Why I dont post here

[Ravi]

Imposing a "state religion" is usurping freedom.

Not if that is what the population wants and not if it is within the bounds of their constitution.

 

[AllieBaba]

There is no population in the world where 100 percent of the people want to be forced to adhere to a state religion, and it is ALWAYS a violation of human and civil rights to require it.

Read your history, girl.

 

[Epsilon Delta]

Not exactly. It really sort of depends on the case. England's 'official' religion of whatever is Anglicanism, but most it's churches are empty, and everyone is free to worship whatever, but hten you look at Saudi Arabia and that's a totally different story.

 

[AllieBaba]

True.

 

[Shogun]

FUCK, dude. What the hell?

I said "equal footing" because YOU were implying that what I was saying was what the Black Panthers were saying, and THEN you tell me to look up Strom Thurmon quotes.

dude.. backtrack however you need to. I used YOUR words.


That didn't make any sense to me, you were comparing me to both things, HENCE the question mark. I felt it was being very obvious. What the hell kind of question is that, anyway? Where did I state that they were on the same footing? Do you have some sort of reading comprehension problem? Do you not understand that I am totally against the racist occupation of Palestine? THERE'S A REASON WHY I KEEP CALLING IT A RACIST OCCUPATION OF PALESTINE. BECAUSE I DON'T AGREE WITH IT.

Reread the post I was responding to. I'm not interested in hearing about your supposed benevolence while you insist that isreal, somehow, is impervious to the lessons of history when we see one dominant group fucking another in the ass. OF COURSE THE OCCUPATION IS RACIST. Do you want a fucking cookie? Im commenting on your excuses for segregated two state solutions.. which, ironically enough, you go on to rationalize below.



Again, ignoring what I said completely, there is a difference between the segregationists in America who wanted to keep a system of blacks as second-class, servile citizens within the same country, and a population that wants ITS OWN COUNTRY. Segregation is what is happening in Israel NOW because the ISRAELI GOVERNMENT is SEGREGATING the population, with Palestinians as second-class citizens. You obviously think that that's wrong, and so do I, and so I advocate for an INDEPENDENT palestine, not a racist segregationalist state like the current one.

An independent Palistine that SHARES isreal? That SHARES the land where isreal wants to build the next temple of solomon? Yea, dude.. I fully expect israel to let that happen.



If you can't understand the simple difference between segregation and independence then the argument is obviously NEVER going to get through to you. So I ask you again, are the East Timorese RACISTS for claiming independence from Indonesia?

If their citizenship criteria is based on ethnic varibales then yes. I'll return the question, What ethnic group has the right to claim eastern europe? Are you a fan of Milosovic as long as a nation can be carved out for those that were purged?

Kosovo War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Is the entire African continent RACIST for claiming independence from their European colonial overlords? I'm sure you'd agree that ALL former Yugoslav republics are undeniably racist for separating from Serbia. Yes, obviously all of these are racists. How dare those East Timorese be so racist as to declare Independence from Indonesia, after indonesia had done so much for them, like obliterating a third of their population. Those silly Timorese should've known better and stayed, but NO, they had to be racist segregationalists. Is that what you're saying?


IS SOUTH AFRICA A TWO STATE SOLUTION TO APARTHIED? WERE THOSE laughable segregated state solutions REALLY convincing ANYONE? Clearly, you don't mind eastern europe being ethnically purged. If thats the hand you want to play then so bit it, dude.



The enormous difference between the South African bantustans and a 1967 Palestine is that 1967 Palestine is SUPPORTED BY THE MAJORITY OF THE PALESTINIAN POPULATION. You say "Well some blacks supported segregation too!", I'm not talking about some Palestinians, I'm talking about the MAJORITY of Palestinians who favour a 2 State solution, not just 'some palestinians'.


post your evidence. If you think a majority of pals want a two state solution im going to laugh at you. I posted quite the opposite just the other day and I'll go ahead and dig it up for you. But, by all means, post what you got.

Support ot opposition to a one-state solution in historic Palestine where Muslims, Christians and Jews have equal rights and responsibilities
Support 528 65.5 70.4
Oppose 222 27.5 29.6
http://www.neareastconsulting.com/surveys/ppp/p22/out_freq_q27.php/


For some Palestinians, one state with Israel is better than none
Frustrated by years of failed peace talks for a two-state solution, some are giving up hope of independence and pushing the idea of a single democratic state with equal rights for all.
For some Palestinians, one state with Israel is better than none - Los Angeles Times



Why is that different from Strom Thurmond? That Strom Thurmond was part of the oppressors while the Palestinians are the oppressed.

again. i've posted my evidence. post yours.



If the independence agreed is based on the terms established by the OPPRESSED, then who the hell am I to say that I know better? "I KNOW BETTER, WHAT YOU REALLY WANT IS TO LIVE WITH THE ISRAELIS!" Why don't you go over there and tell the majority of Palestinians (who support the two-state 1967 solution) that? That they're all a bunch of racists for wanting an independent state, and obviously you know way better than they do. [/sarcasm]


Again, post your evidence. I've had the gonadular fortitude to post mine when making statements..

 

[Shogun]

I said other countries, Shog. I only have a say in how we run ours. No time to read the rest of your post for now.

And, btw, nothing you quoted Editec saying was racist. You, yourself, want to live in a country with an official language. Think about what that says about your position for a while.

He's rationalizing a two state solution exactly how Thruman did. I dont expect you to keep up.


an official language is not an ethnic marginalization, ravi. How many latino politicians have you ever seen me demonize for the sake of a WHITE majority? Im unapologetically American but I hold no standard regarding ethnicity.


Perhaps you should learn to swim before you jump in the river.

 

[Shogun]

So if my mother converted to Judiasm then I'm eligible to live in Israel if I also claim to be a Jew.

Where is the racial issue?

Why must one prove that their parents were jews if this were merely a religious issue, ravi? Bouncing back and forth wont make the right of return any less dictated upon ETHNICITY.


need some e-gatorade?

 

[Shogun]

Not if that is what the population wants and not if it is within the bounds of their constitution.

sooo a majority of christians in the US an invalidate the citizenship of muslims and buddhists?


way to keep that brain juice flowing, ravi!


So, by extension, i guess you really dont have a problem with muslim nations keeping women as subclassed citizens, eh? I mean, it's IN their government.. Its the POPULAR RELIGIOUS AFFILATION..


right?

 

[Shogun]

Not exactly. It really sort of depends on the case. England's 'official' religion of whatever is Anglicanism, but most it's churches are empty, and everyone is free to worship whatever, but hten you look at Saudi Arabia and that's a totally different story.

uh, yea.. if we want to totally ignore the previous 500 years of English history...

 

[Care4all]

uh, yea.. if we want to totally ignore the previous 500 years of English history...

if you can resort to using 500 years for english past history then why not a few thousand years of israeli history or the past 60 or 100 years?


when is using history ok, and is there a magical cutoff somewhere in your head or reasoning on the past years?

care

 

[Care4all]

There is no population in the world where 100 percent of the people want to be forced to adhere to a state religion, and it is ALWAYS a violation of human and civil rights to require it.

Read your history, girl.

isn't the near entire middle east that way?

 

[Shogun]

if you can resort to using 500 years for english past history then why not a few thousand years of israeli history or the past 60 or 100 years?


when is using history ok, and is there a magical cutoff somewhere in your head or reasoning on the past years?

care

um, do the english currently prohibit catholics from worshipping freely despite the Anglican church? further, are the historic dominance of either church currently being used to minimize the equality of the other in regards to THE GOVERNMENT? Care to make that same statement regarding israel?


Hey, if you can whip out a historic example to validate the SUPERIORITY of any social variable go ahead and whip it out. I'll enjoy seeing what you think validates the domination of one over the other.

 

[AllieBaba]

isn't the near entire middle east that way?

Thank you for making my point.

 

[Care4all]

um, do the english currently prohibit catholics from worshipping freely despite the Anglican church? further, are the historic dominance of either church currently being used to minimize the equality of the other in regards to THE GOVERNMENT? Care to make that same statement regarding israel?


Hey, if you can whip out a historic example to validate the SUPERIORITY of any social variable go ahead and whip it out. I'll enjoy seeing what you think validates the domination of one over the other.

arabs living in israel can freely worship their religion, as with christians living there, buddhists, etc....?

so, maybe i'm missing your point?

 

[Care4all]

Just over three quarters, or 75.5%, of the population are Jews from a diversity of Jewish backgrounds. Approximately 68% of Israeli Jews are Israeli-born, 22% are immigrants from Europe and the Americas, and 10% are immigrants from Asia and Africa (including the Arab World).[204] The religious affiliation of Israeli Jews varies widely: 55% say they are "traditional," while 20% consider themselves "secular Jews," 17% define themselves as "Orthodox Jews"; the final 8% define themselves as "Haredi Jews."[205]


Bahá'í World Centre in HaifaMaking up 16.2% of the population, Muslims constitute Israel's largest religious minority. Israeli Arabs, who comprise 19.8% of the population, contribute significantly to that figure as over four fifths (82.6%) of them are Muslim. Of the remaining Israeli Arabs, 8.8% are Christian and 8.4% are Druze.[206] Members of many other religious groups, including Buddhists and Hindus, maintain a presence in Israel, albeit in small numbers.[207]

Christians make up 2.1% of the total population of Israel and consist of both Arab Christians and Messianic Jews.[208]

wiki

 

[Rhys]

no ne stole their house....the Palestinians had a choice to get their own state at the same time the league of nations made israel, but they CHOSE NOT TO ACCEPT IT....

learn a little bit about history kiddo....then they lost other land after that thru WARRING....the arabs attacked israel in the 6 day war...and lost their butts...

Your answer, then, is constant war? Or more probably, I suppose, extermination camps? Your colonialist chums would hardly get away with those nowadays, you know, which is why they haven't tried. I think you are a bit of an ass, frankly. What would you have said to those wicked French, Poles, Yugoslavs and such fighting the victorious Reich?

 

[Shogun]

arabs living in israel can freely worship their religion, as with christians living there, budhists, etc....?

so, maybe i'm missing your point?

They have the same chance to become the PM of israel like catholics OR anglicans do in England?


It's about the equal application of gov regardless of differences; religious or ethnic. Im also not of the mind that America must maintian a christian domination on our gov. LOTS of people do. I find examples of muslims in our gov refreshing to the status quo. This is why I bring up the US at every corner here: Actual western nations governed by Democracy don't apply ethnic standards to equality in order to maintain a chokehold on state power.


So, how quick will WE, the US, restrict latinos blacks asians etc, from our highest positions for the sake of WHITEY?

 

[Ravi]

There is no population in the world where 100 percent of the people want to be forced to adhere to a state religion, and it is ALWAYS a violation of human and civil rights to require it.

Read your history, girl.

Really?

 

[Ravi]

He's rationalizing a two state solution exactly how Thruman did. I dont expect you to keep up.

With the way your silly mind works? I doubt anyone could.

an official language is not an ethnic marginalization, ravi. How many latino politicians have you ever seen me demonize for the sake of a WHITE majority? Im unapologetically American but I hold no standard regarding ethnicity.

Nope, but it is you wanting your ethnic identity protected.

 

[Care4all]

Your answer, then, is constant war? Or more probably, I suppose, extermination camps? Your colonialist chums would hardly get away with those nowadays, you know, which is why they haven't tried. I think you are a bit of an ass, frankly. What would you have said to those wicked French, Poles, Yugoslavs and such fighting the victorious Reich?

i am not jewish, i am not a zionist.....leave it at that....

I do think on several occaisions that Israel has been harsh, and i am in no way happy with conditions over there, especially with the conditions the good Palestinians have to go thru....

what i don't accept, is that ALL OF THIS is solely Israel's fault....i try to put myself in their shoes along with putting myself in the palestinian's shoes and the whole thing sucks from here to kingdom come....

i don't have a sollution, but i am opened to hear about any of them....because one is certainly needed!

care