Would you inform on a benefits cheat?

[Ravi]

no, the defs YOU posted validate my point. pretending that you have no responsibility in proving Jose's status is not an excuse for employers of maids, chefs and drivers either.


again, you know im right.


and, since IM not the one facing criminal penalties I don't need to make the call.

I knew you'd wimp out.

 

[Shogun]

pshssaw..

tell it to the judge, Ravi.

 

[Ravi]

pshssaw..

tell it to the judge, Ravi.

I won't have to. I've not broken the law, unlike some people we know.

 

[Shogun]

I won't have to. I've not broken the law, unlike some people we know.

you keep thinking that as they slap the cuffs on you for hiring illegals.

 

[Ravi]

you keep thinking that as they slap the cuffs on you for hiring illegals.

Nope. You're still wrong about the definition of employee and subcontractor. Maybe you can get your company to send you to some adult ed classes?

 

[Shogun]

They don't need to since im not trying wrap my desire for a cheap driveway in some bullshit definitions despite the i9.





poor Ravi.. don't hate me because im smarter than you.

 

[Ravi]

They don't need to since im not trying wrap my desire for a cheap driveway in some bullshit definitions despite the i9.





poor Ravi.. don't hate me because im smarter than you.

lol

You aren't smarter than I am and I don't hate you.

 

[Shattered]

You are wrong. Deal. The IRS definitions I've given you prove it. I also gave you an IRS number to call. Call and ask them if you must get an I9 from a company that is redoing your driveway. I dare you.

Here's the thing.. You aren't required to get an I9 from anyone that does your driveway. HOWEVER, if 5 years down the road something happens, and you get nailed by the DOB, or anyone else, because there's a fraction of an inch of your driveway that doesn't meet legal requirements, it's YOUR problem, especially if you didn't hire a licensed/bonded agency. You're the one that's fucked - not them. Keep in mind that they can ALSO refuse you the required building permit to fix the problem simply BECAUSE it was handled by illegal aliens, or anyone else that's not licensed/bonded/insured.

If you take the time to do your background searches, and process everything in the correct manner, if something turns out wrong, THEN you have a leg to stand on.

Not until then.

 

[Ravi]

Here's the thing.. You aren't required to get an I9 from anyone that does your driveway. HOWEVER, if 5 years down the road something happens, and you get nailed by the DOB, or anyone else, because there's a fraction of an inch of your driveway that doesn't meet legal requirements, it's YOUR problem, especially if you didn't hire a licensed/bonded agency. You're the one that's fucked - not them. Keep in mind that they can ALSO refuse you the required building permit to fix the problem simply BECAUSE it was handled by illegal aliens, or anyone else that's not licensed/bonded/insured.

If you take the time to do your background searches, and process everything in the correct manner, if something turns out wrong, THEN you have a leg to stand on.

Not until then.

I realize that. But it wasn't the drift of the argument. Just Shog's way of distracting from his illegal behavior, really. I just enjoyed proving him wrong.

 

[manifold]

There is no interpretation. The law is clear. The next time you ask a house painter or roofer to fill out an I9 get back to me.

Ma? Prolly man, but who knows?

You're exploiting a technicality to win the literal argument, but you've had you're ass handed to you on the practicality side. If you hire a licensed contractor who uses illegals, you're protected. If you stop by home depot and hire a couple of day laborers that turn out to be illegal, you're committing a crime and are not protected, regardless of who's tools they use or if you supervise them.

 

[Ravi]

You're exploiting a technicality to win the literal argument, but you've had you're ass handed to you on the practicality side. If you hire a licensed contractor who uses illegals, you're protected. If you stop by home depot and hire a couple of day laborers that turn out to be illegal, you're committing a crime and are not protected, regardless of who's tools they use or if you supervise them.

I don't even think that's true. I could stop by Home Depot and hire some non-illegals or illegals, and as long as they don't fit the IRS criteria of "employee" then I am not obligated to determine their immigrant status from a homeowner's standpoint. Same thing with the kid down the street that wants to make a few bucks painting my house. I don't need to determine his immigrant status. As a business, more than likely.

But please, show me what leads you to believe this.

From what Shog posted:

You DO NOT need to complete a Form I-9 for persons who
are:

2. Employed for casual domestic work in a private home on a sporadic, irregular, or intermittent basis

That seems clear to me.

 

[Shattered]

I don't even think that's true. I could stop by Home Depot and hire some non-illegals or illegals, and as long as they don't fit the IRS criteria of "employee" then I am not obligated to determine their immigrant status from a homeowner's standpoint. Same thing with the kid down the street that wants to make a few bucks painting my house. I don't need to determine his immigrant status. As a business, more than likely.

But please, show me what leads you to believe this.

From what Shog posted:



That seems clear to me.

You can NOT have them put in a driveway, since you need a building permit for that. You can have them cut your grass.

You can have them put wallpaper up in your kitchen. You can NOT have them expand a room, since that requires a building permit.

Well, you can.. But you'd get fucked in more ways than one.

Why are you fighting the right/wrong of this so hard?

 

[Ravi]

You can NOT have them put in a driveway, since you need a building permit for that. You can have them cut your grass.

You can have them put wallpaper up in your kitchen. You can NOT have them expand a room, since that requires a building permit.

Well, you can.. But you'd get fucked in more ways than one.

Why are you fighting the right/wrong of this so hard?

Long days at work. The honor of you commenting on one of my threads. The thrill of proving Shog and Mani wrong in one fell swoop.

btw, my driveway is gravel so I'm almost sure I wouldn't need a permit to replace the gravel. lol

 

[Shattered]

Long days at work. The honor of you commenting on one of my threads. The thrill of proving Shog and Mani wrong in one fell swoop.

btw, my driveway is gravel so I'm almost sure I wouldn't need a permit to replace the gravel. lol

You can't be getting much work done if you're on here 18 out of 24 hours in any given day. Can't have much of a life, either, I'd imagine.

I don't see where you've proven either of them wrong, however.. Instead, you've made yourself look very unethical.

Oh, and it's not your thread, either.. It's Roomy's.

 

[Ravi]

You can't be getting much work done if you're on here 18 out of 24 hours in any given day. Can't have much of a life, either, I'd imagine.

I don't see where you've proven either of them wrong, however.. Instead, you've made yourself look very unethical.

Oh, and it's not your thread, either.. It's Roomy's.

You'd be surprised at how much work I get done while posting here.

This is all hypothetical so if I look unethical, I don't really care.

It's really quite simple. They claim it's illegal for a homeowner to hire an illegal for a one-time job. As far as I can tell, it isn't. Otherwise we'd all have to get an I9 from everyone that ever does anything to our houses or yards.

Have a nice evening.

 

[frazzledgear]

Or would you say, good luck to them if they can get away with it?

I initially wrote a lengthy response. But it all boiled down to this:

If you are willing to make an exception for a particular individual merely because his personal circumstances tugged at your heart -then what's the FUCKING POINT of the system itself? I'm pretty sure I can make an equally poignant case for just about anyone -rich or poor. If you find a legitimate reason for a PARTICULAR person to not abide by the rules -that is a pretty good indictment of the entire system itself. And an acknowledgement that you actually believe the individual has primary responsibility for himself and NOT government. And that the individual will consistently act in his own best interests in spite of whatever government system he lives under or the laws thereof. Which means there is something inherently wrong with ANY system that claims it can EVER know what is in the individual's best interests over his own personal judgment. You can't be a socialist/communist and say you believe this is just a matter of "good luck if he can get away with it" because the system the far left loves actually requires EVERYONE to abide by the identical rules at all times. If you believe in exceptions to those rules, you are only admitting that it isn't a question of "if" your preferred system collapses -just when. And not oddly enough -history has proven that to be exactly true.

 

[Anguille]

You'd be surprised at how much work I get done while posting here.

And to think you are one of NASCAR's safest drivers!!!

 

[Shogun]

I realize that. But it wasn't the drift of the argument. Just Shog's way of distracting from his illegal behavior, really. I just enjoyed proving him wrong.

Again, you are wrong. Read the i-9. Having Jose build your driveway makes you his employer. Stomping your foot and screaming that im a big dummy doesn't make you right, Ravi.

 

[Shogun]

You're exploiting a technicality to win the literal argument, but you've had you're ass handed to you on the practicality side. If you hire a licensed contractor who uses illegals, you're protected. If you stop by home depot and hire a couple of day laborers that turn out to be illegal, you're committing a crime and are not protected, regardless of who's tools they use or if you supervise them.

Thats exactly the fact of the matter. And, it's why she makes such a big fuss over insisting that she has no responsibility in verification as long as she remains purposfully ignorant.

Well, that didn't work for wal mart either.

 

[Shogun]

I don't even think that's true. I could stop by Home Depot and hire some non-illegals or illegals, and as long as they don't fit the IRS criteria of "employee" then I am not obligated to determine their immigrant status from a homeowner's standpoint. Same thing with the kid down the street that wants to make a few bucks painting my house. I don't need to determine his immigrant status. As a business, more than likely.

But please, show me what leads you to believe this.

From what Shog posted:



That seems clear to me.

It SEEMS clear because you are a fucking idiot. Say, you gonna choose one of those criteria to actually fit or just bounce among them each time I clarify why you are wrong? POURING YOUR DRIVEWAY is not domestic work any more than putting on a new roof is. You can't just go EMPLOY a fucking alien hoping that your ignorance will make your actions legal. You assume that a gaggle of mexicans IS A BUSINESS. it's not. And, given your specific motive in een participating in this arguement, the I-9 clearly indicates that you cannot hire an illegal if you know it. YOU may think it sounds good online but I wish I could be a fly on the wall when you try to act innocent... after having hunted down mexicans because you are too cheap to pay an american contractor.


oh, and THE KID DOWN THE STREET IS A LEGAL CITIZEN.