AZ passes law saying life beings pre-conception

[Navy1960]

The Laws says the following...

"Unborn child" means the offspring of human beings from
conception until birth.

http://www.azleg.gov/legtext/50leg/2r/bills/hb2036s.pdf

That concept is not a concept shared by every religion in the world, and as such because the premise of HB 2036 is built around it then the bill seeks to to step on the 1st Amendment rights of those who do not share this, further, had the main aim of this bill been to stop Abortion after 20 weeks then it would have just reaffirmed the Casey decision whose opinion was written by a former justice from Arizona.

Religion is irrelevant.

From a medical perspective, from conception to birth, you have unborn human offspring, or a child. Though many stages are traversed, the fact of a human offspring does not. The political statement that the joining of sperm and ovum results in something other than a human is laughable in it's ignorance.

Do you think that women carry a dog, or a baboon until birth? Then the "magic vagina" trasmorgrifies the baboon into a person? Fundamental changes in genetic structure occur when passing through the magic vagina....

Seriously, do you buffoons care how ignorant you appear? Clearly you are at war with scientific fact, since everything you post openly defies medical science. The left amazes me.

Nothing I have posted is not based in fact , secondly I have never indicated that I am on the "left" and in fact have said more than once on here, that I am a "true "conservative" on this issue not unlike Sen. Goldwater. If you were to take a moment and understand that Law's passed in this nation need to withstand Constitutional muster in order to be Law's then perhaps you would cease your childish name calling and stick the the points of the debate on this subject. As my small posting is hard it seems for you grasp, I will help you, this bill HB2036 was written with the help of a faith based group in Arizona called the Center for Arizona Policy which is a Christian based Legislative and Family Group. The section in the bill that contains the language as I mentioned above is language that is inconsistant with current religious teachings of several religions in this nation and as such is unConstiutional and violates the 1st Amendment. Further in doing so it purports to make those teachings law upon those who do not hold those teachings to be true. Further if you had bothered to read the Casey decision or any of the number of postings I've put in here you would have seen that nothing I've posted in here would deny any medical facts. However, it does not matter, I've noticed in these types of debates that when someone is incapable of an adult converstation they generally resort to name calling because they do not have any other postion to stand on. If that is the case here I suggest you do not read any of my postings from this point forward.

 

[jillian]

"Life beings pre conception>" what the hell does life beings even mean?

It doesn't say that. Jillian has a sub-50 IQ and is regurgitating idiocy from the hate sites. The law uses a well established medical term, "Gestational Age" that calculates the last menses to determine the developmental state of the baby. Since ovulation occurs about two weeks after menses, the morons of the left are shrieking that Az has defined life two weeks before conception.

The left are a bunch of uneducated goons, ignorantly spewing nonsense.

you need to stop projecting your own lack of IQ points onto others. But it's always amusing watching one of the least intelligent people on the board (you) comment on others' intellect.

I'm wondering how all-gov and the AZ statutes (which are what I linked to) are suddenly hate sites, you braindead misyogist loon.

It would probably be helpful, should you wish to participate in discussion of this topic, to learn how to read a statute.

Now run along. I'm certain there are some obama deranged lunatic threads for you to play on.

 

[BDBoop]

The Laws says the following...

"Unborn child" means the offspring of human beings from
conception until birth.

http://www.azleg.gov/legtext/50leg/2r/bills/hb2036s.pdf

That concept is not a concept shared by every religion in the world, and as such because the premise of HB 2036 is built around it then the bill seeks to to step on the 1st Amendment rights of those who do not share this, further, had the main aim of this bill been to stop Abortion after 20 weeks then it would have just reaffirmed the Casey decision whose opinion was written by a former justice from Arizona.

Religion is irrelevant.

From a medical perspective, from conception to birth, you have unborn human offspring, or a child. Though many stages are traversed, the fact of a human offspring does not. The political statement that the joining of sperm and ovum results in something other than a human is laughable in it's ignorance.

Do you think that women carry a dog, or a baboon until birth? Then the "magic vagina" trasmorgrifies the baboon into a person? Fundamental changes in genetic structure occur when passing through the magic vagina....

Seriously, do you buffoons care how ignorant you appear? Clearly you are at war with scientific fact, since everything you post openly defies medical science. The left amazes me.

Nothing I have posted is not based in fact , secondly I have never indicated that I am on the "left" and in fact have said more than once on here, that I am a "true "conservative" on this issue not unlike Sen. Goldwater. If you were to take a moment and understand that Law's passed in this nation need to withstand Constitutional muster in order to be Law's then perhaps you would cease your childish name calling and stick the the points of the debate on this subject. As my small posting is hard it seems for you grasp, I will help you, this bill HB2036 was written with the help of a faith based group in Arizona called the Center for Arizona Policy which is a Christian based Legislative and Family Group. The section in the bill that contains the language as I mentioned above is language that is inconsistant with current religious teachings of several religions in this nation and as such is unConstiutional and violates the 1st Amendment. Further in doing so it purports to make those teachings law upon those who do not hold those teachings to be true. Further if you had bothered to read the Casey decision or any of the number of postings I've put in here you would have seen that nothing I've posted in here would deny and medical facts. However, it does not matter, I've noticed in these types of debates that when someone is incapable of an adult converstation they generally resort to name calling because they do not have any other postion to stand on. If that is the case here I suggest you do not read any of my postings from this point forward.

/thread

You know. If we were going to be logical. Which I am betting we are not.

Great post again, Sir Navy.

 

[koshergrl]

Better than you, who thinks that a bunch of cells without a heartbeat or nerve endings is a 'human being.'

Of course it's a human being.

Just because you want to kill it doesn't change what it is.

Embryo:

(human biology) Baby in the early developmental stage, after the zygote phase (at fertilization) to week eight from the time of fertilization (note: week eight from the time of fertilization is equivalent to 10 weeks gestational age)
Embryo - definition from Biology-Online.org

 

[Uncensored2008]

Better than you, who thinks that a bunch of cells without a heartbeat or nerve endings is a 'human being.'

Say, at what point in gestation is there a heartbeat?

Would you agree to requiring judicial review of abortions past the formation of the heart?

 

[BDBoop]

Nerve endings. If they can't determine pain, they are not qualified as human life (unless the mother chooses to continue through the pregnancy.)

 

[Nic_Driver]

Which is a lie, of course.

Pro-choice is Pro-abortion. Choice means the choice to kill your children.

No, you're wrong. A fetus is not a child.

Does that statement make it easier to insert a metal object into the skull to scramble the brains?

A fetus is not a child.

Does being blind to obvious facts make life easier for you?

 

[Nic_Driver]

No, you're wrong. A fetus is not a child.

Is it a monkey? Perhaps a Klingon?

What of Cesarian births? Since the child never passes through the magic vagina to be transmorgrified, do they remain Klingon?

You leftist sure have a solid grasp of biology.....

Wow, are you really that stupid?

 

[BDBoop]

"Life beings pre conception>" what the hell does life beings even mean?

It doesn't say that. Jillian has a sub-50 IQ and is regurgitating idiocy from the hate sites. The law uses a well established medical term, "Gestational Age" that calculates the last menses to determine the developmental state of the baby. Since ovulation occurs about two weeks after menses, the morons of the left are shrieking that Az has defined life two weeks before conception.

The left are a bunch of uneducated goons, ignorantly spewing nonsense.

you need to stop projecting your own lack of IQ points onto others. But it's always amusing watching one of the least intelligent people on the board (you) comment on others' intellect.

I'm wondering how all-gov and the AZ statutes (which are what I linked to) are suddenly hate sites, you braindead misyogist loon.

It would probably be helpful, should you wish to participate in discussion of this topic, to learn how to read a statute.

Now run along. I'm certain there are some obama deranged lunatic threads for you to play on.

It's always a good time for Princess Bride.

Your post reminded me of this scene.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qF0uaI4GxDU]The Princess Bride - The Best Bit - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Uncensored2008]

you need to stop projecting your own lack of IQ points onto others.

I could lend you 10, thus doubling your IQ.

But it's always amusing watching one of the least intelligent people on the board (you) comment on others' intellect.

I'm hurt. It's like walking through the "special needs" section of the state hospital and having patients yell "thtupid, thtupid, thtupid."

I place so much value on the judgments of one with a sub-50 IQ...

I'm wondering how all-gov and the AZ statutes (which are what I linked to) are suddenly hate sites, you braindead misyogist loon.

ThinkProgess, Democratic Underground, DailyKOS, et al.; you know, the source of your ideas and perceptions, are indeed hate sites.

It would probably be helpful, should you wish to participate in discussion of this topic, to learn how to read a statute.

I read the statute, ergo my elucidating of the fact that what you claim is false.

Look, you're faux outraged, faux outraged I tells ya, that Arizona would dare pass a law that uses the long established medical term "gestational age." After all, the hate sites told you that you're faux outraged...

So, what exactly do you object to in the bill? That using gestational age moves the RvW marker from 20 to 18 weeks? Do you fear that income will be reduced for the multi-billion dollar abortion industry? Seriously, when has the second trimester provision of Roe ever slowed down the abortion mills?

This bill does nothing to slow or stop abortion. Your investment portfolio in Planned Parenthood is safe.

Now run along. I'm certain there are some obama deranged lunatic threads for you to play on.

You're drooling again, you might want to call the attendant to clean you up...

 

[BDBoop]

you need to stop projecting your own lack of IQ points onto others.

I could lend you 10, thus doubling your IQ.

But it's always amusing watching one of the least intelligent people on the board (you) comment on others' intellect.

I'm hurt. It's like walking through the "special needs" section of the state hospital and having patients yell "thtupid, thtupid, thtupid."

I place so much value on the judgments of one with a sub-50 IQ...



ThinkProgess, Democratic Underground, DailyKOS, et al.; you know, the source of your ideas and perceptions, are indeed hate sites.

It would probably be helpful, should you wish to participate in discussion of this topic, to learn how to read a statute.

I read the statute, ergo my elucidating of the fact that what you claim is false.

Look, you're faux outrage, faux outraged I tells ya, that Arizona would dare pass a law that uses the long established medical term "gestational age." After all, the hate sites told you that your faux outraged...

So, what exactly do you object to in the bill? That using gestational age moves the RvW marker from 20 to 18 weeks? Do you fear that income will be reduced for the multi-billion dollar abortion industry? Seriously, when has the second trimester provision of Roe ever slowed down the abortion mills?

This bill does nothing to slow or stop abortion. Your investment portfolio in Planned Parenthood is safe.

Now run along. I'm certain there are some obama deranged lunatic threads for you to play on.

You're drooling again, you might want to call the attendant to clean you up...

I see you're projecting. Is this 'again', or 'still?'

 

[Uncensored2008]

Wow, are you really that stupid?

If I were stupid, I would be claiming that something with verifiable human DNA, distinct from the mother, a heartbeat measurable by EKG, a brainwave pattern recordable by EEG, is "not human." Have you ever even heard of DNA?

I mean, THAT is stupid. I seriously suspect you folk never made it all the way to a 7th grade biology class.

 

[Full-Auto]

No, you're wrong. A fetus is not a child.

Does that statement make it easier to insert a metal object into the skull to scramble the brains?

A fetus is not a child.

Does being blind to obvious facts make life easier for you?

A fetus is the beginning of life and very much a child, though not fully developed MORON..........

 

[Uncensored2008]

I see you're projecting. Is this 'again', or 'still?'

Projecting "what?"

Exactly what does this bill do that has you up in arms?

I'll wait while you log on to ThinkProgress to find what you think....

 

[NYcarbineer]

Killing babies isn't a choice.

It's just killing babies. Call it what it is.

Bring back the death penalty for women caught getting abortions?

See? No objection to this idea from the anti-abortion crowd.

That's where they want to go.

 

[jillian]

Killing babies isn't a choice.

It's just killing babies. Call it what it is.

in *your* opinion.

AMA: Opinion 2.01 - Abortion
The Principles of Medical Ethics of the AMA do not prohibit a physician from
performing an abortion in accordance with good medical practice and under
circumstances that do not violate the law. (III, IV)

I support your right to choose.

I don't support your right to tell other people what their moral choices should be.

 

[FuelRod]

Killing babies isn't a choice.

It's just killing babies. Call it what it is.

in *your* opinion.

AMA: Opinion 2.01 - Abortion
The Principles of Medical Ethics of the AMA do not prohibit a physician from
performing an abortion in accordance with good medical practice and under
circumstances that do not violate the law. (III, IV)

I support your right to choose.

I don't support your right to tell other people what their moral choices should be.

Not exactly.
You are just making the choice as to when.

 

[BDBoop]

Killing babies isn't a choice.

It's just killing babies. Call it what it is.

in *your* opinion.

AMA: Opinion 2.01 - Abortion
The Principles of Medical Ethics of the AMA do not prohibit a physician from
performing an abortion in accordance with good medical practice and under
circumstances that do not violate the law. (III, IV)

I support your right to choose.

I don't support your right to tell other people what their moral choices should be.

Seconded. Motion carried.

If only it were so easy!

 

[Inthemiddle]

It's laughable that vaginal ultrasound conducted to ensure accuracy is "too invasive" but the abortion itself is A-OK.

What complete crap.

You're damn right it's too invasive. When the government can legislatively insert something into your vagina, you're god damned right it's too invasive. What you insert into your own vagina is your own decision and business. But when government does it, it's being too god damned invasive.

 

[BDBoop]

It's laughable that vaginal ultrasound conducted to ensure accuracy is "too invasive" but the abortion itself is A-OK.

What complete crap.

You're damn right it's too invasive. When the government can legislatively insert something into your vagina, you're god damned right it's too invasive. What you insert into your own vagina is your own decision and business. But when government does it, it's being too god damned invasive.

This should be post of the day. Week even.