Cheney Calls for full Release of Memos

[Yurt]

i would rather break a treaty and save lives...

and to those who think our actions dicate how the enemy treats us, i call bullshit...tell that to the families of those who have been beheaded...

 

[Article 15]

You betray your ignorance there - you fail to understand morality.

You are a liar.

But take comfort - the convenience to vocalize your moral lie has been paid for in blood. Others stood strong so that you could remain weak.

Crimson served. DID YOU, muthafucka?

the, at best irony, of those who claim to be against torture and tyranny cursing down those who do not agree with them...

what great american principles

He got exactly what he deserved for saying that shit to a vet.

 

[Yurt]

the, at best irony, of those who claim to be against torture and tyranny cursing down those who do not agree with them...

what great american principles

Americans are against profanity?

LMFAO.

fuck you mothafucka bitch ho, now shut the fuck up

 

[Yurt]

Crimson served. DID YOU, muthafucka?

the, at best irony, of those who claim to be against torture and tyranny cursing down those who do not agree with them...

what great american principles

He got exactly what he deserved for saying that shit to a vet.

oh i see, so if someone is a vet we can't believe they are liars.....

 

[CrimsonWhite]

i would rather break a treaty and save lives...

and to those who think our actions dicate how the enemy treats us, i call bullshit...tell that to the families of those who have been beheaded...

The the downfall of our society is upon us.

"Sell not virtue to purchase wealth, nor Liberty to purchase power."

 

[Indiana Oracle]

Yet another right wing wack job that does that represent or speak for all Americans. I myself believe that the torture tactics run were illegal and broke international rules of law. What gives us the right to think that we are above everyone else in the world. This is why so many hate us and want to see harm done to us, the Cheney/Rove policies that were started under Bush indeed put more harm on us and created even more enemies than before Bush took office.

You realize that is not the point of the original post?

 

[Article 15]

the, at best irony, of those who claim to be against torture and tyranny cursing down those who do not agree with them...

what great american principles

He got exactly what he deserved for saying that shit to a vet.

oh i see, so if someone is a vet we can't believe they are liars.....

Wrong.

This is what he said to a vet:

But take comfort - the convenience to vocalize your moral lie has been paid for in blood. Others stood strong so that you could remain weak.

Kind of a stupid thing to say to a veteran.

 

[CrimsonWhite]

the, at best irony, of those who claim to be against torture and tyranny cursing down those who do not agree with them...

what great american principles

He got exactly what he deserved for saying that shit to a vet.

oh i see, so if someone is a vet we can't believe they are liars.....

Sure you can, just don't expect to patted on the head for it around here.

Vets are not above reproach, but Sinatra stepped on his dick here when he turned a discusion on torture into a rant about me baing a lying liar and weak because I took a different position. I can handle being called a liar. Doesn't bother me, but I'll be damned if I'll be called weak or chastised about not respecting the debts that have been payed in blood over a position that is not that uncommon among those of us that have served.

 

[Newby]

It depends on how you define 'torture', water boarding is not torture. No one is advocating real torture of anyone, but it's easier to be irrational than to really talk about the true topic. If they find evidence of real torture, then you would see a different reaction, justifiably so.

Are you fucking kidding me? Waterboarding IS torture.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l34Tx9oAHZo&feature=related[/ame]


Did you know that waterboarding is a war crime? In 1947, a Japanese soldier who used water boarding against a U.S. citizen during World War II was sentenced to 15 years in U.S. prison for committing a war crime. (HowStuffWorks "How effective is water boarding?")

The Japanese practice of waterboarding was entirely different than what was done here. You can't compare the two issues, you need to read more about what was actually done in the water boarding sessions on American troops by the Japanese. If you did so, you would know they weren't comparable.

 

[Yurt]

He got exactly what he deserved for saying that shit to a vet.

oh i see, so if someone is a vet we can't believe they are liars.....

Wrong.

This is what he said to a vet:

But take comfort - the convenience to vocalize your moral lie has been paid for in blood. Others stood strong so that you could remain weak.

Kind of a stupid thing to say to a veteran.

i took his comment to refer to wars where our country fought for independence and gained him the right to voice his opinion....nothing at all to do with whether one serves now

 

[del]

the, at best irony, of those who claim to be against torture and tyranny cursing down those who do not agree with them...

what great american principles

He got exactly what he deserved for saying that shit to a vet.

oh i see, so if someone is a vet we can't believe they are liars.....

how is posting an opinion, lying?

you may want to reread the thread for comprehension.

 

[Yurt]

i would rather break a treaty and save lives...

and to those who think our actions dicate how the enemy treats us, i call bullshit...tell that to the families of those who have been beheaded...

The the downfall of our society is upon us.

"Sell not virtue to purchase wealth, nor Liberty to purchase power."

you do realize that our laws can be broken in times of dire need, you know, if breaking the law would save a life...

the downfall of our society is when you would rather not torture an enemy just because the law says so and instead allow thousands or more to die....pretty soon, that law isn't goign to be worth the paper it is written on, all your citizens will be dead.

 

[Newby]

I don't understand precisely what is conservative about selling out the Bill of Rights.

I don't understand precisely what is conservative about giving a president unlimited powers to put even AMERICANS in a secret prison without access to an attorney, and then torture them.

I don't understand precisely what is conservative about failing to uphold the international treaties on torture that allow US to claim the moral high ground and protect our military service personnel.

WHAT IN THE HELL HAS HAPPENED TO CONSERVATIVISM if these advocates for torture consider themselves the Republican party's self-appointed spokespeople?

Let me clue you idiots up...TORTURE BY ANY GOVERNMENT is not something that a true conservative would endorse.

I am far more frightened of my government having unlimited powers to snoop, imprison and torture than I will ever be afraid of a bunch of unorganized towel-headed criminals.

What is so hard to understand about that?

REAL CONSERVATIVES understand the inherent dangers of giving a political leader impunity from prosecution and coupling that impunity with unlimited powers that violate the Bill of Rights and international law.

It depends on how you define 'torture', water boarding is not torture. No one is advocating real torture of anyone, but it's easier to be irrational than to really talk about the true topic. If they find evidence of real torture, then you would see a different reaction, justifiably so.

Tell that to Colonel Chase Nielson. I'm pretty sure that he would say it was torture.

World War II
During World War II both Japanese troops, especially the Kempeitai, and the officers of the Gestapo,[64] the German secret police, used waterboarding as a method of torture.[65] During the Japanese occupation of Singapore the Double Tenth Incident occurred. This included waterboarding, by the method of binding or holding down the victim on his back, placing a cloth over his mouth and nose, and pouring water onto the cloth. In this version, interrogation continued during the torture, with the interrogators beating the victim if he did not reply and the victim swallowing water if he opened his mouth to answer or breathe. When the victim could ingest no more water, the interrogators would beat or jump on his distended stomach.[66][67][68]

Chase J. Nielsen, one of the U.S. airmen who flew in the Doolittle raid following the attack on Pearl Harbor, was subjected to waterboarding by his Japanese captors.[69] At their trial for war crimes following the war, he testified "Well, I was put on my back on the floor with my arms and legs stretched out, one guard holding each limb. The towel was wrapped around my face and put across my face and water poured on. They poured water on this towel until I was almost unconscious from strangulation, then they would let up until I'd get my breath, then they'd start over again… I felt more or less like I was drowning, just gasping between life and death."[29]

This doesn't sound to me like what was described during the CIA questioning sessions.

 

[CrimsonWhite]

It depends on how you define 'torture', water boarding is not torture. No one is advocating real torture of anyone, but it's easier to be irrational than to really talk about the true topic. If they find evidence of real torture, then you would see a different reaction, justifiably so.

Are you fucking kidding me? Waterboarding IS torture.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l34Tx9oAHZo&feature=related[/ame]


Did you know that waterboarding is a war crime? In 1947, a Japanese soldier who used water boarding against a U.S. citizen during World War II was sentenced to 15 years in U.S. prison for committing a war crime. (HowStuffWorks "How effective is water boarding?")

The Japanese practice of waterboarding was entirely different than what was done here. You can't compare the two issues, you need to read more about what was actually done in the water boarding sessions on American troops by the Japanese. If you did so, you would know they weren't comparable.

Funny, because Chase Nielson's account is pretty close to what we do now.

 

[Yurt]

He got exactly what he deserved for saying that shit to a vet.

oh i see, so if someone is a vet we can't believe they are liars.....

Sure you can, just don't expect to patted on the head for it around here.

Vets are not above reproach, but Sinatra stepped on his dick here when he turned a discusion on torture into a rant about me baing a lying liar and weak because I took a different position. I can handle being called a liar. Doesn't bother me, but I'll be damned if I'll be called weak or chastised about not respecting the debts that have been payed in blood over a position that is not that uncommon among those of us that have served.

so if you captured an enemy and that enemy had knowledge that if you tortured him for it you would save the life of your entire platoon, you would let them die....

is that right?

 

[catzmeow]

fuck you mothafucka bitch ho, now shut the fuck up

nice effort, but pretty fucking prosaic.

 

[Article 15]

oh i see, so if someone is a vet we can't believe they are liars.....

Wrong.

This is what he said to a vet:

But take comfort - the convenience to vocalize your moral lie has been paid for in blood. Others stood strong so that you could remain weak.

Kind of a stupid thing to say to a veteran.

i took his comment to refer to wars where our country fought for independence and gained him the right to voice his opinion....nothing at all to do with whether one serves now

Good for you. I didn't.

I took his comments as that of an arrogant jerk not having a clue who he was talking to and making an ass out of himself.

 

[Newby]

Are you fucking kidding me? Waterboarding IS torture.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l34Tx9oAHZo&feature=related


Did you know that waterboarding is a war crime? In 1947, a Japanese soldier who used water boarding against a U.S. citizen during World War II was sentenced to 15 years in U.S. prison for committing a war crime. (HowStuffWorks "How effective is water boarding?")

The Japanese practice of waterboarding was entirely different than what was done here. You can't compare the two issues, you need to read more about what was actually done in the water boarding sessions on American troops by the Japanese. If you did so, you would know they weren't comparable.

Funny, because Chase Nielson's account is pretty close to what we do now.

This included waterboarding, by the method of binding or holding down the victim on his back, placing a cloth over his mouth and nose, and pouring water onto the cloth. In this version, interrogation continued during the torture, with the interrogators beating the victim if he did not reply and the victim swallowing water if he opened his mouth to answer or breathe. When the victim could ingest no more water, the interrogators would beat or jump on his distended stomach.

Really? Doesn't sound like it to me.

 

[Chris]

Dick Cheney is what a colon doctor would call a "full release."

 

[CrimsonWhite]

oh i see, so if someone is a vet we can't believe they are liars.....

Sure you can, just don't expect to patted on the head for it around here.

Vets are not above reproach, but Sinatra stepped on his dick here when he turned a discusion on torture into a rant about me baing a lying liar and weak because I took a different position. I can handle being called a liar. Doesn't bother me, but I'll be damned if I'll be called weak or chastised about not respecting the debts that have been payed in blood over a position that is not that uncommon among those of us that have served.

so if you captured an enemy and that enemy had knowledge that if you tortured him for it you would save the life of your entire platoon, you would let them die....

is that right?

Your hypothetical is weak. Try again.