Corporate welfare in action ....

[Ray From Cleveland]

Why is that not happening in Seattle?

Because Seattle already had one of the highest costs of living in the country.

Seattle is also home Boeing, Microsoft, Amazon and several other huge companies. They could not find anyone willing to work for $7.50 an hour and most are paid in excess of $15.00 without a minimum.

Take that same minimum wage to Ocala, Florida or Bellington, Washington, and the place would be devastated.

You do make an exceptional case though for NOT making any minimum wage a Federal Law. Without question, it should be left to the local municipality.

Increasing minimum wage only sets off a domino effect. You may make more money up front, but within a few years, everything else costs more money and you find yourself right back where you started from.

My father and I were discussing this the other day. He's a retired construction worker. We both watch those shows on HGTV where they buy and sell houses all the time. What you get in some of these states for a million dollars you could find here for less than 300K. A million dollar home here is nearly a mansion.

Increased wages creates a huge cost of living increase. Several years ago I rented an apartment to a kid from New York because he was going to school here. I was charging him $450.00 at the time. He told me that the apartment I rented him would cost over $1,000 in New York state. He said my larger apartments (which I was generally charging $500.00 a month for) would go easily for $1,200 a month, and probably over 2 grand a month if they were close to NYC.

 

[dblack]

"
NORTH RANDALL, Ohio - Amazon will bring more than 2,000 jobs to the tiny Cuyahoga County village of North Randall, where a massive fulfillment center is slated to rise from the demolition dust of Randall Park Mall.

The e-commerce giant finalized a lease deal Thursday on a planned 855,000-square-foot building, which could open during the second half of next year on a 69-acre site at Warrensville Center and Emery roads. News of the potential deal broke in July, after the project cropped up on a public meeting agenda. But North Randall was vying against other, unidentified sites.

The North Randall Village Council and the Warrensville Heights Board of Education have approved 15 years of 75 percent property-tax abatement for the Amazon facility. School board records show the village will pass along 33 percent of its income-tax collections from workers at the fulfillment center to the district."

Amazon commits to North Randall fulfillment center, with 2,000-plus jobs on former mall site

"Full-time employees at Amazon receive highly-competitive pay, health insurance, disability insurance, retirement savings plans and company stock starting on day one. The company offers up to 20 weeks of paid leave and innovative benefits such as Leave Share and Ramp Back, which give new parents flexibility with their growing families. Amazon also offers hourly employees its Career Choice program which helps train employees for in-demand jobs at Amazon and other companies so they can prepare for the future and take full advantage of the nation's innovation economy. The program pre-pays 95% of tuition for courses in in-demand, high-wage fields, regardless of whether the skills are relevant to a future career at Amazon. Over 10,000 employees have participated in Career Choice and more are signing up every day."

An Amazon Fulfillment Center Officially Comes to Former Randall Park Mall Site, Needs Workers

Nah, we don't want it. That's the village picking winners......namely the citizens of their village and surrounding areas where those employees will be hired from.

Is it good for business for Amazon to build this? If so why do they need a special deal on taxes?

The amazon around here doesn't pay much and has lots of turnover btw.

There are several articles on this subject that refutes what you claim.

Is it good for business for Amazon to build this? Of course it is. Or do you think it's better for business to leave that mall in a pile of rubble?

They need a tax deal to keep their prices lower and provide good paying jobs with the best of benefits as the article outlines.

Lots of construction, lots of good paying jobs afterwards, the school system makes out, the taxpayers make out, even the state makes out. The domino effect of companies that provide Amazon with packing materials, trucking, and technology a plus.

Everybody wins, and tax abatements are responsible for it.

Good paying jobs? You're kidding, right?

It's already been posted on this board.

A supervisor at Amazon makes $15.65/hr which is crap pay. You have to stand for 8 hours in heat up to 90 degrees because Amazon doesn't believe in air conditioning. To qualify you need a bachelor's degree. Would anyone in their right mind pay $50K for an education for that job?

The American worker is woefully underpaid.

Amazon doesn't need subsidies. Period.

Here's a solution: stop importing cheap labor from Mexico.

A national minimum wage.

Single Payer for Everyone. For Everything.

 

[Brain357]

I've given plenty of examples where the city/state and tax payers get hosed. Are you not paying attention? Politicians hand these things out. They say look at all these jobs we created. The corp gets tons of money, and the tax payer gets hosed.

Then why didn't the people vote those politicians out of office? I'm sure most of the abatements happen in Democrat cities anyway.

Gee why do many bad politicians get reelected? Are you really claiming all bad politicians get voted out?

The will if the local news shows people that an abatement was a net loss. Politicians have no reason to give a company a break unless it benefited the city or town in some way--usually financial.

Conservative and liberal groups have criticized the explosion in tax breaks under Christie, calling it textbook “corporate welfare” and noting that the state has garnered a record 10 credit-rating downgrades because of a lack of revenue to cover the cost of hospitals, pensions, schools, property tax rebates and other services. State revenue is not keeping pace with New Jersey’s ballooning, legally mandated costs, analysts at Fitch Ratings, Moody’s Investors Service and S&P Global Ratings say.

Lawmakers ignoring $7.4B boom in 'corporate welfare,' experts say

Look.......I can't take any of your articles that mention "corporate welfare" seriously. Corporate welfare is a liberal term that means (in mosts cases) tax cuts. Tax cuts are taking less in taxes--not giving anybody anything.

All money does not belong to government in spite of your wishes. What the government doesn't take is not a gift from them to you.

You can call it whatever you want. We are all talking about the same thing. If it is a liberal term why can I find conservatives using it all over? Charles Koch is a liberal? Ron Paul is a liberal? Get real.

I want the government to own all the money? You are the one who trusts them to dish out your tax dollars to huge corporations. You are the one trusting the government, not me. You would make a good liberal.

 

[Brain357]

Why is that not happening in Seattle?

Because Seattle already had one of the highest costs of living in the country.

Seattle is also home Boeing, Microsoft, Amazon and several other huge companies. They could not find anyone willing to work for $7.50 an hour and most are paid in excess of $15.00 without a minimum.

Take that same minimum wage to Ocala, Florida or Bellington, Washington, and the place would be devastated.

You do make an exceptional case though for NOT making any minimum wage a Federal Law. Without question, it should be left to the local municipality.

Increasing minimum wage only sets off a domino effect. You may make more money up front, but within a few years, everything else costs more money and you find yourself right back where you started from.

My father and I were discussing this the other day. He's a retired construction worker. We both watch those shows on HGTV where they buy and sell houses all the time. What you get in some of these states for a million dollars you could find here for less than 300K. A million dollar home here is nearly a mansion.

Increased wages creates a huge cost of living increase. Several years ago I rented an apartment to a kid from New York because he was going to school here. I was charging him $450.00 at the time. He told me that the apartment I rented him would cost over $1,000 in New York state. He said my larger apartments (which I was generally charging $500.00 a month for) would go easily for $1,200 a month, and probably over 2 grand a month if they were close to NYC.

You trust the government to dish out corporate welfare. You should trust them to manipulate wages. See your beliefs make no sense.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Conservative and liberal groups have criticized the explosion in tax breaks under Christie, calling it textbook “corporate welfare” and noting that the state has garnered a record 10 credit-rating downgrades because of a lack of revenue to cover the cost of hospitals, pensions, schools, property tax rebates and other services. State revenue is not keeping pace with New Jersey’s ballooning, legally mandated costs, analysts at Fitch Ratings, Moody’s Investors Service and S&P Global Ratings say.

Lawmakers ignoring $7.4B boom in 'corporate welfare,' experts say

And how is NJ doing with all this corporate welfare?

N.J. economic recovery still lagging, despite recent jobs numbers

So they are growing slower than other states. That has nothing to do with any corporate welfare.

It shows it doesn't lead to greatness. 10 credit rating downgrades and a slow economy.

Because it doesn't show it leads to greatness, it must be responsible? Where in the world do you get that logic from?

Nobody ever said that tax abatements were an all out problem solver. It would be like me making the claim that if not for tax abatement, the state would be growing even slower. There's no way to possibly prove that claim.

It goes against capitalism and the free market. That is bad for an economy. You can't show it does any good. Why do you support this garbage? I've given you example after example of it doing bad things, yet you insist it is a good thing. You make no sense.

And I gave you examples where it does good. This Amazon thing that's happening here is great for our area. It's going to provide thousands of jobs, bring in tax revenue, stir up business in other places. Nothing negative about it. No new roads needed because the roads were designed for the largest mall in the country years ago. Hell, maybe even our company may get some work out of it. Who knows?

But there is nothing negative about it.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Why is that not happening in Seattle?

Because Seattle already had one of the highest costs of living in the country.

Seattle is also home Boeing, Microsoft, Amazon and several other huge companies. They could not find anyone willing to work for $7.50 an hour and most are paid in excess of $15.00 without a minimum.

Take that same minimum wage to Ocala, Florida or Bellington, Washington, and the place would be devastated.

You do make an exceptional case though for NOT making any minimum wage a Federal Law. Without question, it should be left to the local municipality.

Increasing minimum wage only sets off a domino effect. You may make more money up front, but within a few years, everything else costs more money and you find yourself right back where you started from.

My father and I were discussing this the other day. He's a retired construction worker. We both watch those shows on HGTV where they buy and sell houses all the time. What you get in some of these states for a million dollars you could find here for less than 300K. A million dollar home here is nearly a mansion.

Increased wages creates a huge cost of living increase. Several years ago I rented an apartment to a kid from New York because he was going to school here. I was charging him $450.00 at the time. He told me that the apartment I rented him would cost over $1,000 in New York state. He said my larger apartments (which I was generally charging $500.00 a month for) would go easily for $1,200 a month, and probably over 2 grand a month if they were close to NYC.

You trust the government to dish out corporate welfare. You should trust them to manipulate wages. See your beliefs make no sense.

You can keep using that term Corporate Welfare all you want, but when you do, I think tax breaks--not welfare at all. And I'm all for tax breaks. The lower the taxes, the better.

 

[dblack]

Why is that not happening in Seattle?

Because Seattle already had one of the highest costs of living in the country.

Seattle is also home Boeing, Microsoft, Amazon and several other huge companies. They could not find anyone willing to work for $7.50 an hour and most are paid in excess of $15.00 without a minimum.

Take that same minimum wage to Ocala, Florida or Bellington, Washington, and the place would be devastated.

You do make an exceptional case though for NOT making any minimum wage a Federal Law. Without question, it should be left to the local municipality.

Increasing minimum wage only sets off a domino effect. You may make more money up front, but within a few years, everything else costs more money and you find yourself right back where you started from.

My father and I were discussing this the other day. He's a retired construction worker. We both watch those shows on HGTV where they buy and sell houses all the time. What you get in some of these states for a million dollars you could find here for less than 300K. A million dollar home here is nearly a mansion.

Increased wages creates a huge cost of living increase. Several years ago I rented an apartment to a kid from New York because he was going to school here. I was charging him $450.00 at the time. He told me that the apartment I rented him would cost over $1,000 in New York state. He said my larger apartments (which I was generally charging $500.00 a month for) would go easily for $1,200 a month, and probably over 2 grand a month if they were close to NYC.

You trust the government to dish out corporate welfare. You should trust them to manipulate wages. See your beliefs make no sense.

You can keep using that term Corporate Welfare all you want, but when you do, I think tax breaks--not welfare at all. And I'm all for tax breaks. The lower the taxes, the better.

So, it'd be cool with you if everyone got exempted from taxes but you?

 

[OnePercenter]

How much in benefits does a community receive when say a Walmart locates in their area? Or, a distribution hub for Walmart, Amazon or other large corporation?

"
NORTH RANDALL, Ohio - Amazon will bring more than 2,000 jobs to the tiny Cuyahoga County village of North Randall, where a massive fulfillment center is slated to rise from the demolition dust of Randall Park Mall.

The e-commerce giant finalized a lease deal Thursday on a planned 855,000-square-foot building, which could open during the second half of next year on a 69-acre site at Warrensville Center and Emery roads. News of the potential deal broke in July, after the project cropped up on a public meeting agenda. But North Randall was vying against other, unidentified sites.

The North Randall Village Council and the Warrensville Heights Board of Education have approved 15 years of 75 percent property-tax abatement for the Amazon facility. School board records show the village will pass along 33 percent of its income-tax collections from workers at the fulfillment center to the district."

Amazon commits to North Randall fulfillment center, with 2,000-plus jobs on former mall site

"Full-time employees at Amazon receive highly-competitive pay, health insurance, disability insurance, retirement savings plans and company stock starting on day one. The company offers up to 20 weeks of paid leave and innovative benefits such as Leave Share and Ramp Back, which give new parents flexibility with their growing families. Amazon also offers hourly employees its Career Choice program which helps train employees for in-demand jobs at Amazon and other companies so they can prepare for the future and take full advantage of the nation's innovation economy. The program pre-pays 95% of tuition for courses in in-demand, high-wage fields, regardless of whether the skills are relevant to a future career at Amazon. Over 10,000 employees have participated in Career Choice and more are signing up every day."

An Amazon Fulfillment Center Officially Comes to Former Randall Park Mall Site, Needs Workers

Nah, we don't want it. That's the village picking winners......namely the citizens of their village and surrounding areas where those employees will be hired from.

Is it good for business for Amazon to build this? If so why do they need a special deal on taxes?

The amazon around here doesn't pay much and has lots of turnover btw.

There are several articles on this subject that refutes what you claim.

Is it good for business for Amazon to build this? Of course it is. Or do you think it's better for business to leave that mall in a pile of rubble?

They need a tax deal to keep their prices lower and provide good paying jobs with the best of benefits as the article outlines.

Lots of construction, lots of good paying jobs afterwards, the school system makes out, the taxpayers make out, even the state makes out. The domino effect of companies that provide Amazon with packing materials, trucking, and technology a plus.

Everybody wins, and tax abatements are responsible for it.

Good paying jobs? You're kidding, right?

It's already been posted on this board.

A supervisor at Amazon makes $15.65/hr which is crap pay. You have to stand for 8 hours in heat up to 90 degrees because Amazon doesn't believe in air conditioning. To qualify you need a bachelor's degree. Would anyone in their right mind pay $50K for an education for that job?

The American worker is woefully underpaid.

Amazon doesn't need subsidies. Period.

Really? I didn't see anybody post an article on the exact wages Amazon plans on paying. Did you? In spite of the many written articles on this new outlet of theirs, they all seem to contradict what you're claiming here. But they are wrong and you are right. So typically liberal of you.

If the village offered Amazon this deal, it's because the village and city are making out. Amazon is getting a 75% abatement on land taxes which means they are going to be paying 25% tax on nearly 70 acres of city land. And as my one article pointed out, that's on top of the employee city taxes they will be paying.

We'll be glad to take this new center to help our economy any day of the week. And if you bothered to read the article (which I'm sure you didn't) they are also looking at another closed down mall (about 15 miles from North Randall) for another new project. We'll take all the new jobs we can get.

Amazon pays relatively the same wage across the country for distribution. You 'should' know this already.

Amazon is getting a discount of how much in dollars?

City taxes are going to be paid by whom? How much in dollars?

When you subtract the negative from the positive you'll find an even larger negative.

Permanent, better paid jobs ($15.00/hr) are good. How many of these jobs fit that category?

 

[Brain357]

And how is NJ doing with all this corporate welfare?

N.J. economic recovery still lagging, despite recent jobs numbers

So they are growing slower than other states. That has nothing to do with any corporate welfare.

It shows it doesn't lead to greatness. 10 credit rating downgrades and a slow economy.

Because it doesn't show it leads to greatness, it must be responsible? Where in the world do you get that logic from?

Nobody ever said that tax abatements were an all out problem solver. It would be like me making the claim that if not for tax abatement, the state would be growing even slower. There's no way to possibly prove that claim.

It goes against capitalism and the free market. That is bad for an economy. You can't show it does any good. Why do you support this garbage? I've given you example after example of it doing bad things, yet you insist it is a good thing. You make no sense.

And I gave you examples where it does good. This Amazon thing that's happening here is great for our area. It's going to provide thousands of jobs, bring in tax revenue, stir up business in other places. Nothing negative about it. No new roads needed because the roads were designed for the largest mall in the country years ago. Hell, maybe even our company may get some work out of it. Who knows?

But there is nothing negative about it.

Amazon will be using services they are not paying for. That is welfare. And no you haven't given any real examples. The numbers never work out. You live in fantasy land. A good deal would be amazon moves in, creates jobs, and pays taxes for services.

 

[Markle]

They need a tax deal to keep their prices lower? Really? So does Walmart get such a good deal? And if Amazon gets a better deal I guess they have lower prices? You really want the gov picking winners and losers?

If it is good for Amazon to build they don't need a special tax deal. The tax payer shouldn't pay for Amazon to expand.

Are you opposed to the tax payers paying for more jobs in their community? Isn't that Capitalism?

Shouldn't a community be able to decide if they want to entice a company to locate in their community?

Isn't that their business and not yours?

 

[Brain357]

Why is that not happening in Seattle?

Because Seattle already had one of the highest costs of living in the country.

Seattle is also home Boeing, Microsoft, Amazon and several other huge companies. They could not find anyone willing to work for $7.50 an hour and most are paid in excess of $15.00 without a minimum.

Take that same minimum wage to Ocala, Florida or Bellington, Washington, and the place would be devastated.

You do make an exceptional case though for NOT making any minimum wage a Federal Law. Without question, it should be left to the local municipality.

Increasing minimum wage only sets off a domino effect. You may make more money up front, but within a few years, everything else costs more money and you find yourself right back where you started from.

My father and I were discussing this the other day. He's a retired construction worker. We both watch those shows on HGTV where they buy and sell houses all the time. What you get in some of these states for a million dollars you could find here for less than 300K. A million dollar home here is nearly a mansion.

Increased wages creates a huge cost of living increase. Several years ago I rented an apartment to a kid from New York because he was going to school here. I was charging him $450.00 at the time. He told me that the apartment I rented him would cost over $1,000 in New York state. He said my larger apartments (which I was generally charging $500.00 a month for) would go easily for $1,200 a month, and probably over 2 grand a month if they were close to NYC.

You trust the government to dish out corporate welfare. You should trust them to manipulate wages. See your beliefs make no sense.

You can keep using that term Corporate Welfare all you want, but when you do, I think tax breaks--not welfare at all. And I'm all for tax breaks. The lower the taxes, the better.

I will because that's what it is. You prefer crony capitalism?

 

[OnePercenter]

Giving them services they don't pay for is welfare.

How much in benefits does a community receive when say a Walmart locates in their area? Or, a distribution hub for Walmart, Amazon or other large corporation?

"
NORTH RANDALL, Ohio - Amazon will bring more than 2,000 jobs to the tiny Cuyahoga County village of North Randall, where a massive fulfillment center is slated to rise from the demolition dust of Randall Park Mall.

The e-commerce giant finalized a lease deal Thursday on a planned 855,000-square-foot building, which could open during the second half of next year on a 69-acre site at Warrensville Center and Emery roads. News of the potential deal broke in July, after the project cropped up on a public meeting agenda. But North Randall was vying against other, unidentified sites.

The North Randall Village Council and the Warrensville Heights Board of Education have approved 15 years of 75 percent property-tax abatement for the Amazon facility. School board records show the village will pass along 33 percent of its income-tax collections from workers at the fulfillment center to the district."

Amazon commits to North Randall fulfillment center, with 2,000-plus jobs on former mall site

"Full-time employees at Amazon receive highly-competitive pay, health insurance, disability insurance, retirement savings plans and company stock starting on day one. The company offers up to 20 weeks of paid leave and innovative benefits such as Leave Share and Ramp Back, which give new parents flexibility with their growing families. Amazon also offers hourly employees its Career Choice program which helps train employees for in-demand jobs at Amazon and other companies so they can prepare for the future and take full advantage of the nation's innovation economy. The program pre-pays 95% of tuition for courses in in-demand, high-wage fields, regardless of whether the skills are relevant to a future career at Amazon. Over 10,000 employees have participated in Career Choice and more are signing up every day."

An Amazon Fulfillment Center Officially Comes to Former Randall Park Mall Site, Needs Workers

Nah, we don't want it. That's the village picking winners......namely the citizens of their village and surrounding areas where those employees will be hired from.

Is it good for business for Amazon to build this? If so why do they need a special deal on taxes?

The amazon around here doesn't pay much and has lots of turnover btw.

They don't need the special deals.

It's not a question of need, it's a question of attracting businesses. Regardless what you think a business "needs" any business will be happy to take the best competition offer they can get.

If business subsidized offers became illegal, Amazon would still build.

 

[dblack]

They need a tax deal to keep their prices lower? Really? So does Walmart get such a good deal? And if Amazon gets a better deal I guess they have lower prices? You really want the gov picking winners and losers?

If it is good for Amazon to build they don't need a special tax deal. The tax payer shouldn't pay for Amazon to expand.

Are you opposed to the tax payers paying for more jobs in their community? Isn't that Capitalism?

For fuck's sake, no. That's the opposite.

Shouldn't a community be able to decide if they want to entice a company to locate in their community?

Isn't that their business and not yours?

No. People can only bully each other so much in the name of 'government'. That's what having a constitution buys us.

 

[Brain357]

They need a tax deal to keep their prices lower? Really? So does Walmart get such a good deal? And if Amazon gets a better deal I guess they have lower prices? You really want the gov picking winners and losers?

If it is good for Amazon to build they don't need a special tax deal. The tax payer shouldn't pay for Amazon to expand.

Are you opposed to the tax payers paying for more jobs in their community? Isn't that Capitalism?

Shouldn't a community be able to decide if they want to entice a company to locate in their community?

Isn't that their business and not yours?

A community isn't deciding. Show me where one of these has gone up for a vote? I am certain everywhere this has happened there are many who would prefer to keep their tax dollars. Companies lobby and politicians throw deals at them. It is not a community decision. And if the community was smart they would decide to go with capitalism and the free market.

 

[Uncensored2008]

There's no such thing as corporate welfare.

Yeah, just ask Elon Musk...

 

[Brain357]

How much in benefits does a community receive when say a Walmart locates in their area? Or, a distribution hub for Walmart, Amazon or other large corporation?

"
NORTH RANDALL, Ohio - Amazon will bring more than 2,000 jobs to the tiny Cuyahoga County village of North Randall, where a massive fulfillment center is slated to rise from the demolition dust of Randall Park Mall.

The e-commerce giant finalized a lease deal Thursday on a planned 855,000-square-foot building, which could open during the second half of next year on a 69-acre site at Warrensville Center and Emery roads. News of the potential deal broke in July, after the project cropped up on a public meeting agenda. But North Randall was vying against other, unidentified sites.

The North Randall Village Council and the Warrensville Heights Board of Education have approved 15 years of 75 percent property-tax abatement for the Amazon facility. School board records show the village will pass along 33 percent of its income-tax collections from workers at the fulfillment center to the district."

Amazon commits to North Randall fulfillment center, with 2,000-plus jobs on former mall site

"Full-time employees at Amazon receive highly-competitive pay, health insurance, disability insurance, retirement savings plans and company stock starting on day one. The company offers up to 20 weeks of paid leave and innovative benefits such as Leave Share and Ramp Back, which give new parents flexibility with their growing families. Amazon also offers hourly employees its Career Choice program which helps train employees for in-demand jobs at Amazon and other companies so they can prepare for the future and take full advantage of the nation's innovation economy. The program pre-pays 95% of tuition for courses in in-demand, high-wage fields, regardless of whether the skills are relevant to a future career at Amazon. Over 10,000 employees have participated in Career Choice and more are signing up every day."

An Amazon Fulfillment Center Officially Comes to Former Randall Park Mall Site, Needs Workers

Nah, we don't want it. That's the village picking winners......namely the citizens of their village and surrounding areas where those employees will be hired from.

Is it good for business for Amazon to build this? If so why do they need a special deal on taxes?

The amazon around here doesn't pay much and has lots of turnover btw.

They don't need the special deals.

It's not a question of need, it's a question of attracting businesses. Regardless what you think a business "needs" any business will be happy to take the best competition offer they can get.

If business subsidized offers became illegal, Amazon would still build.

If they need to expand and want to grow their business they sure would. And they would make better decisions on that growth if they weren't lobbying for government handouts.

 

[Markle]

Amazon will be using services they are not paying for. That is welfare. And no you haven't given any real examples. The numbers never work out. You live in fantasy land. A good deal would be amazon moves in, creates jobs, and pays taxes for services.

What happens when Pinellas County in Florida offers them a ten-year exemption on property taxes if they locate there instead of your hypothetical county? Amazon should ignore the offer?

 

[danielpalos]

States and local governments need to compete to attract business.
Without competition, idiot politicians could create a "sweetened beverage tax", like the assholes in Cook County, and never suffer the consequences of their stupidity and greed.

No, they don't need to compete. If companies want to grow they need to expand and build. Huge companies win, tax payers lose with these deals. Do you pretend to be conservative?

No, they don't need to compete.

They do.
That's why, when Moonbeam adds more taxes and stupid regulations, corporations and people move to other states. If we forced uniform tax rates nationwide, like the EU wants to do across their federation, it would be harder to escape governmental stupidity.

Again, that's not what this thread is about. State's competing with lower taxes is fine. States are giving "most favored corporation status" to a company, along with a care-package of abatements and exemptions. Corporate Welfare, or whatever you call this game of dueling tax abatements, is government-corporate collusion, plain and simple.

Huge companies win, tax payers lose with these deals.

Believe me, I understand that idiots in government can make stupid deals. When it comes to government, stupidity is a feature, not a bug. I still don't think we should prohibit these abatements.

Should they be allowed to run the entire tax code that way? Everyone gets a different deal depending on what their lobbyists can haggle for? Why even have laws?

Why does the right wing Only complain about welfare for Individuals?

They don't provide jobs, taxes, revenue


.

Did you know, nobody takes the right wing seriously about economics?

We have the largest economy in the world, Mexico is our third largest trading partner, and tourism is one of the largest employers in twenty-nine States.

 

[danielpalos]

So my city collects three million dollars in taxes every year to support our city. A new business moves in and the city (with abatements) now collects 3.4 million in taxes every year. How did the taxpayer lose?

The new business is using .6 million in services.

Utter bull. Nobody would give tax abatements if that were true.

You can dispute the exact amount all you like, but the fact is that a huge new business would be imposing a significant additional cost on city and state government. Just the additional traffic would be a significant additional cost.

And you don't think the city or state had that figured out when they made the offer? What are those additional costs? A new stoplight or two, perhaps an additional lane to a main road?

Do you not see how government works? States go into debt for these stupid deals sometimes. You can't be serious. Have you noticed how deeply in debt our country is? Have you seen how deeply in debt many states are? Most politicians are not fiscally responsible. What more proof do you need?

U.S. National Debt Clock : Real Time

We need the finest tax rates on the One Percent, simply for the greater glory of the credit rating of our Republic.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Amazon will be using services they are not paying for. That is welfare. And no you haven't given any real examples. The numbers never work out. You live in fantasy land. A good deal would be amazon moves in, creates jobs, and pays taxes for services.

What happens when Pinellas County in Florida offers them a ten-year exemption on property taxes if they locate there instead of your hypothetical county? Amazon should ignore the offer?

Bribery and graft should be illegal. The leaders of Pinellas County in Florida should spend the next decade in federal prison.