Bradley Manning Sentenced To 35 Years:

[Kondor3]

I looked at the entire 17-minutes-long video sequence within the past hour, as a memory-refresher of an original viewing months ago, and I did not see a reason to fire upon the van that came-up after Shoot-Sequence No. 1...

It seems as though our fellas got carried away, in undertaking Shoot-Sequence No. 2...

But, if true, then this could have been handled through the IG's office, rather than trusting to Whats-His-Face from WikiLeaks...

that is NOT a full video.

It has been cut.

Refresh my memory, in small words that my tired brain can understand today...

Does the FULL video tell us a different story?

I'm convinced that Shoot Sequence No. 1 may have been righteous...

I'm not convinced (based on the 'edited' version I've seen so far) that Shoot Sequence No. 2 was righteous...

 

[daveman]

Indeed. I'm reminded of a documentary I saw some years ago about crop circles. The filmmaker found the two guys who originally started making them in England, and using IR cameras, filmed them making one. The next day, when one of the "Aliens did it!!" guys came out to look at it, he showed the tape to him.

After looking at the tape, the dood said, "Nope. It was aliens."

Billo has been shown it was two guys, but still insists it was aliens.

You can't convince that kind of willful delusion.

Making up hypotheticals, doesn't further your argument.

It's not a hypothetical. And it's a perfect illustration of your mindset.

"Damn reality, full screech ahead!!"

 

[daveman]

Coming from you, that's absolutely meaningless.

I've answered your silly questions. It's really no concern of mine that you don't like the answers.

Now, do me a favor -- don't screech "Nuh UH!! You haven't answered my questions! Link it!" -- because we both know that I and others have.

Name the posts you answered them in, coward!

Why, so you can ignore them again?

You bore me, you incoherent, raging imbecile.

 

[daveman]

Make him.



Dood. Chill out. I know you hate anyone speaking ill of your beloved terrorists, but it's over. They're dead. Their days of shooting at US troops are over.

Have a good cry and get over it.

Cut the foreplay and name the posts you answered the questions in, coward!

Oh, DO shut up.

 

[daveman]

that's a worshiper mentality. he was TOLD by his "side" it's a "war crime", therefore it HAS TO be a war crime.

Nobody told me anything, fuckhead, you can see everything you need to know in the video.

Yes. The EDITED video.

Assange told you what to think, and you obeyed.

 

[Vox]

sometimes it DOES.

and in that video nobody kills in cold blood people just standing outside talking.

don't LIE

Did you flunk English 101?

Fuck, your grammar sucks!

go fuck yourself, dumbass

 

[Vox]

I looked at the entire 17-minutes-long video sequence within the past hour, as a memory-refresher of an original viewing months ago, and I did not see a reason to fire upon the van that came-up after Shoot-Sequence No. 1...

It seems as though our fellas got carried away, in undertaking Shoot-Sequence No. 2...

But, if true, then this could have been handled through the IG's office, rather than trusting to Whats-His-Face from WikiLeaks...

that is NOT a full video.

It has been cut.

Refresh my memory, in small words that my tired brain can understand today...

Does the FULL video tell us a different story?

I'm convinced that Shoot Sequence No. 1 may have been righteous...

I'm not convinced (based on the 'edited' version I've seen so far) that Shoot Sequence No. 2 was righteous...

it has been discussed in this thread.

don't be lazy - and READ

 

[JoeB131]

Bradley Manning has been sentenced to 35 years -- as if he hasn't been punished enough for categorical whistleblowing (it has not been established that anything he revealed is or has been harmful to U.S. security or military integrity). I am among those Americans who believe what Manning and Snowden have done is wholly justifiable in that their actions have enlightened the American People to a substantial amount of unConstitutional and criminal conduct on the part of our increasingly oppressive and authoritarian government.

This 35 year sentence is a goddam shame and occurs as a brazen example of despotic power, particularly in view of the relatively minor sentence imposed on Irving ("Scooter") Libby, a real traitor, who deliberately outed an undercover CIA operative and compromised an ongoing international operation, jeopardizing many lives. He was sentenced to only thirty months -- and that sentence was commuted by George W. Bush! So Libby walked free while Manning is going to suffer for thirty-five long years.

I certainly don't expect Manning's sentence to be commuted by the two-faced, lying, self-serving, treacherous, corporatist puppet, Obama.

Your argument would hold water if Manning was a true whistleblower, who had evidence of a particular scandal or misconduct and released it. He didn't. He released a whole lot of stuff, some of which should have REMAINED classified.

Now, that said, let's not go into hysterics about Libby. Libby was asked what was pretty much an open secret in Washington- that Joe Wilson only got a job going to Niger because his wife worked at the CIA. And all he did was confirm what other sources had already divulged.

If someone should have gone to jail for "outing" Plame, it should have been Richard Armitage. But you see, Plame's identity was no secret. But dammit, Fitzgerald was going to get somebody for something. (Also known a Ken Starr's Disease) so he prosecuted Libby for Perjury in front of DC jury and didn't let the man present witnesses to discuss the nature of memory.

 

[Kondor3]

"...it has been discussed in this thread. don't be lazy - and READ"

I was looking for the 50-words-or-less Cliffs Notes version and didn't get it, and I'm too lazy tonight to be bothered, quite honestly, so, I guess I'll just hang onto the notion that Shoot Sequence No. 2 was questionable (I saw no weapons within the van, I saw no combatants in the van, I saw no arms being loaded into the van) until I can manage to get off my ass, some other time and finish digging that up. I've just had a fine Sunday-evening ham-dinner with the family and my eyes are bigger than my stomach and there's still home-made apple pie ahead within the hour, so, any serious backpeddling is gonna have to wait 'til later.

 

[daveman]

Alright Daveman,

Since you're such a fuckin' coward to name the post you answered my questions in, lets go back down memory lane and see your posts in this thread, that bear this out!

To date, in this thread, you have a total of 15 posts.

[quoted posts removed -- dave]

Well, we've just reviewed all the Daveman posts to date and none of them shows where he answered my questions. So we can only conclude...

....Daveman is a fucking coward, liar and hypocrite.

Wow. You went to an awful lot of trouble just to fail.

This is not the only thread where we've discussed (well, I discussed -- you mindlessly screeched profanities) the edited WikiLeaks video.

Yes, all of your questions have been answered. That you don't like the answers is your problem.

 

[Vox]

"...it has been discussed in this thread. don't be lazy - and READ"

I was looking for the 50-words-or-less Cliffs Notes version and didn't get it, and I'm too lazy tonight to be bothered, quite honestly, so, I guess I'll just hang onto the notion that Shoot Sequence No. 2 was questionable (I saw no weapons within the van, I saw no combatants in the van, I saw no arms being loaded into the van) until I can manage to get off my ass, some other time and finish digging that up. I've just had a fine Sunday-evening ham-dinner with the family and my eyes are bigger than my stomach and there's still home-made apple pie ahead within the hour, so, any serious backpeddling is gonna have to wait 'til later.

OK, here are Cliff notes ( thanks to the rants of Billy):

Daveman post #6:

I've heard that "journalists" embedded with the insurgents would take pictures of Coalition troops and then show them to the insurgents so they could better target them.

Collateral Murder - The WikiLeaks Deception | Telling the Whole Story

I just showed my husband this footage. He was there and had a role in reviewing the investigation on this case. His response below might clarify some things.

This footage shows the final engagement of the Reuters field reporters in New Baghdad. Missing is the overwatch video and earlier AH64 footage showing the development of the situation where the two reporters and armed men supported by a van and cars were shadowing a Coalition patrol. These reporters accompanied the armed men who were tracking a Coalition patrol about a city block away. The camera man would peek around corners to shoot a few digital frames of the patrol and then show the pictures to the armed men. If you have all the video footage, you will see this activity happened repeatedly. The operational suspicion was that this was enemy TTP (tactic, technic, or procedure) to help prepare for an attack; the digital photos would be used to quickly evaluate the target — to judge what it looked like, its shape, distance, terrain in between, where to aim, etc. This way, the RPG operator would select the right warhead, he’d preset the mechanical sights (elevation), and fix in his mind a visual picture of the target so he would limit his exposure time when stepping out in the street to fire. The recovered camera showed how the cameral man was aiding the enemy.

 

[JoeB131]

that's a worshiper mentality. he was TOLD by his "side" it's a "war crime", therefore it HAS TO be a war crime.

Nobody told me anything, fuckhead, you can see everything you need to know in the video.

Yes. The EDITED video.

Assange told you what to think, and you obeyed.

I looked at the full, unedited video.. Really looks like they shot up a bunch of unarmed guys to me. In one case, they identify a cameraman as having a weapon.


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nH5vaaarpqk]Collateral Murder in Iraq by Wikileaks - YouTube[/ame]

 

[daveman]

Nobody told me anything, fuckhead, you can see everything you need to know in the video.

Yes. The EDITED video.

Assange told you what to think, and you obeyed.

I looked at the full, unedited video.. Really looks like they shot up a bunch of unarmed guys to me. In one case, they identify a cameraman as having a weapon.


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nH5vaaarpqk]Collateral Murder in Iraq by Wikileaks - YouTube[/ame]

But WL does not tell you the whole story -- on purpose.

 

[Vox]

Yes. The EDITED video.

Assange told you what to think, and you obeyed.

I looked at the full, unedited video.. Really looks like they shot up a bunch of unarmed guys to me. In one case, they identify a cameraman as having a weapon.

But WL does not tell you the whole story -- on purpose.

It looks like some people do not want to listen.

they are already pre-brainwashed and that's it - the chips have fallen into the slots - nothing will ever dig them out from there

 

[dblack]

Yes. The EDITED video.

Assange told you what to think, and you obeyed.

I looked at the full, unedited video.. Really looks like they shot up a bunch of unarmed guys to me. In one case, they identify a cameraman as having a weapon.


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nH5vaaarpqk]Collateral Murder in Iraq by Wikileaks - YouTube[/ame]

But WL does not tell you the whole story -- on purpose.

There's no doubt about that. There's always more context, relevant context, to be known and understood. And yes, Wikileaks has an agenda, every bit as much as our government does. But when we reach a place where we so often have to explain actions that looks so heinous - isn't it worthwhile to re-examine the policies that produce these incidents in the first place?

 

[Vox]

There's no doubt about that. There's always more context, relevant context, to be known and understood. And yes, Wikileaks has an agenda, every bit as much as our government does. But when we reach a place where we so often have to explain actions that looks so heinous - isn't it worthwhile to re-examine the policies that produce these incidents in the first place?

probably, not.

I would not engage in explaining - that how I would change the policies.

 

[dblack]

There's no doubt about that. There's always more context, relevant context, to be known and understood. And yes, Wikileaks has an agenda, every bit as much as our government does. But when we reach a place where we so often have to explain actions that looks so heinous - isn't it worthwhile to re-examine the policies that produce these incidents in the first place?

probably, not.

I would not engage in explaining - that how I would change the policies.

Not sure what you mean.

 

[daveman]

I looked at the full, unedited video.. Really looks like they shot up a bunch of unarmed guys to me. In one case, they identify a cameraman as having a weapon.


Collateral Murder in Iraq by Wikileaks - YouTube

But WL does not tell you the whole story -- on purpose.

There's no doubt about that. There's always more context, relevant context, to be known and understood. And yes, Wikileaks has an agenda, every bit as much as our government does. But when we reach a place where we so often have to explain actions that looks so heinous - isn't it worthwhile to re-examine the policies that produce these incidents in the first place?

But the actions don't look so heinous once you see what WL deliberately left out.

Of course, accuracy and truth is not their goal.

 

[Billo_Really]

Yes. The EDITED video.

This proves you don't care about the truth. Because I've seen both videos more than once. I even told you in one of my responses, that I was going to watch "your" video for a second time. Then I specifically commented (with pictures) on the parts of "your" video that was different from the one released by Wikileaks. And yet, after all that, you still act like I haven't seen it.

You're a fuckin' liar and a disgusting piece of shit for a human being.

Assange told you what to think, and you obeyed.

Back to talking like a 5 year old, I see.

 

[Billo_Really]

Wow. You went to an awful lot of trouble just to fail.

This is not the only thread where we've discussed (well, I discussed -- you mindlessly screeched profanities) the edited WikiLeaks video.

Yes, all of your questions have been answered. That you don't like the answers is your problem.

You've never commented on the Apache soldiers joking around while murdering innocent Iraqis. Not once. Not in this thread. Not in any thread. You and I both know this.

You're nothing but a skumbag liar.