Will trump be forced to use national emergency to build wall

[danielpalos]

And the Courts will slap him down when he tries it, assuming someone in the Justice Department doesn't talk some sense into him before he tries it.

A recurring and consistent theme among those against protecting Americans.......clear in many of JoeB131's posts and others like him.....is this concept.....

"The Laws and Constitution of the US expressly allow both to be used against those it was supposed to protect, and to destroy the nation"

In other words, I find it interesting that those celebrating the downfall of the USA, are using our own laws and Constitution against us by twisting it's meanings then calling those who reject the twisting "bigots", "racists" and you name it.

What kind of US Court would rule AGAINST measures that protect American interests and lives???

Wouldn't those courts have to be run by enemies of The People?

no. the right wing is merely clueless and Causeless.

 

[danielpalos]

Most people get drunk and late into the night text their friends, or text for bootie calls. Aponi has neither in her life, so she posts on USMB. Sad!

she must have lousy female intuition.

 

[danielpalos]

The President can both Constitutionally and legally declare a National Emergency, and the courts can't stop him from building the Wall. ...

Uh, yeah, actually, they can. Checks and Balances... they probably should have taught you that at some point.

The National Emergency remedy is a Joint Resolution of Congress. Since the remedy exists, the courts have no basis to stop the emergency declaration, i.e. it is LAWFUL.

there is no immigration clause in our federal Constitution; it is an establishment clause for naturalization.

 

[danielpalos]

The President can both Constitutionally and legally declare a National Emergency, and the courts can't stop him from building the Wall. ...

Uh, yeah, actually, they can. Checks and Balances... they probably should have taught you that at some point.

The National Emergency remedy is a Joint Resolution of Congress. Since the remedy exists, the courts have no basis to stop the emergency declaration, i.e. it is LAWFUL.

I see nothing about Congress here, except that the declaration be transmitted to Congress. What happens then depends on what statute the President is citing to use.

Where did you get a Joint Resolution of Congress? I am not criticizing--I am asking because I would really like to know how this happens.

National Emergencies Act, Sections 201 and 301
Fact Sheet
Overview
The National Emergencies Act (NEA) authorizes the president to declare a “national emergency.”1 A declaration under NEA triggers emergency authorities contained in other federal statutes. Past NEA declarations have addressed, among other things, the imposition of export controls and limitations on transactions and property from specified nations.2 A national emergency was declared in 2001 after the September 11th terrorist attacks and has been renewed every year since then. (Download a printable PDF.)

What the Law Does

The NEA authorizes the president to declare a national emergency, which declaration activates emergency powers contained in other federal statutes.3During the 2009 H1N1 influenza pandemic, the president’s declaration of a national emergency under the NEA, coupled with the HHS secretary’s prior determination of a public health emergency under Section 319 of the Public Health Service Act (PHSA), permitted the activation of Social Security Act (SSA) Section 1135 waiver authorities. (See Figure A for the text of the 2009 H1N1 NEA declaration.)

How the Law Works
The NEA does not provide any specific emergency authority on its own, but relies on emergency authorities provided in other statutes. A national emergency declaration allows for the activation of these other statutory authorities. Emergency statutory provisions are not activated automatically, however; they must be specifically identified in the president’s declaration before these authorities may be given effect.

Declaration
NEA Section 201 authorizes the president to declare a national emergency. The proclamation of a national emergency must be immediately transmitted to Congress and published in the Federal Register.1,2 Under NEA Section 301, statutory emergency authorities enabled by the national emergency declaration cannot be exercised until the president specifies the provisions of law under which the president or other officials will act. Such specification may be made either in the declaration or in subsequent Executive Orders published in theFederal Register and transmitted to Congress.

Termination
A national emergency can be terminated if the president issues a proclamation or if Congress enacts a joint resolution terminating the emergency. A national emergency will terminate automatically upon the anniversary of the proclamation unless the president renews the proclamation by transmitting notice to Congress within a 90-day period prior to the anniversary date and publishing it in the Federal Register.

National Emergencies Act, Sections 201 and 301 Fact Sheet | State Public Health | ASTHO

we have no general defense clause. we have no common defense issue. we have a refugee problem that capitalism could be providing solutions for, with a petty cash fund for that purpose.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

And the Courts will slap him down when he tries it, assuming someone in the Justice Department doesn't talk some sense into him before he tries it.

The President can both Constitutionally and legally declare a National Emergency, and the courts can't stop him from building the Wall. ...

Actually, they can, and so can the House Speaker. The President can't usurp Congressional power to appropriate funding. The Senate isn't going to allow the reappropriation of defense funds for it either.

And it has now been exposed that he was in talks with a Russian owned company to import the steel to relax debts from loans by Russians. This story will becoming mainstream shortly, and when Mueller indicts Trump Jr. here shortly. dotard is going to have much bigger problems than the spanking he just got from Pelosi.

You mean like he's had the last two years? Keep dreaming.

According to Politifact, Trump can declare an emergency and get the money from anywhere he wants to and the Congress can't do squat about it.

it has to be decided by the courts whether it is justified.

Only the procedural and legal part. Why Trump declared it does not.

 

[danielpalos]

We have a president who is for the American people first but your eyes are blinded and mind narrow and closed that you cannot see it. There is nothing more important than the national security of this country. Our very existence depends on a secure America. We cannot have that security with open borders and 20 million in the country illegally is proof and all Americans are affected. If you want to set back in your comfort zone ignoring the facts, just wait because all of that will soon disappear if Trump do not secure the border and stop illegal drugs and aliens. Because if people do not have they will take what you have.

in right wing fantasy, y'all are Always right.

We have no drug war clause, wall building clause or immigration clause. The right wing loves to waste our tax money and blame the Poor.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

The botox bitch Nancy and her Democrat hoard won't change and the deadline will pass without giving the American people their Wall.

So our beloved Pres.Trump will have no choice but to declare a National Emergency and have the Wall built.

Which is absolutely fine with me. ...

Unfortunately this is correct. The Dems will not negotiate in good faith in the next 3 weeks because they lack any real integrity. Trump will have to declare a national emergency in which case the SCOTUS will ultimately decide just like they did on the Obamacare mandate.

The only thing the court can do (legally) is decide whether he used proper procedure or not. If he does (and I"m sure his team will) they really can't stop Trump because there is no definition of a national emergency--only procedural processes.

he has to justify the reasoning. one problem that he will run into is the amount of time. he had 2 years to push it thru. he never really tried to do that...

Where does it say he has to justify the reason? To whom?

 

[JoeB131]

The national emergency can be addressed to ways, either by a Bill passed by congress, or by a declaration. It will get done, its a long term problem not a short term problem. It will take many years to implement all of the required birder improvements.

He has to have an actual emergency to declare on. The fact he didn't do this two years ago is proof there is no emergency.

The courts will slap him down, as they should.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Ah yes, those Republicans trying to secure the Hispanic vote.

A court cannot stop a President from declaring a national emergency. It's not in their authority. The law states a President can declare an emergency by following the process which Trump will do. Because a national emergency has no description, there is nothing for the court to stop. It's not unconstitutional and it's within the laws set forth by Congress back in the 70's.

You keep telling yourself that... but no one is going to believe him.

Explain to me how a situation that has been going on for 30 years and is at 20% of the flow it was at in 2000 suddenly constitutes an "emergency"...

"My daughter might date a Mexican" is not an emergency.

I thought I've explained it quite well. In 2017 our agents apprehended over 300,000 illegals at the border. That's 299,999 too many. It's impossible to know how many others were successful. These people are coming here with drugs, with diseases, with sick children, with criminal records and intent. It's even been reported that people from terrorist organizations have been caught.

So when do you consider it an emergency, when another 911 happens or worse? When they infect tens of thousands of Americans with some disease? When enough Americans are slaughtered by MS-13?

If your city puts up security cameras because 20 people a week are victims of armed robbery on the street, and they eventually reduce that number to 10 armed robberies a week, is that any reason to halt efforts to stop that other 10?

 

[JoeB131]

20% still equates to ten's of thousands of illegals invading our border every year and must be stopped now. ...

Why? They aren't bothering anyone.

I would think any logical person would deem the flood of Illegal Aliens who contain criminals, potential terrorists, and those that want to scam the system (steal) IS a National Emergency. Glad Trump has the b*lls to see that.

Crossing the border without permission isn't even a felony... how does that alone constitute an "emergency".

If Trump declares a national emergency and democrats find a judge to stop the wall and it goes to the Supreme Court, Ginsburg has to recuse herself.

No, she really doesn't. Not to worry, even the Knuckle Draggers he appointed would be loath to allow the president to undercut Congress like this.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

In 21 days, if someone with a lick of sense doesn't talk him out of it, he'll try to pull this nonsense, but then the courts will slap him down because this is in no way, shape or form an "emergency".

The law does not give the courts a say in what an emergency is or not--only the President.

 

[busybee01]

And the Courts will slap him down when he tries it, assuming someone in the Justice Department doesn't talk some sense into him before he tries it.

The President can both Constitutionally and legally declare a National Emergency, and the courts can't stop him from building the Wall. ...

The courts can stop him as the Constitution gives the Congress the power of the purse. It doesn't say but or if. The Congress can defund any action a President says even a military action.

No they can't, not if there is a law permitting the President to do just that. In order for the courts to stop Trump, they would have to rule that the Emergency Act of 1976 is unconstitutional, and good luck with that one.

Declaring an emergency does not involve Congress because it doesn't give the right for a President to pass a budget. It gives the President a right to use funds already appropriated and transfer those funds to his claimed emergency. In other words, it won't strip Congress of their power of the purse and won't cost the taxpayers one additional cent. It will likely transfer money from our defense budget to build the wall.

The Congress authorizes all spending. It does not have to do anything with a budget. The Constitution overrides a law. He has to have a Congressional authorization to SPEND the money. The courts would only have to rule that a Congressional authorization is required. They would not even have to rule on a national emergency. If the Congress was unable to perform their actions due to a natural disaster or a man-made disaster then they may have a case. But Congress is fully functional.

 

[busybee01]

It is different but the principle is the same. Presidents have declared states of emergencies because of inflation or logjams in shipping goods and all kinds of other problems when Congress was unable to take effective action over 500 times.

I don’t have a list of all these instances but I’d bet I would be in agreement with less than 5% of them, based on basic Constitutionality.

It is not really a constitutional issue. In saner times Congress passed laws granting the President vast powers to act when he deems Congress is unable to act effectively, and these laws strip Congress of the power to rescind these powers without the consent of the President.

It is a Constitutional issue as using a national emergency to build a wall would directly contradict the Constitution which gives Congress the power of the purse. Laws cannot override the Constitution.

 

[danielpalos]

In 21 days, if someone with a lick of sense doesn't talk him out of it, he'll try to pull this nonsense, but then the courts will slap him down because this is in no way, shape or form an "emergency".

The law does not give the courts a say in what an emergency is or not--only the President.

there is no express wall building power or express immigration clause. stop blaming the Poor.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

And the Courts will slap him down when he tries it, assuming someone in the Justice Department doesn't talk some sense into him before he tries it.

The President can both Constitutionally and legally declare a National Emergency, and the courts can't stop him from building the Wall. ...

The courts can stop him as the Constitution gives the Congress the power of the purse. It doesn't say but or if. The Congress can defund any action a President says even a military action.

No they can't, not if there is a law permitting the President to do just that. In order for the courts to stop Trump, they would have to rule that the Emergency Act of 1976 is unconstitutional, and good luck with that one.

Declaring an emergency does not involve Congress because it doesn't give the right for a President to pass a budget. It gives the President a right to use funds already appropriated and transfer those funds to his claimed emergency. In other words, it won't strip Congress of their power of the purse and won't cost the taxpayers one additional cent. It will likely transfer money from our defense budget to build the wall.

The Congress authorizes all spending. It does not have to do anything with a budget. The Constitution overrides a law. He has to have a Congressional authorization to SPEND the money. The courts would only have to rule that a Congressional authorization is required. They would not even have to rule on a national emergency. If the Congress was unable to perform their actions due to a natural disaster or a man-made disaster then they may have a case. But Congress is fully functional.

Again, it has nothing to do with Congress. The money has already been allocated. It's just Trump is taking that allocated money from one entity and placing it in another which the law allows him to do with or without congressional approval.

Congress has delegated broad powers allowing a president to repurpose funds after declaring a national emergency, but there are still laws to follow. Declaring a national emergency does not automatically get Trump $5.7 billion for a border wall.

According to some media reports, the White House has asked the Army Corps of Engineers to examine if funds from its budget for civil work projects, including flood control projects in areas affected by recent natural disasters, could be used for the border wall.

"He would have to try to use statutory powers previously given by Congress that purportedly allow him to reallocate money for that purpose," Boyle said.

Could Trump declare a national emergency for a border wall?

 

[BS Filter]

20% still equates to ten's of thousands of illegals invading our border every year and must be stopped now. ...

Why? They aren't bothering anyone.

I would think any logical person would deem the flood of Illegal Aliens who contain criminals, potential terrorists, and those that want to scam the system (steal) IS a National Emergency. Glad Trump has the b*lls to see that.

Crossing the border without permission isn't even a felony... how does that alone constitute an "emergency".

If Trump declares a national emergency and democrats find a judge to stop the wall and it goes to the Supreme Court, Ginsburg has to recuse herself.

No, she really doesn't. Not to worry, even the Knuckle Draggers he appointed would be loath to allow the president to undercut Congress like this.

Yes, Ginsburg should recuse herself because she has publicly stated she is anti-Trump. A judge is supposed to be apolitical.

 

[basquebromance]

"Here’s a useful way of looking at this: If America had spared itself ONE WEEK of Middle East occupation in the last 18 years, it would have paid for the border wall. Ahh, but which precious week of war to spare?"

 

[kyzr]

It is different but the principle is the same. Presidents have declared states of emergencies because of inflation or logjams in shipping goods and all kinds of other problems when Congress was unable to take effective action over 500 times.

I don’t have a list of all these instances but I’d bet I would be in agreement with less than 5% of them, based on basic Constitutionality.

It is not really a constitutional issue. In saner times Congress passed laws granting the President vast powers to act when he deems Congress is unable to act effectively, and these laws strip Congress of the power to rescind these powers without the consent of the President.

It is a Constitutional issue as using a national emergency to build a wall would directly contradict the Constitution which gives Congress the power of the purse. Laws cannot override the Constitution.

Got a link for your bullshit post? If not try reading this one...
What the President Could Do If He Declares a State of Emergency

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

"Here’s a useful way of looking at this: If America had spared itself ONE WEEK of Middle East occupation in the last 18 years, it would have paid for the border wall. Ahh, but which precious week of war to spare?"

It has nothing to do with spending. We already spent more on this shutdown than Trump asked for the wall. We could save 100 billion in some way or form, and the Democrats will still refuse to fund it.

 

[toomuchtime_]

It is not really a constitutional issue. In saner times Congress passed laws granting the President vast powers to act when he deems Congress is unable to act effectively, and these laws strip Congress of the power to rescind these powers without the consent of the President.

It’s always a Constitutional issue. Congress cannot confer powers to the POTUS thst Congress does not itself possess. Considering that Congress is limited to power over the specific items listed in Article I, Section 8 of the Constitution; those same limits should apply to what a National Emergency can be related to.

Recognizing the need for the President to take action when Congress cannot act effectively on an issue the Congress passed laws in 1979 that in effect have Congress rubber stamping whatever the President does under a declaration of national emergency. Certainly, the Constitution does not prohibit Congress from doing that. If a President abuses this authority, Congress still have the power to impeach him and convict him, hence removing him from office.