Will Trump be a war criminal like Truman?

[gipper]

...and Truman was most certainly a war criminal and a liar.

He most certainly was not. His actions, while horrific, ended a war that would have certainly resulted in even thousands more dying than did by dropping the bomb.

Just a terrible lie. Read Ralph Raico.

No, just your own conspiracy theory

Read Ralph and you won't be stupid any longer

 

[Theowl32]

The bombs were about avoiding a conflict with the USSR.

The cold war began with the USSR (left wing paradise) early in 1945 at the Yalta Conference. Stalin was not interested in anything other than expanding his territory. After taking over east Germany and Poland he was intending on taking over those valuable trade routes in the far east. He was encroaching in on the area and he was looking to get Japan to surrender to them. It may have happened and the emperor of Japan would certainly be interested in trying to save face with the Japanese people.

Three choices of Truman...

1. Allow Stalin to come in and allow Japan to surrender to them after American lives had been spilled after a 4 year conflict.

2. Get into a war with the USSR like Patton wanted. America had the logistical advantages, considering American war factories were in working order and American hardware was in the region already. Of course it would have meant a very bloody campaign and would have cost 100k American lives. An almost impossible sell to the American people who were extremely war weary.

3. Get the USSR to back the hell off by dropping the secret weapon and letting stalin know what is coming his way if he does not back off.

Also consider the us dropped little boy on August 6th 1945, the USSR declared war on Japan on August 8th, and the US dropped fat man on August 9th.

Stalin called Americas bluff that they had more than one bomb. USSR backed off, Japan surrendered to us, and then the Jewish commies sold stalin the secrets to making the bomb.

The rest is history.

Those are your choices. What do you do?

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Opinions are like assholes..........

Facts and reality are tough things for many Americans to accept.

Complete fabrications and pure conjecture is all you have.

What do you propose we should have done? Tell them we have this super secret weapon and you better surrender or else?

That would have worked in your fantasy world.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

...and Truman was most certainly a war criminal and a liar.

He most certainly was not. His actions, while horrific, ended a war that would have certainly resulted in even thousands more dying than did by dropping the bomb.

Just a terrible lie. Read Ralph Raico.

No, just your own conspiracy theory

Read Ralph and you won't be stupid any longer

Wake up and you won't be stupid for reading propaganda years after the fact.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Speaking of war criminals I have a question for you Moon Bats.

Was that asshole Obama a war criminal for bombing Libya? How about Slick Willy for bombing Bosnia?
At least in the case of Truman Congress had declared war on Japan after they attacked the US. In the case of Libya or Bosnia neither one of those countries ever did a thing to the US.

Are you Moon Bats hypocritical assholes that hate Trump so much for beating that piece of shit Crooked Hillary that you have gone bat shit cray with Trump's response to North Korea's threats to nuke the US? Are you fucking idiots?

Confusing me with a D liberal, is funny.

At any rate, I think just about every president from Wilson on, is a war criminal.

That's because you are an idiot.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Opinions are like assholes..........

Facts and reality are tough things for many Americans to accept.

When one blurs opinion with fact, all hope for them is lost.

The facts are clearly laid out in the article I posted, in the OP.

Confusing opinion with facts to promote the establishment, could be considered traitorous.

You apparently do not understand the vast difference in opinion and facts.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Truman brought the Pacific war to an end very quickly. Few other lives were lost. Right choice.

LMFAO.

Just another lie that sadly way too many Americans WANT to believe.

So it is a lie that the war ended after the second bomb was dropped? Are you seriously that stupid.?

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

One has to be strong mentally to accept the truth that their nation is a rogue empire.

Are you strong enough?

Your "Libertarian /Anarchist" label should be replaced with "I'm just plain stupid".

 

[RadicalRedneck]

...and Truman was most certainly a war criminal and a liar. Let's hope Trump does not follow in his footsteps.

From the great Ralph Raico....the truth...you might not like it.

Harry Truman and the Atomic Bomb
Great controversy has always surrounded the bombings. One thing Truman insisted on from the start was that the decision to use the bombs, and the responsibility it entailed, was his. Over the years, he gave different, and contradictory, grounds for his decision. Sometimes he implied that he had acted simply out of revenge. To a clergyman who criticized him, Truman responded testily,

Nobody is more disturbed over the use of Atomic bombs than I am but I was greatly disturbed over the unwarranted attack by the Japanese on Pearl Harbor and their murder of our prisoners of war. The only language they seem to understand is the one we have been using to bombard them.2

Such reasoning will not impress anyone who fails to see how the brutality of the Japanese military could justify deadly retaliation against innocent men, women, and children. Truman doubtless was aware of this, so from time to time he advanced other pretexts. On August 9, 1945, he stated, “The world will note that the first atomic bomb was dropped on Hiroshima, a military base. That was because we wished in this first attack to avoid, insofar as possible, the killing of civilians.

This, however, is absurd. Pearl Harbor was a military base. Hiroshima was a city, inhabited by some three hundred thousand people, which contained military elements. In any case, since the harbor was mined and the US Navy and Air Force were in control of the waters around Japan, whatever troops were stationed in Hiroshima had been effectively neutralized.

On other occasions, Truman claimed that Hiroshima was bombed because it was an industrial center. But, as noted in the US Strategic Bombing Survey, “all major factories in Hiroshima were on the periphery of the city — and escaped serious damage.”4 The target was the center of the city. That Truman realized the kind of victims the bombs consumed is evident from his comment to his cabinet on August 10, explaining his reluctance to drop a third bomb: “The thought of wiping out another 100,000 people was too horrible,” he said; he didn’t like the idea of killing “all those kids.”5 Wiping out another one hundred thousand people … all those kids.

Harry Truman’s Atomic Bombs - LewRockwell LewRockwell.com

Get your facts straight, like you their All screwed up.

 

[Tax Man]

The orange buffoon is a criminal now.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

"W" taught the world the U.S. would conduct 'pre-emptive' war, and, with that, blew the possibility of doing so in a really serious situation, which Iraq was not. His illegal invasion justified and re-enforced the determination of the N.K. régime to assure its protection through nuclear weapons acquisition. In general, though, the entire American policy and attitude since the Second World War has been counter productive to any peaceful unification of the peninsula.

There's that "illegal invasion" that you airheads keep bringing up! The only thing on that topic that is truly illegal is that you people are walking around without a keeper!

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

"W" taught the world the U.S. would conduct 'pre-emptive' war, and, with that, blew the possibility of doing so in a really serious situation, which Iraq was not. His illegal invasion justified and re-enforced the determination of the N.K. régime to assure its protection through nuclear weapons acquisition. In general, though, the entire American policy and attitude since the Second World War has been counter productive to any peaceful unification of the peninsula.

What about Slick Willy's preemptive attack on Bosnia? Obama's preemptive attack on Libya?

How about for a teaching moment you look at JFK's and LBJ's preemptive war in Vietnam. The Democrats can teach us a lot, can't they?

The greatest threat to world peace, is the American ruling class and this has been so for decades. Sadly the vast majority of Americans, don't know this.

JFK tried to put a stop to this and he was murdered in broad day light.

Duh, JFK = bay of pigs. Are you actually as stupid as your posts indicate?

Clearly you are uninformed.

JFK was working covertly with both Khrushchev and Castro, to end the Cold War when he was murdered. You might want to listen to his greatest speech. Sometimes referred to as the Peace Speech, given at American University.

You should feel very bad and embarrassed for not knowing this.

How well did that work out?

You are a truly classless clown!

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

[Q



Duh, JFK = bay of pigs. Are you actually as stupid as your posts indicate?

JFK authorized the Bay of Pigs and then was too chickenshit to follow through on it. Typical incompetent Democrat leadership. We see it in every Democrat administration, don't we?

Your post reflects poorly on you. It means you are a dumb person. You are uninformed. Get informed before posting.

A mind is a terrible thing to waste.

Reading contrived bullshit does not make you informed. You are living proof!

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

...and Truman was most certainly a war criminal and a liar.

He most certainly was not. His actions, while horrific, ended a war that would have certainly resulted in even thousands more dying than did by dropping the bomb.

Just a terrible lie. Read Ralph Raico.

He was a liberal. Enough said,

 

[MaryL]

...and Truman was most certainly a war criminal and a liar. Let's hope Trump does not follow in his footsteps.

From the great Ralph Raico....the truth...you might not like it.

Harry Truman and the Atomic Bomb
Great controversy has always surrounded the bombings. One thing Truman insisted on from the start was that the decision to use the bombs, and the responsibility it entailed, was his. Over the years, he gave different, and contradictory, grounds for his decision. Sometimes he implied that he had acted simply out of revenge. To a clergyman who criticized him, Truman responded testily,

Nobody is more disturbed over the use of Atomic bombs than I am but I was greatly disturbed over the unwarranted attack by the Japanese on Pearl Harbor and their murder of our prisoners of war. The only language they seem to understand is the one we have been using to bombard them.2

Such reasoning will not impress anyone who fails to see how the brutality of the Japanese military could justify deadly retaliation against innocent men, women, and children. Truman doubtless was aware of this, so from time to time he advanced other pretexts. On August 9, 1945, he stated, “The world will note that the first atomic bomb was dropped on Hiroshima, a military base. That was because we wished in this first attack to avoid, insofar as possible, the killing of civilians.

This, however, is absurd. Pearl Harbor was a military base. Hiroshima was a city, inhabited by some three hundred thousand people, which contained military elements. In any case, since the harbor was mined and the US Navy and Air Force were in control of the waters around Japan, whatever troops were stationed in Hiroshima had been effectively neutralized.

On other occasions, Truman claimed that Hiroshima was bombed because it was an industrial center. But, as noted in the US Strategic Bombing Survey, “all major factories in Hiroshima were on the periphery of the city — and escaped serious damage.”4 The target was the center of the city. That Truman realized the kind of victims the bombs consumed is evident from his comment to his cabinet on August 10, explaining his reluctance to drop a third bomb: “The thought of wiping out another 100,000 people was too horrible,” he said; he didn’t like the idea of killing “all those kids.”5 Wiping out another one hundred thousand people … all those kids.

Harry Truman’s Atomic Bombs - LewRockwell LewRockwell.com

Truman a war criminal? Please, elaborate. Hyperbole and spin isn't proof. To my knowledge, the imperial Japanese government were the real criminals, and were tried and convicted. They murdered, they slaughtered innocent people of all nationalities with abandon to empower that co-property sphere of theirs. They started the war in the pacific and it took 2 A- bombs to shut down these war mongering xenophobes. I think Truman is a hero. Bravo!

 

[Flash]

Whoever was responsible, the Bay of Pigs was a ridiculously stupid move.

Bosnia was not an illegal invasion.

Vietnam was also not an invasion, nor even a declared war; South Vietnam welcomed American aid.

Iraq was illegal, immoral, unnecessary and totally foolhardy. It ruined American diplomatique capital, needlessly destabilized the region, wasted vast amounts of life and treasure, and hardened the already insidieuse polarization of America. Worse, it limited U.S. military options worldwide. America was sorely weakened by the malfaisance of that watch.

The only thing remotely constructive that can be done in Korea is to get the Chinese to do it. Whatever it takes, that is what it has to be. Anything else invites horrific disaster.

Bosnia was a dumbass war for the US. Imagine killing Christians to protect Muslims. Slick Willy was an idiot.

The intentions in Vietnam were noble but the execution was terrible. Anyway we won but the Democrats gave away the victory.

Iraq was a dumbass war. We invaded a country that had nothing to do with 911.

What we are seeing in North Korea is the nuclear proliferation by a madman that we hoped would never happen. Potential for a nightmare. Unless China does something this could wind up be very nasty. Trump inherited a turd.

 

[gipper]

The bombs were about avoiding a conflict with the USSR.

The cold war began with the USSR (left wing paradise) early in 1945 at the Yalta Conference. Stalin was not interested in anything other than expanding his territory. After taking over east Germany and Poland he was intending on taking over those valuable trade routes in the far east. He was encroaching in on the area and he was looking to get Japan to surrender to them. It may have happened and the emperor of Japan would certainly be interested in trying to save face with the Japanese people.

Three choices of Truman...

1. Allow Stalin to come in and allow Japan to surrender to them after American lives had been spilled after a 4 year conflict.

2. Get into a war with the USSR like Patton wanted. America had the logistical advantages, considering American war factories were in working order and American hardware was in the region already. Of course it would have meant a very bloody campaign and would have cost 100k American lives. An almost impossible sell to the American people who were extremely war weary.

3. Get the USSR to back the hell off by dropping the secret weapon and letting stalin know what is coming his way if he does not back off.

Also consider the us dropped little boy on August 6th 1945, the USSR declared war on Japan on August 8th, and the US dropped fat man on August 9th.

Stalin called Americas bluff that they had more than one bomb. USSR backed off, Japan surrendered to us, and then the Jewish commies sold stalin the secrets to making the bomb.

The rest is history.

Those are your choices. What do you do?

Yes there is that, that being dumb ass Truman dropped those two bombs on two defenseless cities containing mostly women and children, to impress Uncle Joe. Yet Uncle Joe knew about the bombs before Truman did, thanks to the many Soviet spies FDR had placed in high positions.

 

[Theowl32]

The bombs were about avoiding a conflict with the USSR.

The cold war began with the USSR (left wing paradise) early in 1945 at the Yalta Conference. Stalin was not interested in anything other than expanding his territory. After taking over east Germany and Poland he was intending on taking over those valuable trade routes in the far east. He was encroaching in on the area and he was looking to get Japan to surrender to them. It may have happened and the emperor of Japan would certainly be interested in trying to save face with the Japanese people.

Three choices of Truman...

1. Allow Stalin to come in and allow Japan to surrender to them after American lives had been spilled after a 4 year conflict.

2. Get into a war with the USSR like Patton wanted. America had the logistical advantages, considering American war factories were in working order and American hardware was in the region already. Of course it would have meant a very bloody campaign and would have cost 100k American lives. An almost impossible sell to the American people who were extremely war weary.

3. Get the USSR to back the hell off by dropping the secret weapon and letting stalin know what is coming his way if he does not back off.

Also consider the us dropped little boy on August 6th 1945, the USSR declared war on Japan on August 8th, and the US dropped fat man on August 9th.

Stalin called Americas bluff that they had more than one bomb. USSR backed off, Japan surrendered to us, and then the Jewish commies sold stalin the secrets to making the bomb.

The rest is history.

Those are your choices. What do you do?

Yes there is that, that being dumb ass Truman dropped those two bombs on two defenseless cities containing mostly women and children, to impress Uncle Joe. Yet Uncle Joe knew about the bombs before Truman did, thanks to the many Soviet spies FDR had placed in high positions.

Oh, I am sure he knew about them, but I do not think he "really knew." Make no mistake, there was unreal secrecy about the Manhattan Project. However, as the cold war began to grow, the US ALLOWED certain things to get out. Meaning, they wanted stalin to be aware that the US had it. They did not want him to know the specifics.

Stalin called their bluff. We had no real capability of "precision" bombing back then.

The fire bombing Dresden was rather typical.

Truman had 3 choices. All of them dubious at best. Each one having long term severe consequences.

When I presented the choices, you can see they essentially really had only one choice.

Unless you think they should have just allowed stalin to just indescriminantly take over the entire region.

There was really no realistic choice.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Whoever was responsible, the Bay of Pigs was a ridiculously stupid move.

Bosnia was not an illegal invasion.

Vietnam was also not an invasion, nor even a declared war; South Vietnam welcomed American aid.

Iraq was illegal, immoral, unnecessary and totally foolhardy. It ruined American diplomatique capital, needlessly destabilized the region, wasted vast amounts of life and treasure, and hardened the already insidieuse polarization of America. Worse, it limited U.S. military options worldwide. America was sorely weakened by the malfaisance of that watch.

The only thing remotely constructive that can be done in Korea is to get the Chinese to do it. Whatever it takes, that is what it has to be. Anything else invites horrific disaster.

Bosnia was a dumbass war for the US. Imagine killing Christians to protect Muslims. Slick Willy was an idiot.

The intentions in Vietnam were noble but the execution was terrible. Anyway we won but the Democrats gave away the victory.

Iraq was a dumbass war. We invaded a country that had nothing to do with 911.

What we are seeing in North Korea is the nuclear proliferation by a madman that we hoped would never happen. Potential for a nightmare. Unless China does something this could wind up be very nasty. Trump inherited a turd.

Whoever said it had anything to do with 9/11? The only time I usually see this claim is from liberals.

 

[SavannahMann]

...and Truman was most certainly a war criminal and a liar.

He most certainly was not. His actions, while horrific, ended a war that would have certainly resulted in even thousands more dying than did by dropping the bomb.

Just a terrible lie. Read Ralph Raico.

I read it. It uses a handful of cherry picked quotes to support the assertion. It is flawed on so many fronts that it is practically comedy. Or it would be if it wasn't so sad.

If you go looking at History to learn and to understand everything about it you possibly can, you're starting in the right frame of mind. If you go searching for proof for a previously held belief, then you're doing a lot of work to justify your ideals instead of learning. You aren't learning, you're proving an assertion.

Ralph does not examine the question from the end of the 1800's like he should. Science Fiction was already examining the issue of air controlling the ground when the First World War starts. HG Wells wrote about an attack on New York City that drove America to it's knees in 1908. He wasn't alone. He wasn't the only one imagining and thinking of this kind of stuff. Jules Verne also wrote books about the subject in the 1880's.

You have to start much much earlier than 1945, or even 1944 to really understand the issue. You have to examine the period between World Wars, and you have to actually begin far before the First World War, when gas lanterns were the awesome invention that would replace candles.

That is when this all begins. The technology, the tactics, and strategies develop from that point.

With a few notable exceptions the military we will fight the war with in the 1940's is either developed, or in development in the late 1930's. The idea of strategic bombing, bombing targets that would harm enemy war efforts was in development. Close Air Support was proven by the Germans in Spain during the Civil War. That was the place where Blitzkreig was perfected.

There is so much more to consider.