Who here "opposes" this simple Sanders' proposal?

[whitehall]

Simple Sanders....humm. After the federal government "compels" the private sector to "negotiate" what happens next?

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

I pretty sure that the insurers already beat the crap out of Pharma and the retailers for reductions.

If you're gonna "negotiate" --- that's gotta be for each drug individually. Because SOME drugs are only applicable to 10,000 patients or less. You start beating on THOSE drugs -- and folks are gonna die. Because NO pharma will bring a low-volume drug to the market. Another example of socialists not understanding how stuff really works.

It's always a fictional view of a perfectly simple world, where stuff just magically gets willed into existence and costs whatever "good folks with the best intentions" want them to cost.

The future is really in "custom drugs".. Targeted to characteristics of your genome. So this "negotiation" is gonna cost a trainload if it's done for 10 or 100 patients at a time..

I'm an insulin dependent diabetic with crap insurance so I pay for all my medications with cash.

Insulin kept getting more and more expensive and I couldn't figure out why. I called the manufacturer, searched the internet, but could get no satisfactory answer. Then I stumbled on it:

I asked a pharmacist about it at my grocery store, and she couldn't give me an answer either, but she did say that Walmart had a generic insulin for much cheaper. I'm not crazy about taking Walmart insulin, so I discarded the idea.

When the prices increased again, I went to investigate. What I found is that this generic insulin was not generic at all. It was made by Lilly--the same manufacture of the insulin I was using, but put an ® on the package to identify Walmart's generic drug company name--Reliance.

It was less than half the price I was paying for my insulin, but made by the exact same people. I'm still purchasing it today. So what happened?

What happened is that Walmart cornered Lilly into selling their insulin cheaper because Walmart has a huge prescription customer base. Lilly in return increased the price of their insulin everywhere else, and that's why it was getting so expensive. It was a dirty deal between Lilly and Walmart.

The reason I wrote this story is to point out what would happen if drug companies would be pressured into lowering their prices; they would only increase their prices on their other products, or on the same product if let's say the deal was made for Medicare only. We would still be paying.

It's like Commie Care--cost shifting, but no real solution.

Sorry about your situation, but Lily may be compared to the extortionist who peddles "insurance"......Have you ever wondered why European countries do not succumb to such tactics?

Insurance companies do one thing: pay the bills. That's it. They do nothing different than our government does with our social programs. In fact, our government has hired private insurance to do their billing for them because they are so efficient at it.

Until Commie Care came along, health insurance companies made a reasonable profit, but not record profits like companies outside of the healthcare industry. They were between 2% and 9% I believe.

Insurance companies are not the major problem with healthcare costs.

Actually -- they have wrestled the doctors, other providers and pharma into submission. Doctors no longer are "raking it in" and many are retiring early.. Then you get a Sanders that comes along and PRETENDS that the govt is more competent at arm-twisting. And I guess they are if they can THREATEN your business.

But it's not like the Insurance companies aren't screwing the doctors, hospitals and even big Pharma every chance they get. Since O-care -- Tenn has been taken over by BlueCrossBlueShield. Effectively now a monopoly. Can raise prices all they want. And tell doctors to just bang it if they won't take their reimbursement rates.

The exact same is going on with government patients as well.

Medicare and Medicaid typically pay about 2/3 of the bill to the providers of their patients. To recoup those losses, doctors and facilities increase the cost of their services to private pay and privately insured patients. This is one of the reasons premiums have had a steady pace of increases the last few decades.

If you do a search on medical facilities that closed down, you would probably find that a majority of them closed down in poorer areas where most of the clients were government patients. The facilities couldn't recoup the losses because they had such a small amount of private insured patients.

So the solution to the problem is for government to pay their providers in full. But how could they do that? They would have to severely increase taxes such as Medicare deductions on your paycheck.

If that took place, then working people would revolt. They would elect leaders that would change the system such as a private insured system. That would take the control away from the government and nobody is about to do that.

 

[flacaltenn]

I pretty sure that the insurers already beat the crap out of Pharma and the retailers for reductions.

If you're gonna "negotiate" --- that's gotta be for each drug individually. Because SOME drugs are only applicable to 10,000 patients or less. You start beating on THOSE drugs -- and folks are gonna die. Because NO pharma will bring a low-volume drug to the market. Another example of socialists not understanding how stuff really works.

It's always a fictional view of a perfectly simple world, where stuff just magically gets willed into existence and costs whatever "good folks with the best intentions" want them to cost.

The future is really in "custom drugs".. Targeted to characteristics of your genome. So this "negotiation" is gonna cost a trainload if it's done for 10 or 100 patients at a time..

I'm an insulin dependent diabetic with crap insurance so I pay for all my medications with cash.

Insulin kept getting more and more expensive and I couldn't figure out why. I called the manufacturer, searched the internet, but could get no satisfactory answer. Then I stumbled on it:

I asked a pharmacist about it at my grocery store, and she couldn't give me an answer either, but she did say that Walmart had a generic insulin for much cheaper. I'm not crazy about taking Walmart insulin, so I discarded the idea.

When the prices increased again, I went to investigate. What I found is that this generic insulin was not generic at all. It was made by Lilly--the same manufacture of the insulin I was using, but put an ® on the package to identify Walmart's generic drug company name--Reliance.

It was less than half the price I was paying for my insulin, but made by the exact same people. I'm still purchasing it today. So what happened?

What happened is that Walmart cornered Lilly into selling their insulin cheaper because Walmart has a huge prescription customer base. Lilly in return increased the price of their insulin everywhere else, and that's why it was getting so expensive. It was a dirty deal between Lilly and Walmart.

The reason I wrote this story is to point out what would happen if drug companies would be pressured into lowering their prices; they would only increase their prices on their other products, or on the same product if let's say the deal was made for Medicare only. We would still be paying.

It's like Commie Care--cost shifting, but no real solution.

One of the differences is that Walmart is structured so that it can PASS ON the savings that it negotiated to consumers. You don't know what deals WalGreens/CVS/RiteAid have or what they take off the top. But they could never pass AS MUCH of the savings on to you. I'm sure they also have "deals".

Insurance companies also beat up the Pharmas and retailers. The insurance cost is typically less than a 1/3 of the "retail cost" at the pharmacy counter for the uninsured..

What is needed is stop with the special deals. Put consumers back into seeking the lowest price and let the retailers compete for the business. It's like reading the coverage bill from you last visit. Doctor ASKED for $225, the insurance company ALLOWED $95 and you're responsible for the deductible, copay, and OOP. So if you walked in WITHOUT insurance -- the bill would be twice. If enough consumers bargained for terms directly, You'd get that visit for $95 without paying the insurers to go beat the doctors up for you..

I disagree because I'm a truck driver, and I have first hand information on how Walmart works because we have customers that make products for them.

Walmart is constantly hounding their suppliers for lower prices. Walmart is huge in this country, and when they say jump, you ask how high?

In response to Walmart demands, our customers who manufacture products for Walmart go down the line to hound the suppliers that they depend on to make parts for their products.

It's like an assembly line. Our customer makes widgets. But they don't make the entire widget, they only make the plastic housing. The parts that go onto the housing are made by other companies. Then they may need foam for the widgets, so they search for the cheapest foam manufacturers either here or abroad because that's what Walmart demands.

This is what I believe what happened in the Lilly case. If Lilly didn't find a way to give Walmart a huge deal, then Walmart would seek other companies that would cater to their demands.

I didn't disagree with ANY of that.. I have clients who deal with WalMart as well. One of our clients used to do all the product shelf labeling, deli scaling, and point of sale equipment. My only point was -- that Walmart is structured so if they GET those deals and beat suppliers into submission --- the consumers get a bigger cut of the savings than they would if WalGreens or CVS made the same deal.

And that thinking that the government would be MORE diligent or effective at strong-arming the suppliers is just pure fantasy. Unless of course, the government uses its POWER to force and coerce the deal. Like threatening to unionize their operation by force ---- for example. Or forcing them to change employment contracts. It's uglier than when Walmart does it..

 

[nat4900]

So the question is, are the drug companies the culprit or our government?

Probably both......Your cousin (whom I presume works at NIH) will probably confirm that a lot of research on the efficacy of drugs is done by the feds on taxpayers' allocations...in other words, big pharma is "subsidized' by the taxpayers.....all of us.

 

[elektra]

Page not found.

Try again, if interested...

Drug Company Profits Soar as Taxpayers Foot the Bill

If a company does not make a profit how do they pay employees?

The only reason the Government would foot the bill is we have elected socialists for way too long.

 

[eagle1462010]

One of Sanders' proposal is not only sane but doable if only congress was not a bunch of self-centered cowards...The proposal is to compel Medicare to openly negotiate with big pharmaceuticals companies for lower prices based on volume.....

Who would lose if this proposal were to become a reality? Big pharma's CEOs and board members who no longer could upgrade to more modern Lear jets every few years.

Tell that to the politicians from both sides of the Isle................the one's who pick the winners and losers based on campaign contributions..................

A very long time ago our Gov't was only a ref in the game.....................Now they decide the winners and losers....................

 

[elektra]

So simple to just nationalize the drug companies when the unlimited abilities of a a "president" with a phone and a pen are exposed to the harsh realities of daylight. Precedent, dear children, has already been set. You want government-issue drugs then get behind Nutty Old Uncle Bernie. Remember to fill out the forms for your ration cards.

Fantastic...Drug companies rely on nitwits....like you.....to belittle any attempt to curtail their ludicrous profits......

http://www.thefiscaltimes.com/2015/07/30/Drug-Company-Profits-Soar-Taxpayers-Foot-Bill

Yes, drug companies should lose money, go bankrupt, then doctors can simply operate on patients without drugs that stop infection or kill the pain.

 

[Mac1958]

One of Sanders' proposal is not only sane but doable if only congress was not a bunch of self-centered cowards...The proposal is to compel Medicare to openly negotiate with big pharmaceuticals companies for lower prices based on volume.....

Who would lose if this proposal were to become a reality? Big pharma's CEOs and board members who no longer could upgrade to more modern Lear jets every few years.

The pharma companies simply wouldn't negotiate, they'd no longer make those drugs available through Medicare. Like a health insurer pulling out of the ACA.

It would damage revenues, sure, but not net earnings.

Fewer choices would then be available, and R&D would go in different directions.
.

 

[elektra]

I pretty sure that the insurers already beat the crap out of Pharma and the retailers for reductions.

If you're gonna "negotiate" --- that's gotta be for each drug individually. Because SOME drugs are only applicable to 10,000 patients or less. You start beating on THOSE drugs -- and folks are gonna die. Because NO pharma will bring a low-volume drug to the market. Another example of socialists not understanding how stuff really works.

It's always a fictional view of a perfectly simple world, where stuff just magically gets willed into existence and costs whatever "good folks with the best intentions" want them to cost.

The future is really in "custom drugs".. Targeted to characteristics of your genome. So this "negotiation" is gonna cost a trainload if it's done for 10 or 100 patients at a time..

I'm an insulin dependent diabetic with crap insurance so I pay for all my medications with cash.

Insulin kept getting more and more expensive and I couldn't figure out why. I called the manufacturer, searched the internet, but could get no satisfactory answer. Then I stumbled on it:

I asked a pharmacist about it at my grocery store, and she couldn't give me an answer either, but she did say that Walmart had a generic insulin for much cheaper. I'm not crazy about taking Walmart insulin, so I discarded the idea.

When the prices increased again, I went to investigate. What I found is that this generic insulin was not generic at all. It was made by Lilly--the same manufacture of the insulin I was using, but put an ® on the package to identify Walmart's generic drug company name--Reliance.

It was less than half the price I was paying for my insulin, but made by the exact same people. I'm still purchasing it today. So what happened?

What happened is that Walmart cornered Lilly into selling their insulin cheaper because Walmart has a huge prescription customer base. Lilly in return increased the price of their insulin everywhere else, and that's why it was getting so expensive. It was a dirty deal between Lilly and Walmart.

The reason I wrote this story is to point out what would happen if drug companies would be pressured into lowering their prices; they would only increase their prices on their other products, or on the same product if let's say the deal was made for Medicare only. We would still be paying.

It's like Commie Care--cost shifting, but no real solution.

Sorry about your situation, but Lily may be compared to the extortionist who peddles "insurance"......Have you ever wondered why European countries do not succumb to such tactics?

Insurance companies do one thing: pay the bills. That's it. They do nothing different than our government does with our social programs. In fact, our government has hired private insurance to do their billing for them because they are so efficient at it.

Until Commie Care came along, health insurance companies made a reasonable profit, but not record profits like companies outside of the healthcare industry. They were between 2% and 9% I believe.

Insurance companies are not the major problem with healthcare costs.

Actually -- they have wrestled the doctors, other providers and pharma into submission. Doctors no longer are "raking it in" and many are retiring early.. Then you get a Sanders that comes along and PRETENDS that the govt is more competent at arm-twisting. And I guess they are if they can THREATEN your business.

But it's not like the Insurance companies aren't screwing the doctors, hospitals and even big Pharma every chance they get. Since O-care -- Tenn has been taken over by BlueCrossBlueShield. Effectively now a monopoly. Can raise prices all they want. And tell doctors to just bang it if they won't take their reimbursement rates.

The exact same is going on with government patients as well.

Medicare and Medicaid typically pay about 2/3 of the bill to the providers of their patients. To recoup those losses, doctors and facilities increase the cost of their services to private pay and privately insured patients. This is one of the reasons premiums have had a steady pace of increases the last few decades.

If you do a search on medical facilities that closed down, you would probably find that a majority of them closed down in poorer areas where most of the clients were government patients. The facilities couldn't recoup the losses because they had such a small amount of private insured patients.

So the solution to the problem is for government to pay their providers in full. But how could they do that? They would have to severely increase taxes such as Medicare deductions on your paycheck.

If that took place, then working people would revolt. They would elect leaders that would change the system such as a private insured system. That would take the control away from the government and nobody is about to do that.

My dentist charges me half the price that they charge insurance companies. I think this supports what you state.

I bet if we paid cash and did not use the government or insurance, the price for medical would be affordable.

 

[elektra]

For some of those really, really dense right wingers, let me repeat these sentences:

Congress barred Medicare from negotiating the way Medicaid and the Department of Veterans Affairs do with drug makers to get lower prices. Instead, lawmakers insisted the job be done by private insurance companies.”

Congress? Yet you are blind to all the damage democrat controlled congresses have done to the Medical Industry. Simply stating congress means nothing, it is like you read headlines and run with them without thinking or researching what you read.

You post like you are very dense.

 

[elektra]

Next time just say you don't know it gives one much more credibilty than going but Bush.

Well, I could have blamed your grandmother for Medicare Part D....but then I thought that Bush should bear at least some of the blame, don't you think?

Bush should share the blame, sure, he is a socialist, just cause you call yourself a Republican does not make you a Conservative.

 

[Wilbur Right]

The proposal is to compel Medicare to openly negotiate with big pharmaceuticals companies for lower prices based on volume.....

Who would lose if this proposal were to become a reality?

But but but if Medicare was able to negotiate lower reimbursement costs wouldnt that mean less government spending?

At the cost of private company profitability?

As you can tell from the responses from the right wing toadys, that cant happen.
It would be SO bad for the government to spend less. According to Republicans anyway.

Did you see the pork they loaded up into their latest budget proposal?

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

I'm an insulin dependent diabetic with crap insurance so I pay for all my medications with cash.

Insulin kept getting more and more expensive and I couldn't figure out why. I called the manufacturer, searched the internet, but could get no satisfactory answer. Then I stumbled on it:

I asked a pharmacist about it at my grocery store, and she couldn't give me an answer either, but she did say that Walmart had a generic insulin for much cheaper. I'm not crazy about taking Walmart insulin, so I discarded the idea.

When the prices increased again, I went to investigate. What I found is that this generic insulin was not generic at all. It was made by Lilly--the same manufacture of the insulin I was using, but put an ® on the package to identify Walmart's generic drug company name--Reliance.

It was less than half the price I was paying for my insulin, but made by the exact same people. I'm still purchasing it today. So what happened?

What happened is that Walmart cornered Lilly into selling their insulin cheaper because Walmart has a huge prescription customer base. Lilly in return increased the price of their insulin everywhere else, and that's why it was getting so expensive. It was a dirty deal between Lilly and Walmart.

The reason I wrote this story is to point out what would happen if drug companies would be pressured into lowering their prices; they would only increase their prices on their other products, or on the same product if let's say the deal was made for Medicare only. We would still be paying.

It's like Commie Care--cost shifting, but no real solution.

Sorry about your situation, but Lily may be compared to the extortionist who peddles "insurance"......Have you ever wondered why European countries do not succumb to such tactics?

Insurance companies do one thing: pay the bills. That's it. They do nothing different than our government does with our social programs. In fact, our government has hired private insurance to do their billing for them because they are so efficient at it.

Until Commie Care came along, health insurance companies made a reasonable profit, but not record profits like companies outside of the healthcare industry. They were between 2% and 9% I believe.

Insurance companies are not the major problem with healthcare costs.

Actually -- they have wrestled the doctors, other providers and pharma into submission. Doctors no longer are "raking it in" and many are retiring early.. Then you get a Sanders that comes along and PRETENDS that the govt is more competent at arm-twisting. And I guess they are if they can THREATEN your business.

But it's not like the Insurance companies aren't screwing the doctors, hospitals and even big Pharma every chance they get. Since O-care -- Tenn has been taken over by BlueCrossBlueShield. Effectively now a monopoly. Can raise prices all they want. And tell doctors to just bang it if they won't take their reimbursement rates.

The exact same is going on with government patients as well.

Medicare and Medicaid typically pay about 2/3 of the bill to the providers of their patients. To recoup those losses, doctors and facilities increase the cost of their services to private pay and privately insured patients. This is one of the reasons premiums have had a steady pace of increases the last few decades.

If you do a search on medical facilities that closed down, you would probably find that a majority of them closed down in poorer areas where most of the clients were government patients. The facilities couldn't recoup the losses because they had such a small amount of private insured patients.

So the solution to the problem is for government to pay their providers in full. But how could they do that? They would have to severely increase taxes such as Medicare deductions on your paycheck.

If that took place, then working people would revolt. They would elect leaders that would change the system such as a private insured system. That would take the control away from the government and nobody is about to do that.

My dentist charges me half the price that they charge insurance companies. I think this supports what you state.

I bet if we paid cash and did not use the government or insurance, the price for medical would be affordable.

This is true which is why I'm for a mandatory Health Savings account. It would be deducted from your paycheck like a tax, except it would go towards your medical care. You have to use that account first before insurance kicks in.

Insurance companies for years have been complaining about paperwork costs. You see a doctor for $150.00, and the paperwork goes to the insurance companies who in return have to create paperwork to send back along with the check. Then that charge may only apply to your deductible or the insurance company pays part of it.

By eliminating all that, the doctor could do with less staff, it would bypass the insurance company who can use their resources for much larger claims, and the price would go down.

It could be a small deduction let's say 2% for younger workers, and maybe 3% or so for middle-aged workers. That money will add up fast, and you could use it like a debit card where you just swipe it at the end of your doctors visits, the ER or the clinic.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Page not found.

Try again, if interested...

Drug Company Profits Soar as Taxpayers Foot the Bill

If a company does not make a profit how do they pay employees?

The only reason the Government would foot the bill is we have elected socialists for way too long.

Lol, now they complain about how much insurance companies make, but if insurance companies began to pay minimum wage to low or non-skilled workers, then they would be back here complaining about insurance companies not paying a livable wage.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

So the question is, are the drug companies the culprit or our government?

Probably both......Your cousin (whom I presume works at NIH) will probably confirm that a lot of research on the efficacy of drugs is done by the feds on taxpayers' allocations...in other words, big pharma is "subsidized' by the taxpayers.....all of us.

No not really. Drug companies are like any other company. They get much of their money from stockholders. They attract stockholders by having a comfortable or good profit margin so it's up to the CEO to bring those investors in.

 

[nat4900]

Yes, drug companies should lose money, go bankrupt, then doctors can simply operate on patients without drugs that stop infection or kill the pain.

What a MORONIC "conclusion"......Even worse than your usual stupidity.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

I pretty sure that the insurers already beat the crap out of Pharma and the retailers for reductions.

If you're gonna "negotiate" --- that's gotta be for each drug individually. Because SOME drugs are only applicable to 10,000 patients or less. You start beating on THOSE drugs -- and folks are gonna die. Because NO pharma will bring a low-volume drug to the market. Another example of socialists not understanding how stuff really works.

It's always a fictional view of a perfectly simple world, where stuff just magically gets willed into existence and costs whatever "good folks with the best intentions" want them to cost.

The future is really in "custom drugs".. Targeted to characteristics of your genome. So this "negotiation" is gonna cost a trainload if it's done for 10 or 100 patients at a time..

I'm an insulin dependent diabetic with crap insurance so I pay for all my medications with cash.

Insulin kept getting more and more expensive and I couldn't figure out why. I called the manufacturer, searched the internet, but could get no satisfactory answer. Then I stumbled on it:

I asked a pharmacist about it at my grocery store, and she couldn't give me an answer either, but she did say that Walmart had a generic insulin for much cheaper. I'm not crazy about taking Walmart insulin, so I discarded the idea.

When the prices increased again, I went to investigate. What I found is that this generic insulin was not generic at all. It was made by Lilly--the same manufacture of the insulin I was using, but put an ® on the package to identify Walmart's generic drug company name--Reliance.

It was less than half the price I was paying for my insulin, but made by the exact same people. I'm still purchasing it today. So what happened?

What happened is that Walmart cornered Lilly into selling their insulin cheaper because Walmart has a huge prescription customer base. Lilly in return increased the price of their insulin everywhere else, and that's why it was getting so expensive. It was a dirty deal between Lilly and Walmart.

The reason I wrote this story is to point out what would happen if drug companies would be pressured into lowering their prices; they would only increase their prices on their other products, or on the same product if let's say the deal was made for Medicare only. We would still be paying.

It's like Commie Care--cost shifting, but no real solution.

One of the differences is that Walmart is structured so that it can PASS ON the savings that it negotiated to consumers. You don't know what deals WalGreens/CVS/RiteAid have or what they take off the top. But they could never pass AS MUCH of the savings on to you. I'm sure they also have "deals".

Insurance companies also beat up the Pharmas and retailers. The insurance cost is typically less than a 1/3 of the "retail cost" at the pharmacy counter for the uninsured..

What is needed is stop with the special deals. Put consumers back into seeking the lowest price and let the retailers compete for the business. It's like reading the coverage bill from you last visit. Doctor ASKED for $225, the insurance company ALLOWED $95 and you're responsible for the deductible, copay, and OOP. So if you walked in WITHOUT insurance -- the bill would be twice. If enough consumers bargained for terms directly, You'd get that visit for $95 without paying the insurers to go beat the doctors up for you..

I disagree because I'm a truck driver, and I have first hand information on how Walmart works because we have customers that make products for them.

Walmart is constantly hounding their suppliers for lower prices. Walmart is huge in this country, and when they say jump, you ask how high?

In response to Walmart demands, our customers who manufacture products for Walmart go down the line to hound the suppliers that they depend on to make parts for their products.

It's like an assembly line. Our customer makes widgets. But they don't make the entire widget, they only make the plastic housing. The parts that go onto the housing are made by other companies. Then they may need foam for the widgets, so they search for the cheapest foam manufacturers either here or abroad because that's what Walmart demands.

This is what I believe what happened in the Lilly case. If Lilly didn't find a way to give Walmart a huge deal, then Walmart would seek other companies that would cater to their demands.

I didn't disagree with ANY of that.. I have clients who deal with WalMart as well. One of our clients used to do all the product shelf labeling, deli scaling, and point of sale equipment. My only point was -- that Walmart is structured so if they GET those deals and beat suppliers into submission --- the consumers get a bigger cut of the savings than they would if WalGreens or CVS made the same deal.

And that thinking that the government would be MORE diligent or effective at strong-arming the suppliers is just pure fantasy. Unless of course, the government uses its POWER to force and coerce the deal. Like threatening to unionize their operation by force ---- for example. Or forcing them to change employment contracts. It's uglier than when Walmart does it..

I totally agree. Democrat government taxes people into submission. It's really much worse than what Walmart does. Just look at the taxes included in the price of a pack of cigarettes. It's ridiculously taxed on every level to the point you pay more taxes for the cigarettes than the product.

 

[elektra]

Sorry about your situation, but Lily may be compared to the extortionist who peddles "insurance"......Have you ever wondered why European countries do not succumb to such tactics?

Insurance companies do one thing: pay the bills. That's it. They do nothing different than our government does with our social programs. In fact, our government has hired private insurance to do their billing for them because they are so efficient at it.

Until Commie Care came along, health insurance companies made a reasonable profit, but not record profits like companies outside of the healthcare industry. They were between 2% and 9% I believe.

Insurance companies are not the major problem with healthcare costs.

Actually -- they have wrestled the doctors, other providers and pharma into submission. Doctors no longer are "raking it in" and many are retiring early.. Then you get a Sanders that comes along and PRETENDS that the govt is more competent at arm-twisting. And I guess they are if they can THREATEN your business.

But it's not like the Insurance companies aren't screwing the doctors, hospitals and even big Pharma every chance they get. Since O-care -- Tenn has been taken over by BlueCrossBlueShield. Effectively now a monopoly. Can raise prices all they want. And tell doctors to just bang it if they won't take their reimbursement rates.

The exact same is going on with government patients as well.

Medicare and Medicaid typically pay about 2/3 of the bill to the providers of their patients. To recoup those losses, doctors and facilities increase the cost of their services to private pay and privately insured patients. This is one of the reasons premiums have had a steady pace of increases the last few decades.

If you do a search on medical facilities that closed down, you would probably find that a majority of them closed down in poorer areas where most of the clients were government patients. The facilities couldn't recoup the losses because they had such a small amount of private insured patients.

So the solution to the problem is for government to pay their providers in full. But how could they do that? They would have to severely increase taxes such as Medicare deductions on your paycheck.

If that took place, then working people would revolt. They would elect leaders that would change the system such as a private insured system. That would take the control away from the government and nobody is about to do that.

My dentist charges me half the price that they charge insurance companies. I think this supports what you state.

I bet if we paid cash and did not use the government or insurance, the price for medical would be affordable.

This is true which is why I'm for a mandatory Health Savings account. It would be deducted from your paycheck like a tax, except it would go towards your medical care. You have to use that account first before insurance kicks in.

Insurance companies for years have been complaining about paperwork costs. You see a doctor for $150.00, and the paperwork goes to the insurance companies who in return have to create paperwork to send back along with the check. Then that charge may only apply to your deductible or the insurance company pays part of it.

By eliminating all that, the doctor could do with less staff, it would bypass the insurance company who can use their resources for much larger claims, and the price would go down.

It could be a small deduction let's say 2% for younger workers, and maybe 3% or so for middle-aged workers. That money will add up fast, and you could use it like a debit card where you just swipe it at the end of your doctors visits, the ER or the clinic.

You are for a stronger Dictatorship!

I dictate your savings should be taken to pay for my next house, that seems fair seeing how much I do for you.

 

[elektra]

Yes, drug companies should lose money, go bankrupt, then doctors can simply operate on patients without drugs that stop infection or kill the pain.

What a MORONIC "conclusion"......Even worse than your usual stupidity.

At least you responded with a why, and did not simply attack my personally.

When a Socialist is confronted with facts, all that is left is a personal attack, under Stalin I would be sent to the Gulag, without a trial. Thank god a little freedom still exists, which some would take had they had the power.

 

[Iceweasel]

^^^^ ...speaking of pharmaceuticals, they got some goooooooood shit out there man.

Facts are facts.

True. But there are facts and there is stupid shit you pull out of your ass because you hate anything not liberal.

Dude, I think Reagan was pretty good, he ran a deficit that helped the economy.

The Democrats chipped in to a large extend but going in the hole is never good. In his case we had a Democrat president before hand that did what many of them do and cut the military.

The deficit helped the boom. Give Reagan more credit.

How does that work in reality? We are paying out about 40% on interest alone, that money can't be used elsewhere?