Why does the left think the Constitution applies to non-Americans?

[bripat9643]

What "rights" do foreigners residing on foreign soil have in America?

a Bill of Rights?

The Bill of Rights doesn't apply to them, moron. I already explained why.

No, you haven't. Are you merely indulging, right wing fantasy?

How can our supreme law of the land, not apply to any Person in our Republic?

We're discussing people who aren't on US soil, moron.

No, we are not.

Yes we are, moron. Remember this?

"What "rights" do foreigners residing on foreign soil have in America?"

 

[bripat9643]

I keep hearing this asinine argument from the left and it drives me nuts. Where in the hell do they get this concept that our Constitution is supposed to apply to everyone in the world and not just American citizens? .

We hold these truths to be self-evident: that all men [not just US citizens] are created equal; that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights; that among these are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. Thomas Jefferson
Read more at: Thomas Jefferson Quotes - BrainyQuote

The DOI has no legal implications whatsoever. It's a work of propaganda. Even though people overseas have rights, it's not the job of our government to enforce them.

 

[gipper]

A bigger question might be, why does the Left want to flood the nation with immigrants from the third world and Muslim nations?

Read the inscription in the Statue of Liberty the one Trump beheaded with a machete

Again, the Statue of Liberty is not the Constitution and has no legally binding authority.

Could it be the poster believes otherwise?

LMFAO!

Well it's like one of them told me the other day.... and I quote: "Trump is literally Hitler!"

Yes...many on the Left have been inflamed by the D Party and their kooky collegues in the MSM, Hollywood, and academia.

A long time friend of mine went off on me the other day, because he knew I voted for Trump. He went berserk...and screamed he never wanted to talk to me again.

These people are fucking nuts!!!

 

[danielpalos]

What the left really needed to do is visit Ellis Island and see what immigrants had to go through to come to America. By gosh they had English classes.

Two factors at play in my opinion.

The left is lazy. Having no restriction is easy. Besides wanting there pools cleaned and companies filled with cheap labor.

Second is that the left loves to force the unpopular opinion on everyone else and act all righteous in doing so. Most people are for gun rights, f.. them their opinion doesn't matter say the left. Most people think there should be limits on abortion. f.. them their opinion does not matter, say the left. Most people are for legal controlled and safe immigration. f... them their opinion doesn't matter, say the left. More illegals voted for Hillary then Trump, now her receiving more votes all of a sudden most becomes important.

Here is an excellent article explaining the rabid left:

Regurgitating the Apple: How Modern Liberals "Think" | The Heritage Foundation

I guess our Constitution, has nothing to do with it.

You would guess right. the only time the constitution matters is when the left can use it to force the minority opinion onto others, which is their game. Other then that it is just a piece of old paper.

just right wing national socialist projection and propaganda, like usual.

 

[danielpalos]

I keep hearing this asinine argument from the left and it drives me nuts. Where in the hell do they get this concept that our Constitution is supposed to apply to everyone in the world and not just American citizens? .

We hold these truths to be self-evident: that all men [not just US citizens] are created equal; that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights; that among these are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. Thomas Jefferson
Read more at: Thomas Jefferson Quotes - BrainyQuote

A bigger question might be, why does the Left want to flood the nation with immigrants from the third world and Muslim nations?

the national socialist right wing loves to go fishing; for red herrings.

 

[Dim Bulb]

I keep hearing this asinine argument from the left and it drives me nuts. Where in the hell do they get this concept that our Constitution is supposed to apply to everyone in the world and not just American citizens? Over and over, we come up on this issue of constitutionality and they consistently want to apply it to people who aren't subject to it. We cannot enforce our Constitution worldwide so we can't apply it that way. It's really as simple as that.

Then they want to make this silly argument about being "on American soil" ...as if, a radical jihadist could parachute into the country and as soon as his feet hits the ground he has instantaneous constitutional rights! That's not how it works. We are a humane nation who believes in basic human rights for everyone, and so we believe in treating people in accordance with basic human decency but that has nothing to do with constitutional rights. It is only the citizens of the United States who are protected by the Constitution. And guess what else? That's not ALWAYS an absolute!

Many of our constitutional rights have limitations and restrictions. If an American citizen travels to Mexico and returns, they aren't protected by the 4th Amendment against being searched and having property seized. We suspend that right at the border for national security reasons. We've determined that is "reasonable" and so the Amendment doesn't apply. And that's for an American citizen who IS protected by the Constitution!

There is nothing unconstitutional about Trump's executive order on restricting entry into the US. The President has plenary power granted under the Constitution and many presidents before him have used precisely the same plenary power to do the same thing. It's not a "Muslim ban" but guess what else? He's within his authority to make it one if he wants to! There is no restriction on this, the President has plenary power and he can make this effective for any country or ALL countries if he so chooses. He can make it against a specific religion... he can make it against people with red hair! There is nothing in the Constitution that prohibits him in any way with this. You may not LIKE it... but he has that authority under the Constitution.

Read cases, they will answer your question very well.. But you aren't really asking a question here, are you? You are simply trying to incite more hate. Try love. It worked for Jesus.

 

[danielpalos]

Looks like this last federal judge who put a stay on the order nationwide, might disagree???

That was an unconstitutional overreach of judicial power. The judge had no authority to do that. I posted the statute yesterday and it does not give the court authority in this matter. The Trump Justice Department should move to have that judge impeached.

Adjudicating the law, is what judges do.

 

[danielpalos]

A bigger question might be, why does the Left want to flood the nation with immigrants from the third world and Muslim nations?

Read the inscription in the Statue of Liberty the one Trump beheaded with a machete

Right wing national socialism is not about Liberty.

 

[danielpalos]

I keep hearing this asinine argument from the left and it drives me nuts. Where in the hell do they get this concept that our Constitution is supposed to apply to everyone in the world and not just American citizens? .

We hold these truths to be self-evident: that all men [not just US citizens] are created equal; that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights; that among these are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. Thomas Jefferson
Read more at: Thomas Jefferson Quotes - BrainyQuote

That's the Declaration of Independence and not the Constitution. It is stating the basis on which we established our Constitution. It's important in that regard alone.

We cannot apply the Constitution to people we have no jurisdiction over and whom we cannot enforce the Constitution upon. If we ruled the world it would be different, but we don't. It would certainly be a wonderful world if our Constitution prevailed over it all and I would be glad to accept such a world. Unfortunately, that's not going to happen.

Did you know, that our supreme law of the land; was Ordained and Established, gender and race neutral, from its Intelligent Design and Inception?

 

[danielpalos]

a Bill of Rights?

The Bill of Rights doesn't apply to them, moron. I already explained why.

No, you haven't. Are you merely indulging, right wing fantasy?

How can our supreme law of the land, not apply to any Person in our Republic?

We're discussing people who aren't on US soil, moron.

No, we are not.

Yes we are, moron. Remember this?

"What "rights" do foreigners residing on foreign soil have in America?"

Where is that distinction in our US Constitution?

Only national socialist right wing constitutions, do that.

 

[jc456]

I keep hearing this asinine argument from the left and it drives me nuts. Where in the hell do they get this concept that our Constitution is supposed to apply to everyone in the world and not just American citizens? Over and over, we come up on this issue of constitutionality and they consistently want to apply it to people who aren't subject to it. We cannot enforce our Constitution worldwide so we can't apply it that way. It's really as simple as that.

Then they want to make this silly argument about being "on American soil" ...as if, a radical jihadist could parachute into the country and as soon as his feet hits the ground he has instantaneous constitutional rights! That's not how it works. We are a humane nation who believes in basic human rights for everyone, and so we believe in treating people in accordance with basic human decency but that has nothing to do with constitutional rights. It is only the citizens of the United States who are protected by the Constitution. And guess what else? That's not ALWAYS an absolute!

Many of our constitutional rights have limitations and restrictions. If an American citizen travels to Mexico and returns, they aren't protected by the 4th Amendment against being searched and having property seized. We suspend that right at the border for national security reasons. We've determined that is "reasonable" and so the Amendment doesn't apply. And that's for an American citizen who IS protected by the Constitution!

There is nothing unconstitutional about Trump's executive order on restricting entry into the US. The President has plenary power granted under the Constitution and many presidents before him have used precisely the same plenary power to do the same thing. It's not a "Muslim ban" but guess what else? He's within his authority to make it one if he wants to! There is no restriction on this, the President has plenary power and he can make this effective for any country or ALL countries if he so chooses. He can make it against a specific religion... he can make it against people with red hair! There is nothing in the Constitution that prohibits him in any way with this. You may not LIKE it... but he has that authority under the Constitution.

Because a government empowered to strip people of their rights based on their 'papers' is a threat to everyone. Most especially its own citizens.

what rights?

All of them.

what are they? Do you even know? they have rights until they have no papers and then they are deported. So what's your point?

My point is that the Constitution applies to government, not to individuals. It's a set of constraints and grants of power to government. Qualifying those constraints such that they don't apply when the state's actions are against foreigners is not only immoral, it's impractical. It requires society, our society, to sacrifice fundamental tenets of freedom like presumption of innocence and due process. All of the rights previously recognized by our government as universal human rights are reduced to perks of citizenship instead. This makes all of your rights dependent on, first and foremost, being able to prove you are a citizen. It gets even 'curiouser' when you consider that due process, the criminal justice system that gives us a chance to prove our innocence when accused, would be unavailable to anyone the state says is not a citizen.

You mean the person that can't show who they are? Cops don't ride around any longer looking for illegals or nationals. A person Commit a crime and all that charges. Period!

 

[jc456]

but its not the left who thinks the rights are endowed by the creator

but like...i can see anyone being a hypocrite who thinks theyre from a creator.......

but only for Americans

what did the founders state?

uhh, this is in reference to dupes who have the belief that god, not america and its founders, bestowed their rights upon them

uhh, too deep for ya?

if they were bestowed upon you by ..

hrmmm..


GAWWDDDddd


youd think youd uhh, listen to that mother fucker mebbe

No, that isn't what you stated. People on the right know our founding fathers used a creator to create our nation. Again read your dollar bill stupid fk !

 

[G.T.]

but its not the left who thinks the rights are endowed by the creator

but like...i can see anyone being a hypocrite who thinks theyre from a creator.......

but only for Americans

what did the founders state?

uhh, this is in reference to dupes who have the belief that god, not america and its founders, bestowed their rights upon them

uhh, too deep for ya?

if they were bestowed upon you by ..

hrmmm..


GAWWDDDddd


youd think youd uhh, listen to that mother fucker mebbe

No, that isn't what you stated. People on the right know our founding fathers used a creator to create our nation. Again read your dollar bill stupid fk !

"used a creator??"

 

[dblack]

You mean the person that can't show who they are? Cops don't ride around any longer looking for illegals or nationals. A person Commit a crime and all that charges. Period!

That gets right to the heart of the problem. They will. It's the only way to implement Trump's preposterous mandates.

 

[JQPublic1]

Here you seem to have taken an opposing position to the one you tout now. Originally you apparently didn't think the Constitution applied to foreigners on American soil under any circumstances and that any justice they receive is bestowed in the interest of human rights rather than Constitutional rights. I don't accept that position, especially when the foreigner is the perpetrator of a serious crime. If you have changed your perspective since you wrote the second paragraph, I applaud you. If you haven't , please explain.

It doesn't automatically apply to foreigners on American soil. It applies to "foreign nationals" who are here legally, and I have already corrected my error on that.

There are SOME who argue that when a person's feet touch American soil, they instantaneously have Constitutional rights bestowed. That is what I am challenging in the OP.

Pardon my persistence, but I must ask what would you call the trial of Juan Francisco Lopez Sanchez, the illegal who shot and killed Kathryn Steinle. Sanchez had a long history of illegal entry and deportations. You can argue that he did not have Constitutional rights each time he set foot on our soil but that theory was thoroughly debunked when he was accused of killing someone on American soil. Once arrested, Sanchez immediately incurred the right to a lawyer, and a speedy trial so that he could defend himself against accusations of murder. That due process, set in motion by a chain of events, is a Constitutional guarantee that was extended to Sanchez regardless of his legal or illegal status.

You said it best yourself... it was a right EXTENDED to him. This is because we are civilized people in a civilized society, not because he is due something by way of law. In all honesty, he could have just as easily been executed on the spot without a trial. Again... since we are not barbarians, we afforded the man due process rights. This was a courtesy not a requirement.

The reality of an illegal being able to plead his case should have some legal precedence that tests the validity of your argument. My premise needs no validation because Sanchez is receiving due process the same as a citizen would. Here is a precedent in MY favor:

Do Undocumented Immigrants Have Constitutional Rights?

 

[JQPublic1]

We cannot apply the Constitution to people we have no jurisdiction over and whom we cannot enforce the Constitution upon.

Anyone on US soil is under our jurisdiction, including illegal aliens. See post #375.

 

[bripat9643]

The Bill of Rights doesn't apply to them, moron. I already explained why.

No, you haven't. Are you merely indulging, right wing fantasy?

How can our supreme law of the land, not apply to any Person in our Republic?

We're discussing people who aren't on US soil, moron.

No, we are not.

Yes we are, moron. Remember this?

"What "rights" do foreigners residing on foreign soil have in America?"

Where is that distinction in our US Constitution?

Only national socialist right wing constitutions, do that.

You actually believe the US government is obligated to protect the rights of foreigners residing in foreign countries? How would that work? Did we protect the rights of Syrians when ISIS chopped their heads off?

For your information, the distinction is made right at the top:

"We the people of the United States of America."

Is the US Constitution "national socialist right wing?"

 

[bripat9643]

We cannot apply the Constitution to people we have no jurisdiction over and whom we cannot enforce the Constitution upon.

Anyone on US soil is under our jurisdiction, including illegal aliens. See post #375.

This discussion is about foreigners who aren't on US soil, dumbass. No one is contesting the claim that foreigners on US soil have a right to due process.

 

[bripat9643]

You mean the person that can't show who they are? Cops don't ride around any longer looking for illegals or nationals. A person Commit a crime and all that charges. Period!

That gets right to the heart of the problem. They will. It's the only way to implement Trump's preposterous mandates.

Really? you mean we have to patrol the streets of Syria to find criminals so we can deny them a visa?

You get dumber with each post.

 

[danielpalos]

No, you haven't. Are you merely indulging, right wing fantasy?

How can our supreme law of the land, not apply to any Person in our Republic?

We're discussing people who aren't on US soil, moron.

No, we are not.

Yes we are, moron. Remember this?

"What "rights" do foreigners residing on foreign soil have in America?"

Where is that distinction in our US Constitution?

Only national socialist right wing constitutions, do that.

You actually believe the US government is obligated to protect the rights of foreigners residing in foreign countries? How would that work? Did we protect the rights of Syrians when ISIS chopped their heads off?

For your information, the distinction is made right at the top:

"We the people of the United States of America."

Is the US Constitution "national socialist right wing?"

we have a Bill of Rights.