Zone1 Why was Jesus crucified?

[irosie91]

Strange is it not that God allowed Rome to destroy Jerusalem and scatter the Jews all over the world........because of this fake Messiah....no? Or could it be that God was keeping His promise? Lev. 26:27-39 "...............but you will not listen to Me (God), but walk contrary to Me.......then I will walk contrary to you (Israel), in fury..............I will lay waste to your cities..........I will scatter you among the nations......" This was not a threat but a promise. Biblical Israel was wiped from the face of the earth, its holy temple destroyed, its peoples scattered around the world, over 2000 years ago.

Even today...........God has not allowed any tribal IDs, no royal priesthood, no king appointed by God, no burnt offerings to hide their sins from God year to year....


Conclusion: I would declare the Messiah, the only begotten Son of God came to earth over 2000 years ago, about the same time the Jews rejected God's prophecies....as myths and or legends. You can't hide from history actual.

Your sunday school 'lady: forgot to tell you about FREE CHOICE?. did your "god"
and Jesus ALLOW Lee Harvey Oswald to shoot JFK in the head?

 

[irosie91]

no-- I have never heard a rabbi discuss GEEEEZIS. You could do
a search if you are curious. Better yet----read the NT with an opened
and logical mind uncorrupted with the dirt that the sunday school slut
poured therein

suradie disagrees-----I wonder if she can tell me when she was in a synagogue
to hear what rabbis say about GEEZUS. She stated she was never in a mosque
prayer session-----she SHOULD be interested in hearing what Imams say about
Geezus------I did

 

[surada]

suradie disagrees-----I wonder if she can tell me when she was in a synagogue
to hear what rabbis say about GEEZUS. She stated she was never in a mosque
prayer session-----she SHOULD be interested in hearing what Imams say about
Geezus------I did

You may hang out with Sunday school sluts, but I've never met one.

 

[Hector12]

The crucifixion of Jesus has been described by a Jewish legal historian as "a judicial murder." He said that every safeguard of the Sanhedrin were ignored.

I think Jesus was crucified because the belief of most of his followers that he was the rightful King of Jews threatened the Herodian Dynasty - which could not claim descent in the male line from King David, and the Roman Empire. In addition, Jesus offered a way to worship God that did not require expensive sacrifices in the Temple of Jerusalem. The Saducees owed their wealth to these sacrifices.

The Jews who demanded that Jesus be crucified did not speak for Jews of the time. They certainly did not speak for Jews since.

 

[HaShev]

Strange is it not that God allowed Rome to destroy Jerusalem and scatter the Jews all over the world........because of this fake Messiah....no? Or could it be that God was keeping His promise? Lev. 26:27-39 "...............but you will not listen to Me (God), but walk contrary to Me.......then I will walk contrary to you (Israel), in fury..............I will lay waste to your cities..........I will scatter you among the nations......" This was not a threat but a promise. Biblical Israel was wiped from the face of the earth, its holy temple destroyed, its peoples scattered around the world, over 2000 years ago.

Even today...........God has not allowed any tribal IDs, no royal priesthood, no king appointed by God, no burnt offerings to hide their sins from God year to year....


Conclusion: I would declare the Messiah, the only begotten Son of God came to earth over 2000 years ago, about the same time the Jews rejected God's prophecies....as myths and or legends. You can't hide from history actual.

But I find the way humanity looks at Victims and Victimizers very troubling.
It's like how Dems blame Trump for the Division and instability during the rioting protests during his presidency, that which was created by the radical Left to cause the Chaos in order to blame their opponent and set up an image of a divisive unstable administration.
Rome did this to the Jews in blaming them for what they (Rome) were doing to the martyrs (ususally revolt leaders).
Rome scattered and had slain and set the narrative for caused future attrocities(Spanish Inquisition, Holocaust etc), so technically it wasn't the chasing of false idols, as most rejected the fallen ones, including rejecting Baracopa when he failed his liberation.
Rome did similar to the Veiins, slaughtering them and claiming their godess no longer favored them, then errected Junos statue and temple in Rome claiming their new authority.
Always blaming those they try and subvert and revictimize the victims while claiming pious of themselves who were the actual problem. This is the same tactic passed down by the mob, extortion racketeering by claiming you'll protect them, but it's really you they need protection from.

 

[irosie91]

The crucifixion of Jesus has been described by a Jewish legal historian as "a judicial murder." He said that every safeguard of the Sanhedrin were ignored.

I think Jesus was crucified because the belief of most of his followers that he was the rightful King of Jews threatened the Herodian Dynasty - which could not claim descent in the male line from King David, and the Roman Empire. In addition, Jesus offered a way to worship God that did not require expensive sacrifices in the Temple of Jerusalem. The Saducees owed their wealth to these sacrifices.

The Jews who demanded that Jesus be crucified did not speak for Jews of the time. They certainly did not speak for Jews since.

your first seems to me to be utterly correct----except---the Sanhedrin did not
convict Jesus---the pertinent safeguard WORKED. As to your second paragraph--
keep in mind---the NT was written centuries LATER. There is nothing in the NT
to suggest that Jesus offered a way to worship God that
did not require expensive sacrifices in the Temple. The Sadducees COULD NOT
SELL the sacrifices. The romans did that in their Temples so it was easy for the
NICEAN COUNCIL to shove that silly shit down the throats of the people of
Rome --- The idea that jews demanded the crucifixion is UTTER BS. The attack
on the money changers ----shills for Rome ----rendered him a popular hero

 

[Clyde 154]

But I find the way humanity looks at Victims and Victimizers very troubling.
It's like how Dems blame Trump for the Division and instability during the rioting protests during his presidency, that which was created by the radical Left to cause the Chaos in order to blame their opponent and set up an image of a divisive unstable administration.
Rome did this to the Jews in blaming them for what they (Rome) were doing to the martyrs (ususally revolt leaders).
Rome scattered and had slain and set the narrative for caused future attrocities(Spanish Inquisition, Holocaust etc), so technically it wasn't the chasing of false idols, as most rejected the fallen ones, including rejecting Baracopa when he failed his liberation.
Rome did similar to the Veiins, slaughtering them and claiming their godess no longer favored them, then errected Junos statue and temple in Rome claiming their new authority.
Always blaming those they try and subvert and revictimize the victims while claiming pious of themselves who were the actual problem. This is the same tactic passed down by the mob, extortion racketeering by claiming you'll protect them, but it's really you they need protection from.

Can you spell deflection? I simply presented the prophecies from scripture that history proves fulfilled in relation to the Messiah. History actual.......just like applied science and the laws of physics cannot be circumvented by personal opinion based upon personal bias. Again..........why was Israel allowed to be destroyed, its temple destroyed, its land taken from the Jews, and its peoples scattered all over the globe just as the Christ prophesied if........ Jesus was one of many false Messiahs?

".......You serpents, you brood of vipers, how are you to escape being sentenced to hell? Therefore, I send you prophets and wise men and scribes, some of whom you will kill and crucify, and some you will flog in your synagogues and persecute from town to town, so that on you may come all the righteous blood shed on earth....................TRULY I SAY ALL THESE THINGS WILL COME UPON THIS GENERATION........." -- Matthew 23

Following......the Christ prophesied that within this generation (Jesus generation of the 1st century).........the "abomination of desolation" predicted by Daniel would come upon Israel. (Matthew 24:15). And not one stone of the temple was left unturned. These prophecies came true, just as described by Jesus Christ in the scriptures. Biblical Israel was destroyed by the Roman Empire over 2000 years ago, and never allowed to be completely restored, just as described by the prophets from the Old Testament. Israel would be destroyed and broken like a potter's vase.......never to be made whole again. (Jer. 19:7-13). Today the nation calling itself Israel is nothing but a shell of Biblical Israel. Israel does not possess the land of promise, there is no Temple, and no hope of a temple being rebuilt. There are no tribal IDs, no royal priesthood of Levites to offer burnt sacrifices to carry sin over from season to season..........no king appointed by God, only a government established by UN resolution and controlled today by politicians with a government ruled by man made laws instead of God's law as directed by the royal priesthood.

The same prophet............Jeremiah predicted the N.T. covenant because Israel was continually breaking God's law even though God was a husband unto them. (Jer. 31:31-34)\

These facts more than prove that the Holy Scriptures should be taken seriously........and not to be flippantly dismissed as myth due to some personal bias.

No one can deny that the N.T. covenant was established on earth and now includes over 1/3 the worlds total population as self confessed disciples of the Christ.

 

[Hector12]

your first seems to me to be utterly correct----except---the Sanhedrin did not
convict Jesus---the pertinent safeguard WORKED. As to your second paragraph--
keep in mind---the NT was written centuries LATER. There is nothing in the NT
to suggest that Jesus offered a way to worship God that
did not require expensive sacrifices in the Temple. The Sadducees COULD NOT
SELL the sacrifices. The romans did that in their Temples so it was easy for the
NICEAN COUNCIL to shove that silly shit down the throats of the people of
Rome --- The idea that jews demanded the crucifixion is UTTER BS. The attack
on the money changers ----shills for Rome ----rendered him a popular hero

The New Testament was certainly not written centuries later than the ministry of Jesus. Nearly half of the New Testament consists of epistles written by St. Paul. He was martyred about 62 AD., and talked to those who were eye witnesses to the ministry of Jesus.

A passage from the Gospel of St. John has been discovered in Egypt, and dated to about 130 AD.

 

[Clyde 154]

The New Testament was certainly not written centuries later than the ministry of Jesus. Nearly half of the New Testament consists of epistles written by St. Paul. He was martyred about 62 AD., and talked to those who were eye witnesses to the ministry of Jesus.

A passage from the Gospel of St. John has been discovered in Egypt, and dated to about 130 AD.

Facts mean nothing to Bigots.

 

[irosie91]

The New Testament was certainly not written centuries later than the ministry of Jesus. Nearly half of the New Testament consists of epistles written by St. Paul. He was martyred about 62 AD., and talked to those who were eye witnesses to the ministry of Jesus.

A passage from the Gospel of St. John has been discovered in Egypt, and dated to about 130 AD.

OK-----1) who is Saint John? there were lots of "JOHNS" in the NT. As to St. PAUL--
that one might be correct----but St Paul never met Jesus and wrote as if he knew the details
Jesus FIRST HAND. As to authenticity----one old document has been found but not
actually written by St Paul

Facts mean nothing to Bigots.

to what "facts" so you allude?

 

[Hector12]

OK-----1) who is Saint John? there were lots of "JOHNS" in the NT. As to St. PAUL--
that one might be correct----but St Paul never met Jesus and wrote as if he knew the details
Jesus FIRST HAND. As to authenticity----one old document has been found but not
actually written by St Paul

to what "facts" so you allude?

The prevailing theory of the Gospel according to St. John is that the disciple wrote part of it, and that this was eventually embellished by someone else. Whoever wrote the final version, that final version was in circulation by the time a fragment was found in Egypt about 130 AD.

 

[irosie91]

The prevailing theory of the Gospel according to St. John is that the disciple wrote part of it, and that this was eventually embellished by someone else. Whoever wrote the final version, that final version was in circulation by the time a fragment was found in Egypt about 130 AD.

thanks---according to Wikki----the "john" who is said to have written the fourth "gospel"
did so several years after the death of Jesus----and also wrote details of the life of Jesus---
which he could not have witnessed. I believe that is "heresay" in a court of law in the USA

 

[HaShev]

Can you spell deflection? I simply presented the prophecies from scripture that history proves fulfilled in relation to the Messiah. History actual.......just like applied science and the laws of physics cannot be circumvented by personal opinion based upon personal bias. Again..........why was Israel allowed to be destroyed, its temple destroyed, its land taken from the Jews, and its peoples scattered all over the globe just as the Christ prophesied if........ Jesus was one of many false Messiahs?

".......You serpents, you brood of vipers, how are you to escape being sentenced to hell? Therefore, I send you prophets and wise men and scribes, some of whom you will kill and crucify, and some you will flog in your synagogues and persecute from town to town, so that on you may come all the righteous blood shed on earth....................TRULY I SAY ALL THESE THINGS WILL COME UPON THIS GENERATION........." -- Matthew 23

Following......the Christ prophesied that within this generation (Jesus generation of the 1st century).........the "abomination of desolation" predicted by Daniel would come upon Israel. (Matthew 24:15). And not one stone of the temple was left unturned. These prophecies came true, just as described by Jesus Christ in the scriptures. Biblical Israel was destroyed by the Roman Empire over 2000 years ago, and never allowed to be completely restored, just as described by the prophets from the Old Testament. Israel would be destroyed and broken like a potter's vase.......never to be made whole again. (Jer. 19:7-13). Today the nation calling itself Israel is nothing but a shell of Biblical Israel. Israel does not possess the land of promise, there is no Temple, and no hope of a temple being rebuilt. There are no tribal IDs, no royal priesthood of Levites to offer burnt sacrifices to carry sin over from season to season..........no king appointed by God, only a government established by UN resolution and controlled today by politicians with a government ruled by man made laws instead of God's law as directed by the royal priesthood.

The same prophet............Jeremiah predicted the N.T. covenant because Israel was continually breaking God's law even though God was a husband unto them. (Jer. 31:31-34)\

These facts more than prove that the Holy Scriptures should be taken seriously........and not to be flippantly dismissed as myth due to some personal bias.

No one can deny that the N.T. covenant was established on earth and now includes over 1/3 the worlds total population as self confessed disciples of the Christ.

No you did not, which Is why I stopped reading your reply.
You are arguing over Judaic Scripture and History from the passed on perspective of the opponent (Rome) and it's one world religion, which is liken to getting your news and perspective about the Republican debate from a Democrat news host.
That's like debating over an airplane manual when you were trained by a boating instructor.
Shall I go on with the analogies?

 

[BreezeWood]

that which was created by the radical Left to cause the Chaos in order to blame their opponent and set up an image of a divisive unstable administration.

- to cause the chaos ...

and the ever friendly maga innocent lambs were besides themselves in grief ... at their losing the election as well was such a shock. so sad.

no problem for them to behave as outstanding citizens to take it on the chin and and be humbled by their experience.

 

[HaShev]

- to cause the chaos ...

View attachment 835494

and the ever friendly maga innocent lambs were besides themselves in grief ... at their losing the election as well was such a shock. so sad.

no problem for them to behave as outstanding citizens to take it on the chin and and be humbled by their experience.

Reread what I was talking about, I said "DURING HIS ADMINISTRATION", the riots (plural)caused by divisive news broadcasts, and leftist polititians pandering to it's radicalized base, including financing the riots and staffing and staging the social networks & organizing, which now we know the feds where puppet mastering by being embedded into those networks just like we see they were in your mistaken post.

 

[Clyde 154]

No you did not, which Is why I stopped reading your reply.
You are arguing over Judaic Scripture and History from the passed on perspective of the opponent (Rome) and it's one world religion, which is liken to getting your news and perspective about the Republican debate from a Democrat news host.
That's like debating over an airplane manual when you were trained by a boating instructor.
Shall I go on with the analogies?

We agree on one thing that is documented historical truth. Rome indeed corrupted the church/kingdom of Jesus Christ with its man made traditions ("....But in vain they do worship Me (Jesus Christ), teachings for doctrine the commandments of men." -- Matthew 15:9) But these corruptions did not even begin until the 4th century A.D., the church/kingdom given to the Christ by the Father (Matt. 16, 28:18-20) had been in existence for almost 400 years.....take note that the Roman Catholic Church also denies the truth found in the Holy Scriptures and make the claim that their man made traditions are superior to the Holy Spirit of Truth's word found in the canon of the Holy Bible.

What I find amazing is the fact that some Jews deny the Old Testament scriptures because they have been translated from Hebrew to Greek to English.....when history actual proves that the Greek Translation became the most read copy of the Old Testament 200 years before Jesus Christ was even born, and was used by the Jews because the original Hebrew tongue was fast becoming antiquated with fewer and fewer Jews being able to read from the original Text. The Jews of Jesus' time, by majority, read from the Septuagint Translation which came about because of 72 Hebrew scholars from 12 different Hebrew Tribes. (285-247 BCE)





You are the quint essential example of the truth revealed by John.........that an anitchirst doctrine has existed since Jesus was nailed to the cross. You demonstrate all the documented qualifiers of being an AnitChrist. 1. You deny the history contained in the New Testament. 2. You deny that the N.T was authorized by God in spite of the fact that God allowed the destruction of Israel because of its lack of faith in God's prophets. 3 You deny that Jesus Christ even existed as the Messiah of prophecy........and the church/kingdom given to Him does not even exist today. You are an ANTICHRIST as described by the Apostle John (1 John 2 John) Yeah.......... Old Testament prophecy is often described as being written in Rome. I presented historical facts that documented the prophecies of Jesus Christ, Daniel (Abomination of Desolation), and Jeremiah (historically documented fact that the coming N.T. prophesied has existed for over 2000 yrs and now encompasses over 1/3 of the world's population). You can call these historical events some kind of conspiracy if you wish because of your bigotry toward the truth found in the N.T............but all it does is invoke a good belly laugh.

What? You call it a conspiracy of Rome to historically document the total destruction of Jerusalem by the Roman Empire as prophesied by both Jesus and Daniel (event occurred in the late 1st century)........and you can attempt to deny the historical fact that the New Testament Covenant of Jesus Christ has not existed since the 1st century.....while Biblical Israel was destroyed with its people scattered around the world. Can you really deny that Jeremiah's prophecies (Jer. 19:7-13, 31:31-34), have been fulfilled? Israel was not broken into pieces and scattered around the world like an empty potter's vessel........never to be made whole again......NOPE,that's just a Roman Conspiracy........Israel was never removed from the earth 2000 years ago, (Jer.19:7-13). And there has never been a N.T. covenant.........to exist on earth NOPE.......that's just make believe also......Rome did it............that trader Paul/Saul who studied the Law and the Prophets under the great Rabbi teacher "Gamaliel" (Acts 22:3) is just a damn liar.

 

[shimon]

Yeah.......... Old Testament prophecy is often described as being written in Rome. I presented historical facts that documented the prophecies of Jesus Christ, Daniel (Abomination of Desolation), and Jeremiah (historically documented fact that the coming N.T. prophesied has existed for over 2000 yrs and now encompasses over 1/3 of the world's population). You can call these historical events some kind of conspiracy if you wish because of your bigotry toward the truth found in the N.T............but all it does is invoke a good belly laugh.

Yes we are told that 1/3 rd of the stars in heaven would follow Satan( the adversary and accuser) thankyou for pointing that out to all of us…. Wink Wink

 

[HaShev]

We agree on one thing that is documented historical truth. Rome indeed corrupted the church/kingdom of Jesus Christ with its man made traditions ("....But in vain they do worship Me (Jesus Christ), teachings for doctrine the commandments of men." -- Matthew 15:9) But these corruptions did not even begin until the 4th century A.D., the church/kingdom given to the Christ by the Father (Matt. 16, 28:18-20) had been in existence for almost 400 years.....take note that the Roman Catholic Church also denies the truth found in the Holy Scriptures and make the claim that their man made traditions are superior to the Holy Spirit of Truth's word found in the canon of the Holy Bible.

What I find amazing is the fact that some Jews deny the Old Testament scriptures because they have been translated from Hebrew to Greek to English.....when history actual proves that the Greek Translation became the most read copy of the Old Testament 200 years before Jesus Christ was even born, and was used by the Jews because the original Hebrew tongue was fast becoming antiquated with fewer and fewer Jews being able to read from the original Text. The Jews of Jesus' time, by majority, read from the Septuagint Translation which came about because of 72 Hebrew scholars from 12 different Hebrew Tribes. (285-247 BCE)





You are the quint essential example of the truth revealed by John.........that an anitchirst doctrine has existed since Jesus was nailed to the cross. You demonstrate all the documented qualifiers of being an AnitChrist. 1. You deny the history contained in the New Testament. 2. You deny that the N.T was authorized by God in spite of the fact that God allowed the destruction of Israel because of its lack of faith in God's prophets. 3 You deny that Jesus Christ even existed as the Messiah of prophecy........and the church/kingdom given to Him does not even exist today. You are an ANTICHRIST as described by the Apostle John (1 John 2 John) Yeah.......... Old Testament prophecy is often described as being written in Rome. I presented historical facts that documented the prophecies of Jesus Christ, Daniel (Abomination of Desolation), and Jeremiah (historically documented fact that the coming N.T. prophesied has existed for over 2000 yrs and now encompasses over 1/3 of the world's population). You can call these historical events some kind of conspiracy if you wish because of your bigotry toward the truth found in the N.T............but all it does is invoke a good belly laugh.

What? You call it a conspiracy of Rome to historically document the total destruction of Jerusalem by the Roman Empire as prophesied by both Jesus and Daniel (event occurred in the late 1st century)........and you can attempt to deny the historical fact that the New Testament Covenant of Jesus Christ has not existed since the 1st century.....while Biblical Israel was destroyed with its people scattered around the world. Can you really deny that Jeremiah's prophecies (Jer. 19:7-13, 31:31-34), have been fulfilled? Israel was not broken into pieces and scattered around the world like an empty potter's vessel........never to be made whole again......NOPE,that's just a Roman Conspiracy........Israel was never removed from the earth 2000 years ago, (Jer.19:7-13). And there has never been a N.T. covenant.........to exist on earth NOPE.......that's just make believe also......Rome did it............that trader Paul/Saul who studied the Law and the Prophets under the great Rabbi teacher "Gamaliel" (Acts 22:3) is just a damn liar.

I'm a biblical Historian with access to other Biblical era scholars and perhaps you don't realize, the NT you see today is not like the older copies, as well as your lack of access to off shoot cults like the offspring of surviving original followers of John the Baptist whom One of the characters used for the Jesus myth had originally followed before having him killed and stealing some of his flock.
Having access to Apochrypha, codecs, predated ancient tablets, Scroll interpretations from non biased Professors, and archeological research is a huge difference then regurgitation of religious propaganda from known liars

 

[kjw47]

This is in response to the thread about why Jews reject Jesus as Messiah

Answer this question and you get your answer to the other thread.

After all, the rejection of Jesus by the Jewish leaders of the time of Jesus is why he was rejected by Jews today.

They were apostocised when Jesus came. No one could defeat Israel when God was standing with them. The Romans defeated them because God was not with them at that point. Jesus assured them-you are of your father the devil.

 

[Hector12]

This is in response to the thread about why Jews reject Jesus as Messiah

Answer this question and you get your answer to the other thread.

After all, the rejection of Jesus by the Jewish leaders of the time of Jesus is why he was rejected by Jews today.

Most Jews at the time expected their Messiah to defeat the Romans, and re establish the Empire of King David. David conquered Syria and there nations living in what is not Jordan. These were, from north to south the Ammonites, the Moabites, and the Edomites.

Jesus did none of that. After he was crucified life went on as before.