All Is Well In Iraq

[Theowl32]

Seems to me that you are Monday Morning Quarterbacking now Mac. Isn't that inherently a pretty fucking weak argument?

OK, let's play your alternate history game and say that Saddam Hussein went unhindered and got his nuclear armed Baathist regime that he sought? An Arab National Socialist Islamic Caliphate from the Zagros mountains to the whole of the Levant, and growing exponentially. One diabolical socialist dictator who is also the supreme religious leader because he is a direct descendant of both Muhammad and Ali, and reincarnation Nebuchadnezzar II, the ancient king of Babylon. And in control of world oil prices because he controls OPEC.

How do you suppose that would have worked out?

That would have been bad.

But all you can do is assume and extrapolate 100% in your favor. I can look at facts that support what I was saying from the beginning: That it wouldn't be worth it.

$4 trillion plus spent, thousands of young Americans lives lost, many more thousands of young Americans bodies and minds damaged, and the Middle East remains a power keg.

Nope, not close to worth it. Just as we warned. At this cost, saying "I told you so" doesn't satisfy.
.

Do you have any proof whatsoever that the entire world would not have been destroyed in a nuclear holocaust by now if the US did not invade Iraq and depose Saddam Hussein, Mr. MMQ?

Of course you don't. That is why your pathetic argument is so fucking weak.

I have no more proof than you do. So right back atcha.

I'm sure glad I'm not like you.
.

Mac, the only thing we have is what we have learned from history about appeasing tyrants.

Hate to bring it up again, cause this is the job of the left, but the fact is this world appeased hitler when he clearly violated the resolutions of the Treaty of Versailles. Churchill shouted from the rooftops about it and Chamberlain along with Joe Kennedy (ambassador to England appointed by FDR) appeased the tyrant. As a result the League of Nations credibility was utterly destroyed and it was dissolved.

Saddam Hussein violated at least 17 resolutions. That is a fact. The UN and the world clearly acknowledged saddam had and was actively trying to get his wmd programs going. Clinton signed the Iraq Liberation Act for wmds as a result.

Our policy had clearly shifted to a proactive approach in dealing with threats after 911 and it was clear saddam was deliberately sending messages that he had every intention to keep his programs going since much of his infrastructure was in tact.

You have the luxury of claiming saddam would not have done anything since he is not around to prove you wrong. You have that luxury of spewing stuff out since you really don't have access to top secret information.

It's repeating again and the peaceniks get to be the big admirable people. Singing peace songs and holding hands across America and around the world. Meanwhile what we do know is the persons you are crying about are tyrants and are proven murderers.

Pretty ignorant on your part.

We can squabble about our wars in the ME all we want. I didn't think it would be worth it, and after $4 trillion and all the American lives and limbs and minds lost, I know I was right.

But as I've said, the interesting part to me is that the very same Trumpsters who were so anti-war JUST LAST WEEK, so angry at the neocons, are now back to pushing and giving excuses for war.

That's my point, and it's hard to miss.
.

Nothing but bumper sticker tripe and ad hominem attacks.

You are either ignorant or deliberately ignorant which is different.

 

[Desperado]

'
So again I will keep asking....Why are we still in Iraq??

Simply to make money for the military suppliers....
There is no other logical explanation.

 

[Theowl32]

Seems to me that you are Monday Morning Quarterbacking now Mac. Isn't that inherently a pretty fucking weak argument?

OK, let's play your alternate history game and say that Saddam Hussein went unhindered and got his nuclear armed Baathist regime that he sought? An Arab National Socialist Islamic Caliphate from the Zagros mountains to the whole of the Levant, and growing exponentially. One diabolical socialist dictator who is also the supreme religious leader because he is a direct descendant of both Muhammad and Ali, and reincarnation Nebuchadnezzar II, the ancient king of Babylon. And in control of world oil prices because he controls OPEC.

How do you suppose that would have worked out?

That would have been bad.

But all you can do is assume and extrapolate 100% in your favor. I can look at facts that support what I was saying from the beginning: That it wouldn't be worth it.

$4 trillion plus spent, thousands of young Americans lives lost, many more thousands of young Americans bodies and minds damaged, and the Middle East remains a power keg.

Nope, not close to worth it. Just as we warned. At this cost, saying "I told you so" doesn't satisfy.
.

Do you have any proof whatsoever that the entire world would not have been destroyed in a nuclear holocaust by now if the US did not invade Iraq and depose Saddam Hussein, Mr. MMQ?

Of course you don't. That is why your pathetic argument is so fucking weak.

I have no more proof than you do. So right back atcha.

I'm sure glad I'm not like you.
.

Mac, the only thing we have is what we have learned from history about appeasing tyrants.

Hate to bring it up again, cause this is the job of the left, but the fact is this world appeased hitler when he clearly violated the resolutions of the Treaty of Versailles. Churchill shouted from the rooftops about it and Chamberlain along with Joe Kennedy (ambassador to England appointed by FDR) appeased the tyrant. As a result the League of Nations credibility was utterly destroyed and it was dissolved.

Saddam Hussein violated at least 17 resolutions. That is a fact. The UN and the world clearly acknowledged saddam had and was actively trying to get his wmd programs going. Clinton signed the Iraq Liberation Act for wmds as a result.

Our policy had clearly shifted to a proactive approach in dealing with threats after 911 and it was clear saddam was deliberately sending messages that he had every intention to keep his programs going since much of his infrastructure was in tact.

You have the luxury of claiming saddam would not have done anything since he is not around to prove you wrong. You have that luxury of spewing stuff out since you really don't have access to top secret information.

It's repeating again and the peaceniks get to be the big admirable people. Singing peace songs and holding hands across America and around the world. Meanwhile what we do know is the persons you are crying about are tyrants and are proven murderers.

Pretty ignorant on your part.

We can squabble about our wars in the ME all we want. I didn't think it would be worth it, and after $4 trillion and all the American lives and limbs and minds lost, I know I was right.

But as I've said, the interesting part to me is that the very same Trumpsters who were so anti-war JUST LAST WEEK, so angry at the neocons, are now back to pushing and giving excuses for war.

That's my point, and it's hard to miss.
.

Who is pro war?

 

[Lipush]

I wonder if the quiet is due to Iran realizing it's not good to furtherly escalate things, or just because of the horrible weather.

 

[Muhammed]

It's odd this time because at least during the run up to the Iraq War -- this forum wasn't around -- so its easy for these Trumpers to pretend they were against Bush and the Iraq war the whole time....

Now we have receipts...and these people are clearly showing you that they were sycophants for Bush like they are sycophants for Trump..

View attachment 299068


Literally the first time I started seeing this thing called "memes" -- it was during the Iraq war...and they were memes of Bush -- being called a tough guy, a protector -- basically the same shit I see trumpers saying right now about Trump...this is why memory is kryptonite to a Trumper...

I joined USMB several years back, and the best excuse they gave me for Bush's wars was that Congress approved them. They completely ignored the fact he was CIC and that it was his final decision, as was the scale and scope.

That weak of an argument tells you they're flailing. I hope this doesn't happen again.
.

Seems to me that you are Monday Morning Quarterbacking now Mac. Isn't that inherently a pretty fucking weak argument?

OK, let's play your alternate history game and say that Saddam Hussein went unhindered and got his nuclear armed Baathist regime that he sought? An Arab National Socialist Islamic Caliphate from the Zagros mountains to the whole of the Levant, and growing exponentially. One diabolical socialist dictator who is also the supreme religious leader because he is a direct descendant of both Muhammad and Ali, and reincarnation Nebuchadnezzar II, the ancient king of Babylon. And in control of world oil prices because he controls OPEC.

How do you suppose that would have worked out?

That would have been bad.

But all you can do is assume and extrapolate 100% in your favor. I can look at facts that support what I was saying from the beginning: That it wouldn't be worth it.

$4 trillion plus spent, thousands of young Americans lives lost, many more thousands of young Americans bodies and minds damaged, and the Middle East remains a power keg.

Nope, not close to worth it. Just as we warned. At this cost, saying "I told you so" doesn't satisfy.
.

Do you have any proof whatsoever that the entire world would not have been destroyed in a nuclear holocaust by now if the US did not invade Iraq and depose Saddam Hussein, Mr. MMQ?

Of course you don't. That is why your pathetic argument is so fucking weak.

I have no more proof than you do. So right back atcha.

I'm sure glad I'm not like you.
.

My sentiments exactly.

 

[Papageorgio]

We need to leave the Middle East and let them kill each other off. Those nuts over there have been fighting each other for centuries and there is no damn way anyone including us will bring peace to that region. We need to bring our troops home and save American lives. We also need to bring home troops from all over the world, quit policing the world and send troops and resources into our inner cities and fix America.

 

[Muhammed]

So again I will keep asking....Why are we still in Iraq??

for the same reason we went in the 1st place.....~S~

To enforce the clinton policy of liberating Iraq for wmds?

Hans Blix and his team of weapons inspectors checked 700 sites in Iraq and found no WMDs but Gomer and Cheney invaded anyway.
Give up the silly Clinton remarks. He did not invade Iraq. It was Gomer who murdered our troops.
The Prosecution of George W. Bush for Murder - Wikipedia

Bullshit.

Unlike you I am sort of a bookworm and have read Disarming Iraq, the book authored by Hanz Blix regarding this subject. Of course he found WMD in Iraq you fucking dumbass. Blix would have never went there with his team in the first place if there was no WMD in Iraq to inspect you fucking stupid ignorant fool.

You are just a fucking feeble-minded, easily brainwashed by MSM via repeated messaging dumbass.

Oh, BTW, did I mention that you're an ignorant dumbass wikidiot?

 

[Biff_Poindexter]

So again I will keep asking....Why are we still in Iraq??

for the same reason we went in the 1st place.....~S~

To enforce the clinton policy of liberating Iraq for wmds?

when did Clinton invade Iraq??

And why would something Clinton wanted be any justification for why Trumpers nearly 20 years later continue to hang on to this need to remain in Iraq for another 20 years??

 

[Biff_Poindexter]

We need to leave the Middle East and let them kill each other off. Those nuts over there have been fighting each other for centuries and there is no damn way anyone including us will bring peace to that region. We need to bring our troops home and save American lives. We also need to bring home troops from all over the world, quit policing the world and send troops and resources into our inner cities and fix America.

Troops are no more equipped to fix American cities as they are equipped to fix cities in the middle east ..

We need to stop this idea that simply throwing troops at something will always fix the problem....that is not their job....

 

[Theowl32]

So again I will keep asking....Why are we still in Iraq??

for the same reason we went in the 1st place.....~S~

To enforce the clinton policy of liberating Iraq for wmds?

when did Clinton invade Iraq??

And why would something Clinton wanted be any justification for why Trumpers nearly 20 years later continue to hang on to this need to remain in Iraq for another 20 years??

You are ignorant about logistics and have no grasp on reality.

 

[Papageorgio]

We need to leave the Middle East and let them kill each other off. Those nuts over there have been fighting each other for centuries and there is no damn way anyone including us will bring peace to that region. We need to bring our troops home and save American lives. We also need to bring home troops from all over the world, quit policing the world and send troops and resources into our inner cities and fix America.

Troops are no more equipped to fix American cities as they are equipped to fix cities in the middle east ..

We need to stop this idea that simply throwing troops at something will always fix the problem....that is not their job....

That's why I added resources.

 

[Biff_Poindexter]

So again I will keep asking....Why are we still in Iraq??

for the same reason we went in the 1st place.....~S~

To enforce the clinton policy of liberating Iraq for wmds?

Hans Blix and his team of weapons inspectors checked 700 sites in Iraq and found no WMDs but Gomer and Cheney invaded anyway.
Give up the silly Clinton remarks. He did not invade Iraq. It was Gomer who murdered our troops.
The Prosecution of George W. Bush for Murder - Wikipedia

Bullshit.

Unlike you I am sort of a bookworm and have read Disarming Iraq, the book authored by Hanz Blix regarding this subject. Of course he found WMD in Iraq you fucking dumbass. Blix would have never went there with his team in the first place if there was no WMD in Iraq to inspect you fucking stupid ignorant fool.

You are just a fucking feeble-minded, easily brainwashed by MSM repeted messagingdumbass.

Oh, BTW, did I mention that you're an ignorant dumbass wikidiot?

North Korea has ACTUAL WMD's

Why haven't we invaded them yet??

In fact, what Trump did was spend money on fancy new coins for him and his new boo...then claimed him and this guy fell in love over love letters.....


It's almost like we DON'T INVADE countries that we KNOW have nukes and then INVADE other countries we know DOES NOT have nukes...funny how that works

 

[MisterBeale]

So again I will keep asking....Why are we still in Iraq??

for the same reason we went in the 1st place.....~S~

To enforce the clinton policy of liberating Iraq for wmds?

Hans Blix and his team of weapons inspectors checked 700 sites in Iraq and found no WMDs but Gomer and Cheney invaded anyway.
Give up the silly Clinton remarks. He did not invade Iraq. It was Gomer who murdered our troops.
The Prosecution of George W. Bush for Murder - Wikipedia

Bullshit.

Unlike you I am sort of a bookworm and have read Disarming Iraq, the book authored by Hanz Blix regarding this subject. Of course he found WMD in Iraq you fucking dumbass. Blix would have never went there with his team in the first place if there was no WMD in Iraq to inspect you fucking stupid ignorant fool.

You are just a fucking feeble-minded, easily brainwashed by MSM repeted messagingdumbass.

Oh, BTW, did I mention that you're an ignorant dumbass wikidiot?

That's a crap lie.

They found insignificant evidence before their work was cut short for political reasons and YOU KNOW IT.


U.N. weapons inspector Hans Blix faults Bush administration for lack of "critical thinking" in Iraq
U.N. weapons inspector Hans Blix faults Bush Administration for lack of "critical thinking" in Iraq
"There were about 700 inspections, and in no case did we find weapons of mass destruction," said Hans Blix, the Swedish diplomat called out of retirement to serve as the United Nations' chief weapons inspector from 2000 to 2003; from 1981 to 1997 he headed the International Atomic Energy Agency. "We went to sites [in Iraq] given to us by intelligence, and only in three cases did we find something" - a stash of nuclear documents, some Vulcan boosters, and several empty warheads for chemical weapons. More inspections were required to determine whether these findings were the "tip of the iceberg" or simply fragments remaining from that deadly iceberg's past destruction, Blix said he told the United Nations Security Council. However, his work in Iraq was cut short when the United States and the United Kingdom took disarmament into their own hands in March of last year.


Blix accused U.S. President George W. Bush and U.K. Prime Minister Tony Blair of acting not in bad faith, but with a severe lack of "critical thinking." The United States and Britain failed to examine the sources of their primary intelligence - Iraqi defectors with their own agendas for encouraging regime change - with a skeptical eye, he alleged. In the buildup to the war, Saddam Hussein and the Iraqis were cooperating with U.N. inspections, and in February 2003 had provided Blix's team with the names of hundreds of scientists to interview, individuals Saddam claimed had been involved in the destruction of banned weapons. Had the inspections been allowed to continue, Blix said, there would likely be a very different situation in Iraq today. As it was, America's pre-emptive, unilateral actions "have bred more terrorism there and elsewhere."

 

[Muhammed]

So again I will keep asking....Why are we still in Iraq??

for the same reason we went in the 1st place.....~S~

To enforce the clinton policy of liberating Iraq for wmds?

Hans Blix and his team of weapons inspectors checked 700 sites in Iraq and found no WMDs but Gomer and Cheney invaded anyway.
Give up the silly Clinton remarks. He did not invade Iraq. It was Gomer who murdered our troops.
The Prosecution of George W. Bush for Murder - Wikipedia

Bullshit.

Unlike you I am sort of a bookworm and have read Disarming Iraq, the book authored by Hanz Blix regarding this subject. Of course he found WMD in Iraq you fucking dumbass. Blix would have never went there with his team in the first place if there was no WMD in Iraq to inspect you fucking stupid ignorant fool.

You are just a fucking feeble-minded, easily brainwashed by MSM repeted messagingdumbass.

Oh, BTW, did I mention that you're an ignorant dumbass wikidiot?

That's a crap lie.

They found insignificant evidence before their work was cut short for political reasons and YOU KNOW IT.


U.N. weapons inspector Hans Blix faults Bush administration for lack of "critical thinking" in Iraq
U.N. weapons inspector Hans Blix faults Bush Administration for lack of "critical thinking" in Iraq
"There were about 700 inspections, and in no case did we find weapons of mass destruction," said Hans Blix, the Swedish diplomat called out of retirement to serve as the United Nations' chief weapons inspector from 2000 to 2003; from 1981 to 1997 he headed the International Atomic Energy Agency. "We went to sites [in Iraq] given to us by intelligence, and only in three cases did we find something" - a stash of nuclear documents, some Vulcan boosters, and several empty warheads for chemical weapons. More inspections were required to determine whether these findings were the "tip of the iceberg" or simply fragments remaining from that deadly iceberg's past destruction, Blix said he told the United Nations Security Council. However, his work in Iraq was cut short when the United States and the United Kingdom took disarmament into their own hands in March of last year.


Blix accused U.S. President George W. Bush and U.K. Prime Minister Tony Blair of acting not in bad faith, but with a severe lack of "critical thinking." The United States and Britain failed to examine the sources of their primary intelligence - Iraqi defectors with their own agendas for encouraging regime change - with a skeptical eye, he alleged. In the buildup to the war, Saddam Hussein and the Iraqis were cooperating with U.N. inspections, and in February 2003 had provided Blix's team with the names of hundreds of scientists to interview, individuals Saddam claimed had been involved in the destruction of banned weapons. Had the inspections been allowed to continue, Blix said, there would likely be a very different situation in Iraq today. As it was, America's pre-emptive, unilateral actions "have bred more terrorism there and elsewhere."

Nice out of context bullshit. And even in that tiny excerpt Blix tells about the WMD evidence he still found after all those years.

Go to a library you ignorant wikidiot.

 

[Biff_Poindexter]

So again I will keep asking....Why are we still in Iraq??

for the same reason we went in the 1st place.....~S~

To enforce the clinton policy of liberating Iraq for wmds?

when did Clinton invade Iraq??

And why would something Clinton wanted be any justification for why Trumpers nearly 20 years later continue to hang on to this need to remain in Iraq for another 20 years??

You are ignorant about logistics and have no grasp on reality.

Still waiting for you tell me why we are still there after nearly 20 years

There is a reason that you can't -- and it aint because of logistics you pussy

 

[Biff_Poindexter]

We need to leave the Middle East and let them kill each other off. Those nuts over there have been fighting each other for centuries and there is no damn way anyone including us will bring peace to that region. We need to bring our troops home and save American lives. We also need to bring home troops from all over the world, quit policing the world and send troops and resources into our inner cities and fix America.

Troops are no more equipped to fix American cities as they are equipped to fix cities in the middle east ..

We need to stop this idea that simply throwing troops at something will always fix the problem....that is not their job....

That's why I added resources.

Resources is enough...

 

[Papageorgio]

We need to leave the Middle East and let them kill each other off. Those nuts over there have been fighting each other for centuries and there is no damn way anyone including us will bring peace to that region. We need to bring our troops home and save American lives. We also need to bring home troops from all over the world, quit policing the world and send troops and resources into our inner cities and fix America.

Troops are no more equipped to fix American cities as they are equipped to fix cities in the middle east ..

We need to stop this idea that simply throwing troops at something will always fix the problem....that is not their job....

That's why I added resources.

Resources is enough...

Maybe.

 

[2aguy]

This is the basis of why I find it all so interesting. I've done a lot of reading on the subconscious and the psychology of partisanship, started many threads on it. Virtually everything I have read about he we allow our minds to be influenced and even controlled by outside stimuli is evident in group ideology.

I obviously can't do anything about it, but at least I understand it a bit more.
.

It appears to be party over principle.

Sure, that's one of its strongest (and most destructive) manifestations.
.

My guess is had the Ayatollah not shown restraint and instead killed Americans, Trump would have mass murdered untold numbers of Iranians, and his supporters would back the massacre completely and be proud of it.

You shouldn't hit the booze this early in the morning.....you know you can't mix booze with your meds...right?

If they had killed Americans, what would YOU want Dumb Don to do today?

They didn't, did they.....all you freaking left wing, democrat party, Iranian mullah and terrorist sympathizers were completely wrong.....

We were completely right......you are an idiot........

What would he do....I don't know, but I trust him to do whatever it is........you moron...

 

[Muhammed]

So again I will keep asking....Why are we still in Iraq??

for the same reason we went in the 1st place.....~S~

To enforce the clinton policy of liberating Iraq for wmds?

when did Clinton invade Iraq??

Just off the top of my head, and while certainly not a complete anthology, Operation Provide Comfort (1991-1996) Operation Northern Watch (1996-2003) Operation Desert Strike (1996) Operation Desert Fox (1998) Operation Southern Watch (1992-2003) immediately comes to mind.

Yep, the MSM narrative that Bush43 started a war with Iraq was nothing but fake news. He inherited the war from Clinton. Clinton bombed the hell out of radar sites in Baghdad less than a week before Bush43 was inaugurated. IIRC, actually the Iraq war had been steadily escalating since 1998 when Bush43 took office in 2001.

Does that really surprise you?

 

[MisterBeale]

for the same reason we went in the 1st place.....~S~

To enforce the clinton policy of liberating Iraq for wmds?

Hans Blix and his team of weapons inspectors checked 700 sites in Iraq and found no WMDs but Gomer and Cheney invaded anyway.
Give up the silly Clinton remarks. He did not invade Iraq. It was Gomer who murdered our troops.
The Prosecution of George W. Bush for Murder - Wikipedia

Bullshit.

Unlike you I am sort of a bookworm and have read Disarming Iraq, the book authored by Hanz Blix regarding this subject. Of course he found WMD in Iraq you fucking dumbass. Blix would have never went there with his team in the first place if there was no WMD in Iraq to inspect you fucking stupid ignorant fool.

You are just a fucking feeble-minded, easily brainwashed by MSM repeted messagingdumbass.

Oh, BTW, did I mention that you're an ignorant dumbass wikidiot?

That's a crap lie.

They found insignificant evidence before their work was cut short for political reasons and YOU KNOW IT.


U.N. weapons inspector Hans Blix faults Bush administration for lack of "critical thinking" in Iraq
U.N. weapons inspector Hans Blix faults Bush Administration for lack of "critical thinking" in Iraq
"There were about 700 inspections, and in no case did we find weapons of mass destruction," said Hans Blix, the Swedish diplomat called out of retirement to serve as the United Nations' chief weapons inspector from 2000 to 2003; from 1981 to 1997 he headed the International Atomic Energy Agency. "We went to sites [in Iraq] given to us by intelligence, and only in three cases did we find something" - a stash of nuclear documents, some Vulcan boosters, and several empty warheads for chemical weapons. More inspections were required to determine whether these findings were the "tip of the iceberg" or simply fragments remaining from that deadly iceberg's past destruction, Blix said he told the United Nations Security Council. However, his work in Iraq was cut short when the United States and the United Kingdom took disarmament into their own hands in March of last year.


Blix accused U.S. President George W. Bush and U.K. Prime Minister Tony Blair of acting not in bad faith, but with a severe lack of "critical thinking." The United States and Britain failed to examine the sources of their primary intelligence - Iraqi defectors with their own agendas for encouraging regime change - with a skeptical eye, he alleged. In the buildup to the war, Saddam Hussein and the Iraqis were cooperating with U.N. inspections, and in February 2003 had provided Blix's team with the names of hundreds of scientists to interview, individuals Saddam claimed had been involved in the destruction of banned weapons. Had the inspections been allowed to continue, Blix said, there would likely be a very different situation in Iraq today. As it was, America's pre-emptive, unilateral actions "have bred more terrorism there and elsewhere."

Nice out of context bullshit. And even in that tiny excerpt Blix tells about the WMD evidence he still found after all those years.

Go to a library you ignorant wikidiot.