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No, I'm saying the Soviets didn't need FDR to think about annexing neighbors and subsidizing insurrections in far-flung lands. They were doing it before FDR. If anything, getting the bomb made expansion a more dangerous strategy for the Soviets because it could end up triggering an atomic conflict. Korea, Cuba, Vietnam, Afghanistan, could all have been triggers to WWIII instead of just being proxy wars. Stalin only allowed the Korean War because it was seen as a safe way of gauging US resolve.
On a personal note, that must have hurt when you got caught not knowing a fallacy from a load of wood. The expert and all that, I guess the pain continues?
On a note from the real world, if that had actually happened you might have something clever to say. In reality, you have not only ever offered anything but desperate clinging to a logical fallacy, but you have proven yourself incapable of learning anything about the subject.
And the evidence from the real world that using 238 noted historians and presidential experts as authorities on history is a fallacy? Evidence please.
And then, there is our involvement in Korea and Vietnam, 52 K losses and for what? History. Americans, are you paying attention? I have. Then, there is that silly incursion in Panama. OK, then we never lifted a finger after extremist Iranians took 52 American Embassy people "hostage". Forget that? Forget when the Hesbola killed 250 American Marines in Beirut in the 80's? I didn't. I have seen much much more. I leave it at that.
So very glad you brought up the Korean War.
The bulk of our international problems stem directly from the intentions, strategy, actions, of President Franklin Roosevelt. Had he not supported and inflated the USSR, there would not have been a Red China. Nor a Korean War.
1. Major George Racey Jordan was in charge of expediting materials to the USSR. He testified before Congress that materials and instructions to build that atomic bomb were sent to Stalin. Jordan had proof that the orders he received from the White House insisted that everything requested be sent....priority! Even ahead of material the US army needed.
2. And the result, a disaster for America.
On April 5, 1951, Judge Irving R. Kaufman sentenced the Rosenbergs to death for theft of atomic secrets, and, resulted in "the communist aggression in Korea, with the resultant casualties exceeding 50,000 and who knows but that millions more of innocent people may pay the price of your treason." Judge Kaufman's Sentencing Statement in the Rosenberg Case
a. It is clear today, based on archival evidence, unearthed by researchers in Russia and released in the United States, that Kaufman was correct. "Absent an atomic bomb, Stalin would not have released Pyongyang's army to conquer the entire Korean peninsula. Confident that his possession of atomic weapons neutralized America's strategic advantage, Stalin was emboldened to unleash war in Korea in 1950." Haynes, Klehr, and
Vassiliev, "Spies: The Rise and Fall of the KGB in America," p. 143, 545. And Romerstein and Breindel,"The Venona Secrets," p. xv, 253.
b. It is important to connect the treachery with the impact of that treachery: the theft of the nuclear technology with 36,940 Americans killed, 91,134 wounded, and 8,176 still missing, and this does not include at least two million civilian lives claimed on both sides.
Bruce Cumings, "The Korean War: A History.' Included were 1.3 million South Korean casualties, including 400,000 dead. North Korea, 2 million casualties, and 900,000 Chinese soldiers killed.
Uninformed folks like you, Mary, are the reason for so very many of the problems in the world today.
Pick up a book once in a while.
I can recommend a few......
The Soviets were expansionist long before FDR was a going concern. The war with Poland between 1919-1921, annexation wars against Georgia and Azerbaijan, a Sino-Soviet conflict, border clashes with everyone and their brother. All of that was before 1933. There is no reason to believe that the Soviets would have just stayed home and done nothing had FDR not entered into the picture. According to Soviet ideology, it was just a matter of time before wars of liberation against the west would take place.
On a note from the real world, if that had actually happened you might have something clever to say. In reality, you have not only ever offered anything but desperate clinging to a logical fallacy, but you have proven yourself incapable of learning anything about the subject.
And the evidence from the real world that using 238 noted historians and presidential experts as authorities on history is a fallacy? Evidence please.
You are either playing stupid or are actually borderline vegetative. Don't ask me to explain the same thing to you hundreds of times. If you're truly incapable of learning, go sit in the corner and play with a ball of yarn or something.
So very glad you brought up the Korean War.
The bulk of our international problems stem directly from the intentions, strategy, actions, of President Franklin Roosevelt. Had he not supported and inflated the USSR, there would not have been a Red China. Nor a Korean War.
1. Major George Racey Jordan was in charge of expediting materials to the USSR. He testified before Congress that materials and instructions to build that atomic bomb were sent to Stalin. Jordan had proof that the orders he received from the White House insisted that everything requested be sent....priority! Even ahead of material the US army needed.
2. And the result, a disaster for America.
On April 5, 1951, Judge Irving R. Kaufman sentenced the Rosenbergs to death for theft of atomic secrets, and, resulted in "the communist aggression in Korea, with the resultant casualties exceeding 50,000 and who knows but that millions more of innocent people may pay the price of your treason." Judge Kaufman's Sentencing Statement in the Rosenberg Case
a. It is clear today, based on archival evidence, unearthed by researchers in Russia and released in the United States, that Kaufman was correct. "Absent an atomic bomb, Stalin would not have released Pyongyang's army to conquer the entire Korean peninsula. Confident that his possession of atomic weapons neutralized America's strategic advantage, Stalin was emboldened to unleash war in Korea in 1950." Haynes, Klehr, and
Vassiliev, "Spies: The Rise and Fall of the KGB in America," p. 143, 545. And Romerstein and Breindel,"The Venona Secrets," p. xv, 253.
b. It is important to connect the treachery with the impact of that treachery: the theft of the nuclear technology with 36,940 Americans killed, 91,134 wounded, and 8,176 still missing, and this does not include at least two million civilian lives claimed on both sides.
Bruce Cumings, "The Korean War: A History.' Included were 1.3 million South Korean casualties, including 400,000 dead. North Korea, 2 million casualties, and 900,000 Chinese soldiers killed.
Uninformed folks like you, Mary, are the reason for so very many of the problems in the world today.
Pick up a book once in a while.
I can recommend a few......
The Soviets were expansionist long before FDR was a going concern. The war with Poland between 1919-1921, annexation wars against Georgia and Azerbaijan, a Sino-Soviet conflict, border clashes with everyone and their brother. All of that was before 1933. There is no reason to believe that the Soviets would have just stayed home and done nothing had FDR not entered into the picture. According to Soviet ideology, it was just a matter of time before wars of liberation against the west would take place.
....and yet FDR must have known all of that before he was elected POTUS, and still he appeased histories most heinous/ruthless tyrant, once elected POTUS. After all, he was Assistant Secretary of the Navy under dickhead Wilson, ran as VP in 1920, and then was a worthless governor of NY.
Why would FDR appease Stalin IF he knew Uncle Joe's nature?
And the evidence from the real world that using 238 noted historians and presidential experts as authorities on history is a fallacy? Evidence please.
You are either playing stupid or are actually borderline vegetative. Don't ask me to explain the same thing to you hundreds of times. If you're truly incapable of learning, go sit in the corner and play with a ball of yarn or something.
So again you do the name calling bit instead of coming up with evidence on the authority fallacy.
You are either playing stupid or are actually borderline vegetative. Don't ask me to explain the same thing to you hundreds of times. If you're truly incapable of learning, go sit in the corner and play with a ball of yarn or something.
So again you do the name calling bit instead of coming up with evidence on the authority fallacy.
I have explained this to you over and over and over again. You are just trolling now because without your little fallacy you have absolutely nothing to say about the subject of this thread.
So again you do the name calling bit instead of coming up with evidence on the authority fallacy.
I have explained this to you over and over and over again. You are just trolling now because without your little fallacy you have absolutely nothing to say about the subject of this thread.
If you can't come up with some evidence that 238 noted historians and presidential experts are not authorities on history and the presidents, I understand.
The Soviets were expansionist long before FDR was a going concern. The war with Poland between 1919-1921, annexation wars against Georgia and Azerbaijan, a Sino-Soviet conflict, border clashes with everyone and their brother. All of that was before 1933. There is no reason to believe that the Soviets would have just stayed home and done nothing had FDR not entered into the picture. According to Soviet ideology, it was just a matter of time before wars of liberation against the west would take place.
....and yet FDR must have known all of that before he was elected POTUS, and still he appeased histories most heinous/ruthless tyrant, once elected POTUS. After all, he was Assistant Secretary of the Navy under dickhead Wilson, ran as VP in 1920, and then was a worthless governor of NY.
Why would FDR appease Stalin IF he knew Uncle Joe's nature?
What else would he do? Go to war? Treat the Soviets as pariahs and tacitly back Hitler and Franco in Spain? Push and hope France went into Civil War so that we could shoot Reds in the streets of Paris? FDR was dealing with the Depression and anything he could sell Uncle Joe would be of benefit to US farmers and industry. It wasn't like in the 1930s the idea of powerful nations physically pushing their weaker neighbors around was unheard of or even ideological wars (such as what was going on in Spain). Even if FDR admired Stalin and the State Department had a hard on for Communism, it wasn't like DC just rolled over for everything the left loved. Dealing with Stalin was the lesser of two evils, especially once Hitler rolled into Poland and the Japanese started getting frisky in Indochina.
To ally America with the USSR did not mean approval, life long friendship nor any of that, it meant our first enemy was Germany, and Japan, after that we'll see how it works out with the USSR. As it was, we never went to war with the Soviet Union, problems yes, but no war. Supplying American troops in the Pacific was initially a problem because of lack of navy. Operation Orange didn't work.
The bottom line was that it took us almost thirty months to prepare to invade Germany and the losses Russia took during that thirty months were huge and saved how many American lives? In one respect, we used the USSR and they know it, and had no choice, except surrender? Russia surrendered to Germany during WWI and we didn't want that to happen again.
The time for the Birchers and others to protest the way FDR fought the war was some 75 years ago; we could have used some of this free help then.
As it is, Hitler is gone, the USSR is gone and we're still here listening to the Monday morning QB garbage on how to do the deed.
The question is hardly why FDR remains so popular....he was President during a successful war.....and provided so many things for average Americans...
..but why was FDR so in love with Stalin and Soviet communism?
...
Explain it?
Anyone?
Secondly, FDR provided Stalin with huge amounts of war material after we entered the war and to the detriment of the American war effort. That material was needed by our fighting men fighting the Japanese. I wonder how many American boys died in the Pacific because they lacked the necessary equipment....that equipment that was going to the USSR.
The final analysis is FDR was a fool. He believed Communism and Stalin were good things, while condemning Hitler and Nazism. Only a dunce would come to such a conclusion.
The question is hardly why FDR remains so popular....he was President during a successful war.....and provided so many things for average Americans...
..but why was FDR so in love with Stalin and Soviet communism?
...
Explain it?
Anyone?
FDR was never in love with Stalin or Communism. Figure it out
Secondly, FDR provided Stalin with huge amounts of war material after we entered the war and to the detriment of the American war effort. That material was needed by our fighting men fighting the Japanese. I wonder how many American boys died in the Pacific because they lacked the necessary equipment....that equipment that was going to the USSR.
The final analysis is FDR was a fool. He believed Communism and Stalin were good things, while condemning Hitler and Nazism. Only a dunce would come to such a conclusion.
In which battles in the Pacific did the military lack equipment other than at the opening of the war? What weapons and equipment did the military, particularly the Navy lack?
Secondly, FDR provided Stalin with huge amounts of war material after we entered the war and to the detriment of the American war effort. That material was needed by our fighting men fighting the Japanese. I wonder how many American boys died in the Pacific because they lacked the necessary equipment....that equipment that was going to the USSR.
The final analysis is FDR was a fool. He believed Communism and Stalin were good things, while condemning Hitler and Nazism. Only a dunce would come to such a conclusion.
In which battles in the Pacific did the military lack equipment other than at the opening of the war? What weapons and equipment did the military, particularly the Navy lack?
What was the cost of FDR's unswerving dedication to the Soviets? One example, found in Paul Johnson's "Modern Times," 'included 200 modern fighter aircraft, originally intended for Britain's highly vulnerable base in Singapore, which had no modern fighters at all. The diversion of these aircraft, plus tanks, to Russia sealed the fate of Singapore." Johnson, Op.Cit., p. 386.
In which battles in the Pacific did the military lack equipment other than at the opening of the war? What weapons and equipment did the military, particularly the Navy lack?
What was the cost of FDR's unswerving dedication to the Soviets? One example, found in Paul Johnson's "Modern Times," 'included 200 modern fighter aircraft, originally intended for Britain's highly vulnerable base in Singapore, which had no modern fighters at all. The diversion of these aircraft, plus tanks, to Russia sealed the fate of Singapore." Johnson, Op.Cit., p. 386.
Johnson was wrong. 200 fighters would not have made a difference.
To ally America with the USSR did not mean approval, life long friendship nor any of that, it meant our first enemy was Germany, and Japan, after that we'll see how it works out with the USSR. As it was, we never went to war with the Soviet Union, problems yes, but no war. Supplying American troops in the Pacific was initially a problem because of lack of navy. Operation Orange didn't work.
The bottom line was that it took us almost thirty months to prepare to invade Germany and the losses Russia took during that thirty months were huge and saved how many American lives? In one respect, we used the USSR and they know it, and had no choice, except surrender? Russia surrendered to Germany during WWI and we didn't want that to happen again.
The time for the Birchers and others to protest the way FDR fought the war was some 75 years ago; we could have used some of this free help then.
As it is, Hitler is gone, the USSR is gone and we're still here listening to the Monday morning QB garbage on how to do the deed.
"To ally America with the USSR did not mean approval, life long friendship nor any of that, it meant our first enemy was Germany,...."
False.
Roosevelt was clueless as to any future war with Germany. His economic policies were aligned with those of Germany....nor did he anticipate any war.
Now...watch me prove same.
The following is why you should doubt your vaunted 238 famous 'historians' who have clearly misled you.....
....but never, ever....doubt me.
1. FDR came into office March 4th of 1933. One of his first official acts was to recognize the USSR, November 16th, 1933. He already knew what Stalin had done to the Ukrainians, and what kind of regime the USSR had.
2. If this act, based on FDR's additional pro-Soviet endeavors, was rational....then these folks must have been irrational: "Four Presidents and their six Secretaries of State for over a decade and a half held to this resolve," i.e., refusal to recognize the Soviet government. That was written by Herbert Hoover, one of those four Presidents. He wrote it in his Freedom Betrayed: Herbert Hoover's Secret History of the Second World War and Its Aftermath by George H. Nash, published posthumously, obviously, in 2011, pg 24-29.
3. FDR was clueless as far as any upcoming war.
a. Due to cuts in military spending through the 30s as a percentage of the federal budget, the United States was woefully unprepared for war. The US was 17th in the world in military strength, and this ultimately let us into a two-ocean war.
b. FDR did very little for the Army either with its size or weapons and during the 1930s, his defense budgets were cut to the bone. To quote George Marshall's words to FDR in May 1940: "If you don't do something...and do it right away, I don't know what is going to happen to this country". FDR had underestimated the Japanese and the Pearl Harbor attack devastated the American Navy and exposed the president's incompetence.
c. It wasn't until May 16, 1940, that Roosevelt had addressed Congress and asked for more than a billion dollars for defense, with a commitment for fifty thousand military aircraft. He knew, also, that he needed the good will of business to win the war: no longer would he call them privileged princes thirsting for power.
From:
FDR Goes To War: How Expanded Executive Power, Spiraling National Debt, And Restricted Civil Liberties Shaped Wartime America by Burton W. Folsom Jr. and Anita Folsom
