goes unreported. Of the 20% that are reported, very few of them get prosecuted. Less than 3% of all rapists end up even spending a DAY in prison.

We have something better than unions to protect us. It's called the constitution. And we do not sign an agreement waiving their constitutional rights when they take a job. Our rights are inalienable. Period. That is something libs can't get through their heads.

It's mostly liberal colleges running roughshod over people's rights by punishing people based on mere words.

Unions also protect some people that don't deserve it. Most of the union dues go to support liberal politicians.

The reason so few rape cases go to trial is because of a lack of evidence. Our rights say evidence must prove something beyond a shadow of a doubt. Never will it be fair to be punished based solely on the word of a person.

 

[JoeB131]

We have something better than unions to protect us. It's called the constitution. And we do not sign an agreement waiving their constitutional rights when they take a job. Our rights are inalienable. Period. That is something libs can't get through their heads.

Except this isn't a constitutional issue. You don't have a right to attend college. Attending college is - and should be - a privilege.

The reason so few rape cases go to trial is because of a lack of evidence. Our rights say evidence must prove something beyond a shadow of a doubt. Never will it be fair to be punished based solely on the word of a person.

Except that we send poor people to prison all the time based on that. I met a young man who spent 10 years of his life in prison because our wonderful Chicago PD beat a confession out of one of his friends, and he was implicated. Didn't matter that the guy immediately recanted the confession. They were all convicted anyway.

Unions also protect some people that don't deserve it.

I agree, they do. No system is perfect. You'll always have the guy trying to game it, and always have the guy trying to abuse it.

All that said, what are the university's supposed to do if they have a credible accusation of rape that law enforcement refuses to act on? Let the accused run around campus to do it again? That's crazy talk.

 

[imawhosure]

We have something better than unions to protect us. It's called the constitution. And we do not sign an agreement waiving their constitutional rights when they take a job. Our rights are inalienable. Period. That is something libs can't get through their heads.

Except this isn't a constitutional issue. You don't have a right to attend college. Attending college is - and should be - a privilege.

The reason so few rape cases go to trial is because of a lack of evidence. Our rights say evidence must prove something beyond a shadow of a doubt. Never will it be fair to be punished based solely on the word of a person.

Except that we send poor people to prison all the time based on that. I met a young man who spent 10 years of his life in prison because our wonderful Chicago PD beat a confession out of one of his friends, and he was implicated. Didn't matter that the guy immediately recanted the confession. They were all convicted anyway.

Unions also protect some people that don't deserve it.

I agree, they do. No system is perfect. You'll always have the guy trying to game it, and always have the guy trying to abuse it.

All that said, what are the university's supposed to do if they have a credible accusation of rape that law enforcement refuses to act on? Let the accused run around campus to do it again? That's crazy talk.

Yes it IS a constitutional issue, because you are being DENIED something others can do for no reason. I would call that......discrimination.

So folks, now Joe is whining about the Chicago PD. Yes, I heard of John Burge too, but I have a question-------------> did you hear about the Daly 2nd cousin or whatever he was, who killed someone outside a nightclub, and basically got off?

Hmmmmmm, by the way, who has run Chicago for about 50 years? Talk about totalitarian!

And now finally, Jose' wants to be a vigy, AKA vigilante. He doesn't care what the law says, he doesn't care about rules, if he or his friendly Marxist proffesors think someone needs punished; even without any evidence, well then good ole Jose' AKA Joe, is all for it. He wants to stigmatize a man, on the word of a woman, even if there is not one shred of evidence, or if the evidence shows she is lying. This is why Obama put this forward, because in the real world, we have EQUAL PROTECTION under the law. Now Jose' wants to REMOVE that from men on campus, because he knows so much.

This is why leftists/Marxists are dangerous people. When they do NOT like a law like deportation for illegals, they demand you ignore it, and make every excuse why the won't (because they can't) change it. But when they want to PANDER to certain groups, sometimes they want to OVER REACH the law, while denying others their rights.

Our founders were brilliant people. Jose' and his friends are MARXISTS trying to deny MEN their rights. But don't think it is just men, hell.......they want to send men into the womens room, and deny them their privacy. It is how they destroy a civil society, by using CHAOS!

 

[Clementine]

We have something better than unions to protect us. It's called the constitution. And we do not sign an agreement waiving their constitutional rights when they take a job. Our rights are inalienable. Period. That is something libs can't get through their heads.

Except this isn't a constitutional issue. You don't have a right to attend college. Attending college is - and should be - a privilege.

The reason so few rape cases go to trial is because of a lack of evidence. Our rights say evidence must prove something beyond a shadow of a doubt. Never will it be fair to be punished based solely on the word of a person.

Except that we send poor people to prison all the time based on that. I met a young man who spent 10 years of his life in prison because our wonderful Chicago PD beat a confession out of one of his friends, and he was implicated. Didn't matter that the guy immediately recanted the confession. They were all convicted anyway.

Unions also protect some people that don't deserve it.

I agree, they do. No system is perfect. You'll always have the guy trying to game it, and always have the guy trying to abuse it.

All that said, what are the university's supposed to do if they have a credible accusation of rape that law enforcement refuses to act on? Let the accused run around campus to do it again? That's crazy talk.

I am aware that some go to prison when they shouldn't. That is why I support the Innocence Project, though they are not enough.

We do have overzealous assholes who are more worried about high conviction rates than justice. That is why I do not support anyone being punished, especially not by colleges or businesses, without evidence. Most cases are circumstantial and witnesses are the least reliable evidence.

You can't whine that most rape cases go without convictions because of a lack of evidence and support the courts, even kangaroo courts, of taking their word as if it's all the proof needed, then whine about others being sent to prison based on the word of another.

It's wrong to punish anyone without proof of guilt.

 

[Weatherman2020]

So you are for firing people based upon a kangaroo court with no Constitutional rights?

Yep, you lefties are fascists.

Hey, Buddy, At Will Employment. You can get fired if the boss looks at you funny.

And you know what, you sign up for that when you agree to take their money.

Now, if you want to make it such that firing people without cause becomes really difficult, we have something for that. They are called "Unions". You know, those things guys on your side are trying to get rid of for the mortal fear that someone might still be pulling down a middle class wage somewhere.

Now, that said, no university is expelling a student unless they are on some pretty firm ground. After all, he could sue.

The reality is, 80% of campus rape goes unreported. Of the 20% that are reported, very few of them get prosecuted. Less than 3% of all rapists end up even spending a DAY in prison.

So I can kick out any kid from college I want.

WHOO HOOO!

 

[JoeB131]

Yes it IS a constitutional issue, because you are being DENIED something others can do for no reason. I would call that......discrimination.

Well, no, not really. There's a whole shitload of things they can throw you off college for that wouldn't be criminally actionable. You know, like 'Not getting good grades". or "Being flat ass drunk and asleep during class every day because you are partying too hard."

So folks, now Joe is whining about the Chicago PD. Yes, I heard of John Burge too, but I have a question-------------> did you hear about the Daly 2nd cousin or whatever he was, who killed someone outside a nightclub, and basically got off?

Hmmmmmm, by the way, who has run Chicago for about 50 years? Talk about totalitarian!

Meh.... Okay besides the fact that the Daley Cousin was convicted of a crime (just not a very serious one), it doesn't take away from my original point. WE DO convict people on merely someone's word. So a university is pretty much justified in expelling a student based on someone's word if they find that word credible.

And now finally, Jose' wants to be a vigy, AKA vigilante. He doesn't care what the law says, he doesn't care about rules, if he or his friendly Marxist proffesors think someone needs punished; even without any evidence, well then good ole Jose' AKA Joe, is all for it. He wants to stigmatize a man, on the word of a woman, even if there is not one shred of evidence, or if the evidence shows she is lying. This is why Obama put this forward, because in the real world, we have EQUAL PROTECTION under the law. Now Jose' wants to REMOVE that from men on campus, because he knows so much.

Okay, again, the thing is, the University is not responsible for the "constitutional rights" of a student. Their paramount concern is the safety of the student body in general.

If they have good evidence that Little Timmy gets a bit rapey when he's at a frat-party, they have an obligation to protect the other students from him.

And now finally, Jose' wants to be a vigy, AKA vigilante. He doesn't care what the law says, he doesn't care about rules, if he or his friendly Marxist proffesors think someone needs punished; even without any evidence, well then good ole Jose' AKA Joe, is all for it. He wants to stigmatize a man, on the word of a woman, even if there is not one shred of evidence, or if the evidence shows she is lying. This is why Obama put this forward, because in the real world, we have EQUAL PROTECTION under the law. Now Jose' wants to REMOVE that from men on campus, because he knows so much.

This isn't a matter of law. When you enroll in a campus, you agree to abide by their rules. When you take a job, you agree to abide by their rules.

This is why leftists/Marxists are dangerous people. When they do NOT like a law like deportation for illegals, they demand you ignore it, and make every excuse why the won't (because they can't) change it. But when they want to PANDER to certain groups, sometimes they want to OVER REACH the law, while denying others their rights.

Well, no, the reason why the laws on illegals are ignored is because they are unworkable. They can get in faster than we can throw them out. We throw them out, they sneak right back in. Now, on other threads, I've told you my solution to this problem. But they actually involve holding the rich people who cause the problem accountable.

Our founders were brilliant people. Jose' and his friends are MARXISTS trying to deny MEN their rights. But don't think it is just men, hell.......they want to send men into the womens room, and deny them their privacy. It is how they destroy a civil society, by using CHAOS!

Dude, it's hard to keep track of all the rabbit holes you want to run down. The Founders shit in chamber pots and thought leeches were a good medical treatment.

We have to live in the real world of 2017.

In that world, women who say they were raped usually were.
Some people aren't the gender they were born into.
And immigration laws that worked in 1950 don't work today.

 

[JoeB131]

So I can kick out any kid from college I want.

WHOO HOOO!

If you own a college, sure. You should probably give them their money back though, if you are going to capriously throw them out.

 

[Weatherman2020]

So I can kick out any kid from college I want.

WHOO HOOO!

If you own a college, sure. You should probably give them their money back though, if you are going to capriously throw them out.

Boy, takes a real fascist to think you can just deny people a college education on a mere whim.
Congrats.

 

[JoeB131]

Boy, takes a real fascist to think you can just deny people a college education on a mere whim.
Congrats.

Please point out to me where a College Education- or any kind of education - is spelled out as a "right" in the constitution.

Thanks.

No one is getting thrown out on a "whim". If you are getting thrown out on your ass for raping a fellow student, you probably did it.

 

[Weatherman2020]

Boy, takes a real fascist to think you can just deny people a college education on a mere whim.
Congrats.

Please point out to me where a College Education- or any kind of education - is spelled out as a "right" in the constitution.

Thanks.

No one is getting thrown out on a "whim". If you are getting thrown out on your ass for raping a fellow student, you probably did it.

Please let us know why you think a college can refuse to educate people based upon sex.

 

[bripat9643]

Boy, takes a real fascist to think you can just deny people a college education on a mere whim.
Congrats.

Please point out to me where a College Education- or any kind of education - is spelled out as a "right" in the constitution.

Thanks.

No one is getting thrown out on a "whim". If you are getting thrown out on your ass for raping a fellow student, you probably did it.

ROFL! There's your "guilty until proven innocent" theory again. You are such a fucking Nazi.

 

[Coyote]

Does anyone find it ironic that someone like Trump is rewriting campus guidelines on sexual assault?

 

[Coyote]

I missed that one. If you rape someone at your work your work does not hold a trial. You call the cops, who then present it to the DA who then takes you to court where Constitutional procedures are followed.

Fortunately Devos is eliminating the insanity.

Here Is Every Crazy Title IX Rape Case Betsy DeVos Referenced, Plus a Bunch More

I promise you, if you rape your coworker, or even get accused of raping your coworker, you WILL get fired.

Pretty much the same thing here. You act badly on campus, you get expelled.

The real problem is exactly the opposite of what De Vos thinks it is. It isn't that universities are being too hard core prosecuting rapists, it's that htey are as much as possible, sweeping these incidents under the rug.

NObody wants to send their daughter to Rape U.

You're an idiot. You don't get to fire someone or remove them from school without evidence and a proper investigation and trial. It's the law you moron. Your fucking daughter doesn't get to ruin the life of someone on hearsay and bullshit charges because she sucked a dick and felt bad about it. And if she is proven to have falsely accused someone she needs to be exposed as the fraud and expelled and her life should be ruined. Rape isn't a one sided joke.

It is happening in professional sports and other private business. They can fire you for misconduct, violating conduct codes etc and no crime charges or police involvement.

I will agree though that the current situation concerning sexual assault on campus is too one sided, and does not give the accused enough protections and rights. I think the universities can handle it internally without the sort of draconian measures suggested by deVoss that has the potential of attacking the victim and inhibiting reporting.

Accusing someone of rape isn't misconduct and it better be treated with more care than some half ass university student council. If you want rape to be handled by a school as a disciplinary action fine. Take it off the books as a crime. The law prosecutes crimes not you.

Actually the university, and for that matter any school or institution or business or even pro sports team has their own internal guidelines for handling disciplinary actions if a crime has been committed or alleged even.

That doesn't alter the fact it is also a crime and can also be handled by the police.

 

[bripat9643]

Does anyone find it ironic that someone like Trump is rewriting campus guidelines on sexual assault?

He is the victim of exactly the same kind of thing.

 

[Coyote]

Does anyone find it ironic that someone like Trump is rewriting campus guidelines on sexual assault?

He is the victim of exactly the same kind of thing.

Sure.

 

[Weatherman2020]

I missed that one. If you rape someone at your work your work does not hold a trial. You call the cops, who then present it to the DA who then takes you to court where Constitutional procedures are followed.

Fortunately Devos is eliminating the insanity.

Here Is Every Crazy Title IX Rape Case Betsy DeVos Referenced, Plus a Bunch More

I promise you, if you rape your coworker, or even get accused of raping your coworker, you WILL get fired.

Pretty much the same thing here. You act badly on campus, you get expelled.

The real problem is exactly the opposite of what De Vos thinks it is. It isn't that universities are being too hard core prosecuting rapists, it's that htey are as much as possible, sweeping these incidents under the rug.

NObody wants to send their daughter to Rape U.

You're an idiot. You don't get to fire someone or remove them from school without evidence and a proper investigation and trial. It's the law you moron. Your fucking daughter doesn't get to ruin the life of someone on hearsay and bullshit charges because she sucked a dick and felt bad about it. And if she is proven to have falsely accused someone she needs to be exposed as the fraud and expelled and her life should be ruined. Rape isn't a one sided joke.

It is happening in professional sports and other private business. They can fire you for misconduct, violating conduct codes etc and no crime charges or police involvement.

I will agree though that the current situation concerning sexual assault on campus is too one sided, and does not give the accused enough protections and rights. I think the universities can handle it internally without the sort of draconian measures suggested by deVoss that has the potential of attacking the victim and inhibiting reporting.

Accusing someone of rape isn't misconduct and it better be treated with more care than some half ass university student council. If you want rape to be handled by a school as a disciplinary action fine. Take it off the books as a crime. The law prosecutes crimes not you.

Actually the university, and for that matter any school or institution or business or even pro sports team has their own internal guidelines for handling disciplinary actions if a crime has been committed or alleged even.

That doesn't alter the fact it is also a crime and can also be handled by the police.

So you agree that all homosexuals can be kicked out for being accused of a crime.

 

[Missouri_Mike]

I missed that one. If you rape someone at your work your work does not hold a trial. You call the cops, who then present it to the DA who then takes you to court where Constitutional procedures are followed.

Fortunately Devos is eliminating the insanity.

Here Is Every Crazy Title IX Rape Case Betsy DeVos Referenced, Plus a Bunch More

I promise you, if you rape your coworker, or even get accused of raping your coworker, you WILL get fired.

Pretty much the same thing here. You act badly on campus, you get expelled.

The real problem is exactly the opposite of what De Vos thinks it is. It isn't that universities are being too hard core prosecuting rapists, it's that htey are as much as possible, sweeping these incidents under the rug.

NObody wants to send their daughter to Rape U.

You're an idiot. You don't get to fire someone or remove them from school without evidence and a proper investigation and trial. It's the law you moron. Your fucking daughter doesn't get to ruin the life of someone on hearsay and bullshit charges because she sucked a dick and felt bad about it. And if she is proven to have falsely accused someone she needs to be exposed as the fraud and expelled and her life should be ruined. Rape isn't a one sided joke.

It is happening in professional sports and other private business. They can fire you for misconduct, violating conduct codes etc and no crime charges or police involvement.

I will agree though that the current situation concerning sexual assault on campus is too one sided, and does not give the accused enough protections and rights. I think the universities can handle it internally without the sort of draconian measures suggested by deVoss that has the potential of attacking the victim and inhibiting reporting.

Accusing someone of rape isn't misconduct and it better be treated with more care than some half ass university student council. If you want rape to be handled by a school as a disciplinary action fine. Take it off the books as a crime. The law prosecutes crimes not you.

Actually the university, and for that matter any school or institution or business or even pro sports team has their own internal guidelines for handling disciplinary actions if a crime has been committed or alleged even.

That doesn't alter the fact it is also a crime and can also be handled by the police.

And none of them are above the law. They can and do get sued for falsely punishing someone.

 

[JoeB131]

Please let us know why you think a college can refuse to educate people based upon sex.

Go back, read what I said, and then have a grownup explain the big words to you, Cartoon boy.

 

[JoeB131]

ROFL! There's your "guilty until proven innocent" theory again. You are such a fucking Nazi.

Again, the university isn't a right. They have the prerogative to throw someone out if they think that person is a threat to their students.

He is the victim of exactly the same kind of thing.

you mean the part where he was caught on tape ADMITTING that he had sexually assaulted women?

 

[bripat9643]

ROFL! There's your "guilty until proven innocent" theory again. You are such a fucking Nazi.

Again, the university isn't a right. They have the prerogative to throw someone out if they think that person is a threat to their students.

Not without due process, they don't.

He is the victim of exactly the same kind of thing.

you mean the part where he was caught on tape ADMITTING that he had sexually assaulted women?

He admitted no such thing, cockroach. Every accusation that he harassed or assaulted someone turned out to be false. That's exactly why we don't allow snowflakes in the university governing bodies determine the guilt of anyone accused of a crime. They always put political considerations ahead of the rules of justice.