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[logical4u]

When you're able to post civilly, without name calling, I will respond to your ideas.

After 5 Pages of mindless babbling, what else could you possibly have to add??? Face it, your premise was flawed. You will eventually come to terms with that.Funny, my approach was subtle compared to yours. Life is strange, huh.....

When you can post to me without insult I will respond to your ideas. One way to silence the opposition is to label the argument as 'mindless babble'.

Why is it no one ever mentions the religions of the terrorists of Northern Ireland, of Sri Lanka, of Japan, of Germany and of many other countries or people. When Muslims in Bosnia-Herzegovina were being slaughtered by the Serbs, there was no mention of Christian Orthodox terrorists. These Christian Orthodox terrorists killed far more people than were killed on September 11. The world did not mobilise to fight Christian Orthodox terrorists.

Weren't many of them on trial in international court and faced the crimes? How many terrorists (islamic) have been put to trial?

 

[Sky Dancer]

We are not done. You are an Idiot. You have no idea what you are arguing for and against in the same breath. You mis-characterize and argue for pages on your mis-characterization, accusing and pointing fingers, at the same time acknowledging the Threat of World Wide Imposed Sharia Law, when that is tyhe whole point of the Thread.

My problem is not with the Words one uses when they Pray, which is none of my nor your concern Jack Ass. I use that word because I have earned that right, considering the crap you have filled this Thread with. My problem is the Forced imposition of Sharia Law imposed on any unsuspecting body, through Terror, deceit, force of will, in the name of Any God. WTFU. What other Modern Religion do you define as Totalitarian??? The problem with Islam is not that it exists, but that it Must change and learn to respect the Rights of All Human Beings. It was because the diversion from the topic on another Thread that this Thread was started in the first place.

If you expect me to respond to your posts you'll have to leave out the words 'idiot and jack ass'. Unless you're willing to be civil, we are done.

I don't take abuse, even from moderators.

Is that a quote from Sigourney Weaver in Working Woman?

I loved Sigourney Weaver in that movie.

 

[logical4u]

This Thread is not about Condemning Islam, but, separating the Wheat from the Chaff within it. Let's distinguish between an Individual's Right of Freedom of Religion, and the Will to Impose that Religion on Others through Force.

Think of Islam today as Christianity was 500 or 1000 years ago.

Are you saying muslims are slow learners (the religion is like 600 years younger than Christianity)? That is really bigoted to believe that people are stupid just because they follow a particular religion.

 

[Sky Dancer]

After 5 Pages of mindless babbling, what else could you possibly have to add??? Face it, your premise was flawed. You will eventually come to terms with that.Funny, my approach was subtle compared to yours. Life is strange, huh.....

When you can post to me without insult I will respond to your ideas. One way to silence the opposition is to label the argument as 'mindless babble'.

Why is it no one ever mentions the religions of the terrorists of Northern Ireland, of Sri Lanka, of Japan, of Germany and of many other countries or people. When Muslims in Bosnia-Herzegovina were being slaughtered by the Serbs, there was no mention of Christian Orthodox terrorists. These Christian Orthodox terrorists killed far more people than were killed on September 11. The world did not mobilise to fight Christian Orthodox terrorists.

Weren't many of them on trial in international court and faced the crimes? How many terrorists (islamic) have been put to trial?

I have no idea. We tend to not put them on trial. We just imprison and torture them.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

Sufis are rejected as heretics by many Muslims as well.

Sufi are pretty muslim in some ways

Al-Ghazali, a Sufi orthodox Muslim, and follower of the Shafi’i school of Islamic jurisprudence, wrote this about jihad war and the treatment of the vanquished non-Muslim dhimmi peoples, in the Wadjiz: [4]

[O]ne must go on jihad (i.e., warlike razzias or raids) at least once a year…one may use a catapult against them [non-Muslims] when they are in a fortress, even if among them are women and children. One may set fire to them and/or drown them…If a person of the Ahl al-Kitab [People of The Book – primarily Jews and Christians] is enslaved, his marriage is [automatically] revoked…One may cut down their trees…One must destroy their useless books. Jihadists may take as booty whatever they decide…they may steal as much food as they need…


[T]he dhimmi is obliged not to mention Allah or His Apostle…Jews, Christians, and Majians must pay the jizya [poll tax on non-Muslims]…on offering up the jizya, the dhimmi must hang his head while the official takes hold of his beard and hits [thedhimmi] on the protruberant bone beneath his ear [i.e., the mandible]…

They are not permitted to ostentatiously display their wine or church bells…their houses may not be higher than the Muslim’s, no matter how low that is. The dhimmi may not ride an elegant horse or mule; he may ride a donkey only if the saddle [-work] is of wood. He may not walk on the good part of the road. They [the dhimmis] have to wear [an identifying] patch [on their clothing], even women, and even in the [public] baths…[dhimmis] must hold their tongue…. http://www.americanthinker.com/2005/05/sufi_jihad.html

 

[Sky Dancer]

Specific information on arrests, convictions or charges against lesbians, gays, and/or bisexuals in Malaysia could not be found among the sources consulted by the Research Directorate. However, The Independent reported that in 2003, gay men in Malaysia had been subjected to judicially sanctioned flogging (25 Apr. 2003). A researcher who conducted a study on Muslim homosexuals in Thailand found that the objects of his study, despite mistreatment, fared better than homosexuals in Malaysia (The Nation 19 June 2003). In the words of the researcher, "'n Malaysia, many [homosexuals] are arrested and forced to go through a rehabilitation camp to make them "male" again ... .One Thai-Muslim gay man said he was once hit by a police baton while travelling in Malaysia" (ibid.).

UNHCR | Refworld | Malaysia:

Big news. Gays are mistreated all over the world.

 

[High_Gravity]

Specific information on arrests, convictions or charges against lesbians, gays, and/or bisexuals in Malaysia could not be found among the sources consulted by the Research Directorate. However, The Independent reported that in 2003, gay men in Malaysia had been subjected to judicially sanctioned flogging (25 Apr. 2003). A researcher who conducted a study on Muslim homosexuals in Thailand found that the objects of his study, despite mistreatment, fared better than homosexuals in Malaysia (The Nation 19 June 2003). In the words of the researcher, "'n Malaysia, many [homosexuals] are arrested and forced to go through a rehabilitation camp to make them "male" again ... .One Thai-Muslim gay man said he was once hit by a police baton while travelling in Malaysia" (ibid.).

UNHCR | Refworld | Malaysia:

Big news. Gays are mistreated all over the world.

Sky Dancer this is more than "mistreated", gays and lesbians are caned and imprisoned in Malaysia, a country you said you wouldn't mind going to. Thats like me as a Black man saying I wouldn't mind vacationing in Apartheid South Africa. If I were gay I wouldn't be caught dead anywhere near a Muslim country, just sayin.

 

[Sky Dancer]

Sufis are rejected as heretics by many Muslims as well.

Sufi are pretty muslim in some ways

Al-Ghazali, a Sufi orthodox Muslim, and follower of the Shafi’i school of Islamic jurisprudence, wrote this about jihad war and the treatment of the vanquished non-Muslim dhimmi peoples, in the Wadjiz: [4]

[O]ne must go on jihad (i.e., warlike razzias or raids) at least once a year…one may use a catapult against them [non-Muslims] when they are in a fortress, even if among them are women and children. One may set fire to them and/or drown them…If a person of the Ahl al-Kitab [People of The Book – primarily Jews and Christians] is enslaved, his marriage is [automatically] revoked…One may cut down their trees…One must destroy their useless books. Jihadists may take as booty whatever they decide…they may steal as much food as they need…


[T]he dhimmi is obliged not to mention Allah or His Apostle…Jews, Christians, and Majians must pay the jizya [poll tax on non-Muslims]…on offering up the jizya, the dhimmi must hang his head while the official takes hold of his beard and hits [thedhimmi] on the protruberant bone beneath his ear [i.e., the mandible]…

They are not permitted to ostentatiously display their wine or church bells…their houses may not be higher than the Muslim’s, no matter how low that is. The dhimmi may not ride an elegant horse or mule; he may ride a donkey only if the saddle [-work] is of wood. He may not walk on the good part of the road. They [the dhimmis] have to wear [an identifying] patch [on their clothing], even women, and even in the [public] baths…[dhimmis] must hold their tongue…. http://www.americanthinker.com/2005/05/sufi_jihad.html Link Added

Where did you get this stuff from? Please show your source. Link.

 

[logical4u]

I am showing what the horde did, what it does and what the future holds...

Muslims are not a monolith that acts in total unison with the tenets of the Islamic religion. Discussion is pointless as long as you fail to acknowledge this obvious truth.

I believe that is the very reason for this thread... to figure out how to reach the muslims that are interested in freedom and liberty and how to reduce the number that are "misinterpreting scripture".

 

[Sky Dancer]

UNHCR | Refworld | Malaysia:

Big news. Gays are mistreated all over the world.

Sky Dancer this is more than "mistreated", gays and lesbiands are caned and imprisoned in Malaysia, a country you said you wouldn't mind going to. Thats like me as a Black man saying I wouldn't mind vacationing in Apartheid South Africa. If I were gay I wouldn't be caught dead anywhere near a Muslim country, just sayin.

First of all, I don't go to clubs. I've been married a long time and I'm modest in my behavior especially travelling in foreign lands.

Buddhism is the second largest religion in Malaysia. I would love to see some of the temples.

 

[High_Gravity]

Big news. Gays are mistreated all over the world.

Sky Dancer this is more than "mistreated", gays and lesbiands are caned and imprisoned in Malaysia, a country you said you wouldn't mind going to. Thats like me as a Black man saying I wouldn't mind vacationing in Apartheid South Africa. If I were gay I wouldn't be caught dead anywhere near a Muslim country, just sayin.

First of all, I don't go to clubs. I've been married a long time and I'm modest in my behavior especially travelling in foreign lands.

I guess if you didn't show any affection towards your lover you would be ok but still, I wouldn't feel comfortable there if I were gay. They are just not imprisoning gay who go to "clubs" though, they can arrest you if you were caught kissing your wife in a grocery store or pharmacy. I don't think you understand how Muslims in general feel about homosexuality.

 

[Sky Dancer]

I am showing what the horde did, what it does and what the future holds...

Muslims are not a monolith that acts in total unison with the tenets of the Islamic religion. Discussion is pointless as long as you fail to acknowledge this obvious truth.

I believe that is the very reason for this thread... to figure out how to reach the muslims that are interested in freedom and liberty and how to reduce the number that are "misinterpreting scripture".

Why is it you don't focus on helping violent Christians see the error of their ways? Go on a mission to Northern Ireland.

 

[Sky Dancer]

Sky Dancer this is more than "mistreated", gays and lesbiands are caned and imprisoned in Malaysia, a country you said you wouldn't mind going to. Thats like me as a Black man saying I wouldn't mind vacationing in Apartheid South Africa. If I were gay I wouldn't be caught dead anywhere near a Muslim country, just sayin.

First of all, I don't go to clubs. I've been married a long time and I'm modest in my behavior especially travelling in foreign lands.

I guess if you didn't show any affection towards your lover you would be ok but still, I wouldn't feel comfortable there if I were gay. They are just not imprisoning gay who go to "clubs" though, they can arrest you if you were caught kissing your wife in a grocery store or pharmacy. I don't think you understand how Muslims in general feel about homosexuality.

First of all, I don't kiss my wife in public here in America. What on earth makes you think I would make a display in a foreign land?

I was kicked out of a restaurant in America for holding hands across the table with a woman who was crying. Wh can't we work on our own issues?

Why is it we think we need to take over other countries?

 

[High_Gravity]

First of all, I don't go to clubs. I've been married a long time and I'm modest in my behavior especially travelling in foreign lands.

I guess if you didn't show any affection towards your lover you would be ok but still, I wouldn't feel comfortable there if I were gay. They are just not imprisoning gay who go to "clubs" though, they can arrest you if you were caught kissing your wife in a grocery store or pharmacy. I don't think you understand how Muslims in general feel about homosexuality.

First of all, I don't kiss my wife in public here in America. What on earth makes you think I would make a display in a foreign land?

How is showing your lover affection making a "display"?

 

[High_Gravity]

First of all, I don't go to clubs. I've been married a long time and I'm modest in my behavior especially travelling in foreign lands.

I guess if you didn't show any affection towards your lover you would be ok but still, I wouldn't feel comfortable there if I were gay. They are just not imprisoning gay who go to "clubs" though, they can arrest you if you were caught kissing your wife in a grocery store or pharmacy. I don't think you understand how Muslims in general feel about homosexuality.

First of all, I don't kiss my wife in public here in America. What on earth makes you think I would make a display in a foreign land?

I was kicked out of a restaurant in America for holding hands across the table with a woman who was crying. Wh can't we work on our own issues?

Why is it we think we need to take over other countries?

Who said we need to take over other countries? just because you invade a country it does not mean the people will adopt your views, look at Iraq, homosexuals are hunted and killed in the streets there for sport.

 

[High_Gravity]

Muslims are not a monolith that acts in total unison with the tenets of the Islamic religion. Discussion is pointless as long as you fail to acknowledge this obvious truth.

I believe that is the very reason for this thread... to figure out how to reach the muslims that are interested in freedom and liberty and how to reduce the number that are "misinterpreting scripture".

Why is it you don't focus on helping violent Christians see the error of their ways? Go on a mission to Northern Ireland.

How will that help? Logical going to Northern Ireland will do just as good as a moderate Muslim trying to talk to Militants in Iraq or Afghanistan.

 

[Sky Dancer]

I guess if you didn't show any affection towards your lover you would be ok but still, I wouldn't feel comfortable there if I were gay. They are just not imprisoning gay who go to "clubs" though, they can arrest you if you were caught kissing your wife in a grocery store or pharmacy. I don't think you understand how Muslims in general feel about homosexuality.

First of all, I don't kiss my wife in public here in America. What on earth makes you think I would make a display in a foreign land?

I was kicked out of a restaurant in America for holding hands across the table with a woman who was crying. Wh can't we work on our own issues?

Why is it we think we need to take over other countries?

Who said we need to take over other countries? just because you invade a country it does not mean the people will adopt your views, look at Iraq, homosexuals are hunted and killed in the streets there for sport.

Some Americans get enormous pleasure out of the fact that homosexuals are hunted and killed.

An American Christian church supported the death penalty for gays in Africa.

Why aren't we concerned about that?

 

[logical4u]

Islam does not promote totalitarian rule. Dictators use religion to control the people. They exploit sectarian differences to divide the people.

Human rights cannot happen with totalitarian rule. The religion of Islam is varied. It is NOT the problem you think it is.

THEOCRACY IS.

Let me think... what is the religion of most dictators??????? If they were following islam, it should be a utopia, right?

 

[High_Gravity]

First of all, I don't kiss my wife in public here in America. What on earth makes you think I would make a display in a foreign land?

I was kicked out of a restaurant in America for holding hands across the table with a woman who was crying. Wh can't we work on our own issues?

Why is it we think we need to take over other countries?

Who said we need to take over other countries? just because you invade a country it does not mean the people will adopt your views, look at Iraq, homosexuals are hunted and killed in the streets there for sport.

Some Americans get enormous pleasure out of the fact that homosexuals are hunted and killed.

An American Christian church supported the death penalty for gays in Africa.

Why aren't we concerned about that?

Most Americans are not supportive of the treatment of Gays in Uganda, but thats a different subject. You really can't compare the treatment of homosexuals in the US to that of Muslim countries though, thats reaching.

 

[Sky Dancer]

I believe that is the very reason for this thread... to figure out how to reach the muslims that are interested in freedom and liberty and how to reduce the number that are "misinterpreting scripture".

Why is it you don't focus on helping violent Christians see the error of their ways? Go on a mission to Northern Ireland.

How will that help? Logical going to Northern Ireland will do just as good as a moderate Muslim trying to talk to Militants in Iraq or Afghanistan.

Tell that to Logical. He/She thinks the moderates can reform Islam. Why can't Christian moderates reform Christianity?

Rather than going to war with extremists why aren't we supporting the moderate and liberal Muslims? The posters on this thread won't even attend to their existence.