A Fulfillment of Prophecy?

[Trajan]

In all honesty, this thread is not intended to bash Obama, but is intended to be a heads up and encouragement to think about what those in government intend as opposed to what they say.

President Obama is watching his signature legislation crumble before his eyes. And he is a man of sufficient ego, he won't go down without a fight. So if you're paying attention, he is already trying to divert attention away from Obamacare and toward other initiatives that he hopes will save his legacy. Two issues at the top of his list are Immigration Reform and Environmental Controls.

How much more of our libertiy are the people willing to put on the line to save his legacy?

In all honesty, this thread is not intended to bash Obama, but is intended to be a heads up and encouragement to think about what those in government intend as opposed to what they say.

agreed and I will provide an example from the another side of the spectrum; immigration- sounds great 'everyone' wants it, it will balloon their reach out etc etc.... big biz has been pressuring the heck out of the gop to go along,( Conservative 'fly-in' aims to sell House GOP on immigration ) and a lot of them are, however, my question is; why in this economic atmosphere we would want to introduce the means to add more labor especially at the lower end to a market that is glutted with labor...it can only stagnate any wage increases/benefits etc.....

They are wrapped up and engaged in their own form of populism so they can feather their own beds, no different from the machinations/mechanics of .............

 

[Sunshine]

The prophesy that in the end, Israel would stand alone is the most disturbing.

I first heard this when I was a teen. It was suggested that one of two things would have to happen. The US would abandon Israel or the US would no longer exist. At the time both possibilities were considered ridiculous.

Not so much any more.

It was also prophesied that Israel would rebuild the temple on the temple mount. The temple mount now sports the Dome of the Rock, a mosque and sacred to muslims as the place that Mohammed lifted off.

Dome of the Rock

I saw a History Channel show a few months ago about it. They are recreating all the items that were in the original temple EXCEPT the Arc of the Covenant. The person being interviewed said they weren't recreating that because they know where it is. But, at any rate, if they rebuild the temple they ill have to do something to evict the muslims from the foundation of it.

They will have to fight the muslims off of it and there is no way that Obama or any other muslim sympathizer who gets elected to office will support their effort.

 

[Sunshine]

Yes, I encourage all to search the scriptures for how Our Lord would want us to live our lives.

No, the ACA is not crumbling before anyone's eyes: to suggest such is hyperbolic demagoguery.

I admire you in so many ways, but I am very careful when you start talking religion and American narrative, Foxfyre.

So you will not rail on about derailing your thread, I will leave it at this.

Think, folks.

Exactly.

As for ‘prophecy’ and ‘scriptures,’ theists are at liberty of course to believe whatever they wish, provided they don’t attempt to codify those beliefs.

And those free from faith are also at liberty to reject the ridiculous notion of ‘prophecy,’ that it has any ‘bearing’ on current events, and continue to correctly and appropriately ignore the partisan nonsense expressed by Thomas Sowell and his ilk.

Oh?

What prevents them from codifying their beliefs? What law prevents YOU from codifying YOUR beliefs?

As I was so admonished in law school, most of the laws we have consist of someone's effort to legislate their morality.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

There is a passage in the Bible in which the Apostle Paul opines that a time will come when prophecy will cease. These days I wonder if that means literally that there will be no more prophets? Or does it mean that the people will lose their ability to hear and consider prophetic vision?

In 2008, Thomas Sowell used his 'bully pulpit" in a series of essays to warn us what we would be getting with a Barack Obama presidency. He was largely ignored, even by most conservatives.

And now I can look back over the last five years and believe that those essays were pure prophecy.

Agree or disagree.

Some excerpts from some Thomas Sowell Essays during the 2008 campaign (emphasis mine):

The Real Obama - October 7, 2008

. . . .Jeremiah Wright, Father Michael Pfleger, William Ayers and Antoin Rezko are not just people who happened to be at the same place at the same time as Barack Obama. They are people with whom he chose to ally himself for years, and with some of whom some serious money changed hands.

Some gave political support, and some gave financial support, to Obama's election campaigns, and Obama in turn contributed either his own money or the taxpayers' money to some of them. That is a familiar political alliance— but an alliance is not just an "association" from being at the same place at the same time.

Obama could have allied himself with all sorts of other people. But, time and again, he allied himself with people who openly expressed their hatred of America. No amount of flags on his campaign platforms this election year can change that. . . .

. . . . Senator Obama is running on an image that is directly the opposite of what he has been doing for two decades. His escapes from his past have been as remarkable as the great escapes of Houdini. , , ,
Thomas Sowell

The Real Obama - Part II - October 8, 2008

. . . .There is no more real issue today than "Who is the real Barack Obama behind the image?" What does being in favor of sex education in kindergarten tell us about the outlook and character of this largely unknown man who has suddenly appeared on the national scene to claim the highest office in the land?

It gives us an insight into the huge gulf between Senator Obama's election year image and what he has actually been for and against over the preceding decades. It also shows the huge gulf between his values and those of most other Americans.

Many Americans would consider sex education for kindergartners to be absurd but there is more to it than that.

What is called "sex education," whether for kindergartners or older children, is not education about biology but indoctrination in values that go against the traditional values that children learn in their families and in their communities.

Obviously, the earlier this indoctrination begins, the better its chances of overriding traditional values. The question is not how urgently children in kindergarten need to be taught about sex but how important it is for indoctrinators to get an early start. . . .

. . . . Sex education for kindergartners is just one of many issues on which Barack Obama has lined up consistently on the side of arrogant elitists of the far left. Senator Obama's words often sound very reasonable and moderate, as well as lofty and inspiring. But everything that he has actually done over the years places him unmistakably with the extreme left elitists.

Sadly, many of those who are enchanted by his rhetoric are unlikely to check out the facts. But nothing is a more real or more important issue than whether what a candidate says is the direct opposite of what he has actually been doing for years.

The old phrase, "a man of high ideals but no principles," is one that applies all too painfully to Barack Obama today. His words expressing lofty ideals may appeal to the gullible but his long history of having no principles makes him a danger of the first magnitude in the White House.
Thomas Sowell

The Real Obama - Part III - October 9, 2008


The Real Obama - Part IV - October 10, 2008


Believers - October 21, 2008


Obama and the Left - October 26, 2008

. . . .ACORN is not just an organization on the left. In addition to the voter frauds that ACORN has been involved in over the years, it is an organization with a history of thuggery, including going to bankers' homes to harass them and their families, in order to force banks to lend to people with low credit ratings.

Nor was Barack Obama's relationship with ACORN just a matter of once being their attorney long ago. More recently, he has directed hundreds of thousands of dollars their way. Money talks — and what it says is more important than a politician's rhetoric in an election year.
Thomas Sowell

Obama and the Law - October 28, 2008

. . . .Senator Obama has stated very clearly what kinds of Supreme Court justices he wants— those with "the empathy to understand what it's like to be poor, or African-American, or gay, or disabled, or old."

Like so many things that Obama says, it may sound nice if you don't stop and think— and chilling if you do stop and think. Do we really want judges who decide cases based on who you are, rather than on the facts and the law?. . .

. . . . The Constitution of the United States will not mean much if judges carry out Obama's vision of the Constitution as "a living document"— that is, something that judges should feel free to change by "interpretation" to favor particular individuals, groups or causes.

We have already seen where that leads with the 2005 Kelo Supreme Court decision that allows local politicians to take people's homes or businesses and transfer that property to others. . . .
Thomas Sowell

The answer is

the people will lose their ability to hear and consider prophetic vision

Because of
"And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe the LIE: that they all might be damned who believed not the Truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness."

 

[daveman]

Lol no....common themes does not make it so...framers where against the very idea.

They where?

Fuck your moronic spelling.

uh yes...we have a secular government. You want a religious government? go move to the middleeast or something.

No, you moron, I don't want a religious government. Stop lying.

But it would be nice if you could acknowledge the reality that Judeo-Christian thought is the basis for our civilization.

But you won't.

 

[daveman]

This thread and its conservative subscribers is an excellent example of why the Framers mandated that church and state remain separate.

They didn't like intellectual discussion? Who knew? I don't see anyone trying to force their religion on anyone in this thread. It is a discussion of a particular principal that isn't even present in every religion and that some fairly non religious people engaged in. I don't recall any prophecy in Hinduism, or Buddhism. Nostradamus made many prophecies as did Edgar Cayce, and I don't hear you grousing about them.

You need to hit the books. One thing a lawyer has to be able to do is identify the issue. You miss the issue on almost every thread you attempt to derail.

There isn't one damned thing wrong with asking if prophecy occurs.

Remember, you're dealing with people who hate and fear the word "god" (unless it's followed by "damn America), and think that any public utterance of it should be illegal.

 

[Sunshine]

Well, I guess I'm a prophet. I never expected Romney to win. Too clean cut for the gang bangers and hippies who have taken over.

Hippies took over? Sorry, most hippies are not anywhere NEAR that ambitious ... they're usually too stoned.

Actually, you are wrong. Many of them died young due to their drug use, but most mainstreamed themselves and became college faculty. That is my generation. They are there and they are influencing this country as academics. Of course you are too young to remember that a lot of the hippie action took place on college campuses.

Although not as visible as it once was, hippie culture has never died out completely: hippies and neo-hippies can still be found on college campuses, on communes and at festivals; while many still embrace the hippie values of peace, love, and community. Although many of the original hippies and those who were core to the movement remained (or remain) dedicated to the values they originally espoused, many of those who played more peripheral roles are often seen as having "sold out" during the 1980s by becoming a part of the corporate, materialist culture they initially rejected.[42][43]

History of the hippie movement - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The didn't 'sell out'. They mainstreamed themselves.

 

[daveman]

One can’t be expected to ‘focus’ on a concept that’s inherently idiotic.

For example, there’s an anti-Islam rightist currently arguing in his thread that the Supremacy Clause means that no religion can declare its dogma to be ‘supreme’ and if it does that religion can be ‘banned.’

I haven't read that thread. Is he getting any traction with other conservatives?

Let me guess: "No."

This notion is so fundamentally and comprehensively wrong and ridiculous that it defies debate, any debate is impossible because the position is so bizarre, and indeed is not worthy of debate.

The same is true with regard to the notion that subjective religious prophecy has any bearing on current political events; it’s merely the grist of a tedious partisan hack. This notion is also so fundamentally and comprehensively wrong and ridiculous that it defies debate, any debate is impossible because the position is so bizarre, and indeed is not worthy of debate.

Well, that's certainly one way of admitting you can't argue against Sowell.

Not like that's a big surprise or anything.

 

[daveman]

The prophesy that in the end, Israel would stand alone is the most disturbing.

I first heard this when I was a teen. It was suggested that one of two things would have to happen. The US would abandon Israel or the US would no longer exist. At the time both possibilities were considered ridiculous.

Not so much any more.

It was also prophesied that Israel would rebuild the temple on the temple mount. The temple mount now sports the Dome of the Rock, a mosque and sacred to muslims as the place that Mohammed lifted off.

Dome of the Rock

I saw a History Channel show a few months ago about it. They are recreating all the items that were in the original temple EXCEPT the Arc of the Covenant. The person being interviewed said they weren't recreating that because they know where it is. But, at any rate, if they rebuild the temple they ill have to do something to evict the muslims from the foundation of it.

They will have to fight the muslims off of it and there is no way that Obama or any other muslim sympathizer who gets elected to office will support their effort.

That's the crux of the whole Israel debate: Islam is angry because Jews built their sacred religious sites under Islamic ones.

 

[Trajan]

you are in the Political forum.......last time....

 

[Plasmaball]

They where?

Fuck your moronic spelling.

uh yes...we have a secular government. You want a religious government? go move to the middleeast or something.

No, you moron, I don't want a religious government. Stop lying.

But it would be nice if you could acknowledge the reality that Judeo-Christian thought is the basis for our civilization.

But you won't.

yes you do, and no its not. Then again it is you trying to argue this so who cares really.

 

[Foxfyre]

Good morning everyone. A good night's sleep does a body good. And I'm back to fight the good fight and see if there is some way to get this thread back on track.

So so far, the leftists have attacked me, the thread topic, Republicans, conservatives, George W. Bush, rightwingers, conservatives, Mitt Romney, Israel, the Bible, and the prophets of the Bible, and have called the thread dishonest, boring, irrelevent, and stupid.

But not one has made even a cursory attempt to discuss the concept offered in the OP or even the most feeble reasoned argument as to how Thomas Sowell was wrong in his assessment of Barack Obama back in 2008. Several other members have made useful comments or observations, but it is difficult to focus on a concept when dozens of irrelevent or non sequitur posts keep being thrown into the mix so we've been pulled off into other unrelated things. And that doesn't even count those who are deliberately trying to start a food fight.

This thread is not about any of those other things, whether or not the criticisms are valid. This thread is intended to analyze Sowell's analysis of Barack Obama in 2008 and where he was right or wrong in that analysis now that we have five years of experience with President Barack Obama. And if the topic is unacceptable or boring to you, I understand that, and I would suggest there are many other threads on USMB that you would likely find to be fascinating, even invigorating, and would pleasantly urge you to go visit those.

So let's refocus shall we?

For instance, looking at the first essay. It offers the full rationale for the summary sentences I selected:

Obama could have allied himself with all sorts of other people. But, time and again, he allied himself with people who openly expressed their hatred of America. No amount of flags on his campaign platforms this election year can change that. . . .

. . . . Senator Obama is running on an image that is directly the opposite of what he has been doing for two decades. His escapes from his past have been as remarkable as the great escapes of Houdini. . . .​

From the so-called 'apology tour' early in his presidency to government seizure of some financial institutions and General Motors to Obamacare that gives the government control over one sixth of the U.S. economy to what some see as a flat out, poorly veiled assault on the private sector, can anybody in all honesty say that Barack Obama loves the America that was? Can anybody in all honesty say that the Barack Obama we got bears any resemblance to the rhetoric he gave us in 2008?

 

[TemplarKormac]

Good morning everyone. A good night's sleep does a body good. And I'm back to fight the good fight and see if there is some way to get this thread back on track.

So so far, the leftists have attacked me, the thread topic, Republicans, conservatives, George W. Bush, rightwingers, conservatives, Mitt Romney, Israel, the Bible, and the prophets of the Bible, and have called the thread dishonest, boring, irrelevent, and stupid.

But not one has made even a cursory attempt to discuss the concept offered in the OP or even the most feeble reasoned argument as to how Thomas Sowell was wrong in his assessment of Barack Obama back in 2008. Several other members have made useful comments or observations, but it is difficult to focus on a concept when dozens of irrelevent or non sequitur posts keep being thrown into the mix so we've been pulled off into other unrelated things. And that doesn't even count those who are deliberately trying to start a food fight.

This thread is not about any of those other things, whether or not the criticisms are valid. This thread is intended to analyze Sowell's analysis of Barack Obama in 2008 and where he was right or wrong in that analysis now that we have five years of experience with President Barack Obama. And if the topic is unacceptable or boring to you, I understand that, and I would suggest there are many other threads on USMB that you would likely find to be fascinating, even invigorating, and would pleasantly urge you to go visit those.

So let's refocus shall we?

For instance, looking at the first essay. It offers the full rationale for the summary sentences I selected:

Obama could have allied himself with all sorts of other people. But, time and again, he allied himself with people who openly expressed their hatred of America. No amount of flags on his campaign platforms this election year can change that. . . .

. . . . Senator Obama is running on an image that is directly the opposite of what he has been doing for two decades. His escapes from his past have been as remarkable as the great escapes of Houdini. . . .​

From the so-called 'apology tour' early in his presidency to government seizure of some financial institutions and General Motors to Obamacare that gives the government control over one sixth of the U.S. economy to what some see as a flat out, poorly veiled assault on the private sector, can anybody in all honesty say that Barack Obama loves the America that was? Can anybody in all honesty say that the Barack Obama we got bears any resemblance to the rhetoric he gave us in 2008?

I am a big fan of Thomas Sowell, and I believe he was way ahead of his time when he burst onto the scene in the early 1980's. I believe he was right about Obama from the beginning. Obama never fulfilled any of the promises made during his campaign, but has instead done the exact opposite. A good example would be the promises he made about Obamacare, or about cutting the deficit. After the Gabrielle Giffords shooting, Obama encouraged civility in discourse but did not admonish anyone in his party for blaming Sarah Palin, the Tea Party or Republicans.

Basically in my objective opinion, he is a hypocrite and an exact contradiction the man who ran for President in 2008 and 2012.

 

[Foxfyre]

Yes, TK, I agree that the hypocrisy is glaring at times. And that speaks to the summary statement in the second essay:

The old phrase, "a man of high ideals but no principles," is one that applies all too painfully to Barack Obama today. His words expressing lofty ideals may appeal to the gullible but his long history of having no principles makes him a danger of the first magnitude in the White House.​

And yet his adoring throng continues to defend and support and excuse and rationalize everything about him as is glaringly obvious in this and many other threads.

At the beginning--before the Preface--of Sowell's amazing book A Vision of the Annointed, (1995), he offered two quotations that, given our experience of the last decade or so, give us a profound insight into how things look through Sowell's eyes:

"At most only a tiny set of policies have been studied with even moderate care." -- George J. Stigler, Nobel Laureate in Economics

"In the flaring parks, in the taverns, in the hushed academies, your murmur will applaud the wisdom of a thousand quacks. For theirs is the kingdom." -- Kenneth Fearing, poet​

Those quotations make so much more sense to me now.

So how much quackery is involved in the defense of Obamacare? How much did Barack Obama study the very policies that are being forced upon all of us now? No, I do not wish to discuss Obamacare as there are numerous other active threads to do that.

I wish to look at a Barack Obama who is pushing the greatest power grab we have ever seen from government upon us - and who based on his own sales pitch over the last four years is clueless about what that power grab will do to people. Or he doesn't care. Or it is on purpose. Take your pick.

Is THAT the Barack Obama who campaigned in 2008?

 

[Trajan]

seems time for an ageless quote;


"Of all tyrannies a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victim may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies.

The robber baron’s cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated, but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval
of their own conscience."

cs lewis...

 

[Foxfyre]

seems time for an ageless quote;


"Of all tyrannies a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victim may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies.

The robber baron’s cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated, but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval
of their own conscience."

cs lewis...

Bravo. Very appropriate, Trajan!! That is a quotation included in Sowell's arsenal of favorite quotations, and he and C.S. Lewis saw pretty much eye to eye in that regard.

It is the same concept that Sowell, in various ways, often includes in his own arguments.

The statists/political class among us seem to be willing to turn a blind eye to the consequences of high sounding, moralistic government programs. And they cannot seem to see the negative consequences or simply blow them off because after all, the program with the high minded sounding title sounds so much more noble than the observations of the critics of that same program.

Is THAT how Barack Obama manages to keep the folks on his plantation? Because they shrug off the quackery because they want to believe it so desperately? Or is it because nobody but hated conservatives are telling them the truth. The media won't do its job to expose the flaws in policy. Too many politicians don't even read the bills they pass.

And Obama doesn't seem to care about negative consequences if it puts more power, authority, and clout into the federal government.

In that Thomas Sowell's essays have indeed been prophetic.

 

[TemplarKormac]

Yes, TK, I agree that the hypocrisy is glaring at times. And that speaks to the summary statement in the second essay:

The old phrase, "a man of high ideals but no principles," is one that applies all too painfully to Barack Obama today. His words expressing lofty ideals may appeal to the gullible but his long history of having no principles makes him a danger of the first magnitude in the White House.​

And yet his adoring throng continues to defend and support and excuse and rationalize everything about him as is glaringly obvious in this and many other threads.

At the beginning--before the Preface--of Sowell's amazing book A Vision of the Annointed, (1995), he offered two quotations that, given our experience of the last decade or so, give us a profound insight into how things look through Sowell's eyes:

"At most only a tiny set of policies have been studied with even moderate care." -- George J. Stigler, Nobel Laureate in Economics

"In the flaring parks, in the taverns, in the hushed academies, your murmur will applaud the wisdom of a thousand quacks. For theirs is the kingdom." -- Kenneth Fearing, poet​

Those quotations make so much more sense to me now.

So how much quackery is involved in the defense of Obamacare? How much did Barack Obama study the very policies that are being forced upon all of us now? No, I do not wish to discuss Obamacare as there are numerous other active threads to do that.

I wish to look at a Barack Obama who is pushing the greatest power grab we have ever seen from government upon us - and who based on his own sales pitch over the last four years is clueless about what that power grab will do to people. Or he doesn't care. Or it is on purpose. Take your pick.

Is THAT the Barack Obama who campaigned in 2008?

I'm afraid you won't get a liberal to admit that freely, but if I had to take a guess... Deep inside they know that the Obama now isn't the Obama they elected in 2008. Not by a long shot. I'm thinking they are a bit let down by what he has become lately. However, they remain undeterred; their intense hatred of the other side will compel them to vote for like minded people in the future, setting us up for more government and less freedom--and for them more disappointment or a sort of electoral masochism, if you will.

 

[Foxfyre]

Yes, TK, I agree that the hypocrisy is glaring at times. And that speaks to the summary statement in the second essay:

The old phrase, "a man of high ideals but no principles," is one that applies all too painfully to Barack Obama today. His words expressing lofty ideals may appeal to the gullible but his long history of having no principles makes him a danger of the first magnitude in the White House.​

And yet his adoring throng continues to defend and support and excuse and rationalize everything about him as is glaringly obvious in this and many other threads.

At the beginning--before the Preface--of Sowell's amazing book A Vision of the Annointed, (1995), he offered two quotations that, given our experience of the last decade or so, give us a profound insight into how things look through Sowell's eyes:

"At most only a tiny set of policies have been studied with even moderate care." -- George J. Stigler, Nobel Laureate in Economics

"In the flaring parks, in the taverns, in the hushed academies, your murmur will applaud the wisdom of a thousand quacks. For theirs is the kingdom." -- Kenneth Fearing, poet​

Those quotations make so much more sense to me now.

So how much quackery is involved in the defense of Obamacare? How much did Barack Obama study the very policies that are being forced upon all of us now? No, I do not wish to discuss Obamacare as there are numerous other active threads to do that.

I wish to look at a Barack Obama who is pushing the greatest power grab we have ever seen from government upon us - and who based on his own sales pitch over the last four years is clueless about what that power grab will do to people. Or he doesn't care. Or it is on purpose. Take your pick.

Is THAT the Barack Obama who campaigned in 2008?

I'm afraid you won't get a liberal to admit that freely, but if I had to take a guess... Deep inside they know that the Obama now isn't the Obama they elected in 2008. Not by a long shot. I'm thinking they are a bit let down by what he has become lately. However, they remain undeterred; their intense hatred of the other side will compel them to vote for like minded people in the future, setting us up for more government and less freedom--and for them more disappointment or a sort of electoral masochism, if you will.

Interesting analogy. Do you really think so? Do those on the left who still defend Obama really think they got the guy who campaigned in 2008? They adored him then and they honestly adore him now?

 

[Sunshine]

Yes, TK, I agree that the hypocrisy is glaring at times. And that speaks to the summary statement in the second essay:

The old phrase, "a man of high ideals but no principles," is one that applies all too painfully to Barack Obama today. His words expressing lofty ideals may appeal to the gullible but his long history of having no principles makes him a danger of the first magnitude in the White House.​

And yet his adoring throng continues to defend and support and excuse and rationalize everything about him as is glaringly obvious in this and many other threads.

At the beginning--before the Preface--of Sowell's amazing book A Vision of the Annointed, (1995), he offered two quotations that, given our experience of the last decade or so, give us a profound insight into how things look through Sowell's eyes:

"At most only a tiny set of policies have been studied with even moderate care." -- George J. Stigler, Nobel Laureate in Economics

"In the flaring parks, in the taverns, in the hushed academies, your murmur will applaud the wisdom of a thousand quacks. For theirs is the kingdom." -- Kenneth Fearing, poet​

Those quotations make so much more sense to me now.

So how much quackery is involved in the defense of Obamacare? How much did Barack Obama study the very policies that are being forced upon all of us now? No, I do not wish to discuss Obamacare as there are numerous other active threads to do that.

I wish to look at a Barack Obama who is pushing the greatest power grab we have ever seen from government upon us - and who based on his own sales pitch over the last four years is clueless about what that power grab will do to people. Or he doesn't care. Or it is on purpose. Take your pick.

Is THAT the Barack Obama who campaigned in 2008?

I'm afraid you won't get a liberal to admit that freely, but if I had to take a guess... Deep inside they know that the Obama now isn't the Obama they elected in 2008. Not by a long shot. I'm thinking they are a bit let down by what he has become lately. However, they remain undeterred; their intense hatred of the other side will compel them to vote for like minded people in the future, setting us up for more government and less freedom--and for them more disappointment or a sort of electoral masochism, if you will.

Interesting analogy. Do you really think so? Do those on the left who still defend Obama really think they got the guy who campaigned in 2008? They adored him then and they honestly adore him now?

All depends on the effect of Obamacare on their life! LOL

 

[Foxfyre]

I'm afraid you won't get a liberal to admit that freely, but if I had to take a guess... Deep inside they know that the Obama now isn't the Obama they elected in 2008. Not by a long shot. I'm thinking they are a bit let down by what he has become lately. However, they remain undeterred; their intense hatred of the other side will compel them to vote for like minded people in the future, setting us up for more government and less freedom--and for them more disappointment or a sort of electoral masochism, if you will.

Interesting analogy. Do you really think so? Do those on the left who still defend Obama really think they got the guy who campaigned in 2008? They adored him then and they honestly adore him now?

All depends on the effect of Obamacare on their life! LOL

But I think that it is exactly that which inspired Sowell's analysis and critique of what we would get or could expect with a Barack Obama presidency. He knew, I know, you know--everybody but the leftists seem to know--that once the die is cast, it is hard to pull it back. Yes, Obamacare is setting up to be one of the most destructive and unpopular initiatives ever imposed on the American people, but by the time enough leftist Obama worshippers are sufficiently convinced of that, will it be too late to reverse it? Will the private healthcare system we have enjoyed for more than 200 years already be destroyed making it very difficult to re-create?

That is why those essays are so important. They should inform us of the motives, intent, and probabilities sufficiently to change the course of history before irreversible damage is done.