America's most hated woman prior to Pelosi.

[Lastamender]

Sorry you had friends die...but why did you go to a foreign land, invading it, killing its people?

To contain Communism. As we can see it did not work.

 

[9thIDdoc]

The problem here is that one person's enemy might not be someone else's enemy.

A lot of people felt the Vietnam should not be the US's enemy.

The Vietnamese were only killing US soldiers who were literally invading their country. They weren't killing US people in the US.

The Vietnamese were only killing US soldiers who were literally invading their country. They weren't killing US people in the US.

The problem here is that one person's enemy might not be someone else's enemy.

One person does not decide for the Nation who is friend and who is foe just like no single person has the right to decide when or against whom our Nation will wage war.

A lot of people felt the Vietnam should not be the US's enemy.

The fact is that "Vietnam" was never our enemy. Those who attacked and killed our soldiers as well as those of friends and allies became our enemies and rightly so. That was North Vietnam and other Communist sympathizers.

The Vietnamese were only killing US soldiers who were literally invading their country. They weren't killing US people in the US.

ONLY??!! US soldiers did NOT invade North Vietnam even though they gave us more than sufficient cause to do so.
Are you trying to claim that enemies should be allowed to kill US citizens as long as those citizens are also soldiers? Soldiers aren't important like you civilians are? How bigoted.

And if you think an American going to Vietnam and having their photo taken with "the enemy" is treason, then surely Americans at home killing US military personnel, killing 140,000 US military personnel, is also treason.

Obviously both would be true if the person in the later instance were American. I suspect you may have some "apples and oranges" example in mind.
Fonda also organized food and blood drives for the enemy as well as using her celebrity in aid of their propaganda.

 

[frigidweirdo]

The problem here is that one person's enemy might not be someone else's enemy.

One person does not decide for the Nation who is friend and who is foe just like no single person has the right to decide when or against whom our Nation will wage war.

A lot of people felt the Vietnam should not be the US's enemy.

The fact is that "Vietnam" was never our enemy. Those who attacked and killed our soldiers as well as those of friends and allies became our enemies and rightly so. That was North Vietnam and other Communist sympathizers.

The Vietnamese were only killing US soldiers who were literally invading their country. They weren't killing US people in the US.

ONLY??!! US soldiers did NOT invade North Vietnam even though they gave us more than sufficient cause to do so.
Are you trying to claim that enemies should be allowed to kill US citizens as long as those citizens are also soldiers? Soldiers aren't important like you civilians are? How bigoted.

And if you think an American going to Vietnam and having their photo taken with "the enemy" is treason, then surely Americans at home killing US military personnel, killing 140,000 US military personnel, is also treason.

Obviously both would be true if the person in the later instance were American. I suspect you may have some "apples and oranges" example in mind.
Fonda also organized food and blood drives for the enemy as well as using her celebrity in aid of their propaganda.

Well, one person does, actually.

And when it's the rich people deciding that people are "the enemy" because it suits the rich people, and not the poor people, then you know there's a problem.

Iraq became the "enemy" because it had oil. Libya became the "enemy" because it had oil. Iran became the "enemy" because it had oil.

Think about it. Who's benefiting from this?

 

[Rigby5]

She sat on a North anti aircraft gun saying "I wish I had one of those suckers in my sight right now". sucker being a US Airman A truly respected democRat that should rotted from the tree with John Kerry and Walter Cronkite long long ago Pelosi and her have two things in common, both low IQed democRats and both will be sporting a beard after their next face lift.

Wrong.
She was photographed sitting on a seat, but that is all.
There was no one there to quote her saying anything like that.
But if I were there, I most certainly would have try to shoot down those illegal US planes committing war crime by attacking civilian targets in a country they had no right to even be in .
Those pilots were not ignorant draftees, but educated people who knew better and were deliberating murdering innocent people.

 

[Rigby5]

Bullshit. The only personal liberties you are willing to consider are your own and that of those who agree with your incredibly ignorant opinions. The stupidity of claiming North Vietnam was in any way in favor of personal liberty is simply mind boggling. North Vietnam was intent on invading and enslaving South Vietnam and that is exactly what they did with the aid of folks like you who are unwilling to tolerate personal liberty.

Wrong.
It is obvious almost everyone in Vietnam wanted us out.
It was only the wealthy, who had gained that wealth by collaborating with the Japanese and the French, who did not want Ho Chi Minh to win.

 

[Rigby5]

If you actually believed that idiocy how could you ever condone the North Vietnamese murder of so many innocent South Vietnamese? You-in your infinite wisdom- are the only correct definer of innocence? I don't think so.

It was the US doing almost all the murdering.

 

[Rigby5]

Those were not illegal actions. The war was a righteous legal war started By minh who also seized power in a coup and then attacked another nation.

Wrong.
Ho Chi Minh was wildly popular, and he gained that by defeating the French and driving them out.
There were never suppose to be 2 countries, but instead an nation wide plebiscite in 1955, to decide who was to be the new ruler.
But Diem perpetrated an illegal military coup to prevent those elections, with the aid of the US.
The US illegally tried to create South Vietnam as a separate country, and that was against the Geneva peace accord between the Vietnamese and the French.

 

[DrLove]

That was almost 50 years ago. Carry a grudge much?

 

[Rigby5]

Quite wrong. Minh was a bloodthirsty dictator and most wanted help from his war of aggression. Fonda was in the wrong

That is just silly.
How could Ho Chi Minh have defeated the French without the backing of all the Vietnamese.
He was wildly popular in the south and north equally.

If he was a dictator, then why not just allow the elections in 1955?
Why did the US and Diem have to prevent those elections?

 

[Rigby5]

Orders were illegal?

Orders to even go to Vietnam were illegal.
The US was bound by the UN charter after it was ratified by Congress, and the Vietnamese and French had reached a Geneva Peace Accord that then bound the US to not interfere.
The US has no jurisdiction to be there.
Diem was not the legal representative of South Vietnam, and had taken over illegal by military coup.
He had no legal authority to invite the US in.

 

[Rigby5]

The problem here is that one person's enemy might not be someone else's enemy.

One person does not decide for the Nation who is friend and who is foe just like no single person has the right to decide when or against whom our Nation will wage war.

A lot of people felt the Vietnam should not be the US's enemy.

The fact is that "Vietnam" was never our enemy. Those who attacked and killed our soldiers as well as those of friends and allies became our enemies and rightly so. That was North Vietnam and other Communist sympathizers.

The Vietnamese were only killing US soldiers who were literally invading their country. They weren't killing US people in the US.

ONLY??!! US soldiers did NOT invade North Vietnam even though they gave us more than sufficient cause to do so.
Are you trying to claim that enemies should be allowed to kill US citizens as long as those citizens are also soldiers? Soldiers aren't important like you civilians are? How bigoted.

And if you think an American going to Vietnam and having their photo taken with "the enemy" is treason, then surely Americans at home killing US military personnel, killing 140,000 US military personnel, is also treason.

Obviously both would be true if the person in the later instance were American. I suspect you may have some "apples and oranges" example in mind.
Fonda also organized food and blood drives for the enemy as well as using her celebrity in aid of their propaganda.

The US soldiers in Vietnam were there illegally and were illegally murdering 3 million Vietnamese.
All the US soldiers there were criminals by definition.
There was no legal way for them to be there, since Diem was illegal by taking over the South with a military coup.
Obviously the majority of the Vietnamese never wanted us there.

 

[Rigby5]

To contain Communism. As we can see it did not work.

Wrong.
Ho Chi Minh did not want help from China because he was not a communist and did not like the Chinese.
But we gave him no choice.
He spent years in the US, trying to get US support to get the French out of Vietnam.
We were the ones who turned him down.
China did not.

 

[Lastamender]

Wrong.
Ho Chi Minh did not want help from China because he was not a communist and did not like the Chinese.
But we gave him no choice.
He spent years in the US, trying to get US support to get the French out of Vietnam.
We were the ones who turned him down.
China did not.

He ended up a Communist. Get it?

 

[Rigby5]

He ended up a Communist. Get it?

If your choice was between communism and French colonialism, you would pick communism as well.
There is nothing inherently evil about communism. For example, all families are communist.

 

[Soupnazi630]

The problem here is that one person's enemy might not be someone else's enemy.

A lot of people felt the Vietnam should not be the US's enemy.

The Vietnamese were only killing US soldiers who were literally invading their country. They weren't killing US people in the US.

And if you think an American going to Vietnam and having their photo taken with "the enemy" is treason, then surely Americans at home killing US military personnel, killing 140,000 US military personnel, is also treason.

The US did not invade.

The north vietnamese did

 

[Soupnazi630]

Wrong.
Ho Chi Minh was wildly popular, and he gained that by defeating the French and driving them out.
There were never suppose to be 2 countries, but instead an nation wide plebiscite in 1955, to decide who was to be the new ruler.
But Diem perpetrated an illegal military coup to prevent those elections, with the aid of the US.
The US illegally tried to create South Vietnam as a separate country, and that was against the Geneva peace accord between the Vietnamese and the French.

Wrong.

There were historically two countries going back hundreds of years. Minh was not popular he actually siezed power in a coup and was never elected. Once extablished as ruler he slaughtered over 150,000 dissidents who were guilty of having an education or owning land.

It was not illegal at all. We are not the French and that accord did not apply.

 

[Soupnazi630]

If your choice was between communism and French colonialism, you would pick communism as well.
There is nothing inherently evil about communism. For example, all families are communist.

COmmunism is inherently evil it is strictly about authoritarian tyranny and slavery

 

[Rigby5]

The US did not invade.

The north vietnamese did

That is totally untrue.
There were to be elections agreed upon by the Vietnamese, French, and everyone else.
The US then illegally prevented those elections because we knew Ho Chi Minh would win them if they were allowed.,
So no, the north did not invade, the south raised up in rebellion against the dictator Diem and the evil US imperialists.

 

[Soupnazi630]

The US soldiers in Vietnam were there illegally and were illegally murdering 3 million Vietnamese.
All the US soldiers there were criminals by definition.
There was no legal way for them to be there, since Diem was illegal by taking over the South with a military coup.
Obviously the majority of the Vietnamese never wanted us there.

Outright lie and proven so

The US were there by a legally elected governmetns invitation.

Yes the majority did want protection from the illegallyu invaqding north vietnamese communist'

That is totally untrue.
There were to be elections agreed upon by the Vietnamese, French, and everyone else.
The US then illegally prevented those elections because we knew Ho Chi Minh would win them if they were allowed.,
So no, the north did not invade, the south raised up in rebellion against the dictator Diem and the evil US imperialists.

It is historic truth

We are not the french and not bound by their agreement.

We did not prevent anything mingh did by siezing power.

The north invaded the south WE DID NOT

 

[Rigby5]

Wrong.

There were historically two countries going back hundreds of years. Minh was not popular he actually siezed power in a coup and was never elected. Once extablished as ruler he slaughtered over 150,000 dissidents who were guilty of having an education or owning land.

It was not illegal at all. We are not the French and that accord did not apply.

That is ridiculous.
There never were 2 separate countries of Vietnam.
The division was only a temporary one for who would administer the elections in each half.
The US breaking the Geneva Peace Accord between the French and Vietnamese, and preventing elections, was totally illegal.
And it is an incredible lie to call Ho Chi Minh to coup dictator, when it was clearly DIem and the US who illegally committed a coup.

There was conflict in the north when Ho Chi Minh established land reform to give the land to the peasants who had been forced to pay rent to evil landlords who had no right to the land. But it was they who started the violence by armed resistance.

The French and Vietnamese accord did apply to the US, using UN law.
Supporting the military coup of Diem was totally illegal under any concept of law.