Congressional Ukraine Caucus Cochair: Not Sure Ukraine 'Winnable Anymore'

[toomuchtime_]

No they do not.

Civilian casualties rise, despite progress in eliminating cluster bombs

Casualties caused by lethal cluster munitions continued to increase in 2020, despite progress in efforts to eliminate these weapons, a UN-backed civil society report said on Wednesday.

news.un.org

According to the Monitor, civilians remain the primary victims of cluster munitions at the time of the attacks and after the conflict has ended and accounted for all casualties recorded in 2020.

Children represented nearly half (44 per cent) of all casualties where the age was known, and a quarter were women and girls, who in 2020 were less likely to survive an attack.

If you had actually read the article, you would know they are talking about a few hundred casualties world wide, but the cluster bombs used by the AFU to clear Russian trenches kill thousands of Russian soldiers who are the major cause of death in Ukraine.

Again, why are you such a committed advocate for Russian imperialsim?

 

[TNHarley]

Again, why are you such a committed advocate for Russian imperialsim?

Dont give me that ignorant shit. All of you parrots are the exact same. "If you dont support us helping ukraine kill children and pay their citizens pensions, you love pooootin!"
Grow up dude

 

[toomuchtime_]

Dont give me that ignorant shit. All of you parrots are the exact same. "If you dont support us helping ukraine kill children and pay their citizens pensions, you love pooootin!"
Grow up dude

Obviously you do love Putin since you parrot his propaganda, but what I asked you is why?

 

[TNHarley]

Obviously you do love Putin since you parrot his propaganda, but what I asked you is why?

His propaganda is anti-war? And not paying other citizens pensions? That makes sense

 

[toomuchtime_]

His propaganda is anti-war? And not paying other citizens pensions? That makes sense

In a sense, yes, Putin is opposed to anyone fighting back against Russian imperialism as you are.

 

[luiza]

Well, Troll Toomuchbooze . Seems your third army is now close to collapse with just one last chance to penetrate the Russian first defence line . The elite brigade being saved to march into Crimea is now being pulled in -- the last reserve brigade and not within sixty miles of the Azov Sea . A total and utter failure with huge loss of lives and equipment . Nazi Kyiv and Washington are desperate for a face saving negotiation but so far Dear Uncle P is not interesred and the Coke Dwarf knows that this would spell the end of his career as an international murderer .

 

[Delldude]

And if Ukraine depended on Patriot missiles to take down drones that might be significant.

They have......$3mil missiles take out $20,000 drones.

Intel claiming Uke's not doing so well:

The U.S. intelligence community assesses that Ukraine’s counteroffensive will fail to reach the key southeastern city of Melitopol, people familiar with the classified forecast told The Washington Post, a finding that, should it prove correct, would mean Kyiv won’t fulfill its principal objective of severing Russia’s land bridge to Crimea in this year’s push.
The grim assessment is based on Russia’s brutal proficiency in defending occupied territory through a phalanx of minefields and trenches, and is likely to prompt finger pointing inside Kyiv and Western capitals about why a counteroffensive that saw tens of billions of dollars of Western weapons and military equipment fell short of its goals.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2023/08/17/ukraine-counteroffensive-melitopol/

The CIA is preparing you for the realization that all those billions of your hard-earned dollars didn't make a difference after all.

 

[toomuchtime_]

They have......$3mil missiles take out $20,000 drones.

Intel claiming Uke's not doing so well:

The U.S. intelligence community assesses that Ukraine’s counteroffensive will fail to reach the key southeastern city of Melitopol, people familiar with the classified forecast told The Washington Post, a finding that, should it prove correct, would mean Kyiv won’t fulfill its principal objective of severing Russia’s land bridge to Crimea in this year’s push.
The grim assessment is based on Russia’s brutal proficiency in defending occupied territory through a phalanx of minefields and trenches, and is likely to prompt finger pointing inside Kyiv and Western capitals about why a counteroffensive that saw tens of billions of dollars of Western weapons and military equipment fell short of its goals.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2023/08/17/ukraine-counteroffensive-melitopol/

The CIA is preparing you for the realization that all those billions of your hard-earned dollars didn't make a difference after all.

If Ukraine doesn't make it all the way to the coast before winter sets in, then it will try again in the spring counteroffensive.

 

[Delldude]

If Ukraine doesn't make it all the way to the coast before winter sets in, then it will try again in the spring counteroffensive.

No win situation. Russia will prevail.

 

[TNHarley]

In a sense, yes, Putin is opposed to anyone fighting back against Russian imperialism as you are.

Im not against them fighting back you idiot. Try reading what I actually write

 

[BlueGin]

Good maybe those war mongering pieces of shit will stop sending them the fruits of our labor. Kinda tired of paying their pensions and sending bombs that will be killing children for the next 4 decades.

Maybe they are afraid people are catching in to their money laundering scam finally.

 

[toomuchtime_]

No win situation. Russia will prevail.

Apparently that is your hope, but clearly nearly all the rest of the world is determined to prevent that.

 

[toomuchtime_]

Im not against them fighting back you idiot. Try reading what I actually write

Of course you are. Withdrawing US aid will advance Russian imperialism, so no matter how you try to disguise it, or how you arrived at this position, you are clearly an advocate for Russian imperialism.

If you were genuinely interested in saving lives, you would be advocating for enough aid to Ukraine so that the Russian imperialists can be so decisively defeated, they will give up their imperialist ambitions.

 

[JohnDB]

Fighting does not win wars....
It is pure propaganda to suggest otherwise.

WW2 and 2nd Iraq war are the only conflicts to end because of decisive victories.

Otherwise nope....doesn't happen. Look at Korea, Moldovia, Africa and the list goes on.

What ends war is political pressure from such things like economic factors and lack of gains vx cost. (War is extremely expensive and difficult)

Even Napoleon's Waterloo was lost due to political reasons and ended Napoleon's wars.

So....
In the meantime what is working is the sanctions and the drone strikes in Moscow. I would recommend drone strikes in St Petersburg. Also the drone strikes on oil tankers at sea. These things matter more to end the war than anything else.

However,
Because Putin has staked his political life on the outcome of this war....he can't afford to lose it. Meaning that the generals in his military are going to have to remove him when they can find a suitable replacement for Putin that everyone can agree upon.

This is going to take time. It's not easy.

But the pressure of pain is growing.

 

[TNHarley]

Of course you are. Withdrawing US aid will advance Russian imperialism, so no matter how you try to disguise it, or how you arrived at this position, you are clearly an advocate for Russian imperialism.

If you were genuinely interested in saving lives, you would be advocating for enough aid to Ukraine so that the Russian imperialists can be so decisively defeated, they will give up their imperialist ambitions.

Being against me paying for another countries war and pension, doesnt mean i want the other side to win. You are repeating war monger rhetoric.
Your outlook is very binary. Binary is ignorance. So congrats on that.

 

[toomuchtime_]

Being against me paying for another countries war and pension, doesnt mean i want the other side to win. You are repeating war monger rhetoric.
Your outlook is very binary. Binary is ignorance. So congrats on that.

So now you are no longer opposed to aid to Ukraine because of people dying but because of the few dollars it might cost you without considering the enormous cost of increasing the US military presence in Europe if Russia should manage to conquer Ukraine.

You can run, but you can't hide. You may have begun this nonsense in order to attack Biden, but now you are waking shoulder to shoulder with Putin,

 

[TNHarley]

So now you are no longer opposed to aid to Ukraine because of people dying but because of the few dollars it might cost you without considering the enormous cost of increasing the US military presence in Europe if Russia should manage to conquer Ukraine.

You can run, but you can't hide. You may have begun this nonsense in order to attack Biden, but now you are waking shoulder to shoulder with Putin,

I am opposed to us arming ukraine. I am opposed to us paying their fucking pensions. I am opposed to us being responsible for women and children dying for the next 40 years.
Im not opposed to ukraine handling THEIR business.
This shit isnt complicated. Well, it shouldnt be....

 

[toomuchtime_]

I am opposed to us arming ukraine. I am opposed to us paying their fucking pensions. I am opposed to us being responsible for women and children dying for the next 40 years.
Im not opposed to ukraine handling THEIR business.
This shit isnt complicated. Well, it shouldnt be....

You are opposed to helping Ukrainians defend themselves against Russian imperialism despite the fact that you know halting aid to Ukraine will advance the Russian empire advancing eastward to confront US troops in Europe and the cost of increasing US military presence in Europe, not to mention the risk to US soldiers, would vastly outweigh the cost of aiding Ukraine in its fight against Russian imperialism. That makes no sense at all unless you are supporting Russian imperialism.

 

[TNHarley]

You are opposed to helping Ukrainians defend themselves against Russian imperialism despite the fact that you know halting aid to Ukraine will advance the Russian empire advancing eastward to confront US troops in Europe and the cost of increasing US military presence in Europe, not to mention the risk to US soldiers, would vastly outweigh the cost of aiding Ukraine in its fight against Russian imperialism. That makes no sense at all unless you are supporting Russian imperialism.

Im opposed to US helping them. Other nations can do whatever the fuck they want. Like the ones that live on the same continent.
Its not our business. This is why the world fucking hates us. Because we are nosey war mongers. Well, people like you are. Im certainly not.

 

[toomuchtime_]

Im opposed to US helping them. Other nations can do whatever the fuck they want. Like the ones that live on the same continent.
Its not our business. This is why the world fucking hates us. Because we are nosey war mongers. Well, people like you are. Im certainly not.

Of course, it is our business. As a member of NATO it is in America's interests to have the Russian imperialists stopped in Ukraine rather than to have US and Russian troops face to face at Ukraine's western border.

You may hate America, but the rest of the world certainly does not. Russian hates America because NATO stops the Russian empire from expanding westward, and a few others hate America because we stand in the way of their ambitions, but to most of the world, the US is still Reagan's "shining city upon a hill." This is why US sanctions are so widely respected even by China and other BRICS and nations on all continents, and why so many nations seek special relationships with the US.