4 Signs that DOMA is doomed

I am a straight-married for 37 years with 3 kids, southern drawl speaking, bourbon swiller, beer guzzler, backer chewin, football lovin, flannel shirt wearin, fishin n huntin lover and Georgia by the grace of God.

I have no problem with gay folk wanting to get married.
Does not affect me in any way.

While I would vote to approve same sex marriage at the state level, I do not see any constitutional right to it. With regards the constitution I have always been a strict constructionist, and am wary of 5 of 9 people being able to create a right out of thin air, mostly because those that create one can limit or destroy one just as easy. Anyone who puts all thier faith in the courts must remember it was the courts that created the civil rights issues of the 50's and 60's with thier terrible plessey v. Fergueson ruling.

We have bypassed the amendment process with judges who legislate rather and adjudicate.

Not what is happening here.
They are ruling if DOMA gives government the right to take rights AWAY.
And it does and if they are strict constitutionalists theywill rule that DOMA does just that.
Those that support DOMA and government laws banning gay marriage support government taking the right away from gays and lesbians to marry each other.

I actually hope DOMA gets overturned, but for other reasons. Marriage is a contract managed at the state level, the feds should have nothing to do with it, just as the courts should have nothing to do with it, at any level. It is something for the state legislatures to determine as if proper for thier power to legislate government interactions with its citizens.
 
While I would vote to approve same sex marriage at the state level, I do not see any constitutional right to it. With regards the constitution I have always been a strict constructionist, and am wary of 5 of 9 people being able to create a right out of thin air, mostly because those that create one can limit or destroy one just as easy. Anyone who puts all thier faith in the courts must remember it was the courts that created the civil rights issues of the 50's and 60's with thier terrible plessey v. Fergueson ruling.

We have bypassed the amendment process with judges who legislate rather and adjudicate.

Not what is happening here.
They are ruling if DOMA gives government the right to take rights AWAY.
And it does and if they are strict constitutionalists theywill rule that DOMA does just that.
Those that support DOMA and government laws banning gay marriage support government taking the right away from gays and lesbians to marry each other.

I actually hope DOMA gets overturned, but for other reasons. Marriage is a contract managed at the state level, the feds should have nothing to do with it, just as the courts should have nothing to do with it, at any level. It is something for the state legislatures to determine as if proper for thier power to legislate government interactions with its citizens.

Its not that easy. You can't move among states and be married or not married

ALL states will have to honor the marital status issued by other states. You can't say.....We accept heterosexual marriages from NY but not gay marriages

Sooner or later the courts will have to weigh in and every state will have to accept gay marriage whether they issued it or not
 
Not what is happening here.
They are ruling if DOMA gives government the right to take rights AWAY.
And it does and if they are strict constitutionalists theywill rule that DOMA does just that.
Those that support DOMA and government laws banning gay marriage support government taking the right away from gays and lesbians to marry each other.

I actually hope DOMA gets overturned, but for other reasons. Marriage is a contract managed at the state level, the feds should have nothing to do with it, just as the courts should have nothing to do with it, at any level. It is something for the state legislatures to determine as if proper for thier power to legislate government interactions with its citizens.

Its not that easy. You can't move among states and be married or not married

ALL states will have to honor the marital status issued by other states. You can't say.....We accept heterosexual marriages from NY but not gay marriages

Sooner or later the courts will have to weigh in and every state will have to accept gay marriage whether they issued it or not

Different states can have different concealed carry rules, and people choose to go or not to go to a given state because of those rules. With marriage, why would one want to move into a state that doesnt want to support gay marriage if you are in one?

For travel purposes, as long as the state recognizes basics like health coverage, and visitiation rights in hospitals, why would they need to give full marriage recognition to visitors?
 
Not what is happening here.
They are ruling if DOMA gives government the right to take rights AWAY.
And it does and if they are strict constitutionalists theywill rule that DOMA does just that.
Those that support DOMA and government laws banning gay marriage support government taking the right away from gays and lesbians to marry each other.

I actually hope DOMA gets overturned, but for other reasons. Marriage is a contract managed at the state level, the feds should have nothing to do with it, just as the courts should have nothing to do with it, at any level. It is something for the state legislatures to determine as if proper for thier power to legislate government interactions with its citizens.

Its not that easy. You can't move among states and be married or not married

ALL states will have to honor the marital status issued by other states. You can't say.....We accept heterosexual marriages from NY but not gay marriages

Sooner or later the courts will have to weigh in and every state will have to accept gay marriage whether they issued it or not

As sick and tired as I am of all this gay boogeyman nonsense it can not come too soon.

And then a year after that happens watch this go away as the open service in the military argument has.
That went over with little to no problems at all.
Because IT AFFECTS NO ONE.
 
I actually hope DOMA gets overturned, but for other reasons. Marriage is a contract managed at the state level, the feds should have nothing to do with it, just as the courts should have nothing to do with it, at any level. It is something for the state legislatures to determine as if proper for thier power to legislate government interactions with its citizens.

Its not that easy. You can't move among states and be married or not married

ALL states will have to honor the marital status issued by other states. You can't say.....We accept heterosexual marriages from NY but not gay marriages

Sooner or later the courts will have to weigh in and every state will have to accept gay marriage whether they issued it or not

Different states can have different concealed carry rules, and people choose to go or not to go to a given state because of those rules. With marriage, why would one want to move into a state that doesnt want to support gay marriage if you are in one?

For travel purposes, as long as the state recognizes basics like health coverage, and visitiation rights in hospitals, why would they need to give full marriage recognition to visitors?

Because the civil code in all the states except Louisiana has the exact same property rights and that is what marriage has in it.
 
You believe my family members that happen to be gays and lesbians are morally corrupt and are covering up your bigotry with jelly doughnuts and powdered bull shit.
You clearly stated that homosexuality is depravity.
We are speaking of YOUR bigotry and all you have to come back with is "well, all through history everyone else has persecuted gays more when they had the audacity to come out of the closet " in a further attempt to cloak your bigotry.
And you are sucking at it because it is a milk weak argument if one at all.
Is that all you have? No guts to just admit you do not like gay people, you believe them to be 2nd class immoral citizens and that they are one day, some day going to "swing from the lamp posts" with you there on a front row seat cheering on the executioners?
I would have had an ounce of respect for you then as a testament to your candor and honesty.

I now see your mistake. I do not think that gays and lesbians are morally corrupt. They have an aberration. Those who accept the aberration as normal behavior are morally corrupt. Why do I say they will swing from lamp posts? It is a historical fact that out of all of the civilizations that have normalized homosexual relationships gays were slaughtered when that civilization collapsed. Not one time has the normalcy of homosexuality been passed on to a subsequent civilization. In the case of western civilization it looks like islam will be the replacement. They do like to decorate lamp posts and cranes with bodies.

You have an opinion. You hate gays, think they are degenerate....an aberation

You are free to maintain your hatred and repulsion at gays.....you do not have a right to force government to accept your hatred

The government has no right to tell me to accept the normalcy of homosexuality, of the growing acceptance of beastiality or incest or even finding those who molest children just another normal sexual orientation.

That's the difference. Will DOMA be overturned? Certainly. Because the culture is decomposing and this is part of it.
 
Its not that easy. You can't move among states and be married or not married

ALL states will have to honor the marital status issued by other states. You can't say.....We accept heterosexual marriages from NY but not gay marriages

Sooner or later the courts will have to weigh in and every state will have to accept gay marriage whether they issued it or not

Different states can have different concealed carry rules, and people choose to go or not to go to a given state because of those rules. With marriage, why would one want to move into a state that doesnt want to support gay marriage if you are in one?

For travel purposes, as long as the state recognizes basics like health coverage, and visitiation rights in hospitals, why would they need to give full marriage recognition to visitors?

Because the civil code in all the states except Louisiana has the exact same property rights and that is what marriage has in it.

I still don't see why that means the consitution says every state has to allow gay marriage.
 
Different states can have different concealed carry rules, and people choose to go or not to go to a given state because of those rules. With marriage, why would one want to move into a state that doesnt want to support gay marriage if you are in one?

Because the States themselves have chosen to recognize Civil Marriage from other States. If a State were to choose not to recognize any Civil Marriage performed from another State I suppose that would be Constitutional.

Do you know that except for Civil Marriages based on gender, ALL States recognize ALL other Civil Marriages performed in another State even if it conflicts with that States laws.

For travel purposes, as long as the state recognizes basics like health coverage, and visitiation rights in hospitals, why would they need to give full marriage recognition to visitors?

Let's take Virginia for example, the Constitutional Amendment to the State Constitution bars ANY recognition of both Civil Marriages and Civil Unions. A legally married same-sex couple that travels on vacation to Virginia does not even get the basics recognized. They would not have hospital visitation rights as family, they would no have medical decision making capability as next of kin. In addition, if the couple were the legal parents of the child based on assumed parentage laws of their home state, the non-biological parent would not have the legal status of "parent" here in Virginia.

Of course that's just for visitation, then of course there are people that move here from out of state as a requirement of work. Hampton Roads has major military bases. A female sailor and her wife married and stationed at Naval Base Groten CT who are order to transfer to Naval Base Norfolk VA for example.



>>>>
 
There are people in this world who still oppose court ordered integration?

You understand that court ordered integration failed don't you? You can support it but that cow has left the barn. Affirmative action failed. We are now into the third generation of affirmative action with no real improvement. In fact blacks are worse off with higher unemployment than if we never had affirmative action.

If you could rewind this movie you would clearly see that Chicago, Detroit, Philadelphia and other cities started disintegrating when they adopted plans for cout ordered integration.

Sorry to disabuse you of your fuzzy feel good but acceptance and normalization of homosexuality has happened before with always the same result of lots of dead gay people.

I don't know why but it would seem that along with acceptance of homosexuality comes acceptance of all other forms of depravity. What decent people remain just stop caring what happens to degenerates. When some group rises to oppose degeneracy there isn't enough people caring enough to defend them. That seems to be the case in London and Paris where the public is largely not moved to outrage when muslims attack gays.

In America it has been somewhat different. It's self induced disease that brings the big yawn. So far.

You have to prove homosexuality is depravity for any of your claims to have any credibility.
Shame as some do but the fact you claim that bull shit throws the rest out with the bull shit.
You can believe that homosexuality is moral corruption all you want, have at it.
But we will not allow you to push your bull shit on us. We believe that our family members, neighbors and friends that happen to be homosexual are not immoral citizens.
And are offended by your ruthless claims that they are. We just assume you keep your religious beliefs to yourself and if you do not have anything nice to say about folks you do not even know then just keep your pie hole shut.
One day you may come out of your angry, pompous, opinionated and self righteous self.
For the sake of your family I hope you do. Otherwise you are going to grow an old, bitter and angry grump.

Matter of conscience are for no person to dictate to another, that is a two way street. History, Religions, teach what they teach. Feel free to take it or leave it. To assume that you have the foundation of moral high ground here, is a big mistake. True, it is an issue between each of us and our Maker. Past that you become what you accuse others of, just the other side of the same coin.
 
Does every state recognize common law marriage? Absolutely not.


Actually they do. Most States do not allow for the assumption of Common Law Marriage under their State law, however they recognize as legally valid legal Common Law Marriages from another State and in addition the federal government recognizes them as valid if entered into in a State that allows for the assumption of Common Law Marriages.


>>>>
 
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Different states can have different concealed carry rules, and people choose to go or not to go to a given state because of those rules. With marriage, why would one want to move into a state that doesnt want to support gay marriage if you are in one?

For travel purposes, as long as the state recognizes basics like health coverage, and visitiation rights in hospitals, why would they need to give full marriage recognition to visitors?

Because the civil code in all the states except Louisiana has the exact same property rights and that is what marriage has in it.

I still don't see why that means the consitution says every state has to allow gay marriage.

The claim is that every state has to give full faith and credit to the laws of every other state. We know that doesn't really happen because a CCW permit that's good in one state isn't good in all states. We know that a driver's license in one state is only good temporarily in another state. We know that voter registration laws do not transfer from one state to another. But, the claim is that full faith and credit will be given to same sex couples.
 
If as many people who claimed to not care about gay rights, actually didnt care, gay marriage would be legal by now.

If only there was such a thing as Gay marriage.


No state laws have been written based on sexual orientation. The proper term is "Same-sex Civil Marriage" as no State in the union has a test or even asks a question about sexual orientation. So ya, two heterosexuals of the same-sex could get Civilly Married.

And yes, there are a number of States where Same-sex Civil Marriage exists.



>>>>
 
Does every state recognize common law marriage? Absolutely not.


Actually they do. Most States do not allow for the assumption of Common Law Marriage under their State law, however they recognize as legally valid legally Common Law Marriages from another State and in addition the federal government recognizes them as valid if entered into in a State that allows for the assumption of Common Law Marriages.


>>>>

In a state that does not allow common law marriage, you cannot enter into a common law marriage.
 
If as many people who claimed to not care about gay rights, actually didnt care, gay marriage would be legal by now.

If only there was such a thing as Gay marriage.


No state laws have been written based on sexual orientation. The proper term is "Same-sex Civil Marriage" as no State in the union has a test or even asks a question about sexual orientation. So ya, two heterosexuals of the same-sex could get Civilly Married.

And yes, there are a number of States where Same-sex Civil Marriage exists.



>>>>

Civil marriage isn't quite what gays want. What they want is the same as they want in the UK, a law mandating that all religious institutions must perform marriage rites. The legal trappings of marriage isn't what they want. They want to debase the religion of others.
 
Does every state recognize common law marriage? Absolutely not.


Actually they do. Most States do not allow for the assumption of Common Law Marriage under their State law, however they recognize as legally valid legally Common Law Marriages from another State and in addition the federal government recognizes them as valid if entered into in a State that allows for the assumption of Common Law Marriages.


>>>>

In a state that does not allow common law marriage, you cannot enter into a common law marriage.


Correct. But that's not what I said.

If you enter into a Common Law Marriage in a State that does allow a Common Law Marriage - that Civil Marriage (and yes Common Law Marriages are a valid Civil Marriage) is recognized by both the federal government and other states. If you are legally married in Georgia under it's Common Law and move to Virginia (which doesn't allow for the assumption of Common Law Marriages) you are still legally married in Virginia and still legally married for federal purposes.

" 3. Does Virginia have "Common Law Marriages?"

No. A common law marriage is one by agreement of two people who consider themselves married without any formal ceremony or license and hold themselves out as married. Such arrangements are not marriages in Virginia, but they will be recognized here if they were valid in the state where they took place and if they were between people who would have been eligible to marry under Virginia law."​


Virginia State Bar -


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If only there was such a thing as Gay marriage.


No state laws have been written based on sexual orientation. The proper term is "Same-sex Civil Marriage" as no State in the union has a test or even asks a question about sexual orientation. So ya, two heterosexuals of the same-sex could get Civilly Married.

And yes, there are a number of States where Same-sex Civil Marriage exists.



>>>>

Civil marriage isn't quite what gays want.

Yes it is as same-sex couples already have access to Same-sex Religious Marriage in every State in the union.

What they want is the same as they want in the UK, a law mandating that all religious institutions must perform marriage rites. The legal trappings of marriage isn't what they want. They want to debase the religion of others.


We are not the UK. One, we don't have a government run Church like the Church of England. Second, we have a Constitution (which they don't have in the UK) which spells out religious freedom under the First Amendment.

The idea that same-sex couples want to mandate that Churches or religious person be forced under the rule of law to perform Same-sex Religious Marriages is just fear mongering.



>>>>
 
Actually they do. Most States do not allow for the assumption of Common Law Marriage under their State law, however they recognize as legally valid legally Common Law Marriages from another State and in addition the federal government recognizes them as valid if entered into in a State that allows for the assumption of Common Law Marriages.


>>>>

In a state that does not allow common law marriage, you cannot enter into a common law marriage.


Correct. But if you enter into a Common Law Marriage in a State that does allow a Common Law Marriage - that Civil Marriage (and yes Common Law Marriages are a valid Civil Marriage) is recognized by both the federal government and other states. If you are legally married in Georgia under it's Common Law and move to Virginia (which doesn't allow for the assumption of Common Law Marriages) you are still legally married in Virginia and still legally married for federal purposes.

" 3. Does Virginia have "Common Law Marriages?"

No. A common law marriage is one by agreement of two people who consider themselves married without any formal ceremony or license and hold themselves out as married. Such arrangements are not marriages in Virginia, but they will be recognized here if they were valid in the state where they took place and if they were between people who would have been eligible to marry under Virginia law."​


Virginia State Bar -


>>>>

But you cannot enter into a common law marriage in Virginia. So if a same sex couple could get married in a state that recognizes such marriages but not married in a state that doesn't does that work for you?

Whether or not gays are married, should not in any way affect the right of individuals who choose to conduct their lives according to the way they see fit. This includes the individual right to refuse services or goods to same sex couples.
 
Different states can have different concealed carry rules, and people choose to go or not to go to a given state because of those rules. With marriage, why would one want to move into a state that doesnt want to support gay marriage if you are in one?

Because the States themselves have chosen to recognize Civil Marriage from other States. If a State were to choose not to recognize any Civil Marriage performed from another State I suppose that would be Constitutional.

Do you know that except for Civil Marriages based on gender, ALL States recognize ALL other Civil Marriages performed in another State even if it conflicts with that States laws.

For travel purposes, as long as the state recognizes basics like health coverage, and visitiation rights in hospitals, why would they need to give full marriage recognition to visitors?

Let's take Virginia for example, the Constitutional Amendment to the State Constitution bars ANY recognition of both Civil Marriages and Civil Unions. A legally married same-sex couple that travels on vacation to Virginia does not even get the basics recognized. They would not have hospital visitation rights as family, they would no have medical decision making capability as next of kin. In addition, if the couple were the legal parents of the child based on assumed parentage laws of their home state, the non-biological parent would not have the legal status of "parent" here in Virginia.

Of course that's just for visitation, then of course there are people that move here from out of state as a requirement of work. Hampton Roads has major military bases. A female sailor and her wife married and stationed at Naval Base Groten CT who are order to transfer to Naval Base Norfolk VA for example.



>>>>

For military people, considering thier services are mostly from the military, federal law would apply, but only in a federal sense. Getting rid of DOMA would help this, and allow the military to follow its own guidlines.

I agree the situation is complex, and having a hodgepodge of laws from state to state is in the end unworkable. In this case if people want to make marriage that is not based on gender a "right" they need to get a federal amendment to force states to do it. I just dont see a way for federal courts to force states to modify thier marriage laws to suit the desires of same sex marriage proponents. That leaves them legislative relief on a state by state basis, or the amendment process.
 

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