Americans vs. Government

[boedicca]

And, Right On, PC .... excellent posting as usual.

 

[NYcarbineer]

What a moron. Willa Cather was a wonderful writer who is appreciated by many people of all political views.

Oh of course, and conservatives everywhere have great admiration for Jackie Robinson, although the conservative consensus is that a restaurant shouldn't have to serve him breakfast if they don't like the colored people.

 

[boedicca]

The concept of America versus the government is ridiculous. Our government, thanks to the founders, is made up of We the People.

You really haven't been paying much attention to the nature of the Federal Government and its ever encroaching regulatory and military reach within the U.S.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Oh really? Then I guess you brought her up in your first post in order to deflect from the topic of your thread?

lol, that's a good one even for you. Usually you wait a few posts before you change the subject of your own threads.

As usual, your modus operandi alternates between outright lies, to an attempt to change he subject.

The subject, halfhead, is the conditions faced and accepted by the people who built this nation.

And what the thread will conclude is that big government not only ignores what people have endured, but how Liberal tactics squeeze every drop of what they created away from them.

 

[boedicca]

NYC, who hails from the Part of Embracing Diversity can't grok the concept that anyone actually does admire someone who isn't exactly line him or herself.

 

[NYcarbineer]

NYC, who hails from the Part of Embracing Diversity can't grok the concept that anyone actually does admire someone who isn't exactly line him or herself.

You mean like in the way PC admires the racist lawbreaker Clive Bundy because he looks cool in a cowboy hat?

 

[PoliticalChic]

You mean like in the way PC admires the racist lawbreaker Clive Bundy because he looks cool in a cowboy hat?

"...racist lawbreaker...."

Not all laws are equal, ask Dred Scott

 

[PoliticalChic]

You really haven't been paying much attention to the nature of the Federal Government and its ever encroaching regulatory and military reach within the U.S.

Absolutely!


Big government is the enemy of private property rights, and is the tool of communism, socialism, Liberalism, Progressivism, etc.


Not only does big government control regulation, disguised in all sorts of 'saving the world' language.....but it twists language to it's own use.

Case in point: 'environmentalism.'


12. Modern environmentalism is, and I mean this in the kindest way, a bastardization of the conservation of the Progressive Era. Today’s devotees are a random mix of a) the pagan religion of Gaia worship, b) folks who believe that human beings are a virus that must be eradicated from the land, c) the ignorant and easily led, and…a very strong influence of the NeoMarxist Frankfurt School.


a. To understand the change in the movement from its earliest days requires a look at Teddy Roosevelt’s efforts. History Professor Andrew Fisher recently lectured on same via American History TV, C-Span 3, [ Lectures in History: Conservation & the Progressive Era | C-SPAN]


b. Teddy Roosevelt, icon of conservation, along with his ideological soul-mate, Gifford Pinchot, head of the Division of Forestry (later the Forest Service), strongly believed in the preservation of forest lands. Their view of conservation saw waste as the problem…..not people. “He was a progressive who strongly believed in theefficiency movement. The most economically efficient use of natural resources was his goal; waste was his great enemy.” Gifford Pinchot - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


c. TR and Pinchot did not intend to set aside forests for perpetual pristine preservation. Their conservation was anthropocentric, a very different concept from modern environmentalists. No, their aim was to set aside resources for future development, for profit, and for the benefit of the many: “The greatest good, for the greatest number, for the longest time” (the Utilitarianism of Jeremy Bentham). The TR/Pinchot plan was for the preserves to be multiple use forests: for logging, for grazing, for mining and for recreation. The saw that efficient use is a way to maintain America’s position in the world.


d. While John Muir fought against dams in Yosemite, TR and Pinchot felt that San Francisco’s need for water took precedence.

“With the creation of the National Forest Service within the Department of Agriculture, and with Pinchot as its first director, his view prevailed in Washington: forests would be treated like a crop, not a temple. Pinchot prevailed again when he persuadedPresident Theodore Rooseveltto allow the construction of the Hetch Hetchy dam inYosemite, despite Muir's vociferous objections.” The National Parks: America's Best Idea: Historical Figures | PBS

 

[NYcarbineer]

And we can thank our conservative, Christian founders for fighting and dying so that "we the people" can enjoy our freedom, liberty, and personal rights.

The conservatives were the Loyalists, the Confederacy, and the Conservative Coalition that fought against civil rights, among others.

 

[NYcarbineer]

1


What sort of homage did the government pay to the progeny of those settlers?

The government gave them the statehood they desired. The government let them become part of the government, which is what they wanted.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Willa Cather was a lesbian. Your conservative pals consider her a pervert, not an American.

Way to miss the point, oh vapid one

 

[thereisnospoon]

The concept of America versus the government is ridiculous. Our government, thanks to the founders, is made up of We the People.

One would like ot believe that. Even political candidates running for Congress the first time.
Then they get elected. Then they are introduced to "how we do things up here"....

 

[NYcarbineer]

Way to miss the point, oh vapid one

You missed my point.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Conservatives wouldn't give Willa Cather her full rights and privileges as an American and conservatives would want the GOVERNMENT to assure she wouldn't get them.

I guess that's the distinction between Americans vs. GOVERNMENT that the author of this thread is accidentally pointing out.

Wow..Just wow.
Look, if you have nothing to add to the discussion, put a sock in it.

 

[thereisnospoon]

You missed my point.

You made no point.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Let me remind the readers that PC never pointed out the sexual orientation of the person. In fact, PC held her up as a fine example of what Americans USED to be.

The problem is that people like NYCarbineer can't see past sexual orientation.

No, NY Carb cannot see past the narrow views of his ideology.

 

[M.D. Rawlings]

Willa Cather was a lesbian. Your conservative pals consider her a pervert, not an American.

Ignore.

 

[bendog]

What a moron. Willa Cather was a wonderful writer who is appreciated by many people of all political views.

I admit I see as little nexis between the OP's "connection" between Nebraska settlers and govt as I do between Cather's work and her sexuality. That said, Cather's hard for me, because her stuff moves slowly. My mother, who grew up in Nebraska a generation after Cather did, was a fan.

 

[boedicca]

I admit I see as little nexis between the OP's "connection" between Nebraska settlers and govt as I do between Cather's work and her sexuality. That said, Cather's hard for me, because her stuff moves slowly. My mother, who grew up in Nebraska a generation after Cather did, was a fan.

Her style is a matter of taste. It's a more leisurely narrative than is found in modern fiction - I prefer it.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Right!! The Federal Government was established and ratified by the states. We find ourselves in a different circumstance today.....Our Constitution gives us a way out.....brownie points to anyone who can cite said way out....

Today, the Federal Government reigns over us all, and in very big and growing ways. We have lost something very, very important to humanity along this dangerous, progressive path.

"We have lost something very, very important to humanity along this dangerous, progressive path."

So very true.

At the founding of this nation, people were important. That is still the case for conservatives, classical Liberals.


Now, with modern Liberals in the ascendency, that is not the case. Power is important, useful for mandates, banning, and regulating. The precursors of this political view slaughtered over 100 million during the last century: people are not allowed to stand in the way of government!


At the heart of it, 'environmentalism,' aptly described as 'the Watermelon Movement- green on the outside, red on the inside,' is camouflage for government co-opting of private property.


Need proof environmentalism is a scam and a fraud? The Spotted Owl.


13. TheSpotted Owl(Strix occidentalis) is a species of true owl. It is a resident species of old-growth forests in western North America, where it nests in tree holes, old bird of prey nests, or rock crevices….TheInternational Union for Conservation of Nature(IUCN) Red list status for the Spotted Owl is Near Threatened with a decreasing population trend…..In February 2008, a federal judge reinforced aU.S. Fish and Wildlife Service decision to designate 8,600,000 acres (35,000 km2) in Arizona, Utah, Colorado and New Mexico as critical habitat for the owl. Spotted owl - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


a. Ten years of research and more than 1,000 published studies detail the threats to its survival, but there's still no sure way to stop its decline. Saving the Spotted Owl : NPR





14. What is the cost of ‘saving’ the bird, and what’s the reason? Have organism’s become extinct? And the result?
“From the environmentalists' perspective, the benefits of preserving the northern spotted owl and its habitat far outweigh any of the costs….society ought to preserve this species and the unique ecosystem it represents because of their aesthetic value."
Ethics and the Environment: The Spotted Owl Controversy

"...far outweigh any of the costs...' to people living and using the land.



a. The Spotted Owl campaign, as is so very many other environmental campaigns, a deceit. It is a way of advancing the real agenda, confiscating property, making land off-limit, and eliminating any human presence. No matter the cost. No matter the result.

Liberalism.....thirsts for power.



b. “Look, I don’t doubt that the regulatory processed that we put in place to produce the environmental goods that we wan have taken a toll on the economy generally and the rural economy in particular. Telling the story that rural communities are being harmed may tug at the heartstrings of rural people, but no one else will care.

c. You see, what the sage grouse is about is, they want to stop drilling in beautiful Wyoming. That’s the hidden agenda….Take the spotted owl case….One of the people instrumental in shutting down the forests told me that ‘if the spotted owl hadn’t existed, we would have had to invent it.’ The goal was to stop logging….It is totally questionable whether owls were endangered by logging. Was it good for the overall health of the forest? Probably not.
Was it good for the spotted owl? It probably didn’t make a difference. Did it hurt the overall economies of the West? Yes.”
Nickson, “Eco-Fascists,” p.129.


It's a scam....a fraud....a lie.
And that is how Liberalism operates.

15. “The spotted owl was dying anyway. First of all, its prey was being eaten by the larger barred owl, which had been moving west for the last hundred years, but its supposed natural habitat was dying. In eastern Oregon and Washington’s Blue Mountain forests. 6 million acres are dead and dying. The Shasta-Trinity National Forest- formally designated spotted owl habitat- has so much root rot that it is called the Valley of Death. One breeding pair remains.”
Nickson, Op. Cit., p.131.


Yet, somehow, this is a higher value than the people who live and work in these areas.