CDZ Would you support enhanced interrogation if:

[Coyote]

Of course it’s torture. You should know this as even the U.S. officially called it torture when the Japanese did it to our servicemen in WWII. You don’t get to redefine words to suit your agenda. Torture is physical or mental abuse. Convincing someone they’re drowning is absolutely mental abuse.

What the Japanese did is not what we did.....you should try to know what you are talking about before you post....

We poured water over a cloth covering their faces, filling their sinuses....the Japanes forced hoses down the throats of POWs filling their stomachs to capcity, then jumped on the abdomens of the prisoners with both feet to force the water out explosively...

do you see what the difference in the two techniques are?

They are both torture. Quit trying to defend it because it differs in degree.

Wrong......I will listen to the 3 POWs who actually know what torture is, because they endured it for years under the socialists...

McCain’s fellow POWs support waterboarding

When I was researching my book, “Courting Disaster,” I interviewed many of them, including Col. Bud Day, who received our nation’s highest award for valor, the Medal of Honor, for his heroic escape from a North Vietnamese prison camp.

When Day was returned to the prison, his right arm was broken in three places and he had been shot in the hand and thigh during his capture. But he continued to resist interrogation and provide false information — suffering such excruciating torture that he became totally physically debilitated and unable to perform even the simplest task for himself. In short, Day is an expert on the subject of torture. Here is what he says about CIA waterboarding:

“I am a supporter of waterboarding. It is not torture. Torture is really hurting someone. Waterboarding is just scaring someone, with no long-term injurious effects. It is a scare tactic that works.”

I asked Day in an e-mail what he would say to the CIA officer who waterboarded Khalid Sheik Mohammed, if he had the chance to speak with him. Day replied immediately: “YOU DID THE RIGHT THING.”

And the other Congressional of Medal Awardee...also agrees......waterboarding is not torture.....

Like Day, Col. Leo Thorsness was awarded the Medal of Honor for extraordinary heroism during the Vietnam War. He experienced excruciating torture during his captivity — his back broken, his body wrenched apart. He says what the CIA did to al-Qaeda terrorists in its custody was not torture:

“To me, waterboarding is intensive interrogation. It is not torture. Torture involves extreme, brutal pain — breaking bones, passing out from pain, beatings so severe that blood spatters the walls . . . when you pop shoulders out of joints.. . . In my mind, there’s a difference, and in most POWs’ minds there’s a difference.. . . I would not hesitate a second to use ‘enhanced interrogation,’ including waterboarding, if it would save the lives of innocent people.”

And the most famous supporter of water boarding......

Another torture victim who supports waterboarding is Adm. Jeremiah Denton — the POW who famously winked the word “T-O-R-T-U-R-E” in Morse code during a North Vietnamese propaganda interview.

It was the first message to the outside world that American prisoners were being tortured. Denton later received the Navy Cross for this courageous and costly act of defiance, for which he paid dearly when his captors figured out what he had done. I asked Denton if he thought waterboarding was torture. He told me:

“No, I think it’s persuasive.. . . The big, monstrous difference here is that the gentlemen we are waterboarding are people who swore to kill Americans. They will wreak any kind of torture just for the hell of it on anybody. When they are captured by the U.S., and we know or have reason to believe that they know of a subsequent event after 9/11, if you don’t interrogate them, more misery will take place.. . . Waterboarding is not an evil. Some of the things they did to us were torture. I passed out a dozen times from torture. We’re not exerting that kind of excruciation.”

Let me know when you subject yourself to water boarding at the hands of an enemy captor and you have no idea whether they will kill you or not.

It is ironic that, according to one of your quotes, what makes waterboarding “not torture” is defined by who the victim is, not the act. That is seriously warped.

We waterboard our Navy Seals and used to do it to all of our SERE course trainees...pilots and other military personnel.....it is not torture....and the fact that the actual POWs tell you this shows you are immune to facts.

When Stephen Crowder can undergo waterboarding as part of a Christmas show, it demonstrates how not torture waterboarding is...

There is a HUGE difference between being water boarded in friendly hands knowing you won’t die, and being in the hands of an enemy...waterboarded again and again. Let me know when you have experienced it.

 

[2aguy]

You don't know what you are talking about.....it works, the guys who implemented it state that it worked...the POWs who underwent actual torture at the hands of the Vietnamese socialists say it works........

The CIA and DoD concluded it did not work.

Wrong, Leon Penetta and Rodriguez the guy charge and the guy who actually did it say it worked....

US report on 'enhanced interrogation' concludes: torture doesn't work

Yes..I remember that, the democrat controlled Senate created a phony report...thanks for the info.

And more...including from the military.

Torture: Why the uniformed military balked at ‘enhanced interrogation’

Interrogation Experts From Every Branch of the Military and Intelligence Agree: Torture DOESN’T Produce Useful Information | Washington's Blog

Torture: Unreliable and Inestimably Costly

Waterboarding worked.....it breaks Navy Seals in training when they know they aren't going to be killed......

Debra J. Saunders - Waterboarding Worked

Former CIA Directors George Tenet and Porter Goss contend that harsh techniques helped deliver valuable intelligence. And though former CIA Director Leon Panetta said waterboarding is "torture," he said the methods produced clues that led to Osama bin Laden. Democratic committee staffers combed through 6.3 million documents, Feinstein noted. The GOP minority report countered that the Democrats' staff never interviewed CIA officials, even after a federal probe had been closed. My issue with the Feinstein report was that it cost $40 million and years of staff work to try to prove something I do not believe can be proved, i.e., that the CIA could have found the information through other means.

 

[Coyote]

The CIA and DoD concluded it did not work.

Wrong, Leon Penetta and Rodriguez the guy charge and the guy who actually did it say it worked....

US report on 'enhanced interrogation' concludes: torture doesn't work

Yes..I remember that, the democrat controlled Senate created a phony report...thanks for the info.

And more...including from the military.

Torture: Why the uniformed military balked at ‘enhanced interrogation’

Interrogation Experts From Every Branch of the Military and Intelligence Agree: Torture DOESN’T Produce Useful Information | Washington's Blog

Torture: Unreliable and Inestimably Costly

The uniformed military is under the Geneva convention, they can't waterboard enemy POWs who are also covered by the convention...terrorists are not covered by the Convention, they are illegal, enemy combatants....

The military doesn't waterboard POWs, so they don't know how it works....and again......it worked, the guys who did it say it worked......

If it worked, what useful intelligence was gained? And how many innocent people were tortured?

 

[2aguy]

What the Japanese did is not what we did.....you should try to know what you are talking about before you post....

We poured water over a cloth covering their faces, filling their sinuses....the Japanes forced hoses down the throats of POWs filling their stomachs to capcity, then jumped on the abdomens of the prisoners with both feet to force the water out explosively...

do you see what the difference in the two techniques are?

They are both torture. Quit trying to defend it because it differs in degree.

Wrong......I will listen to the 3 POWs who actually know what torture is, because they endured it for years under the socialists...

McCain’s fellow POWs support waterboarding

When I was researching my book, “Courting Disaster,” I interviewed many of them, including Col. Bud Day, who received our nation’s highest award for valor, the Medal of Honor, for his heroic escape from a North Vietnamese prison camp.

When Day was returned to the prison, his right arm was broken in three places and he had been shot in the hand and thigh during his capture. But he continued to resist interrogation and provide false information — suffering such excruciating torture that he became totally physically debilitated and unable to perform even the simplest task for himself. In short, Day is an expert on the subject of torture. Here is what he says about CIA waterboarding:

“I am a supporter of waterboarding. It is not torture. Torture is really hurting someone. Waterboarding is just scaring someone, with no long-term injurious effects. It is a scare tactic that works.”

I asked Day in an e-mail what he would say to the CIA officer who waterboarded Khalid Sheik Mohammed, if he had the chance to speak with him. Day replied immediately: “YOU DID THE RIGHT THING.”

And the other Congressional of Medal Awardee...also agrees......waterboarding is not torture.....

Like Day, Col. Leo Thorsness was awarded the Medal of Honor for extraordinary heroism during the Vietnam War. He experienced excruciating torture during his captivity — his back broken, his body wrenched apart. He says what the CIA did to al-Qaeda terrorists in its custody was not torture:

“To me, waterboarding is intensive interrogation. It is not torture. Torture involves extreme, brutal pain — breaking bones, passing out from pain, beatings so severe that blood spatters the walls . . . when you pop shoulders out of joints.. . . In my mind, there’s a difference, and in most POWs’ minds there’s a difference.. . . I would not hesitate a second to use ‘enhanced interrogation,’ including waterboarding, if it would save the lives of innocent people.”

And the most famous supporter of water boarding......

Another torture victim who supports waterboarding is Adm. Jeremiah Denton — the POW who famously winked the word “T-O-R-T-U-R-E” in Morse code during a North Vietnamese propaganda interview.

It was the first message to the outside world that American prisoners were being tortured. Denton later received the Navy Cross for this courageous and costly act of defiance, for which he paid dearly when his captors figured out what he had done. I asked Denton if he thought waterboarding was torture. He told me:

“No, I think it’s persuasive.. . . The big, monstrous difference here is that the gentlemen we are waterboarding are people who swore to kill Americans. They will wreak any kind of torture just for the hell of it on anybody. When they are captured by the U.S., and we know or have reason to believe that they know of a subsequent event after 9/11, if you don’t interrogate them, more misery will take place.. . . Waterboarding is not an evil. Some of the things they did to us were torture. I passed out a dozen times from torture. We’re not exerting that kind of excruciation.”

Let me know when you subject yourself to water boarding at the hands of an enemy captor and you have no idea whether they will kill you or not.

It is ironic that, according to one of your quotes, what makes waterboarding “not torture” is defined by who the victim is, not the act. That is seriously warped.

We waterboard our Navy Seals and used to do it to all of our SERE course trainees...pilots and other military personnel.....it is not torture....and the fact that the actual POWs tell you this shows you are immune to facts.

When Stephen Crowder can undergo waterboarding as part of a Christmas show, it demonstrates how not torture waterboarding is...

There is a HUGE difference between being water boarded in friendly hands knowing you won’t die, and being in the hands of an enemy...waterboarded again and again. Let me know when you have experienced it.

No, there isn't.....the interrogators said the terrorists knew we weren't going to kill them because they had trained in resistance techniques.....they counted to 10 on their fingers so the interrogators could see them doing it since they knew each pour of water could only be 10 seconds...so the terrorists also knew they wouldn't be killed......and they still gave up the information....you don't know what you are talking about.

Let me know when you get your two front teeth knocked out with a chisel.....and if Christopher Hitchens can get waterboarded, I know I can too...can you loose two front teeth to a chisel?

 

[Faun]

Be real, folks!
First, it is absolutely inadmissible that America, land of the free, etc., have as an approved policy that torture be not only tolerated, but approved. The image is too ugly to accept. The damage to U.S. reputation is too much to pay. We can't be a country like that.
Second, of course anyone, anywhere, would use whatever means it took to dislodge information of the imagined magnitude presented in this thread. It doesn't have to be said and discussed. That only makes it seem even more hypocritical if things ever come to that.
Third, short of some extreme, absurd situation imagined here, torture is out of the question. Nyet. Nichts. Non. Basta. It is something only the disgusting would be involved in, or encourage!

waterboarding isn't torture.....we did it to our military personel....

Of course it’s torture. You should know this as even the U.S. officially called it torture when the Japanese did it to our servicemen in WWII. You don’t get to redefine words to suit your agenda. Torture is physical or mental abuse. Convincing someone they’re drowning is absolutely mental abuse.

What the Japanese did is not what we did.....you should try to know what you are talking about before you post....

We poured water over a cloth covering their faces, filling their sinuses....the Japanes forced hoses down the throats of POWs filling their stomachs to capcity, then jumped on the abdomens of the prisoners with both feet to force the water out explosively...

do you see what the difference in the two techniques are?

What I see is your claims don’t match the recorded testimony...

”Yuki placed some cloth on my face. And then with water from the faucet, they poured on me until I became unconscious. He repeated that four or five times.”​

 

[2aguy]

Wrong, Leon Penetta and Rodriguez the guy charge and the guy who actually did it say it worked....

US report on 'enhanced interrogation' concludes: torture doesn't work

Yes..I remember that, the democrat controlled Senate created a phony report...thanks for the info.

And more...including from the military.

Torture: Why the uniformed military balked at ‘enhanced interrogation’

Interrogation Experts From Every Branch of the Military and Intelligence Agree: Torture DOESN’T Produce Useful Information | Washington's Blog

Torture: Unreliable and Inestimably Costly

The uniformed military is under the Geneva convention, they can't waterboard enemy POWs who are also covered by the convention...terrorists are not covered by the Convention, they are illegal, enemy combatants....

The military doesn't waterboard POWs, so they don't know how it works....and again......it worked, the guys who did it say it worked......

If it worked, what useful intelligence was gained? And how many innocent people were tortured?

3 terrorist leaders were waterboarded and the info they got from them led us to bin laden....ask Leon Penetta...

Agents employed waterboarding on three detainees over a period of eight months,

 

[dblack]

There was credible evidence that the person being interrogated had knowledge of an impending terrorist attack involving a weapon of mass destruction? What if that person was an American citizen?

I already support it for known terrorist leadership...and for select terrorist individuals. Wateboarding works, and doesn't harm the terrorist......

An American citizen has Rights under the Constitution so he can't be subjected to enhanced interrogation techniques.....

The Constitution protects the rights of everyone, not just citizens.

No...it doesn't.

Hmm well that's certainly not the consensus of legal scholars, but I'm open to novel opinions. Are you saying the Bill of Rights doesn't apply to non-citizens? Why not?

This doesn't really jibe with the Founders conception of rights as "God given". It seems more in line with the leftist notion of rights as gifts from government.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

There was credible evidence that the person being interrogated had knowledge of an impending terrorist attack involving a weapon of mass destruction? What if that person was an American citizen?

Didn’t we just do this thread?

We did.

And conservatives were just as wrong and ridiculous in that thread as this one.

 

[2aguy]

Be real, folks!
First, it is absolutely inadmissible that America, land of the free, etc., have as an approved policy that torture be not only tolerated, but approved. The image is too ugly to accept. The damage to U.S. reputation is too much to pay. We can't be a country like that.
Second, of course anyone, anywhere, would use whatever means it took to dislodge information of the imagined magnitude presented in this thread. It doesn't have to be said and discussed. That only makes it seem even more hypocritical if things ever come to that.
Third, short of some extreme, absurd situation imagined here, torture is out of the question. Nyet. Nichts. Non. Basta. It is something only the disgusting would be involved in, or encourage!

waterboarding isn't torture.....we did it to our military personel....

Of course it’s torture. You should know this as even the U.S. officially called it torture when the Japanese did it to our servicemen in WWII. You don’t get to redefine words to suit your agenda. Torture is physical or mental abuse. Convincing someone they’re drowning is absolutely mental abuse.

What the Japanese did is not what we did.....you should try to know what you are talking about before you post....

We poured water over a cloth covering their faces, filling their sinuses....the Japanes forced hoses down the throats of POWs filling their stomachs to capcity, then jumped on the abdomens of the prisoners with both feet to force the water out explosively...

do you see what the difference in the two techniques are?

What I see is your claims don’t match the record recorded testimony...

”Yuki placed some cloth on my face. And then with water from the faucet, they poured on me until I became unconscious. He repeated that four or five times.”​

That was one of several water techniques they used......they also put prisoners upside down into tubs of water....

 

[Coyote]

They are both torture. Quit trying to defend it because it differs in degree.

Wrong......I will listen to the 3 POWs who actually know what torture is, because they endured it for years under the socialists...

McCain’s fellow POWs support waterboarding

When I was researching my book, “Courting Disaster,” I interviewed many of them, including Col. Bud Day, who received our nation’s highest award for valor, the Medal of Honor, for his heroic escape from a North Vietnamese prison camp.

When Day was returned to the prison, his right arm was broken in three places and he had been shot in the hand and thigh during his capture. But he continued to resist interrogation and provide false information — suffering such excruciating torture that he became totally physically debilitated and unable to perform even the simplest task for himself. In short, Day is an expert on the subject of torture. Here is what he says about CIA waterboarding:

“I am a supporter of waterboarding. It is not torture. Torture is really hurting someone. Waterboarding is just scaring someone, with no long-term injurious effects. It is a scare tactic that works.”

I asked Day in an e-mail what he would say to the CIA officer who waterboarded Khalid Sheik Mohammed, if he had the chance to speak with him. Day replied immediately: “YOU DID THE RIGHT THING.”

And the other Congressional of Medal Awardee...also agrees......waterboarding is not torture.....

Like Day, Col. Leo Thorsness was awarded the Medal of Honor for extraordinary heroism during the Vietnam War. He experienced excruciating torture during his captivity — his back broken, his body wrenched apart. He says what the CIA did to al-Qaeda terrorists in its custody was not torture:

“To me, waterboarding is intensive interrogation. It is not torture. Torture involves extreme, brutal pain — breaking bones, passing out from pain, beatings so severe that blood spatters the walls . . . when you pop shoulders out of joints.. . . In my mind, there’s a difference, and in most POWs’ minds there’s a difference.. . . I would not hesitate a second to use ‘enhanced interrogation,’ including waterboarding, if it would save the lives of innocent people.”

And the most famous supporter of water boarding......

Another torture victim who supports waterboarding is Adm. Jeremiah Denton — the POW who famously winked the word “T-O-R-T-U-R-E” in Morse code during a North Vietnamese propaganda interview.

It was the first message to the outside world that American prisoners were being tortured. Denton later received the Navy Cross for this courageous and costly act of defiance, for which he paid dearly when his captors figured out what he had done. I asked Denton if he thought waterboarding was torture. He told me:

“No, I think it’s persuasive.. . . The big, monstrous difference here is that the gentlemen we are waterboarding are people who swore to kill Americans. They will wreak any kind of torture just for the hell of it on anybody. When they are captured by the U.S., and we know or have reason to believe that they know of a subsequent event after 9/11, if you don’t interrogate them, more misery will take place.. . . Waterboarding is not an evil. Some of the things they did to us were torture. I passed out a dozen times from torture. We’re not exerting that kind of excruciation.”

Let me know when you subject yourself to water boarding at the hands of an enemy captor and you have no idea whether they will kill you or not.

It is ironic that, according to one of your quotes, what makes waterboarding “not torture” is defined by who the victim is, not the act. That is seriously warped.

We waterboard our Navy Seals and used to do it to all of our SERE course trainees...pilots and other military personnel.....it is not torture....and the fact that the actual POWs tell you this shows you are immune to facts.

When Stephen Crowder can undergo waterboarding as part of a Christmas show, it demonstrates how not torture waterboarding is...

There is a HUGE difference between being water boarded in friendly hands knowing you won’t die, and being in the hands of an enemy...waterboarded again and again. Let me know when you have experienced it.

No, there isn't.....the interrogators said the terrorists knew we weren't going to kill them because they had trained in resistance techniques.....they counted to 10 on their fingers so the interrogators could see them doing it since they knew each pour of water could only be 10 seconds...so the terrorists also knew they wouldn't be killed......and they still gave up the information....you don't know what you are talking about.

Let me know when you get your two front teeth knocked out with a chisel.....and if Christopher Hitchens can get waterboarded, I know I can too...can you loose two front teeth to a chisel?

Oh baloney, some were killed under torture! Including some who were innocent! Part of the torture protocol is convincing the person they COULD be killed. And it is all done in secret so there is no way of knowing if any pseudo ethics in timing were adhered to. In fact you almost seem to be contradicting yourself. If the ones being tortured were so savvy then the torture could not possibly be effective anyway.

 

[2aguy]

There was credible evidence that the person being interrogated had knowledge of an impending terrorist attack involving a weapon of mass destruction? What if that person was an American citizen?

I already support it for known terrorist leadership...and for select terrorist individuals. Wateboarding works, and doesn't harm the terrorist......

An American citizen has Rights under the Constitution so he can't be subjected to enhanced interrogation techniques.....

The Constitution protects the rights of everyone, not just citizens.

No...it doesn't.

Hmm well that's certainly not the consensus of legal scholars, but I'm open to novel opinions. Are you saying the Bill of Rights doesn't apply to non-citizens? Why not?

This doesn't really jibe with the Founders conception of rights as "God given". It seems more in line with the leftist notion of rights as gifts from government.

It doesn't apply to terrorists....they are not covered by the Geneva Conventions..... And no, the Constitution does not apply to over seas foreigners...once they hit land, they are covered.

 

[Coyote]

They are both torture. Quit trying to defend it because it differs in degree.

Wrong......I will listen to the 3 POWs who actually know what torture is, because they endured it for years under the socialists...

McCain’s fellow POWs support waterboarding

When I was researching my book, “Courting Disaster,” I interviewed many of them, including Col. Bud Day, who received our nation’s highest award for valor, the Medal of Honor, for his heroic escape from a North Vietnamese prison camp.

When Day was returned to the prison, his right arm was broken in three places and he had been shot in the hand and thigh during his capture. But he continued to resist interrogation and provide false information — suffering such excruciating torture that he became totally physically debilitated and unable to perform even the simplest task for himself. In short, Day is an expert on the subject of torture. Here is what he says about CIA waterboarding:

“I am a supporter of waterboarding. It is not torture. Torture is really hurting someone. Waterboarding is just scaring someone, with no long-term injurious effects. It is a scare tactic that works.”

I asked Day in an e-mail what he would say to the CIA officer who waterboarded Khalid Sheik Mohammed, if he had the chance to speak with him. Day replied immediately: “YOU DID THE RIGHT THING.”

And the other Congressional of Medal Awardee...also agrees......waterboarding is not torture.....

Like Day, Col. Leo Thorsness was awarded the Medal of Honor for extraordinary heroism during the Vietnam War. He experienced excruciating torture during his captivity — his back broken, his body wrenched apart. He says what the CIA did to al-Qaeda terrorists in its custody was not torture:

“To me, waterboarding is intensive interrogation. It is not torture. Torture involves extreme, brutal pain — breaking bones, passing out from pain, beatings so severe that blood spatters the walls . . . when you pop shoulders out of joints.. . . In my mind, there’s a difference, and in most POWs’ minds there’s a difference.. . . I would not hesitate a second to use ‘enhanced interrogation,’ including waterboarding, if it would save the lives of innocent people.”

And the most famous supporter of water boarding......

Another torture victim who supports waterboarding is Adm. Jeremiah Denton — the POW who famously winked the word “T-O-R-T-U-R-E” in Morse code during a North Vietnamese propaganda interview.

It was the first message to the outside world that American prisoners were being tortured. Denton later received the Navy Cross for this courageous and costly act of defiance, for which he paid dearly when his captors figured out what he had done. I asked Denton if he thought waterboarding was torture. He told me:

“No, I think it’s persuasive.. . . The big, monstrous difference here is that the gentlemen we are waterboarding are people who swore to kill Americans. They will wreak any kind of torture just for the hell of it on anybody. When they are captured by the U.S., and we know or have reason to believe that they know of a subsequent event after 9/11, if you don’t interrogate them, more misery will take place.. . . Waterboarding is not an evil. Some of the things they did to us were torture. I passed out a dozen times from torture. We’re not exerting that kind of excruciation.”

Let me know when you subject yourself to water boarding at the hands of an enemy captor and you have no idea whether they will kill you or not.

It is ironic that, according to one of your quotes, what makes waterboarding “not torture” is defined by who the victim is, not the act. That is seriously warped.

We waterboard our Navy Seals and used to do it to all of our SERE course trainees...pilots and other military personnel.....it is not torture....and the fact that the actual POWs tell you this shows you are immune to facts.

When Stephen Crowder can undergo waterboarding as part of a Christmas show, it demonstrates how not torture waterboarding is...

There is a HUGE difference between being water boarded in friendly hands knowing you won’t die, and being in the hands of an enemy...waterboarded again and again. Let me know when you have experienced it.

No, there isn't.....the interrogators said the terrorists knew we weren't going to kill them because they had trained in resistance techniques.....they counted to 10 on their fingers so the interrogators could see them doing it since they knew each pour of water could only be 10 seconds...so the terrorists also knew they wouldn't be killed......and they still gave up the information....you don't know what you are talking about.

Let me know when you get your two front teeth knocked out with a chisel.....and if Christopher Hitchens can get waterboarded, I know I can too...can you loose two front teeth to a chisel?

You know you can too? Put yourself in the hands of NK and tell them to waterboard you.

 

[2aguy]

Wrong......I will listen to the 3 POWs who actually know what torture is, because they endured it for years under the socialists...

McCain’s fellow POWs support waterboarding

When I was researching my book, “Courting Disaster,” I interviewed many of them, including Col. Bud Day, who received our nation’s highest award for valor, the Medal of Honor, for his heroic escape from a North Vietnamese prison camp.

When Day was returned to the prison, his right arm was broken in three places and he had been shot in the hand and thigh during his capture. But he continued to resist interrogation and provide false information — suffering such excruciating torture that he became totally physically debilitated and unable to perform even the simplest task for himself. In short, Day is an expert on the subject of torture. Here is what he says about CIA waterboarding:

“I am a supporter of waterboarding. It is not torture. Torture is really hurting someone. Waterboarding is just scaring someone, with no long-term injurious effects. It is a scare tactic that works.”

I asked Day in an e-mail what he would say to the CIA officer who waterboarded Khalid Sheik Mohammed, if he had the chance to speak with him. Day replied immediately: “YOU DID THE RIGHT THING.”

And the other Congressional of Medal Awardee...also agrees......waterboarding is not torture.....

Like Day, Col. Leo Thorsness was awarded the Medal of Honor for extraordinary heroism during the Vietnam War. He experienced excruciating torture during his captivity — his back broken, his body wrenched apart. He says what the CIA did to al-Qaeda terrorists in its custody was not torture:

“To me, waterboarding is intensive interrogation. It is not torture. Torture involves extreme, brutal pain — breaking bones, passing out from pain, beatings so severe that blood spatters the walls . . . when you pop shoulders out of joints.. . . In my mind, there’s a difference, and in most POWs’ minds there’s a difference.. . . I would not hesitate a second to use ‘enhanced interrogation,’ including waterboarding, if it would save the lives of innocent people.”

And the most famous supporter of water boarding......

Another torture victim who supports waterboarding is Adm. Jeremiah Denton — the POW who famously winked the word “T-O-R-T-U-R-E” in Morse code during a North Vietnamese propaganda interview.

It was the first message to the outside world that American prisoners were being tortured. Denton later received the Navy Cross for this courageous and costly act of defiance, for which he paid dearly when his captors figured out what he had done. I asked Denton if he thought waterboarding was torture. He told me:

“No, I think it’s persuasive.. . . The big, monstrous difference here is that the gentlemen we are waterboarding are people who swore to kill Americans. They will wreak any kind of torture just for the hell of it on anybody. When they are captured by the U.S., and we know or have reason to believe that they know of a subsequent event after 9/11, if you don’t interrogate them, more misery will take place.. . . Waterboarding is not an evil. Some of the things they did to us were torture. I passed out a dozen times from torture. We’re not exerting that kind of excruciation.”

Let me know when you subject yourself to water boarding at the hands of an enemy captor and you have no idea whether they will kill you or not.

It is ironic that, according to one of your quotes, what makes waterboarding “not torture” is defined by who the victim is, not the act. That is seriously warped.

We waterboard our Navy Seals and used to do it to all of our SERE course trainees...pilots and other military personnel.....it is not torture....and the fact that the actual POWs tell you this shows you are immune to facts.

When Stephen Crowder can undergo waterboarding as part of a Christmas show, it demonstrates how not torture waterboarding is...

There is a HUGE difference between being water boarded in friendly hands knowing you won’t die, and being in the hands of an enemy...waterboarded again and again. Let me know when you have experienced it.

No, there isn't.....the interrogators said the terrorists knew we weren't going to kill them because they had trained in resistance techniques.....they counted to 10 on their fingers so the interrogators could see them doing it since they knew each pour of water could only be 10 seconds...so the terrorists also knew they wouldn't be killed......and they still gave up the information....you don't know what you are talking about.

Let me know when you get your two front teeth knocked out with a chisel.....and if Christopher Hitchens can get waterboarded, I know I can too...can you loose two front teeth to a chisel?

Oh baloney, some were killed under torture! Including some who were innocent! Part of the torture protocol is convincing the person they COULD be killed. And it is all done in secret so there is no way of knowing if any pseudo ethics in timing were adhered to. In fact you almost seem to be contradicting yourself. If the ones being tortured were so savvy then the torture could not possibly be effective anyway.

You don't know what you are talking about ..... you can read how they used waterboarding

 

[2aguy]

Be real, folks!
First, it is absolutely inadmissible that America, land of the free, etc., have as an approved policy that torture be not only tolerated, but approved. The image is too ugly to accept. The damage to U.S. reputation is too much to pay. We can't be a country like that.
Second, of course anyone, anywhere, would use whatever means it took to dislodge information of the imagined magnitude presented in this thread. It doesn't have to be said and discussed. That only makes it seem even more hypocritical if things ever come to that.
Third, short of some extreme, absurd situation imagined here, torture is out of the question. Nyet. Nichts. Non. Basta. It is something only the disgusting would be involved in, or encourage!

waterboarding isn't torture.....we did it to our military personel....

Of course it’s torture. You should know this as even the U.S. officially called it torture when the Japanese did it to our servicemen in WWII. You don’t get to redefine words to suit your agenda. Torture is physical or mental abuse. Convincing someone they’re drowning is absolutely mental abuse.

What the Japanese did is not what we did.....you should try to know what you are talking about before you post....

We poured water over a cloth covering their faces, filling their sinuses....the Japanes forced hoses down the throats of POWs filling their stomachs to capcity, then jumped on the abdomens of the prisoners with both feet to force the water out explosively...

do you see what the difference in the two techniques are?

What I see is your claims don’t match the record recorded testimony...

”Yuki placed some cloth on my face. And then with water from the faucet, they poured on me until I became unconscious. He repeated that four or five times.”​

That isn't how the CIA did it.......not even close.....

Sorry, Paul Begala — You’re Still Wrong | National Review

 

[Coyote]

Let me know when you subject yourself to water boarding at the hands of an enemy captor and you have no idea whether they will kill you or not.

It is ironic that, according to one of your quotes, what makes waterboarding “not torture” is defined by who the victim is, not the act. That is seriously warped.

We waterboard our Navy Seals and used to do it to all of our SERE course trainees...pilots and other military personnel.....it is not torture....and the fact that the actual POWs tell you this shows you are immune to facts.

When Stephen Crowder can undergo waterboarding as part of a Christmas show, it demonstrates how not torture waterboarding is...

There is a HUGE difference between being water boarded in friendly hands knowing you won’t die, and being in the hands of an enemy...waterboarded again and again. Let me know when you have experienced it.

No, there isn't.....the interrogators said the terrorists knew we weren't going to kill them because they had trained in resistance techniques.....they counted to 10 on their fingers so the interrogators could see them doing it since they knew each pour of water could only be 10 seconds...so the terrorists also knew they wouldn't be killed......and they still gave up the information....you don't know what you are talking about.

Let me know when you get your two front teeth knocked out with a chisel.....and if Christopher Hitchens can get waterboarded, I know I can too...can you loose two front teeth to a chisel?

Oh baloney, some were killed under torture! Including some who were innocent! Part of the torture protocol is convincing the person they COULD be killed. And it is all done in secret so there is no way of knowing if any pseudo ethics in timing were adhered to. In fact you almost seem to be contradicting yourself. If the ones being tortured were so savvy then the torture could not possibly be effective anyway.

You don't know what you are talking about ..... you can read how they used waterboarding

I suspect I know at least as much as you.

 

[2aguy]

Wrong......I will listen to the 3 POWs who actually know what torture is, because they endured it for years under the socialists...

McCain’s fellow POWs support waterboarding

When I was researching my book, “Courting Disaster,” I interviewed many of them, including Col. Bud Day, who received our nation’s highest award for valor, the Medal of Honor, for his heroic escape from a North Vietnamese prison camp.

When Day was returned to the prison, his right arm was broken in three places and he had been shot in the hand and thigh during his capture. But he continued to resist interrogation and provide false information — suffering such excruciating torture that he became totally physically debilitated and unable to perform even the simplest task for himself. In short, Day is an expert on the subject of torture. Here is what he says about CIA waterboarding:

“I am a supporter of waterboarding. It is not torture. Torture is really hurting someone. Waterboarding is just scaring someone, with no long-term injurious effects. It is a scare tactic that works.”

I asked Day in an e-mail what he would say to the CIA officer who waterboarded Khalid Sheik Mohammed, if he had the chance to speak with him. Day replied immediately: “YOU DID THE RIGHT THING.”

And the other Congressional of Medal Awardee...also agrees......waterboarding is not torture.....

Like Day, Col. Leo Thorsness was awarded the Medal of Honor for extraordinary heroism during the Vietnam War. He experienced excruciating torture during his captivity — his back broken, his body wrenched apart. He says what the CIA did to al-Qaeda terrorists in its custody was not torture:

“To me, waterboarding is intensive interrogation. It is not torture. Torture involves extreme, brutal pain — breaking bones, passing out from pain, beatings so severe that blood spatters the walls . . . when you pop shoulders out of joints.. . . In my mind, there’s a difference, and in most POWs’ minds there’s a difference.. . . I would not hesitate a second to use ‘enhanced interrogation,’ including waterboarding, if it would save the lives of innocent people.”

And the most famous supporter of water boarding......

Another torture victim who supports waterboarding is Adm. Jeremiah Denton — the POW who famously winked the word “T-O-R-T-U-R-E” in Morse code during a North Vietnamese propaganda interview.

It was the first message to the outside world that American prisoners were being tortured. Denton later received the Navy Cross for this courageous and costly act of defiance, for which he paid dearly when his captors figured out what he had done. I asked Denton if he thought waterboarding was torture. He told me:

“No, I think it’s persuasive.. . . The big, monstrous difference here is that the gentlemen we are waterboarding are people who swore to kill Americans. They will wreak any kind of torture just for the hell of it on anybody. When they are captured by the U.S., and we know or have reason to believe that they know of a subsequent event after 9/11, if you don’t interrogate them, more misery will take place.. . . Waterboarding is not an evil. Some of the things they did to us were torture. I passed out a dozen times from torture. We’re not exerting that kind of excruciation.”

Let me know when you subject yourself to water boarding at the hands of an enemy captor and you have no idea whether they will kill you or not.

It is ironic that, according to one of your quotes, what makes waterboarding “not torture” is defined by who the victim is, not the act. That is seriously warped.

We waterboard our Navy Seals and used to do it to all of our SERE course trainees...pilots and other military personnel.....it is not torture....and the fact that the actual POWs tell you this shows you are immune to facts.

When Stephen Crowder can undergo waterboarding as part of a Christmas show, it demonstrates how not torture waterboarding is...

There is a HUGE difference between being water boarded in friendly hands knowing you won’t die, and being in the hands of an enemy...waterboarded again and again. Let me know when you have experienced it.

No, there isn't.....the interrogators said the terrorists knew we weren't going to kill them because they had trained in resistance techniques.....they counted to 10 on their fingers so the interrogators could see them doing it since they knew each pour of water could only be 10 seconds...so the terrorists also knew they wouldn't be killed......and they still gave up the information....you don't know what you are talking about.

Let me know when you get your two front teeth knocked out with a chisel.....and if Christopher Hitchens can get waterboarded, I know I can too...can you loose two front teeth to a chisel?

You know you can too? Put yourself in the hands of NK and tell them to waterboard you.

I will be waterboarded by Americans using the CIA protocols...the ones used on the terrorists.... again, the socialists didn't do the same thing......

 

[2aguy]

We waterboard our Navy Seals and used to do it to all of our SERE course trainees...pilots and other military personnel.....it is not torture....and the fact that the actual POWs tell you this shows you are immune to facts.

When Stephen Crowder can undergo waterboarding as part of a Christmas show, it demonstrates how not torture waterboarding is...

There is a HUGE difference between being water boarded in friendly hands knowing you won’t die, and being in the hands of an enemy...waterboarded again and again. Let me know when you have experienced it.

No, there isn't.....the interrogators said the terrorists knew we weren't going to kill them because they had trained in resistance techniques.....they counted to 10 on their fingers so the interrogators could see them doing it since they knew each pour of water could only be 10 seconds...so the terrorists also knew they wouldn't be killed......and they still gave up the information....you don't know what you are talking about.

Let me know when you get your two front teeth knocked out with a chisel.....and if Christopher Hitchens can get waterboarded, I know I can too...can you loose two front teeth to a chisel?

Oh baloney, some were killed under torture! Including some who were innocent! Part of the torture protocol is convincing the person they COULD be killed. And it is all done in secret so there is no way of knowing if any pseudo ethics in timing were adhered to. In fact you almost seem to be contradicting yourself. If the ones being tortured were so savvy then the torture could not possibly be effective anyway.

You don't know what you are talking about ..... you can read how they used waterboarding

I suspect I know at least as much as you.

You obviously don't.....

 

[dblack]

There was credible evidence that the person being interrogated had knowledge of an impending terrorist attack involving a weapon of mass destruction? What if that person was an American citizen?

I already support it for known terrorist leadership...and for select terrorist individuals. Wateboarding works, and doesn't harm the terrorist......

An American citizen has Rights under the Constitution so he can't be subjected to enhanced interrogation techniques.....

The Constitution protects the rights of everyone, not just citizens.

No...it doesn't.

Hmm well that's certainly not the consensus of legal scholars, but I'm open to novel opinions. Are you saying the Bill of Rights doesn't apply to non-citizens? Why not?

This doesn't really jibe with the Founders conception of rights as "God given". It seems more in line with the leftist notion of rights as gifts from government.

It doesn't apply to terrorists....they are not covered by the Geneva Conventions..... And no, the Constitution does not apply to over seas foreigners...once they hit land, they are covered.

In reality, it doesn't apply to individuals at all. The Constitution protects freedom by limiting the power of government, not by granting special privileges to citizens.

 

[Faun]

Of course it’s torture. You should know this as even the U.S. officially called it torture when the Japanese did it to our servicemen in WWII. You don’t get to redefine words to suit your agenda. Torture is physical or mental abuse. Convincing someone they’re drowning is absolutely mental abuse.

What the Japanese did is not what we did.....you should try to know what you are talking about before you post....

We poured water over a cloth covering their faces, filling their sinuses....the Japanes forced hoses down the throats of POWs filling their stomachs to capcity, then jumped on the abdomens of the prisoners with both feet to force the water out explosively...

do you see what the difference in the two techniques are?

They are both torture. Quit trying to defend it because it differs in degree.

Wrong......I will listen to the 3 POWs who actually know what torture is, because they endured it for years under the socialists...

McCain’s fellow POWs support waterboarding

When I was researching my book, “Courting Disaster,” I interviewed many of them, including Col. Bud Day, who received our nation’s highest award for valor, the Medal of Honor, for his heroic escape from a North Vietnamese prison camp.

When Day was returned to the prison, his right arm was broken in three places and he had been shot in the hand and thigh during his capture. But he continued to resist interrogation and provide false information — suffering such excruciating torture that he became totally physically debilitated and unable to perform even the simplest task for himself. In short, Day is an expert on the subject of torture. Here is what he says about CIA waterboarding:

“I am a supporter of waterboarding. It is not torture. Torture is really hurting someone. Waterboarding is just scaring someone, with no long-term injurious effects. It is a scare tactic that works.”

I asked Day in an e-mail what he would say to the CIA officer who waterboarded Khalid Sheik Mohammed, if he had the chance to speak with him. Day replied immediately: “YOU DID THE RIGHT THING.”

And the other Congressional of Medal Awardee...also agrees......waterboarding is not torture.....

Like Day, Col. Leo Thorsness was awarded the Medal of Honor for extraordinary heroism during the Vietnam War. He experienced excruciating torture during his captivity — his back broken, his body wrenched apart. He says what the CIA did to al-Qaeda terrorists in its custody was not torture:

“To me, waterboarding is intensive interrogation. It is not torture. Torture involves extreme, brutal pain — breaking bones, passing out from pain, beatings so severe that blood spatters the walls . . . when you pop shoulders out of joints.. . . In my mind, there’s a difference, and in most POWs’ minds there’s a difference.. . . I would not hesitate a second to use ‘enhanced interrogation,’ including waterboarding, if it would save the lives of innocent people.”

And the most famous supporter of water boarding......

Another torture victim who supports waterboarding is Adm. Jeremiah Denton — the POW who famously winked the word “T-O-R-T-U-R-E” in Morse code during a North Vietnamese propaganda interview.

It was the first message to the outside world that American prisoners were being tortured. Denton later received the Navy Cross for this courageous and costly act of defiance, for which he paid dearly when his captors figured out what he had done. I asked Denton if he thought waterboarding was torture. He told me:

“No, I think it’s persuasive.. . . The big, monstrous difference here is that the gentlemen we are waterboarding are people who swore to kill Americans. They will wreak any kind of torture just for the hell of it on anybody. When they are captured by the U.S., and we know or have reason to believe that they know of a subsequent event after 9/11, if you don’t interrogate them, more misery will take place.. . . Waterboarding is not an evil. Some of the things they did to us were torture. I passed out a dozen times from torture. We’re not exerting that kind of excruciation.”

Let me know when you subject yourself to water boarding at the hands of an enemy captor and you have no idea whether they will kill you or not.

It is ironic that, according to one of your quotes, what makes waterboarding “not torture” is defined by who the victim is, not the act. That is seriously warped.

Hey,...I'll undergo waterboarding it you undergo actual torture...we'll make it a contest...I will be waterboarded, you will have your front two teeth knocked out with a hammer and chisel...then we will compare notes and discuss which is torture and which isn't...

LOLOL

I like how you try to argue Waterboarding is not torture because knocking out someone’s teeth is.

 

[2aguy]

What the Japanese did is not what we did.....you should try to know what you are talking about before you post....

We poured water over a cloth covering their faces, filling their sinuses....the Japanes forced hoses down the throats of POWs filling their stomachs to capcity, then jumped on the abdomens of the prisoners with both feet to force the water out explosively...

do you see what the difference in the two techniques are?

They are both torture. Quit trying to defend it because it differs in degree.

Wrong......I will listen to the 3 POWs who actually know what torture is, because they endured it for years under the socialists...

McCain’s fellow POWs support waterboarding

When I was researching my book, “Courting Disaster,” I interviewed many of them, including Col. Bud Day, who received our nation’s highest award for valor, the Medal of Honor, for his heroic escape from a North Vietnamese prison camp.

When Day was returned to the prison, his right arm was broken in three places and he had been shot in the hand and thigh during his capture. But he continued to resist interrogation and provide false information — suffering such excruciating torture that he became totally physically debilitated and unable to perform even the simplest task for himself. In short, Day is an expert on the subject of torture. Here is what he says about CIA waterboarding:

“I am a supporter of waterboarding. It is not torture. Torture is really hurting someone. Waterboarding is just scaring someone, with no long-term injurious effects. It is a scare tactic that works.”

I asked Day in an e-mail what he would say to the CIA officer who waterboarded Khalid Sheik Mohammed, if he had the chance to speak with him. Day replied immediately: “YOU DID THE RIGHT THING.”

And the other Congressional of Medal Awardee...also agrees......waterboarding is not torture.....

Like Day, Col. Leo Thorsness was awarded the Medal of Honor for extraordinary heroism during the Vietnam War. He experienced excruciating torture during his captivity — his back broken, his body wrenched apart. He says what the CIA did to al-Qaeda terrorists in its custody was not torture:

“To me, waterboarding is intensive interrogation. It is not torture. Torture involves extreme, brutal pain — breaking bones, passing out from pain, beatings so severe that blood spatters the walls . . . when you pop shoulders out of joints.. . . In my mind, there’s a difference, and in most POWs’ minds there’s a difference.. . . I would not hesitate a second to use ‘enhanced interrogation,’ including waterboarding, if it would save the lives of innocent people.”

And the most famous supporter of water boarding......

Another torture victim who supports waterboarding is Adm. Jeremiah Denton — the POW who famously winked the word “T-O-R-T-U-R-E” in Morse code during a North Vietnamese propaganda interview.

It was the first message to the outside world that American prisoners were being tortured. Denton later received the Navy Cross for this courageous and costly act of defiance, for which he paid dearly when his captors figured out what he had done. I asked Denton if he thought waterboarding was torture. He told me:

“No, I think it’s persuasive.. . . The big, monstrous difference here is that the gentlemen we are waterboarding are people who swore to kill Americans. They will wreak any kind of torture just for the hell of it on anybody. When they are captured by the U.S., and we know or have reason to believe that they know of a subsequent event after 9/11, if you don’t interrogate them, more misery will take place.. . . Waterboarding is not an evil. Some of the things they did to us were torture. I passed out a dozen times from torture. We’re not exerting that kind of excruciation.”

Let me know when you subject yourself to water boarding at the hands of an enemy captor and you have no idea whether they will kill you or not.

It is ironic that, according to one of your quotes, what makes waterboarding “not torture” is defined by who the victim is, not the act. That is seriously warped.

Hey,...I'll undergo waterboarding it you undergo actual torture...we'll make it a contest...I will be waterboarded, you will have your front two teeth knocked out with a hammer and chisel...then we will compare notes and discuss which is torture and which isn't...

LOLOL

I like how you try to argue Waterboarding is not torture because knocking out someone’s teeth is.

3 actual experts in torture say it isn't...you might want to pay attention to people who know what they are talking about....

McCain’s fellow POWs support waterboarding

When I was researching my book, “Courting Disaster,” I interviewed many of them, including Col. Bud Day, who received our nation’s highest award for valor, the Medal of Honor, for his heroic escape from a North Vietnamese prison camp.

When Day was returned to the prison, his right arm was broken in three places and he had been shot in the hand and thigh during his capture. But he continued to resist interrogation and provide false information — suffering such excruciating torture that he became totally physically debilitated and unable to perform even the simplest task for himself. In short, Day is an expert on the subject of torture. Here is what he says about CIA waterboarding:

“I am a supporter of waterboarding. It is not torture. Torture is really hurting someone. Waterboarding is just scaring someone, with no long-term injurious effects. It is a scare tactic that works.”

I asked Day in an e-mail what he would say to the CIA officer who waterboarded Khalid Sheik Mohammed, if he had the chance to speak with him. Day replied immediately: “YOU DID THE RIGHT THING.”

And the other Congressional of Medal Awardee...also agrees......waterboarding is not torture.....

Like Day, Col. Leo Thorsness was awarded the Medal of Honor for extraordinary heroism during the Vietnam War. He experienced excruciating torture during his captivity — his back broken, his body wrenched apart. He says what the CIA did to al-Qaeda terrorists in its custody was not torture:

“To me, waterboarding is intensive interrogation. It is not torture. Torture involves extreme, brutal pain — breaking bones, passing out from pain, beatings so severe that blood spatters the walls . . . when you pop shoulders out of joints.. . . In my mind, there’s a difference, and in most POWs’ minds there’s a difference.. . . I would not hesitate a second to use ‘enhanced interrogation,’ including waterboarding, if it would save the lives of innocent people.”

And the most famous supporter of water boarding......

Another torture victim who supports waterboarding is Adm. Jeremiah Denton — the POW who famously winked the word “T-O-R-T-U-R-E” in Morse code during a North Vietnamese propaganda interview.

It was the first message to the outside world that American prisoners were being tortured. Denton later received the Navy Cross for this courageous and costly act of defiance, for which he paid dearly when his captors figured out what he had done. I asked Denton if he thought waterboarding was torture. He told me:

“No, I think it’s persuasive.. . . The big, monstrous difference here is that the gentlemen we are waterboarding are people who swore to kill Americans. They will wreak any kind of torture just for the hell of it on anybody. When they are captured by the U.S., and we know or have reason to believe that they know of a subsequent event after 9/11, if you don’t interrogate them, more misery will take place.. . . Waterboarding is not an evil. Some of the things they did to us were torture. I passed out a dozen times from torture. We’re not exerting that kind of excruciation.”