Why is abortion the way of the world?

[FA_Q2]

25 Cultures That Practiced Human Sacrifice

Because historically child sacrifice was the status quo

It's just who we are.

And it is for the same reason, which is material gain. Most women have abortions due to financial concerns. Likewise, pretty much all ancient religions sacrificed their children to the gods for such things as victory at war or fertile crops, etc.

In the old, old days, some cultures believed that the gods would be more moved and willing to "help" if they were given the most precious gifts of the people. There is no more precious gift than a person's child, yannow---like Isaac?
Today people are terminating pregnancies when they cannot afford to feed, clothe, educate and house the child in a decent fashion. It is called being responsible to not bring an unwelcome child into the world.

Its called murder. Cant sanitize it.

In our society, not all killings are murder. Fact.

True, but killing innocent life is murder. That's abortion. Can't sanitize or gray it out to help you with your emotions.

First off, it's not "murder", nor is it killing "innocent life". That is what YOU believe.

It is not murder - that is a legal term. It is 'killing innocent life' though - that is simply a fact. Killing does not attach a moral component to the act though.

 

[buckeye45_73]

25 Cultures That Practiced Human Sacrifice

Because historically child sacrifice was the status quo

It's just who we are.

And it is for the same reason, which is material gain. Most women have abortions due to financial concerns. Likewise, pretty much all ancient religions sacrificed their children to the gods for such things as victory at war or fertile crops, etc.

In the old, old days, some cultures believed that the gods would be more moved and willing to "help" if they were given the most precious gifts of the people. There is no more precious gift than a person's child, yannow---like Isaac?
Today people are terminating pregnancies when they cannot afford to feed, clothe, educate and house the child in a decent fashion. It is called being responsible to not bring an unwelcome child into the world.

Killing kids because of your poor decisions and lifestyle is not kosher. Lots of people have kids they cant "afford".....you make it work, you don't off your toddler, because you lost your job and can't "afford" him/her.

 

[FA_Q2]

25 Cultures That Practiced Human Sacrifice

Because historically child sacrifice was the status quo

It's just who we are.

And it is for the same reason, which is material gain. Most women have abortions due to financial concerns. Likewise, pretty much all ancient religions sacrificed their children to the gods for such things as victory at war or fertile crops, etc.

Says it all.


The Public Papers of Margaret Sanger: Web Edition

Does it?

Why does a singular entity - even the founder - pigeonhole an entity into morality or immorality? This is little different than the idiots declaring America as immoral because its founders were slave holders and womanizers. PP stands on its own accord and can, or rather must, be judged on its own merits.

 

[FA_Q2]

A zygote or fetus is no different in those respects though - the fetus feeds off the mother (and finds/consumes food as well on its own before the cord forms) and is confined in her body in the same manner and the same limitations as thousands of other small (multi celled and complex) organisms in all our bodies.

Which gut bacteria is worthy of legal protections?

Did you already forget my position? None of them do - as I stated I don't think a zygote should get legal protections either.

That does not change the fact that we are talking about an independent and complete human.

 

[BlindBoo]

At conception, that is a unique and wholly separate human.

No it's not. It is a unique combination of human DNA. it is not yet a Human Being.

Anyway, so what? There is nothing divine about a fertilized egg just because it is human. Many of those never become human being either.

Yes it is and no stamping the floor and demanding it is not changes that.

There is no magic moment when those DNA cells suddenly become human. Trying to define it any other way only leads to logical pretzels with indistinct definitions.

And I never stated there was anything divine about it. That is locked in YOUR head, not mine, or you would not be trying to define early stages of HUMAN development as somehow not human.

My issue here is not a 'divine' egg but that the majority of those supporting abortion outright refuse to acknowledge what they support in the first place. The implication there is blatantly obvious - the moral implications of abortion are clear to pretty much everyone so supporters redefine what is human in an attempt to make those implications go away.

It is an attempt to whitewash the severity and weight of what abortion is - something that should almost NEVER happen because even a modicum of responsibility stops almost all unwanted pregnancies.

When did I ever say it wasn't human?

Every single cell in our bodies is human right? But a single cell or even a collection of cells like heart muscle or brain tissue, is human but not a human being.

If the woman doesn't want to create a new life she has the choice to stop it.

No one cheers that life ending choice.

However I celebrate that she has that choice.

 

[FA_Q2]

25 Cultures That Practiced Human Sacrifice

Because historically child sacrifice was the status quo

It's just who we are.

And it is for the same reason, which is material gain. Most women have abortions due to financial concerns. Likewise, pretty much all ancient religions sacrificed their children to the gods for such things as victory at war or fertile crops, etc.

In the old, old days, some cultures believed that the gods would be more moved and willing to "help" if they were given the most precious gifts of the people. There is no more precious gift than a person's child, yannow---like Isaac?
Today people are terminating pregnancies when they cannot afford to feed, clothe, educate and house the child in a decent fashion. It is called being responsible to not bring an unwelcome child into the world.

Killing kids because of your poor decisions and lifestyle is not kosher. Lots of people have kids they cant "afford".....you make it work, you don't off your toddler, because you lost your job and can't "afford" him/her.

It is a wonder why abortion is the 'responsible' choice rather than the responsible choice of not getting pregnant.

Abortion is not being 'responsible.' It is avoiding responsibility after failing to do the responsible thing of not getting pregnant in the first place. A poor solution to irresponsible behavior.

 

[FA_Q2]

At conception, that is a unique and wholly separate human.

No it's not. It is a unique combination of human DNA. it is not yet a Human Being.

Anyway, so what? There is nothing divine about a fertilized egg just because it is human. Many of those never become human being either.

Yes it is and no stamping the floor and demanding it is not changes that.

There is no magic moment when those DNA cells suddenly become human. Trying to define it any other way only leads to logical pretzels with indistinct definitions.

And I never stated there was anything divine about it. That is locked in YOUR head, not mine, or you would not be trying to define early stages of HUMAN development as somehow not human.

My issue here is not a 'divine' egg but that the majority of those supporting abortion outright refuse to acknowledge what they support in the first place. The implication there is blatantly obvious - the moral implications of abortion are clear to pretty much everyone so supporters redefine what is human in an attempt to make those implications go away.

It is an attempt to whitewash the severity and weight of what abortion is - something that should almost NEVER happen because even a modicum of responsibility stops almost all unwanted pregnancies.

When did I ever say it wasn't human?

Every single cell in our bodies is human right? But a single cell or even a collection of cells like heart muscle or brain tissue, is human but not a human being.

If the woman doesn't want to create a new life she has the choice to stop it.

No one cheers that life ending choice.

However I celebrate that she has that choice.

It is a unique combination of human DNA. it is not yet a Human Being.

You are stating it is not human right there. Comparing it to a piece of a human (such as heart cells) is nonsensical. The zygote, fetus or whatever stage of development of a HUMAN BEING you want to discuss is a complete and separate organism. Legal protections do not extend to all humans and I have stated as such but that does not make the particular human in question something else.

 

[BlindBoo]

In the old, old days, some cultures believed that the gods would be more moved and willing to "help" if they were given the most precious gifts of the people. There is no more precious gift than a person's child, yannow---like Isaac?
Today people are terminating pregnancies when they cannot afford to feed, clothe, educate and house the child in a decent fashion. It is called being responsible to not bring an unwelcome child into the world.

Its called murder. Cant sanitize it.

In our society, not all killings are murder. Fact.

True, but killing innocent life is murder. That's abortion. Can't sanitize or gray it out to help you with your emotions.

First off, it's not "murder", nor is it killing "innocent life". That is what YOU believe.

I'm a woman who has never had an abortion because I believe it's wrong, but I have had 2 miscarriages, and three live births, and I would NEVER ask another woman to carry a child to term that she does not want and cannot afford, because it's NOT YOUR LIFE, and you will not be financially responsible for carrying and bearing that child.

I can imagine nothing more horrible in my entire life than being forced to have a baby you must give away or otherwise are not in a position to raise. Those who say that it would be OK for a woman who becomes pregnant because of rape or incest to have an abortion but under other circumstances ignore the horrendous abuse that it was to put women through the most intrusive, personal, and life changing decision a woman ever makes in her life, which is the decision whether or not to have a baby,

God gave me free will, but YOU would take that away. You're not doing God's will by denying abortion. You are THWARTING it.

Its not your life either and the man is equally responsible. Im not sure how you surmised that I somehow think its all the woman's problem. No, not at all. Is it Gods will to murder innocent babies and life?

The man is the donor. The woman has the baby factory. It should be her choice when that factory is open.

 

[alang1216]

What's a soul? Is it natural or supernatural?

It's the part of the brain that allows for abstract thought.

Is that a uniquely human attribute?
Study shows chimps capable of insightful reasoning ability
There's convincing evidence that some animals reason abstractly under some circumstances (some other examples regarding nonhuman primates can be found here; data are available, too, for animals as diverse as dolphins and pigs).

 

[BlindBoo]

A

At conception, that is a unique and wholly separate human.

No it's not. It is a unique combination of human DNA. it is not yet a Human Being.

Anyway, so what? There is nothing divine about a fertilized egg just because it is human. Many of those never become human being either.

Yes it is and no stamping the floor and demanding it is not changes that.

There is no magic moment when those DNA cells suddenly become human. Trying to define it any other way only leads to logical pretzels with indistinct definitions.

And I never stated there was anything divine about it. That is locked in YOUR head, not mine, or you would not be trying to define early stages of HUMAN development as somehow not human.

My issue here is not a 'divine' egg but that the majority of those supporting abortion outright refuse to acknowledge what they support in the first place. The implication there is blatantly obvious - the moral implications of abortion are clear to pretty much everyone so supporters redefine what is human in an attempt to make those implications go away.

It is an attempt to whitewash the severity and weight of what abortion is - something that should almost NEVER happen because even a modicum of responsibility stops almost all unwanted pregnancies.

When did I ever say it wasn't human?

Every single cell in our bodies is human right? But a single cell or even a collection of cells like heart muscle or brain tissue, is human but not a human being.

If the woman doesn't want to create a new life she has the choice to stop it.

No one cheers that life ending choice.

However I celebrate that she has that choice.

It is a unique combination of human DNA. it is not yet a Human Being.

You are stating it is not human right there. Comparing it to a piece of a human (such as heart cells) is nonsensical. The zygote, fetus or whatever stage of development of a HUMAN BEING you want to discuss is a complete and separate organism. Legal protections do not extend to all humans and I have stated as such but that does not make the particular human in question something else.

A human zygote is no more a human being than a fertilized snake egg is a snake.

 

[BlackFlag]

Disagree with your title and OP linking ancient human sacrifices to abortion. The human sacrifices were generally of adults to appease their gods. Abortion is the murder of babies for convenience.

Cite what I added up top. Both were and are for financial reasons.

I still think that abortion and human sacrifice are apples & oranges. The sacrifices, mostly animals and crops, were to appease their gods, or as you cite for specific favors from the gods like to win a war or battle or to end a drought. The link you're missing is the old gods vs the new "all about me" generations.

I prefer to keep the argument about the babies' human right to life vs the inconvenience of the mothers. Gosnell and Cuomo are examples of mass murderers, not human sacrificers.

So if I suck out a fetus through a tube and say it’s for Poseidon, then we’re all good

 

[BlindBoo]

Disagree with your title and OP linking ancient human sacrifices to abortion. The human sacrifices were generally of adults to appease their gods. Abortion is the murder of babies for convenience.

Cite what I added up top. Both were and are for financial reasons.

I still think that abortion and human sacrifice are apples & oranges. The sacrifices, mostly animals and crops, were to appease their gods, or as you cite for specific favors from the gods like to win a war or battle or to end a drought. The link you're missing is the old gods vs the new "all about me" generations.

I prefer to keep the argument about the babies' human right to life vs the inconvenience of the mothers. Gosnell and Cuomo are examples of mass murderers, not human sacrificers.

So if I suck out a fetus through a tube and say it’s for Poseidon, then we’re all good

Only if you're facing the ocean when you perform the sacrifice..........

 

[BlackFlag]

Disagree with your title and OP linking ancient human sacrifices to abortion. The human sacrifices were generally of adults to appease their gods. Abortion is the murder of babies for convenience.

Cite what I added up top. Both were and are for financial reasons.

I still think that abortion and human sacrifice are apples & oranges. The sacrifices, mostly animals and crops, were to appease their gods, or as you cite for specific favors from the gods like to win a war or battle or to end a drought. The link you're missing is the old gods vs the new "all about me" generations.

I prefer to keep the argument about the babies' human right to life vs the inconvenience of the mothers. Gosnell and Cuomo are examples of mass murderers, not human sacrificers.

So if I suck out a fetus through a tube and say it’s for Poseidon, then we’re all good

Only if you're facing the ocean when you perform the sacrifice..........

Of course. If I invent a tube that can suck a whole fetus out and launch it hundreds of feet out into the ocean, I’ll earn extra favor from the Gods.

 

[BlindBoo]

Disagree with your title and OP linking ancient human sacrifices to abortion. The human sacrifices were generally of adults to appease their gods. Abortion is the murder of babies for convenience.

Cite what I added up top. Both were and are for financial reasons.

I still think that abortion and human sacrifice are apples & oranges. The sacrifices, mostly animals and crops, were to appease their gods, or as you cite for specific favors from the gods like to win a war or battle or to end a drought. The link you're missing is the old gods vs the new "all about me" generations.

I prefer to keep the argument about the babies' human right to life vs the inconvenience of the mothers. Gosnell and Cuomo are examples of mass murderers, not human sacrificers.

So if I suck out a fetus through a tube and say it’s for Poseidon, then we’re all good

Only if you're facing the ocean when you perform the sacrifice..........

Of course. If I invent a tube that can suck a whole fetus out and launch it hundreds of feet out into the ocean, I’ll earn extra favor from the Gods.

Only Poseidon. Be careful, that might piss off Aphrodite. You don't want that Goddess mad at you!

 

[BlackFlag]

Cite what I added up top. Both were and are for financial reasons.

I still think that abortion and human sacrifice are apples & oranges. The sacrifices, mostly animals and crops, were to appease their gods, or as you cite for specific favors from the gods like to win a war or battle or to end a drought. The link you're missing is the old gods vs the new "all about me" generations.

I prefer to keep the argument about the babies' human right to life vs the inconvenience of the mothers. Gosnell and Cuomo are examples of mass murderers, not human sacrificers.

So if I suck out a fetus through a tube and say it’s for Poseidon, then we’re all good

Only if you're facing the ocean when you perform the sacrifice..........

Of course. If I invent a tube that can suck a whole fetus out and launch it hundreds of feet out into the ocean, I’ll earn extra favor from the Gods.

Only Poseidon. Be careful, that might piss off Aphrodite. You don't want that Goddess mad at you!

I’ll suffer her wrath for favor with the God of storms anytime!!!

 

[Cecilie1200]

25 Cultures That Practiced Human Sacrifice

Because historically child sacrifice was the status quo

It's just who we are.

And it is for the same reason, which is material gain. Most women have abortions due to financial concerns. Likewise, pretty much all ancient religions sacrificed their children to the gods for such things as victory at war or fertile crops, etc.

Lucifer is The Lord of this World until after The Battle of Armageddon, and a couple other end times battles at which some point The Second Coming Occurs, and Jesus dethrones Lucifer, and takes back The Throne and Crown of Adam which was lost during the whole Garden of Eden fiasco.

Until this occurs, people will be selfish and wicked, and resist all attempts at protecting, respecting, and revering life.

To my point of view, a woman who terminates a pregnancy that she knows she cannot care for properly IS revering, protecting and respecting life. A quality life.

To my point of view, anyone who thinks "respecting life" consists of eugenics is too ignorant to be allowed access to sharp objects.

 

[FA_Q2]

A

At conception, that is a unique and wholly separate human.

No it's not. It is a unique combination of human DNA. it is not yet a Human Being.

Anyway, so what? There is nothing divine about a fertilized egg just because it is human. Many of those never become human being either.

Yes it is and no stamping the floor and demanding it is not changes that.

There is no magic moment when those DNA cells suddenly become human. Trying to define it any other way only leads to logical pretzels with indistinct definitions.

And I never stated there was anything divine about it. That is locked in YOUR head, not mine, or you would not be trying to define early stages of HUMAN development as somehow not human.

My issue here is not a 'divine' egg but that the majority of those supporting abortion outright refuse to acknowledge what they support in the first place. The implication there is blatantly obvious - the moral implications of abortion are clear to pretty much everyone so supporters redefine what is human in an attempt to make those implications go away.

It is an attempt to whitewash the severity and weight of what abortion is - something that should almost NEVER happen because even a modicum of responsibility stops almost all unwanted pregnancies.

When did I ever say it wasn't human?

Every single cell in our bodies is human right? But a single cell or even a collection of cells like heart muscle or brain tissue, is human but not a human being.

If the woman doesn't want to create a new life she has the choice to stop it.

No one cheers that life ending choice.

However I celebrate that she has that choice.

It is a unique combination of human DNA. it is not yet a Human Being.

You are stating it is not human right there. Comparing it to a piece of a human (such as heart cells) is nonsensical. The zygote, fetus or whatever stage of development of a HUMAN BEING you want to discuss is a complete and separate organism. Legal protections do not extend to all humans and I have stated as such but that does not make the particular human in question something else.

A human zygote is no more a human being than a fertilized snake egg is a snake.

Considering that the thing in that egg is a growing SNAKE, you are correct.

I wonder what you think that egg is? A rock?

 

[Dragonlady]

25 Cultures That Practiced Human Sacrifice

Because historically child sacrifice was the status quo

It's just who we are.

And it is for the same reason, which is material gain. Most women have abortions due to financial concerns. Likewise, pretty much all ancient religions sacrificed their children to the gods for such things as victory at war or fertile crops, etc.

In the old, old days, some cultures believed that the gods would be more moved and willing to "help" if they were given the most precious gifts of the people. There is no more precious gift than a person's child, yannow---like Isaac?
Today people are terminating pregnancies when they cannot afford to feed, clothe, educate and house the child in a decent fashion. It is called being responsible to not bring an unwelcome child into the world.

Killing kids because of your poor decisions and lifestyle is not kosher. Lots of people have kids they cant "afford".....you make it work, you don't off your toddler, because you lost your job and can't "afford" him/her.

It is a wonder why abortion is the 'responsible' choice rather than the responsible choice of not getting pregnant.

Abortion is not being 'responsible.' It is avoiding responsibility after failing to do the responsible thing of not getting pregnant in the first place. A poor solution to irresponsible behavior.

Birth control does not ELIMINATE the possibility of pregnancy. It reduces it. 50% of the women seeking abortions used birth control in the month they became pregnant. I know women who had tubal ligations, who got pregnant.

I had two "unintended" pregnancies while being rigorous in my birth control. The first ended in a spontaneous miscarriage, the second is about to make me a grandmother - again.

 

[Cecilie1200]

25 Cultures That Practiced Human Sacrifice

Because historically child sacrifice was the status quo

It's just who we are.

And it is for the same reason, which is material gain. Most women have abortions due to financial concerns. Likewise, pretty much all ancient religions sacrificed their children to the gods for such things as victory at war or fertile crops, etc.

Lucifer is The Lord of this World until after The Battle of Armageddon, and a couple other end times battles at which some point The Second Coming Occurs, and Jesus dethrones Lucifer, and takes back The Throne and Crown of Adam which was lost during the whole Garden of Eden fiasco.

Until this occurs, people will be selfish and wicked, and resist all attempts at protecting, respecting, and revering life.

According to Christian Mythology, Lucifer was the Angel of Light. One of God's favorite creations.

According to Christianity, that changed pretty early on.

Which is why condescension about things you're ignorant of is a bad look, even though it's the look religiophobes most often cultivate.

 

[Dragonlady]

25 Cultures That Practiced Human Sacrifice

Because historically child sacrifice was the status quo

It's just who we are.

And it is for the same reason, which is material gain. Most women have abortions due to financial concerns. Likewise, pretty much all ancient religions sacrificed their children to the gods for such things as victory at war or fertile crops, etc.

Lucifer is The Lord of this World until after The Battle of Armageddon, and a couple other end times battles at which some point The Second Coming Occurs, and Jesus dethrones Lucifer, and takes back The Throne and Crown of Adam which was lost during the whole Garden of Eden fiasco.

Until this occurs, people will be selfish and wicked, and resist all attempts at protecting, respecting, and revering life.

To my point of view, a woman who terminates a pregnancy that she knows she cannot care for properly IS revering, protecting and respecting life. A quality life.

To my point of view, anyone who thinks "respecting life" consists of eugenics is too ignorant to be allowed access to sharp objects.

Suddenly abortion is "eugenics". Nice try.

Abortion is about poverty. Plain and simple. And the lack of rights or protections that lower wage workers have in the USA. As long as a poor woman can be fired from her low paying job when she gets pregnant, she will opt for abortion. By being fired, she will not only lose her income, she'll lose her health care at the time both she and her family need it most. And she'll have no help with child care when she is ready to return to work.

This is true regardless of the race of the woman. Poor women have abortions. Low income women in other first world countries where they have universal health care, mandated maternity leaves, job protections, and subsidized day care, have abortionos at a rate of nearly half that of American women even though their abortions are being paid for by their universal health care system.