Breaking News: Restaurants Closing All Over Seattle As $15 Minimum Wage Mandate Starts April 1st.

[sealybobo]

Man would you look at what I found. This is a partial list of jobs to be filled at GM.
Look at the jobs paying above 100k.
And then the wages of the lowly production worker.

But wait. It's the unions fault their workers get paid well. Whose fault is it for paying non union workers so damn much. And why shouldn't the guys building the cars, supporting the 100k plus workers get paid well? Everybody else is. That's the fucking reason people want union jobs. They get paid better than non union jobs.

You fucks are dense.



[+] Operations Manager (3)
$48,088 - $125,932




[+] Operations Research Manager (2)
$113,530 - $187,246




[+] Packaging Engineer (12)
$42,485 - $90,511




[+] Performance Engineer (5)
$59,109 - $117,641




[+] Plant Superintendent (2)
$76,171 - $156,607




[+] Powertrain Control Systems & Software Engineer (2)
$74,776 - $113,828




[+] Process Engineer (6)
$55,739 - $105,513




[+] Product Design Engineer (3)
$76,612 - $135,916




[+] Product Development Engineer, Automotive (5)
$54,672 - $124,757




[+] Production Supervisor (5)
$37,577 - $88,951




[+] Production Worker (2)
$22,590 - $56,037




[+] Program Manager, IT (3)
$86,608 - $172,723




[+] Project Coordinator, (Unknown Type / General) (2)
$30,668 - $62,298




[+] Project Engineer (3)
$57,535 - $130,740




[+] Project Manager, Information Te

THat production worker wage is bullshit. The union scale is over $30 per hour not including benefits. Before GM was bailed out by the taxpayers via political fiat, the total compensation for a GM line worker was $71 per hour. That was GM's COST per worker.
From 2008...
UAW Workers Actually Cost the Big Three Automakers 70 an Hour
How much does an American auto worker make Bent Corner

Good! See how much the CEO costs every company?

Board members are not paid wages. Their earnings are tied to the value of the stock. The pay of these people does not come from the bottom line.
Look, if union labor were cost efficient and unions cooperative, there would be no argument.
The fact that non union labor is more productive and performs equally as well and in many cases is more productive than union labor, is the reason why unions are being run out of the equation.
Finally, you evaded the issue. That is the cost of union labor.

Unions did and probably do protect people who should be fired. That's true. But ford had record profits the last 2 years and they gave their employees over $6k in profit sharing. Buy american.

 

[thereisnospoon]

I used to buy GM cars, I love Cadillac. Since union takeover, I don't anymore. I'm pretty happy with Benz.

Union takeover? What the hell you talking about?
Oh and that Benz. If it was made in Germany, it was union. If it was made down south in the USA, the workers were paid union wages.

What the fuck is your point? You think Benz expects the quality they get from 12 dollar an hour workers? Grow the fuck up. You think the labor component on a Benz isn't figured into that premium price you paid? LMAO.

Most foreign branded cars sold in the US are made in US or Canada. In mostly non union plants.
All BMW's and MB's sold here are made here.
Same goes for many Asian branded models.
Again, non union plants

 

[sealybobo]

I used to buy GM cars, I love Cadillac. Since union takeover, I don't anymore. I'm pretty happy with Benz.

Union takeover? What the hell you talking about?
Oh and that Benz. If it was made in Germany, it was union. If it was made down south in the USA, the workers were paid union wages.

What the fuck is your point? You think Benz expects the quality they get from 12 dollar an hour workers? Grow the fuck up. You think the labor component on a Benz isn't figured into that premium price you paid? LMAO.

Most foreign branded cars sold in the US are made in US or Canada. In mostly non union plants.
All BMW's and MB's sold here are made here.
Same goes for many Asian branded models.
Again, non union plants

Those plants only pay well because they dont want you to unionize. If not for fear of unions they'd be paying low skilled Toyota workers the same as Walmart does.

 

[Dragonlady]

Economics 101.When minimum wage goes up, so do baseline prices in the area, so it solves nothing and contributes to a cost of living/wages spiral. All it does is cause a meaningless illusion....

Actually, they don't. That's another conservative lie.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Man would you look at what I found. This is a partial list of jobs to be filled at GM.
Look at the jobs paying above 100k.
And then the wages of the lowly production worker.

But wait. It's the unions fault their workers get paid well. Whose fault is it for paying non union workers so damn much. And why shouldn't the guys building the cars, supporting the 100k plus workers get paid well? Everybody else is. That's the fucking reason people want union jobs. They get paid better than non union jobs.

You fucks are dense.



[+] Operations Manager (3)
$48,088 - $125,932




[+] Operations Research Manager (2)
$113,530 - $187,246




[+] Packaging Engineer (12)
$42,485 - $90,511




[+] Performance Engineer (5)
$59,109 - $117,641




[+] Plant Superintendent (2)
$76,171 - $156,607




[+] Powertrain Control Systems & Software Engineer (2)
$74,776 - $113,828




[+] Process Engineer (6)
$55,739 - $105,513




[+] Product Design Engineer (3)
$76,612 - $135,916




[+] Product Development Engineer, Automotive (5)
$54,672 - $124,757




[+] Production Supervisor (5)
$37,577 - $88,951




[+] Production Worker (2)
$22,590 - $56,037




[+] Program Manager, IT (3)
$86,608 - $172,723




[+] Project Coordinator, (Unknown Type / General) (2)
$30,668 - $62,298




[+] Project Engineer (3)
$57,535 - $130,740




[+] Project Manager, Information Te

THat production worker wage is bullshit. The union scale is over $30 per hour not including benefits. Before GM was bailed out by the taxpayers via political fiat, the total compensation for a GM line worker was $71 per hour. That was GM's COST per worker.
From 2008...
UAW Workers Actually Cost the Big Three Automakers 70 an Hour
How much does an American auto worker make Bent Corner

Good! See how much the CEO costs every company?

Board members are not paid wages. Their earnings are tied to the value of the stock. The pay of these people does not come from the bottom line.
Look, if union labor were cost efficient and unions cooperative, there would be no argument.
The fact that non union labor is more productive and performs equally as well and in many cases is more productive than union labor, is the reason why unions are being run out of the equation.
Finally, you evaded the issue. That is the cost of union labor.

Unions did and probably do protect people who should be fired. That's true. But ford had record profits the last 2 years and they gave their employees over $6k in profit sharing. Buy american.

Gotta ask....Can you without tell me two things, Where are Ford Fusions built?...What percentage of the parts that are in the Fusion are made here in the US?
The Hyundai I just bought was built in the US....Ok?

 

[MaryL]

Why not raise minimum wage to a thousand dollars a minute? Why not pay people in diamonds and gold bars whilst we are at it. Why not? I am there! I want some of that action. But if are going to be real and pull back from the fantasies, we will realize what a pipe dream paying lots of money to base laborers pulls out the tent pegs to the economy.

 

[Ame®icano]

Here's your downfall. The fact that unions now make up just under 7% of the total private sector workforce.
Unions had their purpose. Now it is time for them to step aside.
No business wants to deal with unions. They are a thing of the past.
The Machinist's Union has been trying to organize some of the workers in the Boeing plant in Charleston, SC for quite some time.
The workers want nothing to do with the union. In order to get a vote, the Machinist's union had to go to the government to get help from the Left wing NLRB.
The union vote will fail. The union will cry foul. They will claim the vote was fixed and go pissing their pants to court with a lawsuit.
In the end, they will fail.
Even if the union wins, they lose. Wanna know why? All the company has to do is drag out the process until all the people that voted for the union are transferred, quit or get fired.
Unions no longer have the clout they used to.

Little reminder that VW had plan in Pennsylvania, where they accepted union as part of "cost of doing business" and closed it after having no profit for 5 straight years. How they could have been profitable back then everywhere in the world but not in US?

 

[Ame®icano]

Board members are not paid wages. Their earnings are tied to the value of the stock. The pay of these people does not come from the bottom line.
Look, if union labor were cost efficient and unions cooperative, there would be no argument.
The fact that non union labor is more productive and performs equally as well and in many cases is more productive than union labor, is the reason why unions are being run out of the equation.
Finally, you evaded the issue. That is the cost of union labor.

If saint union worker is so great, they wouldn't need union to represent them. I have to say, there are good union workers, but there are many more under union shield that are just sucking off of them. If they get rid of them, they would earn much more money.

 

[thereisnospoon]

With exception of those two production jobs, none are union jobs

Yea. OK. You all claim the union is the reason cars cost so much. Bullshit. Cars cost so much because of A,. big markups in cars and particularly trucks.

And two, there are a lot of highly paid, (100k plus) workers who have to have their salaries covered in the price of a car or truck.

Why don't you go after their earnings to reduce the prices of cars?

Why don't you bitch about the multi millionaire upper level managers ?

Why is it just union members? It's that they vote Dem. That's the only reason.

If unions and their members supported Republicans, you fucks would love you some unions. LMAO.

Labor costs are always factored into the product..
Before the near collapse of GM, the ticket for union labor was Nearly $2000 per unit.
That is, the additional cost of the UAW labor vs non union labor...
For example.
A worker in a non union plant, that pays as most do to keep the unions out, for example the Toyota Georgetown, KY plant the avg wage for line workers is $28 per hour. The cost of the worker however is around $45 per hour. Their benefits are comprehensive. Instead of defined benefit pensions, the workers are offered a number of different investment/retirement vehicles.
The cost of the UAW worker is around $70 per hour...Link provided earlier in the thread..
Now, you can deny that cost is factored into the retail price of each vehicle all you like. It doesn't change the facts.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Here's your downfall. The fact that unions now make up just under 7% of the total private sector workforce.
Unions had their purpose. Now it is time for them to step aside.
No business wants to deal with unions. They are a thing of the past.
The Machinist's Union has been trying to organize some of the workers in the Boeing plant in Charleston, SC for quite some time.
The workers want nothing to do with the union. In order to get a vote, the Machinist's union had to go to the government to get help from the Left wing NLRB.
The union vote will fail. The union will cry foul. They will claim the vote was fixed and go pissing their pants to court with a lawsuit.
In the end, they will fail.
Even if the union wins, they lose. Wanna know why? All the company has to do is drag out the process until all the people that voted for the union are transferred, quit or get fired.
Unions no longer have the clout they used to.

Little reminder that VW had plan in Pennsylvania, where they accepted union as part of "cost of doing business" and closed it after having no profit for 5 straight years. How they could have been profitable back then everywhere in the world but not in US?

Harley Davidson had a plant in York, PA which sought concessions from the union. The union refused. The workers were told to strike. The company closed the plant and moved the production to plants in other states which are more business friendly.

 

[Ame®icano]

Most foreign branded cars sold in the US are made in US or Canada. In mostly non union plants.
All BMW's and MB's sold here are made here.
Same goes for many Asian branded models.
Again, non union plants

I agree on all with one exception. MB Tuscaloosa (Vance) plant makes M, R and GL class, they just added C class last year. The other models are imported.

 

[saintmichaeldefendthem]

Here's your downfall. The fact that unions now make up just under 7% of the total private sector workforce.
Unions had their purpose. Now it is time for them to step aside.
No business wants to deal with unions. They are a thing of the past.
The Machinist's Union has been trying to organize some of the workers in the Boeing plant in Charleston, SC for quite some time.
The workers want nothing to do with the union. In order to get a vote, the Machinist's union had to go to the government to get help from the Left wing NLRB.
The union vote will fail. The union will cry foul. They will claim the vote was fixed and go pissing their pants to court with a lawsuit.
In the end, they will fail.
Even if the union wins, they lose. Wanna know why? All the company has to do is drag out the process until all the people that voted for the union are transferred, quit or get fired.
Unions no longer have the clout they used to.

Little reminder that VW had plan in Pennsylvania, where they accepted union as part of "cost of doing business" and closed it after having no profit for 5 straight years. How they could have been profitable back then everywhere in the world but not in US?

Harley Davidson had a plant in York, PA which sought concessions from the union. The union refused. The workers were told to strike. The company closed the plant and moved the production to plants in other states which are more business friendly.

That's what Boeing tried to do but was stopped by mafia style tactics.

 

[thereisnospoon]

With exception of those two production jobs, none are union jobs

Yea. OK. You all claim the union is the reason cars cost so much. Bullshit. Cars cost so much because of A,. big markups in cars and particularly trucks.

And two, there are a lot of highly paid, (100k plus) workers who have to have their salaries covered in the price of a car or truck.

Why don't you go after their earnings to reduce the prices of cars?

Why don't you bitch about the multi millionaire upper level managers ?

Why is it just union members? It's that they vote Dem. That's the only reason.

If unions and their members supported Republicans, you fucks would love you some unions. LMAO.

Because of all the employees in the manufacturing sector, the hourly semi skilled ages are above market rate for similar work.
Once one achieves a 2 or 4 year degree, wages actually begin to flatten.

 

[Ame®icano]

Those plants only pay well because they dont want you to unionize. If not for fear of unions they'd be paying low skilled Toyota workers the same as Walmart does.

Not really. They pay enough to bring you in and what they think the work is worth. They're not afraid of unions, they let workers vote and workers keep rejecting union. Let me repeat it so you can sink it in. Workers are rejecting unions. One more time? Workers are rejecting unions.

Why, because American unions today are in extortion business. Extortion from worker and from employer. All they care are union dues, nothing else.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Why don't you tell me how many hour truck driver can drive? Are you saying limit is 40?

What the fuck is wrong with you. Yea. so I based the number on 40 hours of driving. He gets paid by the mile.
He made 50k last year. It look like he drove about 98000 miles

What you want to do is reduce what would be his hourly rate.

Lets say he drove 60 hours a week to make 50k. You with me dude?

50k by 52 by 60. Fucking cool. Now his hourly earnings are down to $16.02

You are really stupid.

98K miles? that's it?...Wow...No wonder why he made so little.And weren't you the one who stated $25 per hour to drive a truck was too much?

 

[thereisnospoon]

I used to buy GM cars, I love Cadillac. Since union takeover, I don't anymore. I'm pretty happy with Benz.

Union takeover? What the hell you talking about?
Oh and that Benz. If it was made in Germany, it was union. If it was made down south in the USA, the workers were paid union wages.

What the fuck is your point? You think Benz expects the quality they get from 12 dollar an hour workers? Grow the fuck up. You think the labor component on a Benz isn't figured into that premium price you paid? LMAO.

Most foreign branded cars sold in the US are made in US or Canada. In mostly non union plants.
All BMW's and MB's sold here are made here.
Same goes for many Asian branded models.
Again, non union plants

Those plants only pay well because they dont want you to unionize. If not for fear of unions they'd be paying low skilled Toyota workers the same as Walmart does.

Precisely...It is on the best interest of the business to pay above market wages. The reasons are many.
One is unions prohibit cross training. The incentive of a union is to create as many jobs as possible. And to lock people into a certain job. Non union plants encourage workers to learn all facets of the assembly line. This allows flexibility. So if a worker who calls in sick, another worker can easily take that worker's place. In a union plant, this is not permitted.
Two..Productivity. Unions DESPISE this concept. The union philosophy is the faster pace of work means less hours. Can't have that. IN the union world, workers who do an exemplary job, work quickly are scorned by fellow workers for such stupid things as "trying to show them up"...or "sucking up to management".
Three. Merit pay/increases. Under union contracts, this is not permitted. Unions are collectives. Therefore the most mediocre workers get the same pay and same increases as the best workers. That's a bunch of shit.
And it breeds complacency which spreads mediocrity throughout the facility.
So, you want to tell me why unions are so good?
Sick pay without a medical reason for missing work.. Unions insist on coercing companies to pay people NOT to work. All the worker has to do is claim they are too sick to come to work..That's nuts and it ripe for abuse.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Most foreign branded cars sold in the US are made in US or Canada. In mostly non union plants.
All BMW's and MB's sold here are made here.
Same goes for many Asian branded models.
Again, non union plants

I agree on all with one exception. MB Tuscaloosa (Vance) plant makes M, R and GL class, they just added C class last year. The other models are imported.

Yeah..I missworded the MB part. I meant to type "most MB's sold in the US are made here in the US....Of course that may change with a new plant being built in Georgia.
Also, MB is leaving New Jersey, moving the North American HQ to Atlanta.
Many large companies which located in sprawling campuses in suburban Northern NJ are leaving for lower tax and more business friendly states.
The list includes some of the Giants in industry, telecomm, pharmaceuticals, auto and electronics. It's damned shame. But the confiscatory taxes, high cost of labor, high cost of doing business etc, is turning NJ into a giant drain of tax revenue, jobs and brain power.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Economics 101.When minimum wage goes up, so do baseline prices in the area, so it solves nothing and contributes to a cost of living/wages spiral. All it does is cause a meaningless illusion....

Actually, they don't. That's another conservative lie.

Right...The additional money to pay the government mandated wages just drops out of the sky....
Here's some advice...You're not very good at this. Find another hobby.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Board members are not paid wages. Their earnings are tied to the value of the stock. The pay of these people does not come from the bottom line.
Look, if union labor were cost efficient and unions cooperative, there would be no argument.
The fact that non union labor is more productive and performs equally as well and in many cases is more productive than union labor, is the reason why unions are being run out of the equation.
Finally, you evaded the issue. That is the cost of union labor.

If saint union worker is so great, they wouldn't need union to represent them. I have to say, there are good union workers, but there are many more under union shield that are just sucking off of them. If they get rid of them, they would earn much more money.

Correct. The way unions are set up, as collectives, the concept permits the mediocre to ride the coat tails of the outstanding.

 

[thereisnospoon]

You can try to rewrite history, but you can't change the fact that unions distort the market by artificially setting wages well beyond what the market can reasonably support.

I'll tell you who makes to much money and drives up the cost of goods. Fucking truck drivers. Why the hell should you make 25 bucks (50k by 52 by 40) an hour for sitting on your ass driving? You think you are worth 25 bucks an hour? Why. The price of the goods you haul could be a lot less if you were not making so much damn money. That your job isn't even worth?

My hope for you is that some company you haul for will do exactly what they should do for the economy. Cut your earnings.
Cause the negative effect on the economy is just to much. You are way overpaid for what you do. I drove a truck. Whoop de shit. Ain't worth 25 bucks an hour.

Don't forget to thank a Teamster for the pay you get. They are the ones forced the wage scale up to the point you could make 50k.

Fuckstick, you try being responsible for $250,000 of equipment and the load you're carrying and the lives of everyone driving around you. You try being away from your family for several nights, putting on heavy chains to make it over an icy overpass, and knowing all the laws required to transport hazardous materials. We don't get paid $25 an hour either, you stupid asshole. Our typical day is 12-16 hours then we sleep in a bunk after spending 10 minutes in Skype to talk to our wives and children and then we get up and do it all over again. You are truly a horse's ass thinking you can criticize truck drivers when everything you have, your food, your clothes, your car, and even the material that built your home was hauled by a truck.

And behalf of 3.5 million truck drivers, fuck you, eat shit, and die.

are you and owner/operator?