Church denies funeral to gay man

[Andylusion]

"I still have no problem calling you a false prophet," Androw, for you mistake your relationship to scripture as if you had one with Jesus.

I now have you and the others by name above in our prayer circle, asking for the Lord's lave and witness in your live.

That's fine. You can call me anything you want.

Still don't care.

 

[ChrisL]

I think it is rotten, and the farthest thing from being "Godly." Jesus would NEVER turn a person away from God.

I find this to be the case with a lot of "churches" though. Aside from not preaching violence, they really aren't much different than your typical mosque in the Middle East, teaching hatred and intolerance.

Of course, we all know their decisions are based upon donations by their parishioners, so they have to keep the hateful ones happy too.

Um... I don't think so... We had a guy who gave tons of money to the church, but was cheating on his wife. We kicked him out. Adultery is a sin too. We don't treat it any different.

I'm always confused by this. Years ago, I decided I wanted volunteer at a charity, and one that I particularly liked, and donated money too, was a battered women's shelter.

Well of course they turned me down. I was oblivious to why, and was kind of put off by it.

They sent me a letter and explained... Duh... these were women who were abused by men. They want to feel safe with other women, and no men are allowed there. (and of course there are other reasons as well).

Did they 'hate me'? Were these Christians (it was a christian run shelter), pushing me away from G-d? Should I have been sending them letters saying "Jesus would NEVER turn a person away!"?

Of course not. They didn't hate me. I just didn't fit with their plan. Their organization had a doctrine that excluded me.

If I eat meat every day (which I do), I can't join PETA. They won't accept me. I don't play golf. I can't join the US Golf team. None of these people HATE me. I just don't fit with their doctrine, or requirements.

My Church has a set of beliefs. One of those beliefs, is Romans 1:18-32, which states very clearly that Homosexuality is a sin. So what do we do with members engaging in clearly defined sin? 1 Corinthians 5:1-5.

We remove them. Which is again, a clearly defined Biblical action.

You people seem to have a made up 'jesus' that doesn't exist, that never talked harshly, never required anyone to do anything, never had standards that people had to meet to be accepted by him.

That's not the real Jesus. Jesus talked very harshly to people, and if they didn't repent, he didn't accept them. Have none of you read the parables? Take the wedding banquet in Matthew 22:1-14

Those servants went out into the highways, and gathered together as many as they found, both bad and good. The wedding was filled with guests. But when the king came in to see the guests, he saw there a man who didn't have on wedding clothing, and he said to him, 'Friend, how did you come in here not wearing wedding clothing?' He was speechless. Then the king said to the servants, 'Bind him hand and foot, take him away, and throw him into the outer darkness; there is where the weeping and grinding of teeth will be.' For many are called, but few chosen.

That's Jesus talking. What's he saying? You have to repent! Many called to repent, and those that do, will be forgiven and accepted.

But if you think that because you are invited, that you can come without repenting, you will be like the guy who showed up in his rags, not ready for the wedding feast. He was tossed out.

People..... you are invited to follow Christ. And I promise you, if you repent of your evil, no matter what it is... you WILL be forgiven and accepted by Christ, and you are more than welcome at our church, and most Christian churches. Not all... there are some that hold it over your head, but forget those people.

But on the other hand, if you are not going to repent "and you should love me regardless, because you ought to!" and "nothing I do is wrong, and this is my choice, my life style, my blaw blaw blaw".... No. Thanks for stopping by. Have a nice life. Good luck with that. Don't hate you.... just not what our Church stands for.

Honestly, that sounds like a place I want no part of anyway. I have to say, that sounds evil to me. I think your church is not what you think it is.

I believe that Jesus was a good person who had a good message though. Too bad so many people ignore him and concentrate on the hateful parts of the Bible.

I have a different idea of man-made religion than you do, so it's only natural that we are going to disagree on this point,and probably many, many others too.

 

[ChrisL]

No, Jesus would not turn a person away who asked Him to be forgiven, however, He did teach about those who choose not to choose God over the world.

Luke 12: …18"Then he said, 'This is what I will do: I will tear down my barns and build larger ones, and there I will store all my grain and my goods. 19And I will say to my soul, "Soul, you have many goods laid up for many years to come; take your ease, eat, drink and be merry."' 20"But God said to him, 'You fool! This very night your soul is required of you; and now who will own what you have prepared?'…

Luke 16: …22"Now the poor man died and was carried away by the angels to Abraham's bosom; and the rich man also died and was buried. 23"In Hades he lifted up his eyes, being in torment, and saw Abraham far away and Lazarus in his bosom. 24"And he cried out and said, 'Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus so that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool off my tongue, for I am in agony in this flame.'……25"But Abraham said, 'Child, remember that during your life you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus bad things; but now he is being comforted here, and you are in agony. 26And besides all this, between us and you there is a great chasm fixed, so that those who wish to come over from here to you will not be able, and that none may cross over from there to us.'…27"And he said, 'Then I beg you, father, that you send him to my father's house-- 28for I have five brothers-- in order that he may warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.' 29"But Abraham said, 'They have Moses and the Prophets; let them hear them.'…

If it is hateful and intolerant to teach what Jesus taught, then you will call me hateful and intolerant. Jesus taught much more than just 'love thy neighbor' problem is, people want to pick and choose which verses they want to keep, instead of keeping all of them.

No way. If Jesus believed they had sinned, he would have forgiven them and made sure they got into the Kingdom of Heaven.

Do you think a gay person who is a good person, who volunteers, helps others, etc., should go to HELL simply because of his sexual orientation? I'm sorry, I don't believe that Jesus would EVER be that cold.

Good works don't get you into the Kingdom. No matter how many of them you do.

John 14: 6Jesus said to him, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me.

Titus 3:5He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit,

Ephesians 2:8For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; 9not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.…

No one will be in the Kingdom, just because of the good works they did on earth. If they are not washed in the blood of Christ, then they will not be there. This is what Jesus taught, if you don't believe it, then you don't believe in Him.

No, I probably don't believe in "Him" in the same way that you do.

 

[BillyP]

2 Peter 1:20But know this first of all, that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of one's own interpretation,

NIV version: Above all, you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture came about by the prophet's own interpretation of things.

NET Bible: Above all, you do well if you recognize this: No prophecy of scripture ever comes about by the prophet's own imagination,

Weymouth New Testament: But, above all, remember that no prophecy in Scripture will be found to have come from the prophet's own prompting;

Young's Literal translation: this first knowing, that no prophecy of the Writing doth come of private exposition,

All that is included in the Bible, is the Word of God, and I am sorry that you hate that, Billy.

I don't hate it, I'm just trying to help you not be so deluded since the bible is fiction, written by men several generations after the "fact". Meaning there's no proof that any of the bible is the word of god. None. Plus, don't you think that it's kind of dumb that god would punish you for not obeying a book?

There is plenty of proof, if you know what to look for. Do you think it is kind of dumb for a parent to punish a child for not obeying what the parent said?

If you blindly read it in a book without questioning the thousands of inconsistencies and outright bs, well, then yes, that would be dumb, and for sure not good for the child to be scolded for not following a book of fiction. When that kid grows up, he'll think, gee, my dad sure is a doofus.

 

[Andylusion]

I think it is rotten, and the farthest thing from being "Godly." Jesus would NEVER turn a person away from God.

I find this to be the case with a lot of "churches" though. Aside from not preaching violence, they really aren't much different than your typical mosque in the Middle East, teaching hatred and intolerance.

Of course, we all know their decisions are based upon donations by their parishioners, so they have to keep the hateful ones happy too.

Um... I don't think so... We had a guy who gave tons of money to the church, but was cheating on his wife. We kicked him out. Adultery is a sin too. We don't treat it any different.

I'm always confused by this. Years ago, I decided I wanted volunteer at a charity, and one that I particularly liked, and donated money too, was a battered women's shelter.

Well of course they turned me down. I was oblivious to why, and was kind of put off by it.

They sent me a letter and explained... Duh... these were women who were abused by men. They want to feel safe with other women, and no men are allowed there. (and of course there are other reasons as well).

Did they 'hate me'? Were these Christians (it was a christian run shelter), pushing me away from G-d? Should I have been sending them letters saying "Jesus would NEVER turn a person away!"?

Of course not. They didn't hate me. I just didn't fit with their plan. Their organization had a doctrine that excluded me.

If I eat meat every day (which I do), I can't join PETA. They won't accept me. I don't play golf. I can't join the US Golf team. None of these people HATE me. I just don't fit with their doctrine, or requirements.

My Church has a set of beliefs. One of those beliefs, is Romans 1:18-32, which states very clearly that Homosexuality is a sin. So what do we do with members engaging in clearly defined sin? 1 Corinthians 5:1-5.

We remove them. Which is again, a clearly defined Biblical action.

You people seem to have a made up 'jesus' that doesn't exist, that never talked harshly, never required anyone to do anything, never had standards that people had to meet to be accepted by him.

That's not the real Jesus. Jesus talked very harshly to people, and if they didn't repent, he didn't accept them. Have none of you read the parables? Take the wedding banquet in Matthew 22:1-14

Those servants went out into the highways, and gathered together as many as they found, both bad and good. The wedding was filled with guests. But when the king came in to see the guests, he saw there a man who didn't have on wedding clothing, and he said to him, 'Friend, how did you come in here not wearing wedding clothing?' He was speechless. Then the king said to the servants, 'Bind him hand and foot, take him away, and throw him into the outer darkness; there is where the weeping and grinding of teeth will be.' For many are called, but few chosen.

That's Jesus talking. What's he saying? You have to repent! Many called to repent, and those that do, will be forgiven and accepted.

But if you think that because you are invited, that you can come without repenting, you will be like the guy who showed up in his rags, not ready for the wedding feast. He was tossed out.

People..... you are invited to follow Christ. And I promise you, if you repent of your evil, no matter what it is... you WILL be forgiven and accepted by Christ, and you are more than welcome at our church, and most Christian churches. Not all... there are some that hold it over your head, but forget those people.

But on the other hand, if you are not going to repent "and you should love me regardless, because you ought to!" and "nothing I do is wrong, and this is my choice, my life style, my blaw blaw blaw".... No. Thanks for stopping by. Have a nice life. Good luck with that. Don't hate you.... just not what our Church stands for.

Honestly, that sounds like a place I want no part of anyway. I have to say, that sounds evil to me. I think your church is not what you think it is.

I believe that Jesus was a good person who had a good message though. Too bad so many people ignore him and concentrate on the hateful parts of the Bible.

I have a different idea of man-made religion than you do, so it's only natural that we are going to disagree on this point,and probably many, many others too.

That's fine. I can buy that last part fine.

But you say you wouldn't want to be part of a church like that.

Ok.... What is the alternative? A church that doesn't kick people out who fragrantly sin against G-d?

Would you want to be part of a church that operates that way? Really?

I'm just asking. You tell me.

Because there are Churches that do operate that way.

[ame=http://youtu.be/Ti210wRCXvc]Adultery - YouTube[/ame]

Commit adultery on your spouse... it's ok... we forgive... don't push anyone away... Jesus never sent anyone away for sin.

If your husband was cheating on you, and was administrator at the church... would you be so keen on not removing him?

 

[UllysesS.Archer]

I think it is rotten, and the farthest thing from being "Godly." Jesus would NEVER turn a person away from God.

I find this to be the case with a lot of "churches" though. Aside from not preaching violence, they really aren't much different than your typical mosque in the Middle East, teaching hatred and intolerance.

Of course, we all know their decisions are based upon donations by their parishioners, so they have to keep the hateful ones happy too.

Um... I don't think so... We had a guy who gave tons of money to the church, but was cheating on his wife. We kicked him out. Adultery is a sin too. We don't treat it any different.

I'm always confused by this. Years ago, I decided I wanted volunteer at a charity, and one that I particularly liked, and donated money too, was a battered women's shelter.

Well of course they turned me down. I was oblivious to why, and was kind of put off by it.

They sent me a letter and explained... Duh... these were women who were abused by men. They want to feel safe with other women, and no men are allowed there. (and of course there are other reasons as well).

Did they 'hate me'? Were these Christians (it was a christian run shelter), pushing me away from G-d? Should I have been sending them letters saying "Jesus would NEVER turn a person away!"?

Of course not. They didn't hate me. I just didn't fit with their plan. Their organization had a doctrine that excluded me.

If I eat meat every day (which I do), I can't join PETA. They won't accept me. I don't play golf. I can't join the US Golf team. None of these people HATE me. I just don't fit with their doctrine, or requirements.

My Church has a set of beliefs. One of those beliefs, is Romans 1:18-32, which states very clearly that Homosexuality is a sin. So what do we do with members engaging in clearly defined sin? 1 Corinthians 5:1-5.

We remove them. Which is again, a clearly defined Biblical action.

You people seem to have a made up 'jesus' that doesn't exist, that never talked harshly, never required anyone to do anything, never had standards that people had to meet to be accepted by him.

That's not the real Jesus. Jesus talked very harshly to people, and if they didn't repent, he didn't accept them. Have none of you read the parables? Take the wedding banquet in Matthew 22:1-14

Those servants went out into the highways, and gathered together as many as they found, both bad and good. The wedding was filled with guests. But when the king came in to see the guests, he saw there a man who didn't have on wedding clothing, and he said to him, 'Friend, how did you come in here not wearing wedding clothing?' He was speechless. Then the king said to the servants, 'Bind him hand and foot, take him away, and throw him into the outer darkness; there is where the weeping and grinding of teeth will be.' For many are called, but few chosen.

That's Jesus talking. What's he saying? You have to repent! Many called to repent, and those that do, will be forgiven and accepted.

But if you think that because you are invited, that you can come without repenting, you will be like the guy who showed up in his rags, not ready for the wedding feast. He was tossed out.

People..... you are invited to follow Christ. And I promise you, if you repent of your evil, no matter what it is... you WILL be forgiven and accepted by Christ, and you are more than welcome at our church, and most Christian churches. Not all... there are some that hold it over your head, but forget those people.

But on the other hand, if you are not going to repent "and you should love me regardless, because you ought to!" and "nothing I do is wrong, and this is my choice, my life style, my blaw blaw blaw".... No. Thanks for stopping by. Have a nice life. Good luck with that. Don't hate you.... just not what our Church stands for.

Thus it came to pass the heretic reveals his lack of understanding and his error.

The Bible is not literal, and those who follow it as so plunge over the cliff into the lake of confusion.

Oh Jake, I did warn you.

Matthew 12:31"Therefore I say to you, any sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven people, but blasphemy against the Spirit shall not be forgiven. 32"Whoever speaks a word against the Son of Man, it shall be forgiven him; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit, it shall not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come.

Have you committed the unforgiveable sin Jake? For Jesus believed the Bible to be literal.

 

[JakeStarkey]

"I still have no problem calling you a false prophet," Androw, for you mistake your relationship to scripture as if you had one with Jesus.

I now have you and the others by name above in our prayer circle, asking for the Lord's love and witness in your live.

That's fine. You can call me anything you want. Still don't care.

I know you don't now, for that is the heretic's path, but you will. Have a great day.

 

[UllysesS.Archer]

"I still have no problem calling you a false prophet," Androw, for you mistake your relationship to scripture as if you had one with Jesus.

I now have you and the others by name above in our prayer circle, asking for the Lord's lave and witness in your live.

Jake, I want nothing to do with your lord. Your lord was put to shame before Job, your lord was rebuked by Jesus, your lord is satan, lord of lies and deceit, and you serve him well.

Luke 4:1Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, left the Jordan and was led by the Spirit into the wilderness, 2where for forty days he was tempted by the devil. He ate nothing during those days, and at the end of them he was hungry.

3The devil said to him, “If you are the Son of God, tell this stone to become bread.”

4Jesus answered, “It is written: ‘Man shall not live on bread alone.’ ”

5The devil led him up to a high place and showed him in an instant all the kingdoms of the world. 6And he said to him, “I will give you all their authority and splendor; it has been given to me, and I can give it to anyone I want to. 7If you worship me, it will all be yours.”

8Jesus answered, “It is written: ‘Worship the Lord your God and serve him only.’ ”

9The devil led him to Jerusalem and had him stand on the highest point of the temple. “If you are the Son of God,” he said, “throw yourself down from here. 10For it is written:


“ ‘He will command his angels concerning you

to guard you carefully;

11they will lift you up in their hands,

so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.’ ”

12Jesus answered, “It is said: ‘Do not put the Lord your God to the test.’ ”

13When the devil had finished all this tempting, he left him until an opportune time.

 

[ChrisL]

Um... I don't think so... We had a guy who gave tons of money to the church, but was cheating on his wife. We kicked him out. Adultery is a sin too. We don't treat it any different.

I'm always confused by this. Years ago, I decided I wanted volunteer at a charity, and one that I particularly liked, and donated money too, was a battered women's shelter.

Well of course they turned me down. I was oblivious to why, and was kind of put off by it.

They sent me a letter and explained... Duh... these were women who were abused by men. They want to feel safe with other women, and no men are allowed there. (and of course there are other reasons as well).

Did they 'hate me'? Were these Christians (it was a christian run shelter), pushing me away from G-d? Should I have been sending them letters saying "Jesus would NEVER turn a person away!"?

Of course not. They didn't hate me. I just didn't fit with their plan. Their organization had a doctrine that excluded me.

If I eat meat every day (which I do), I can't join PETA. They won't accept me. I don't play golf. I can't join the US Golf team. None of these people HATE me. I just don't fit with their doctrine, or requirements.

My Church has a set of beliefs. One of those beliefs, is Romans 1:18-32, which states very clearly that Homosexuality is a sin. So what do we do with members engaging in clearly defined sin? 1 Corinthians 5:1-5.

We remove them. Which is again, a clearly defined Biblical action.

You people seem to have a made up 'jesus' that doesn't exist, that never talked harshly, never required anyone to do anything, never had standards that people had to meet to be accepted by him.

That's not the real Jesus. Jesus talked very harshly to people, and if they didn't repent, he didn't accept them. Have none of you read the parables? Take the wedding banquet in Matthew 22:1-14



That's Jesus talking. What's he saying? You have to repent! Many called to repent, and those that do, will be forgiven and accepted.

But if you think that because you are invited, that you can come without repenting, you will be like the guy who showed up in his rags, not ready for the wedding feast. He was tossed out.

People..... you are invited to follow Christ. And I promise you, if you repent of your evil, no matter what it is... you WILL be forgiven and accepted by Christ, and you are more than welcome at our church, and most Christian churches. Not all... there are some that hold it over your head, but forget those people.

But on the other hand, if you are not going to repent "and you should love me regardless, because you ought to!" and "nothing I do is wrong, and this is my choice, my life style, my blaw blaw blaw".... No. Thanks for stopping by. Have a nice life. Good luck with that. Don't hate you.... just not what our Church stands for.

Honestly, that sounds like a place I want no part of anyway. I have to say, that sounds evil to me. I think your church is not what you think it is.

I believe that Jesus was a good person who had a good message though. Too bad so many people ignore him and concentrate on the hateful parts of the Bible.

I have a different idea of man-made religion than you do, so it's only natural that we are going to disagree on this point,and probably many, many others too.

That's fine. I can buy that last part fine.

But you say you wouldn't want to be part of a church like that.

Ok.... What is the alternative? A church that doesn't kick people out who fragrantly sin against G-d?

Would you want to be part of a church that operates that way? Really?

I'm just asking. You tell me.

Because there are Churches that do operate that way.

[ame=http://youtu.be/Ti210wRCXvc]Adultery - YouTube[/ame]

Commit adultery on your spouse... it's ok... we forgive... don't push anyone away... Jesus never sent anyone away for sin.

If your husband was cheating on you, and was administrator at the church... would you be so keen on not removing him?

I guess that depends on the situation. I'm not a member of any church though. Also, I don't think that homosexuality is necessarily a sin anyways. I don't think it makes a person bad or evil. I just think homosexuals are people who have their wires crossed, and they can't help it.

There are a lot of things that considered "sins" by the man-made religions that I don't and never would buy into because it, if you have any kind of education, it goes against common sense and modern knowledge of the world IMO.

However, I think that MOST religious people have their hearts in the right place. For instance, my auntie is a very religious woman. I love her to pieces though!

 

[JakeStarkey]

Oh Jake, I did warn you. Matthew 12:31"Therefore I say to you, any sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven people, but blasphemy against the Spirit shall not be forgiven. 32"Whoever speaks a word against the Son of Man, it shall be forgiven him; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit, it shall not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come. Have you committed the unforgiveable sin Jake? For Jesus believed the Bible to be literal.

Yes, we know what Matthew thought. Jesus is not a shape shifter or a magician as you seem to think Ullyses. You are the perfect example of the heresy of evangelicalism, fundamentalism, and Pentecostalism, worldly sects in which their followers blaspheme the Lord as if they were speaking in His words.

 

[UllysesS.Archer]

Oh Jake, I did warn you. Matthew 12:31"Therefore I say to you, any sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven people, but blasphemy against the Spirit shall not be forgiven. 32", it shall be forgiven him; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit, it shall not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come. Have you committed the unforgiveable sin Jake? For Jesus believed the Bible to be literal.

Yes, we know what Matthew thought. Jesus is not a shape shifter or a magician as you seem to think Ullyses. You are the perfect example of the heresy of evangelicalism, fundamentalism, and Pentecostalism, worldly sects in which their followers blaspheme the Lord as if they were speaking in His words.

You still have learned nothing. You know nothing of the Bible or of Jesus. For the most important things are written time and again.

Luke 12:10"And everyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but he who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him.

Those are Jesus' words, not Luke's words, Luke, who was a doctor and well educated, just wrote them down.

I got you Jake, you took the bait and hit the line, and I hooked you for the false prophet you are. Now go away Jake, live your life, and move to southern Florida, it gets hot there and you will need to get used to the heat.

 

[Andylusion]

Honestly, that sounds like a place I want no part of anyway. I have to say, that sounds evil to me. I think your church is not what you think it is.

I believe that Jesus was a good person who had a good message though. Too bad so many people ignore him and concentrate on the hateful parts of the Bible.

I have a different idea of man-made religion than you do, so it's only natural that we are going to disagree on this point,and probably many, many others too.

That's fine. I can buy that last part fine.

But you say you wouldn't want to be part of a church like that.

Ok.... What is the alternative? A church that doesn't kick people out who fragrantly sin against G-d?

Would you want to be part of a church that operates that way? Really?

I'm just asking. You tell me.

Because there are Churches that do operate that way.

[ame=http://youtu.be/Ti210wRCXvc]Adultery - YouTube[/ame]

Commit adultery on your spouse... it's ok... we forgive... don't push anyone away... Jesus never sent anyone away for sin.

If your husband was cheating on you, and was administrator at the church... would you be so keen on not removing him?

I guess that depends on the situation. I'm not a member of any church though. Also, I don't think that homosexuality is necessarily a sin anyways. I don't think it makes a person bad or evil. I just think homosexuals are people who have their wires crossed, and they can't help it.

There are a lot of things that considered "sins" by the man-made religions that I don't and never would buy into because it, if you have any kind of education, it goes against common sense and modern knowledge of the world IMO.

However, I think that MOST religious people have their hearts in the right place. For instance, my auntie is a very religious woman. I love her to pieces though!

If all belief systems are man made, then who are you to say others are doing wrong? Isn't it just your opinion against their opinion?

Again, it doesn't matter if they are a 'bad person' or not. If you have a belief system, then that system has rules. If they don't follow the rules, then that's all there is to it.

You live in a house, I assume. And I would also assume that there are rules for being your home. If I come to your home, and violate those rules, will kick me out? If your children break the rules, does that mean they are evil and satanic, or did they just violate the rules, and thus you discipline them?

If you are single, I would assume you likely have rules for people you date. If your date slaps you, you likely are going to terminate that date. Maybe he's a really decent person, but you don't put up with being slapped. Or maybe he smells. You don't date a guy who smells. You have rules in your life. Those that violate your rules for your life, maybe are not evil.... but they still violated your rules.

Churches have rules. Why are they not allowed to impose their rules for their people in their church, but you are allowed to impose your rules on people in your life?

I'm just asking. Not attacking you. These are just questions.

 

[ChrisL]

That's fine. I can buy that last part fine.

But you say you wouldn't want to be part of a church like that.

Ok.... What is the alternative? A church that doesn't kick people out who fragrantly sin against G-d?

Would you want to be part of a church that operates that way? Really?

I'm just asking. You tell me.

Because there are Churches that do operate that way.

Adultery - YouTube

Commit adultery on your spouse... it's ok... we forgive... don't push anyone away... Jesus never sent anyone away for sin.

If your husband was cheating on you, and was administrator at the church... would you be so keen on not removing him?

I guess that depends on the situation. I'm not a member of any church though. Also, I don't think that homosexuality is necessarily a sin anyways. I don't think it makes a person bad or evil. I just think homosexuals are people who have their wires crossed, and they can't help it.

There are a lot of things that considered "sins" by the man-made religions that I don't and never would buy into because it, if you have any kind of education, it goes against common sense and modern knowledge of the world IMO.

However, I think that MOST religious people have their hearts in the right place. For instance, my auntie is a very religious woman. I love her to pieces though!

If all belief systems are man made, then who are you to say others are doing wrong? Isn't it just your opinion against their opinion?

Again, it doesn't matter if they are a 'bad person' or not. If you have a belief system, then that system has rules. If they don't follow the rules, then that's all there is to it.

You live in a house, I assume. And I would also assume that there are rules for being your home. If I come to your home, and violate those rules, will kick me out? If your children break the rules, does that mean they are evil and satanic, or did they just violate the rules, and thus you discipline them?

If you are single, I would assume you likely have rules for people you date. If your date slaps you, you likely are going to terminate that date. Maybe he's a really decent person, but you don't put up with being slapped. Or maybe he smells. You don't date a guy who smells. You have rules in your life. Those that violate your rules for your life, maybe are not evil.... but they still violated your rules.

Churches have rules. Why are they not allowed to impose their rules for their people in their church, but you are allowed to impose your rules on people in your life?

I'm just asking. Not attacking you. These are just questions.

Well, in reality, I'm not the one saying anyone is doing wrong. You and your church are the ones doing that.

 

[Mertex]

You should get to know Jesus better, and make Him your Lord. For obviously, He is not.

From your statement, and others I have seen posted by you, I would assume Lucifer to be your lord, if you actually have one.

Questioning another's faith is not very Christian. The Pharisees were very good at pointing other's sins not realizing their own sins. Accusing someone who claims to be a Christian to be a follower of Satan puts you in a very precarious position. Only Jesus knows such things and Jesus you are not.

Actually, judging someone who claims to be a Christian is demanded of other Christians.

And you know for a fact that he is "immoral," "covetous,", "idolater" or a reviler? Even if he were all those things, if he has accepted Jesus, it is up to Jesus to change him, not you. Jesus commanded you to love even your enemies and to win others to Him. Do you think you are going to win others to Him by telling them they are of the Devil? You have a lot to learn. You are placing yourself above others, and like I said, a very precarious position.

1 Corinthians 5: …11But actually, I wrote to you not to associate with any so-called brother if he is an immoral person, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or a swindler-- not even to eat with such a one. 12For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Do you not judge those who are within the church? 13But those who are outside, God judges. REMOVE THE WICKED MAN FROM AMONG YOURSELVES

And Jesus tells us how to judge

John 7:24"Do not judge according to appearance, but judge with righteous judgment."

Now, this gives Christians the right to judge others who call themselves Christian, and it is something that has been abandoned, but Jesus does expect us to keep His Church as pure as possible, and without pretenders, when we find them.

Christians do not have the right to pass judgment on unbelievers, that is reserved for God.

If anything, you can judge the "actions" of others, but telling someone that they belong to Satan, especially when the other person claims to be a Christian is sanctimonious and not very Christian. What you are suggesting is that only those that are pure and sinless are to remain in the church....just like the Pharisees, and we know what Jesus thought of them.

If what you say is true, why didn't Jesus throw Judas out? Jesus knew he was a liar, and that he was dipping into the treasury. So why didn't Jesus throw him out? Because Jesus came to teach a new concept. You work with sinners, you pray for them, you don't call them names and throw them out of the church.

What you espouse sounds a lot like what Westboro Baptist Church espouses, and I wouldn't be part of a congregation that acts like that for anything.

Go back to Jake's past posts, read some of them, you will soon realize, he is in no way a Christian, he is at best an atheist with an agenda, and at worst, a false prophet.

A lot of people who claim to be Christian can sometimes be misled by wrong interpretations of the Bible. Many churches have taken it upon themselves to call themselves "true" Christians while preaching hate and anger. Only Jesus can separate those who are true believers from those who are not, and you are not able to do that, no matter how hard you try to convince me that you can.

 

[Mertex]

You should get to know Jesus better, and make Him your Lord. For obviously, He is not.

From your statement, and others I have seen posted by you, I would assume Lucifer to be your lord, if you actually have one.

Questioning another's faith is not very Christian. The Pharisees were very good at pointing other's sins not realizing their own sins. Accusing someone who claims to be a Christian to be a follower of Satan puts you in a very precarious position. Only Jesus knows such things and Jesus you are not.

One more thing, Jesus gives us the ability to know such things. We have the Holy Bible. If it is not of the Bible, it is not Christian, and taking a little bit of the Bible and ignoring the rest of it, is also not Christian.

Am I in a precarious position? No, because I know that I am a sinner, saved only by Grace, and the sacrifice of the Lamb.

Neither God nor Jesus gives you permission to condemn others. Jesus himself, when he was brought a woman whom the Pharisees said was living in sin didn't condemn her.
You are acting like the Pharisees in that story, who wanted her to be stoned to death. Undoubtedly you are without sin.

John 8
3 The teachers of the law and the Pharisees brought in a woman caught in adultery. They made her stand before the group 4 and said to Jesus, “Teacher, this woman was caught in the act of adultery. 5 In the Law Moses commanded us to stone such women. Now what do you say?” 6 They were using this question as a trap, in order to have a basis for accusing him.

But Jesus bent down and started to write on the ground with his finger. 7 When they kept on questioning him, he straightened up and said to them, “Let any one of you who is without sin be the first to throw a stone at her.” 8 Again he stooped down and wrote on the ground.

9 At this, those who heard began to go away one at a time, the older ones first, until only Jesus was left, with the woman still standing there. 10 Jesus straightened up and asked her, “Woman, where are they? Has no one condemned you?”

11 “No one, sir,” she said.

“Then neither do I condemn you,” Jesus declared. “Go now and leave your life of sin.”

 

[Andylusion]

I guess that depends on the situation. I'm not a member of any church though. Also, I don't think that homosexuality is necessarily a sin anyways. I don't think it makes a person bad or evil. I just think homosexuals are people who have their wires crossed, and they can't help it.

There are a lot of things that considered "sins" by the man-made religions that I don't and never would buy into because it, if you have any kind of education, it goes against common sense and modern knowledge of the world IMO.

However, I think that MOST religious people have their hearts in the right place. For instance, my auntie is a very religious woman. I love her to pieces though!

If all belief systems are man made, then who are you to say others are doing wrong? Isn't it just your opinion against their opinion?

Again, it doesn't matter if they are a 'bad person' or not. If you have a belief system, then that system has rules. If they don't follow the rules, then that's all there is to it.

You live in a house, I assume. And I would also assume that there are rules for being your home. If I come to your home, and violate those rules, will kick me out? If your children break the rules, does that mean they are evil and satanic, or did they just violate the rules, and thus you discipline them?

If you are single, I would assume you likely have rules for people you date. If your date slaps you, you likely are going to terminate that date. Maybe he's a really decent person, but you don't put up with being slapped. Or maybe he smells. You don't date a guy who smells. You have rules in your life. Those that violate your rules for your life, maybe are not evil.... but they still violated your rules.

Churches have rules. Why are they not allowed to impose their rules for their people in their church, but you are allowed to impose your rules on people in your life?

I'm just asking. Not attacking you. These are just questions.

Well, in reality, I'm not the one saying anyone is doing wrong. You and your church are the ones doing that.

So you are not saying that me and my church are not wrong. Not sure what the point of all those posts were then, but ok. I take you at your word.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Mertex, Androw and the others like him are nothing but idolaters who worship an object not the Lord. They have every right to be foolish that way. The Muslims do the same thing, and we see where that leads.

Forgive them, pray for them, but never let them have the last word here because they won't get it either in the eternities.

 

[ChrisL]

If all belief systems are man made, then who are you to say others are doing wrong? Isn't it just your opinion against their opinion?

Again, it doesn't matter if they are a 'bad person' or not. If you have a belief system, then that system has rules. If they don't follow the rules, then that's all there is to it.

You live in a house, I assume. And I would also assume that there are rules for being your home. If I come to your home, and violate those rules, will kick me out? If your children break the rules, does that mean they are evil and satanic, or did they just violate the rules, and thus you discipline them?

If you are single, I would assume you likely have rules for people you date. If your date slaps you, you likely are going to terminate that date. Maybe he's a really decent person, but you don't put up with being slapped. Or maybe he smells. You don't date a guy who smells. You have rules in your life. Those that violate your rules for your life, maybe are not evil.... but they still violated your rules.

Churches have rules. Why are they not allowed to impose their rules for their people in their church, but you are allowed to impose your rules on people in your life?

I'm just asking. Not attacking you. These are just questions.

Well, in reality, I'm not the one saying anyone is doing wrong. You and your church are the ones doing that.

So you are not saying that me and my church are not wrong. Not sure what the point of all those posts were then, but ok. I take you at your word.

I don't think you and your church are following what God or Jesus would really want. I think a lot of you have been brainwashed by your respective religions to look down upon certain segments of the population and to think you are better than they are, which of course is NOT the case.

 

[ChrisL]

Questioning another's faith is not very Christian. The Pharisees were very good at pointing other's sins not realizing their own sins. Accusing someone who claims to be a Christian to be a follower of Satan puts you in a very precarious position. Only Jesus knows such things and Jesus you are not.

One more thing, Jesus gives us the ability to know such things. We have the Holy Bible. If it is not of the Bible, it is not Christian, and taking a little bit of the Bible and ignoring the rest of it, is also not Christian.

Am I in a precarious position? No, because I know that I am a sinner, saved only by Grace, and the sacrifice of the Lamb.

Neither God nor Jesus gives you permission to condemn others. Jesus himself, when he was brought a woman whom the Pharisees said was living in sin didn't condemn her.
You are acting like the Pharisees in that story, who wanted her to be stoned to death. Undoubtedly you are without sin.

John 8
3 The teachers of the law and the Pharisees brought in a woman caught in adultery. They made her stand before the group 4 and said to Jesus, “Teacher, this woman was caught in the act of adultery. 5 In the Law Moses commanded us to stone such women. Now what do you say?” 6 They were using this question as a trap, in order to have a basis for accusing him.

But Jesus bent down and started to write on the ground with his finger. 7 When they kept on questioning him, he straightened up and said to them, “Let any one of you who is without sin be the first to throw a stone at her.” 8 Again he stooped down and wrote on the ground.

9 At this, those who heard began to go away one at a time, the older ones first, until only Jesus was left, with the woman still standing there. 10 Jesus straightened up and asked her, “Woman, where are they? Has no one condemned you?”

11 “No one, sir,” she said.

“Then neither do I condemn you,” Jesus declared. “Go now and leave your life of sin.”

See? This is one of the problems with religion. Others will just come back at you with other verses that support their views because the "books" and "scriptures" are hypocritical and sometimes go against one another. This is how you can tell that they were written by men and have absolutely nothing to do with God, just God as man would like to believe him to be.

 

[Vandalshandle]

Reading many of these posts, I have a mental image of Jesus standing at the entrance of the temple, saying, "All are welcome at my father's house, .....except you, and you, and you, and you...."