Bergdahl smearer already had OTH discharge...

[JoeB131]

Yes, it's totally Obama's fault The Onion stopped being funny years ago.

Yet you guys blame Bush still......

What's your point, other than you can't face up to reality?


Face it, Obama is president, not Bush.

Guy, you seriously need to seek treatment for your Obama Derangement Syndrome.

Before you hurt yourself.

 

[rdean]

Yes, it's totally Obama's fault The Onion stopped being funny years ago.

Yet you guys blame Bush still......

What's your point, other than you can't face up to reality?


Face it, Obama is president, not Bush.

It can take only a second to smash a car. Sometimes, the damage is so bad, it can't be fixed.

 

[mudwhistle]

What "reported intimidation"?

Seems to me these Yardbirds are pretty much shooting off their mouths to any Faux News or Hate Radio station that will have them.

And then we find out they couldn't even meet the lowered standards of Bush's Army.

Who's they?

I heard about only one got a OTH discharge, not all of them.

Are you making shit up again Joe?

did you read Hasting's article in Rolling Stone?

It's pretty enlightening.

Here are some of the highlights.

In early June, after photographs taken by Sean Smith appeared in The Guardian, Bowe's unit got reamed out by its commander for its lack of discipline. Bowe's squad leader, Sgt. Greg Leatherman, was demoted, and two other sergeants in the squad were reassigned. According to Fancey, one was made "a gate guard for the rest of the deployment." As often happens in the Army, senior officers were going unpunished for screw-ups like the MRAP mission, while lower-ranking men paid the price for minor infractions.

The discipline problems that had plagued Bowe's unit back home only got worse when immersed in the fog of war. From the start, everything seemed to go wrong. In April, Lt. Fancey was removed from his post for clashing with a superior officer. He was replaced by Sgt. 1st Class Larry Hein, who had never held such a command – a move that left the remote outpost with no officers. According to four soldiers in the battalion, the removal of Fancey was quickly followed by a collapse in unit morale and an almost complete breakdown of authority.

By the time the month long training session ended, the platoon was so notorious for screwing up that it had become a convenient scapegoat. At the firing range one day, another company failed to bring ammunition, and Bowe's unit took the flak. "We were heckled and blamed for not being prepared," Fancey wrote. "All said and done, NTC was an eye-opener and a bit of a disappointing one, at that."

Oh, so Bergdahl was the only decent trooper in his unit.

I remember my last deployment. Without command support we were foundering. Our SGTMajor got shot, our CO had to go home or risk being divorced by his spouse. We were down to one Captain and a SFC as our command structure. Good thing every one of us had the training we needed to run a Battalion of foreign troops, or we would have been up shit-creek.

Our replacements were sent and began occupying our billets yet we didn't even have a flight home. They forgot to book air assets to bring us back.

Being deployed in a warzone is no cakewalk, paper-pusher. There's plenty of reasons those who've been there doesn't want to talk about it.

 

[martybegan]

[

Terrible, just terrible.

The horror.....the horror.......

Seems Obama likes to double-down on everything Bush did, because he has a ready made excuse.

Or basic rule of life, fixing things is a lot harder than breaking things.

Bush had 8 years to fuck up, well, just about everything. The economy, the military, America's reputation around the world.

Obama's had 5 to fix them, and I'll be perfectly honest, I think he lacks some of the managerial skills to do a lot of them. We'd have been vastly better served had Hillary won in 2008 and brought in Bill and the people who knew what they were doing.

But Jesus, you guys all like to pretend this man didn't inherit a hot mess in Jan 2009.

And the 2nd level slurper makes his entrance. And a nice job with the apologist part in the 3rd paragraph.

Slurp Slurp Slurp.

 

[jon_berzerk]

Somehow, I think that for the "Bergdahl is a Traitor" crowd, this is not going to go very well...

This dude:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=48ZLcv9nqWI

former Army Sgt. Josh Korder (who served with Bergdahl), the one who railed on Bergdahl as a traitor, received an OTH discharge from the military.

Korder is the same guy who started the "6 guys died" lie that has since then been debunked.

OTH stands for "other than honorable"

MN Soldier Speaks Out Against Freed POW Bowe Bergdahl « CBS Minnesota

Korder did sign a nondisclosure agreement about this situation. His family told WCCO he knows the risk he’s taking by talking.

Korder was recently discharged, which was listed as “other than honorable.”

And BTW, who organized these Bergdahl critics?

Why, none other than former Bush administration official, then later, a Romney foreign policy advisor/strategist Richard Grennell. Yes, that Richard Grenell, whom Romney dropped like a hot potato when it came out that Grenell was gay and the religious Right went into holy holy spasms.

Cody Full, one of the soldiers quoted in the New York Times and other stories, tweeted yesterday about Grenell: “I want to thank @richardgrenell for helping get our platoon’s story out.” Grenell retweeted the tweet, calling Full a “true American hero.”

This is the definition of "other than honorable discharge"

Military Justice 101 - Part 3, Enlisted Administrative Separations

Under Other Than Honorable Conditions.

OTH Discharges are warranted when the reason for separation is based upon a pattern of behavior that constitutes a significant departure from the conduct expected of members of the Military Services, or when the reason for separation is based upon one or more acts or omissions that constitute a significant departure from the conduct expected of members of the Military Services. Examples of factors that may be considered include the use of force or violence to produce serious bodily injury or death, abuse of a special position of trust, disregard by a superior of customary superior-subordinate relationships, acts or omissions that endanger the security of the United States or the health and welfare of other members of the Military Services, and deliberate acts or omissions that seriously endanger the health and safety of other persons.

Persons awarded an OTH characterization of service: are not entitled to retain their uniforms or wear them home (although they may be furnished civilian clothing at a cost of not more than $50); must accept transportation in kind to their homes; are subject to recoupment of any reenlistment bonus they may have received; are not eligible for notice of discharge to employers (which may affect unemployment benefits); and, do not receive mileage fees from the place of discharge to their home of record.

It is generally believed that an OTH Discharge will render an individual ineligible for all VA Benefits. This is not necessarily so. The Department of Veterans Affairs will make its own determination with respect as to whether the OTH was based on conditions which would forfeit any or all VA benefits...

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So, CNN decided to interview a dude who was already dishonorably discharged to speak about Bergdahl. Isn't that kind of like a whore being interviewed for celibacy advocacy?

Nosiree, nothing partisan about #Bergdahlghazi at all, folks. Nosiree....

in the last ten years over 100 thousand troops has received a OTH discharge

 

[Statistikhengst]

Somehow, I think that for the "Bergdahl is a Traitor" crowd, this is not going to go very well...

This dude:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=48ZLcv9nqWI

former Army Sgt. Josh Korder (who served with Bergdahl), the one who railed on Bergdahl as a traitor, received an OTH discharge from the military.

Korder is the same guy who started the "6 guys died" lie that has since then been debunked.

OTH stands for "other than honorable"

MN Soldier Speaks Out Against Freed POW Bowe Bergdahl « CBS Minnesota

Korder did sign a nondisclosure agreement about this situation. His family told WCCO he knows the risk he’s taking by talking.

Korder was recently discharged, which was listed as “other than honorable.”

And BTW, who organized these Bergdahl critics?

Why, none other than former Bush administration official, then later, a Romney foreign policy advisor/strategist Richard Grennell. Yes, that Richard Grenell, whom Romney dropped like a hot potato when it came out that Grenell was gay and the religious Right went into holy holy spasms.





This is the definition of "other than honorable discharge"

Military Justice 101 - Part 3, Enlisted Administrative Separations

Under Other Than Honorable Conditions.

OTH Discharges are warranted when the reason for separation is based upon a pattern of behavior that constitutes a significant departure from the conduct expected of members of the Military Services, or when the reason for separation is based upon one or more acts or omissions that constitute a significant departure from the conduct expected of members of the Military Services. Examples of factors that may be considered include the use of force or violence to produce serious bodily injury or death, abuse of a special position of trust, disregard by a superior of customary superior-subordinate relationships, acts or omissions that endanger the security of the United States or the health and welfare of other members of the Military Services, and deliberate acts or omissions that seriously endanger the health and safety of other persons.

Persons awarded an OTH characterization of service: are not entitled to retain their uniforms or wear them home (although they may be furnished civilian clothing at a cost of not more than $50); must accept transportation in kind to their homes; are subject to recoupment of any reenlistment bonus they may have received; are not eligible for notice of discharge to employers (which may affect unemployment benefits); and, do not receive mileage fees from the place of discharge to their home of record.

It is generally believed that an OTH Discharge will render an individual ineligible for all VA Benefits. This is not necessarily so. The Department of Veterans Affairs will make its own determination with respect as to whether the OTH was based on conditions which would forfeit any or all VA benefits...

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So, CNN decided to interview a dude who was already dishonorably discharged to speak about Bergdahl. Isn't that kind of like a whore being interviewed for celibacy advocacy?

Nosiree, nothing partisan about #Bergdahlghazi at all, folks. Nosiree....

in the last ten years over 100 thousand troops has received a OTH discharge

And how many of them are interviewed to smear an officer who has not been discharged?

 

[JoeB131]

In the last 24 hours I have been termed both a "dimcrat _____" (Edgetho) and one of the Right. I must be a "radical Centrist". The facts is, I want more than accusations to discredit Bergdahl, but think the same applies to those attacking him. The involvement of Grenell is enough to raise questions in my mind about the attackers. Still, years later two opposing views can both be correct, in the mind of each individual. The facts are are not yet established. I BELIEVE, repeat, believe, do not know, the evidence thus far points to existing mental health problems with Bergdahl, long before he turned up in the hands of radical Islamic extremists.

very well said.

I've said in other places, and I will say it here. Bergdahl is a symptom of a system that failed.

The notion of the All Volunteer Army was that you would have an Active Component to meet the initial need, a National Guard to supplement them, and eventually, draft an Army reserve large enough to meet the long term needs.

That didn't happen, and instead we had a war that has dragged on longer than any war in our history, with the Army continually lowering standards to meet the demand.

IN an ideal situation, NCO's who were not sleeping through PLDC and BNCOC would have recognized that this kid who came in with a lot of enthusiasm was undergoing a serious change in attitude and behavior and did an intervention.

This was obviously not an ideal situation. This unit (again, please read Hastings article) had serious command and control issues before it ever left the NTC, and they sent them off to Afghanistan anyway.

 

[Stephanie]

Liberals are selective in who they care about in our military

Even thought they keep hearing all that's this Obama pet has done, it's now time to SMEAR all the other military men and women because HOW DARE speak up

they did the same with Swift boat vets

we should of known this was coming

but Obama's reputation is more important TO THEM right now and all the rest can to go hell

oh and notice, they it's all about this guy, do they care one bit he TRADED to TERRORIST? I hope he waved the white flag while he doing trade

you all defending trade for one person who is in doubt of being POW and Obama are traitors to us and our country

 

[jon_berzerk]

My, they are desperate.

I agree, despite my questions about those attacking him, this isn't a valid reason to discount the fellow soldier's report.

Why? The dude has a dishonorable discharge. That doesn't make him particularly trustworthy.

The dude has a dishonorable discharge.

no he doesnt

he has a OTH discharge is an administrative discharge

a dis honorable discharge is the result of a court martial

 

[JoeB131]

[

in the last ten years over 100 thousand troops has received a OTH discharge

True. ANd that should be an alarming figure of how badly Bush's war has broken the army.

The point being, however, that we have all these people rushing forward to smear Bergdahl, and a lot of them are kind of foulups, too.

 

[Statistikhengst]

I agree, despite my questions about those attacking him, this isn't a valid reason to discount the fellow soldier's report.

Why? The dude has a dishonorable discharge. That doesn't make him particularly trustworthy.

The dude has a dishonorable discharge.

no he doesnt

he has a OTH discharge is an administrative discharge

a dis honorable discharge is the result of a court martial

You are correct. I misstyped. Thanks for the correction.

 

[jon_berzerk]

Somehow, I think that for the "Bergdahl is a Traitor" crowd, this is not going to go very well...

This dude:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=48ZLcv9nqWI

former Army Sgt. Josh Korder (who served with Bergdahl), the one who railed on Bergdahl as a traitor, received an OTH discharge from the military.

Korder is the same guy who started the "6 guys died" lie that has since then been debunked.

OTH stands for "other than honorable"

MN Soldier Speaks Out Against Freed POW Bowe Bergdahl « CBS Minnesota




And BTW, who organized these Bergdahl critics?

Why, none other than former Bush administration official, then later, a Romney foreign policy advisor/strategist Richard Grennell. Yes, that Richard Grenell, whom Romney dropped like a hot potato when it came out that Grenell was gay and the religious Right went into holy holy spasms.





This is the definition of "other than honorable discharge"

Military Justice 101 - Part 3, Enlisted Administrative Separations





-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So, CNN decided to interview a dude who was already dishonorably discharged to speak about Bergdahl. Isn't that kind of like a whore being interviewed for celibacy advocacy?

Nosiree, nothing partisan about #Bergdahlghazi at all, folks. Nosiree....

in the last ten years over 100 thousand troops has received a OTH discharge

And how many of them are interviewed to smear an officer who has not been discharged?

what officer

 

[Statistikhengst]

in the last ten years over 100 thousand troops has received a OTH discharge

And how many of them are interviewed to smear an officer who has not been discharged?

what officer

Bergdahl, of course.

 

[jon_berzerk]

And how many of them are interviewed to smear an officer who has not been discharged?

what officer

Bergdahl, of course.

he is enlisted not an officer

interesting read showing the witnesses are correct

on searching for him

Bowe Berghdal Military Investigation Documents

 

[Statistikhengst]

what officer

Bergdahl, of course.

he is enlisted not an officer

interesting read showing the witnesses are correct

on searching for him

Bowe Berghdal Military Investigation Documents

A Sergeant is not an officer?

 

[JoeB131]

Liberals are selective in who they care about in our military

Even thought they keep hearing all that's this Obama pet has done, it's now time to SMEAR all the other military men and women because HOW DARE speak up

they did the same with Swift boat vets

we should of known this was coming

but Obama's reputation is more important TO THEM right now and all the rest can to go hell

oh and notice, they it's all about this guy, do they care one bit he TRADED to TERRORIST? I hope he waved the white flag while he doing trade

you all defending trade for one person who is in doubt of being POW and Obama are traitors to us and our country

Again, we were going to have to let these guys go, eventually, anyway.

We couldn't charge them, the Afghans won't, and no international tribunal would touch them.

 

[jon_berzerk]

Bergdahl, of course.

he is enlisted not an officer

interesting read showing the witnesses are correct

on searching for him

Bowe Berghdal Military Investigation Documents

A Sergeant is not an officer?

no they are not

 

[jon_berzerk]

Bergdahl, of course.

he is enlisted not an officer

interesting read showing the witnesses are correct

on searching for him

Bowe Berghdal Military Investigation Documents

A Sergeant is not an officer?

no they are not

US Army Military Ranks, lowest to highest

 

[JoeB131]

Bergdahl, of course.

he is enlisted not an officer

interesting read showing the witnesses are correct

on searching for him

Bowe Berghdal Military Investigation Documents

A Sergeant is not an officer?

Yeah, he's only a "Sergeant" because the military kept promoting him in abstentia.

At the time of his capture, he was a PFC.

But that does raise an interesting question. If the army knew he was a deserter, why did they keep promoting him?

 

[JoeB131]

he is enlisted not an officer

interesting read showing the witnesses are correct

on searching for him

Bowe Berghdal Military Investigation Documents

A Sergeant is not an officer?

no they are not

US Army Military Ranks, lowest to highest

Technically, a Sergeant is a Non-Commissioned Officer.