Christian Bake Shop Must Serve Gakes

[Avatar4321]

It's really messed up that there are judges think they can force people to do work for others. I could have sworn we faught a civil war to stop that kind of stuff.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Folks just are having trouble accepting that in the eyes of the law, as determined by legislation and courts have decided and determined that sexual orientation in regards to discrimination holds the same status as race, color, ethnicity, national origin, and religion. How one feels about any one of those groups is irrelevent. The law of the land says those groups can not be discriminated against. All of those groups spent time and resources to follow the process used in a democracy to change laws. No one is entitled to skip the process because they are somehow special. If people don't like the law they have the means available to follow the process and change the law. Until they do, they are required to follow the laws of the land just like everyone else.

I also had a hard time accepting that, in the eyes of the law, blacks couldn't ride in the front of the bus. What can I say, I think some things are more important than the law.

 

[Katzndogz]

The sticking point is should the baker be allowed to be an asshole bigot or not. My answer is, unless he is absolutely in love with each cause celebrated by goods ordered from his bakery, he should bake the cake and make the sale. If he refuses, he is showing an attitude that the customer is not always right. He will get a reputation of being a dis-honest broker, along with being an asshole hater.

To be quite honest, if he were not to bake the cake, he would get a reputation that he will not renounce his faith for any reason.

This is really sad. The guy is forced to choose between his faith and his livelihood. In my opinion, there is no contest, my faith always comes first.

Nicolle Martin, an attorney for Masterpiece Cakeshop, said the judge's order puts Phillips in an impossible position of going against his Christian faith.

'He can't violate his conscience in order to collect a paycheck,' she said. 'If Jack can't make wedding cakes, he can't continue to support his family. And in order to make wedding cakes, Jack must violate his belief system. That is a reprehensible choice. It is antithetical to everything America stands for.'

I'm sorry but it's not much of a faith if it requires hatred and judgment. Christianity is based on loving one's neighbor as he himself would wish to be loved. If suspicion, judgment and exclusivity is involved, that faith does not in any way represent the teachings of Jesus of Nazareth.

All faith requires judgment! At least to one's own actions and behavior. You don't have to hate someone to not commit a sin on their behalf. It is entirely possible to love someone in your heart and still not commit a personal sin just because it makes them feel better about themselves.

Jesus forgave and blessed the whore, he didn't jump up and say "I'll run out and turn a few tricks with you."

 

[Katzndogz]

Folks just are having trouble accepting that in the eyes of the law, as determined by legislation and courts have decided and determined that sexual orientation in regards to discrimination holds the same status as race, color, ethnicity, national origin, and religion. How one feels about any one of those groups is irrelevent. The law of the land says those groups can not be discriminated against. All of those groups spent time and resources to follow the process used in a democracy to change laws. No one is entitled to skip the process because they are somehow special. If people don't like the law they have the means available to follow the process and change the law. Until they do, they are required to follow the laws of the land just like everyone else.

Like any laws that facilitate degenerate behavior, those who do not want to follow perverted and degenerate laws have to find ways of following their faith within the law. It is certainly not impossible. If I can do it, anyone can do it.

 

[Camp]

Folks just are having trouble accepting that in the eyes of the law, as determined by legislation and courts have decided and determined that sexual orientation in regards to discrimination holds the same status as race, color, ethnicity, national origin, and religion. How one feels about any one of those groups is irrelevent. The law of the land says those groups can not be discriminated against. All of those groups spent time and resources to follow the process used in a democracy to change laws. No one is entitled to skip the process because they are somehow special. If people don't like the law they have the means available to follow the process and change the law. Until they do, they are required to follow the laws of the land just like everyone else.

I also had a hard time accepting that, in the eyes of the law, blacks couldn't ride in the front of the bus. What can I say, I think some things are more important than the law.

Good example. Folks used the process spelled out in our constitution to change the law because they thought the law that allowed this behavior was wrong and unconstitutional. They used their rights to public assemly, free speech, free press and petition, access to courts and the vote to legislate new law.

 

[WorldWatcher]

It's really messed up that there are judges think they can force people to do work for others. I could have sworn we faught a civil war to stop that kind of stuff.

Public Accommodation laws are written by the Congress and the Legislatures, not the Judges.

The law says that businesses can't discriminate in terms of the goods and services they provide based on race, ethnicity, gender, religion and in this case sexual orientwation (Colorado Law). Are you saying the State Judge should have been an activist and ignore the law as passed by the State Legislature?


>>>>

 

[manifold]

Folks just are having trouble accepting that in the eyes of the law, as determined by legislation and courts have decided and determined that sexual orientation in regards to discrimination holds the same status as race, color, ethnicity, national origin, and religion. How one feels about any one of those groups is irrelevent. The law of the land says those groups can not be discriminated against. All of those groups spent time and resources to follow the process used in a democracy to change laws. No one is entitled to skip the process because they are somehow special. If people don't like the law they have the means available to follow the process and change the law. Until they do, they are required to follow the laws of the land just like everyone else.

Yup.

So the next time a business owner wants to refuse service to a queer he'll know he has to give some other reason, or no reason at all.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Folks just are having trouble accepting that in the eyes of the law, as determined by legislation and courts have decided and determined that sexual orientation in regards to discrimination holds the same status as race, color, ethnicity, national origin, and religion. How one feels about any one of those groups is irrelevent. The law of the land says those groups can not be discriminated against. All of those groups spent time and resources to follow the process used in a democracy to change laws. No one is entitled to skip the process because they are somehow special. If people don't like the law they have the means available to follow the process and change the law. Until they do, they are required to follow the laws of the land just like everyone else.

Like any laws that facilitate degenerate behavior, those who do not want to follow perverted and degenerate laws have to find ways of following their faith within the law. It is certainly not impossible. If I can do it, anyone can do it.

Acts 5:28-29.

 

[Katzndogz]

Folks just are having trouble accepting that in the eyes of the law, as determined by legislation and courts have decided and determined that sexual orientation in regards to discrimination holds the same status as race, color, ethnicity, national origin, and religion. How one feels about any one of those groups is irrelevent. The law of the land says those groups can not be discriminated against. All of those groups spent time and resources to follow the process used in a democracy to change laws. No one is entitled to skip the process because they are somehow special. If people don't like the law they have the means available to follow the process and change the law. Until they do, they are required to follow the laws of the land just like everyone else.

Yup.

So the next time a business owner wants to refuse service to a queer he'll know he has to give some other reason, or no reason at all.

Or, say "That's not a service that we offer. If you want that service, I can perform it as a personal favor and I don't feel like doing you a favor."

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Folks just are having trouble accepting that in the eyes of the law, as determined by legislation and courts have decided and determined that sexual orientation in regards to discrimination holds the same status as race, color, ethnicity, national origin, and religion. How one feels about any one of those groups is irrelevent. The law of the land says those groups can not be discriminated against. All of those groups spent time and resources to follow the process used in a democracy to change laws. No one is entitled to skip the process because they are somehow special. If people don't like the law they have the means available to follow the process and change the law. Until they do, they are required to follow the laws of the land just like everyone else.

I also had a hard time accepting that, in the eyes of the law, blacks couldn't ride in the front of the bus. What can I say, I think some things are more important than the law.

Good example. Folks used the process spelled out in our constitution to change the law because they thought the law that allowed this behavior was wrong and unconstitutional. They used their rights to public assemly, free speech, free press and petition, access to courts and the vote to legislate new law.

Stupid is as stupid does.

People disobeyed the laws because they were wrong. Bad laws do not go away if you pretend that law trumps justice, they get worse. It wasn't until people got up and were willing to go to jail because the laws were wrong that anything got accomplished. Most of those laws are still on the books because they were never changed, they just got to expensive to enforce.

Come back when you live in the real world.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

It's really messed up that there are judges think they can force people to do work for others. I could have sworn we faught a civil war to stop that kind of stuff.

Public Accommodation laws are written by the Congress and the Legislatures, not the Judges.

The law says that businesses can't discriminate in terms of the goods and services they provide based on race, ethnicity, gender, religion and in this case sexual orientwation (Colorado Law). Are you saying the State Judge should have been an activist and ignore the law as passed by the State Legislature?


>>>>

And they are wrong, period.

 

[manifold]

Folks just are having trouble accepting that in the eyes of the law, as determined by legislation and courts have decided and determined that sexual orientation in regards to discrimination holds the same status as race, color, ethnicity, national origin, and religion. How one feels about any one of those groups is irrelevent. The law of the land says those groups can not be discriminated against. All of those groups spent time and resources to follow the process used in a democracy to change laws. No one is entitled to skip the process because they are somehow special. If people don't like the law they have the means available to follow the process and change the law. Until they do, they are required to follow the laws of the land just like everyone else.

Yup.

So the next time a business owner wants to refuse service to a queer he'll know he has to give some other reason, or no reason at all.

Or, say "That's not a service that we offer. If you want that service, I can perform it as a personal favor and I don't feel like doing you a favor."

I'm sorry, but your breath smells of santorum and therefore I don't want you in my shop.

 

[Katzndogz]

Yup.

So the next time a business owner wants to refuse service to a queer he'll know he has to give some other reason, or no reason at all.

Or, say "That's not a service that we offer. If you want that service, I can perform it as a personal favor and I don't feel like doing you a favor."

I'm sorry, but your breath smells of santorum and therefore I don't want you in my shop.

In a better world, that would be the law.

 

[Jarlaxle]

What ever happen to the right to refuse service on private property?
Here's a suggestion sale them a gake at 10,000

If you're open to the public, you do not have the right to refuse service.

I'd serve them a shity tasting cake.

I might put 10x the normal amount of salt in it....or simply add a cup of sand to the batter. Maybe put vinegar in the frosting.

 

[Jarlaxle]

Your business would fail. You'd have the rep of a business owner who does not believe that the customer is always right and therefore should not be trusted.

Funny how market forces justify societal evolution, ain't it?

Hows so? Are you suggesting that their are no bakeries other than that one, the faggots could have gone too? those faggots are only doing this as some fucked political statement
And Your cake would be uneatable and the price would cost you at least 1000

Don't you understand by now that bigots and idiots never last long in business? That 'exclusive' personality trait only serves angry White Republican men and is always roundly rejected by the sane people who make up the majority of the world. That's why it always fails in business and politics and ultimately in life..

You truly are the STUPIDEST person in the world...

 

[Nosmo King]

To be quite honest, if he were not to bake the cake, he would get a reputation that he will not renounce his faith for any reason.

This is really sad. The guy is forced to choose between his faith and his livelihood. In my opinion, there is no contest, my faith always comes first.

I'm sorry but it's not much of a faith if it requires hatred and judgment. Christianity is based on loving one's neighbor as he himself would wish to be loved. If suspicion, judgment and exclusivity is involved, that faith does not in any way represent the teachings of Jesus of Nazareth.

Please stop pretending you understand something you never paid attention to, I really don't want to bitch slap you for being a complete ignoramus.

By the way, trying to use the Bible to justify your politics generally gets a neg, even if I agree with the politics. I will give you a pass this time because you, obviously, never read it, but don't let it happen again.

Are you negging the folks who are hiding behind the skirts of Christianity to justify their politics? Above and beyond their mis-understanding of the law and the judicial rulings of that law, they are relying on the Bible to justify their politics. It's their one and only defense in this case.

And I take umbrage at your suggestion that I don't know the Bible. My use of the Bible is that of the words of Jesus of Nazareth and His mandate to love one another. There is no inaccuracy in my Biblical reference, neither is there any parsing, equivocation or lie. You, sir, owe me an apology on this point.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

If you're open to the public, you do not have the right to refuse service.

I'd serve them a shity tasting cake.

I might put 10x the normal amount of salt in it....or simply add a cup of sand to the batter. Maybe put vinegar in the frosting.

Or the TERRIBLE AWFUL!

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QB2bnQfqZvM]The Terrible Awful - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Jarlaxle]

Well, I would then advertise "standard wedding cakes", no customization possible. As customized cakes are not available to the general public, then they would also not be available to the gay couple.

Anyone making wedding cakes who refuses to provide customized cakes, will not be in business for long. Custom cakes is the only way you can make money in the wedding business.

Being gay isn't a choice. I didn't wake up one day and make a decision to date men and be a heterosexual person. It's who I am. Being gay is the same. God made some people gay and God doesn't make mistakes.

Jesus was very clear that you have no right to judge others and treat them badly because they are sinners. If you believe being gay is a sin, you should not refuse any kindness to a gay person.

Imagine how God will feel towards you for your treatment of His children.

Being a vicious, vindictive bitch determined to ram your lifestyle down everyone's throat IS a choice!

 

[Nosmo King]

Hows so? Are you suggesting that their are no bakeries other than that one, the faggots could have gone too? those faggots are only doing this as some fucked political statement
And Your cake would be uneatable and the price would cost you at least 1000

Don't you understand by now that bigots and idiots never last long in business? That 'exclusive' personality trait only serves angry White Republican men and is always roundly rejected by the sane people who make up the majority of the world. That's why it always fails in business and politics and ultimately in life..

You truly are the STUPIDEST person in the world...

Where in the world are bigots flourishing? Only in repressive states. You are, as all Social Conservatives, way behind the curve of history. The American people are increasingly tolerant of homosexuals and increasingly willing to extend homosexuals all the rights enjoyed by all Americans.

Stupid? Because I recognize the basic American virtues of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness? What kind of American are you if you hold those truths as stupid?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

I'm sorry but it's not much of a faith if it requires hatred and judgment. Christianity is based on loving one's neighbor as he himself would wish to be loved. If suspicion, judgment and exclusivity is involved, that faith does not in any way represent the teachings of Jesus of Nazareth.

Please stop pretending you understand something you never paid attention to, I really don't want to bitch slap you for being a complete ignoramus.

By the way, trying to use the Bible to justify your politics generally gets a neg, even if I agree with the politics. I will give you a pass this time because you, obviously, never read it, but don't let it happen again.

Are you negging the folks who are hiding behind the skirts of Christianity to justify their politics? Above and beyond their mis-understanding of the law and the judicial rulings of that law, they are relying on the Bible to justify their politics. It's their one and only defense in this case.

And I take umbrage at your suggestion that I don't know the Bible. My use of the Bible is that of the words of Jesus of Nazareth and His mandate to love one another. There is no inaccuracy in my Biblical reference, neither is there any parsing, equivocation or lie. You, sir, owe me an apology on this point.

Don't say I didn't warn you.

34 “A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. 35 By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.”

Wow, look at that, Jesus specifically said that people, like the idiots that attempt to misquote him, could tell who his disciples are by the love they have for each other. That is not a command to love sinners, nor is it an excuse for idiots to make believers feel guilty because they don't love sinners.

Like I said, you have, obviously, never read the Bible. Either that, or you are a lying scumbag who is deliberately misrepresenting the words of a man who is widely recognized as a wise and compassionate teacher.