Cuts to SS and Medicare

[struth]

Again semantics.

They earned the entitlement by paying into the system for 35 years.

I earned my military 'entitlement" by paying (with years of service) for over 20 years.

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Because you appear to want to play the semantics game you may have missed an earlier post:

It's one of a number of options to address the SS Trust Fund running out of money resulting in the cutting of benefits. Some option are:

• Increase the cap (politically doable).
• Increase retirement age with no grandfather (not politically doable). Then what happens to those that recently retired.
• Increase retirement age but only on younger workers say those under 50) to cut the amount of benefits they receive by decreasing their years of eligibility (might be politically doable, but since it would be 15 years before it would being to have an impact and the Trust fund shortage starts in 10 it doesn't help).
• Increase Revenue with a national sales tax. (A) not politically doable, and (B) taxes people for SS that are not eligible to draw SS security. So you have certain unions (i.e. Railroad), private pension plans, and certain state/city pension plans that don't pay into SS now - those not eligible to SS would be paying to support SS?
• Increase Revenue by expanding SS taxed income beyond "wages" to include passive income like interest, dividends, capital gains, etc.

So with the SS Trust Fund being depleted by 2034 and benefits having to be cut for current seniors, what is your suggestion that falls into the realms of (a) fair and (b) politically achievable. Details would be nice to review, not a bumper sticker.

Your thoughts would be appreciated.

WW

words matter. it’s called an entitlement because it is one

nothing is earned, the money is taxed, it’s not invested

 

[WorldWatcher]

words matter. it’s called an entitlement because it is one

nothing is earned, the money is taxed, it’s not invested

Fine, I'll take my military entitlement and my Social Security entitlement (in a few years) that I earned (one through years of service and one throu8gh 45 years of payments) as part of my retirement plan.

With that put to bed.
.
.
.
Because you appear to want to play the semantics game you may have missed an earlier post:

It's one of a number of options to address the SS Trust Fund running out of money resulting in the cutting of benefits. Some option are:

• Increase the cap (politically doable).
• Increase retirement age with no grandfather (not politically doable). Then what happens to those that recently retired.
• Increase retirement age but only on younger workers say those under 50) to cut the amount of benefits they receive by decreasing their years of eligibility (might be politically doable, but since it would be 15 years before it would being to have an impact and the Trust fund shortage starts in 10 it doesn't help).
• Increase Revenue with a national sales tax. (A) not politically doable, and (B) taxes people for SS that are not eligible to draw SS security. So you have certain unions (i.e. Railroad), private pension plans, and certain state/city pension plans that don't pay into SS now - those not eligible to SS would be paying to support SS?
• Increase Revenue by expanding SS taxed income beyond "wages" to include passive income like interest, dividends, capital gains, etc.

So with the SS Trust Fund being depleted by 2034 and benefits having to be cut for current seniors, what is your suggestion that falls into the realms of (a) fair and (b) politically achievable. Details would be nice to review, not a bumper sticker.

Your thoughts would be appreciated.

WW

 

[struth]

Fine, I'll take my military entitlement and my Social Security entitlement (in a few years) that I earned (one through years of service and one throu8gh 45 years of payments) as part of my retirement plan.

With that put to bed.
.
.
.
Because you appear to want to play the semantics game you may have missed an earlier post:

It's one of a number of options to address the SS Trust Fund running out of money resulting in the cutting of benefits. Some option are:

• Increase the cap (politically doable).
• Increase retirement age with no grandfather (not politically doable). Then what happens to those that recently retired.
• Increase retirement age but only on younger workers say those under 50) to cut the amount of benefits they receive by decreasing their years of eligibility (might be politically doable, but since it would be 15 years before it would being to have an impact and the Trust fund shortage starts in 10 it doesn't help).
• Increase Revenue with a national sales tax. (A) not politically doable, and (B) taxes people for SS that are not eligible to draw SS security. So you have certain unions (i.e. Railroad), private pension plans, and certain state/city pension plans that don't pay into SS now - those not eligible to SS would be paying to support SS?
• Increase Revenue by expanding SS taxed income beyond "wages" to include passive income like interest, dividends, capital gains, etc.

So with the SS Trust Fund being depleted by 2034 and benefits having to be cut for current seniors, what is your suggestion that falls into the realms of (a) fair and (b) politically achievable. Details would be nice to review, not a bumper sticker.

Your thoughts would be appreciated.

WW

the solution is the one that’s been proposed, and one that was successful with Sweden

 

[WorldWatcher]

the solution is the one that’s been proposed, and one that was successful with Sweden

Sweden - Individual - Other taxes

Detailed description of other taxes impacting individuals in Sweden

taxsummaries.pwc.com

7% on all employee wages (no cap) and 31.42% on taxable pay (no cap) paid by employers.

So you are advocating for MORE tax increases then my previous suggestion of doubling the current wage cap of $160K to $320K (or raising it to $500K).

Increasing Social Security taxes from the current 12.4% (EE and ER) rate capped at $160K to 35-48% (it's a little unclear) with no cap.

You think that will pass?

WW

 

[struth]

And that is?

WW

look it up…it’s been highly successful

 

[WorldWatcher]

look it up…it’s been highly successful

See post #544, I did look it up and edited it before your post.

WW

 

[WorldWatcher]

But there we go folks.

The complaint was about doubling the current cap.

The replacement? Raise taxes to even higher levels using the Swedish model. (Not saying the Swedish model is bad, but it is more expensive.)

WW

 

[Dragonlady]

where does that money go though? SS payouts are based on what you pay in

are we not gonna raise the cap? or are we just gonna take more from those that earn to give to those that don’t?

Someone once likened the Baby Boomers to a rat being digested by a snake. They are going to create a huge bulge in the economy at every age and stage of their lives that profundly impacts the economy. When we were growing up, schools had to be built to accommodate us. When we moved out and got married it created a housing boom. When we had families "minivans" became a thing. But there was always the fear that Boomers would bankrupt Social Security and Medicare at the end of our lives, and here we are. We have similar fears here with the Canada Pension Plan.
SS guarantees you income for life based on actuarial tables. Live long enough and you get far more than you paid in. End of life care is not cheap. Especially in the USA.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

Doubling the cap increases revenue into SS extending the life of the Trust Fund to get through the baby boomer bubble.

Raising the income cap, does not mean raising the benefit cap.

You know there is a benefit cap of $3627 (at full retirement age) for 2023. Right?

WW

Yes. And you have no problem with the guy making $500k paying 70% of his $3600 benefit
While the guy making $60k pays 20% of his $1500 benefit.

Where is the parity in that?

 

[Hutch Starskey]

Hmmm...

People that have paid into SS for 45 years are people that earned. The very way you earn SS is by paying into the system. They are not - to paraphrase - people that don't earn.

WW

Then everyone should pay more.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

Funded by 6.2% taken from each check. Whomever you work for does the same. It is capped at a certain amount, somewhere like $160,000. Then you do not contribute anymore for the year.

Removing the cap means you contribute all year. Most Americans do contribute all year due to fact they do NOT make the cap limit.

That’s how it’s designed to work though.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

Someone once likened the Baby Boomers to a rat being digested by a snake. They are going to create a huge bulge in the economy at every age and stage of their lives that profundly impacts the economy. When we were growing up, schools had to be built to accommodate us. When we moved out and got married it created a housing boom. When we had families "minivans" became a thing. But there was always the fear that Boomers would bankrupt Social Security and Medicare at the end of our lives, and here we are. We have similar fears here with the Canada Pension Plan.
SS guarantees you income for life based on actuarial tables. Live long enough and you get far more than you paid in. End of life care is not cheap. Especially in the USA.

It then become a question of who gets screwed.
The only realistic answer is everyone as everyone who participates has done their share. No one is at fault but the elected officials who have put this off for too long.

 

[WorldWatcher]

It then become a question of who gets screwed.
The only realistic answer is everyone as everyone who participates has done their share. No one is at fault but the elected officials who have put this off for too long.

I agree with the sentiment.

The question is...

What is your non-bumper sticker proposal that will fix the system through the baby boomer bump?

WW

 

[struth]

See post #544, I did look it up and edited it before your post.

WW

well you have my answer

 

[WorldWatcher]

well you have my answer

Roger.

Go with the Swedish model which will result in more increased taxes then just doubling the current cap.

7% paid by Employees and 31.42% paid by the employer (see post above for the link).

Do you think tripling the tax (currently 12.4% paid by EE and ER) to 37.42% (paid by EE and ER) will be politically doable? Or does this fall into - and I paraphrase - "I really don't have a solution, so I'm going to throw out a bumper sticker 'Do the same as Sweden'", hoping no one would check?

WW

 

[Aldo Raine]

That’s how it’s designed to work though.

It is and it is failing, that is why the cap needs to be raised or eliminated! That alone will make the program solvent!

 

[Grumblenuts]

Social Security Trust Fund Cash Flows and Reserves

Social Security Administration Research, Statistics, and Policy Analysis

www.ssa.gov

That was amazingly well written. Easy to follow, except for inducing a mandatory five minute nap every paragraph or so. Authors like that deserve a public service medal, a long vacation in the tropics, then a dirt nap for giving up so much their own lives just to clarify routine accounting for others.

 

[Grumblenuts]

Yes. And you have no problem with the guy making $500k paying 70% of his $3600 benefit
While the guy making $60k pays 20% of his $1500 benefit.

Where is the parity in that?

Parity? "By definition" "a guy making $500K" is not at a parity with a "guy making $60k".

noun

1. 1.
   the state or condition of being equal, especially regarding status or pay.
   "parity of incomes between rural workers and those in industrial occupations"
   
   Similar:
   equality
   equivalence
   uniformity
   sameness
   consistency

Your brain is truly broken.

 

[CowboyTed]

If only you weren’t a dupe of the establishment and could actually get informed. This from over six months ago.

The "safe and effective" narrative is falling apart​

Here is my list of over 50 leading indicators that the momentum is moving in our favor. I'd be surprised if the narrative doesn't fall apart soon. It's now unravelling quickly in the UK.​

Steve Kirsch

Jul 7, 2022


The vaccine deaths are now simply too massive to keep hiding/explaining them away:

1. Teens never die in their sleep. How can this happen two days after getting the vaccine instead of before getting the vaccine?
2. Latest UK numbers show unvaccinated have lower mortality for pretty much all age groups.
3. Turbo-cancer is being reported now. It’s impossible to explain. Never been seen before.
4. Wayne Root reported that 33 guests at his wedding who are now sick or dead were all vaccinated. The punchline: virtually all his guests were unvaccinated. So that’s unexplainable. He wrote: “It’s important to note, I’m a conservative talk show host who has warned LOUDLY of the dangers of the vaccine since day one. So, my friends are overwhelmingly conservative and unvaccinated too. Yet the few friends I know who did choose to vaccinate are almost all dead or ill.” And he said, “Among my friends and family who are unvaccinated, not one of them has died or been sick since my wedding eight months ago.” The article has a list of 8 headlines from TMZ of serious injury/death and then he points out: “These were all headlines in one day this week!” So Wayne isn’t just having bad luck. Bad luck is in the newspaper.
5. Joel Smalley documents child deaths reported to VAERS. None of these deaths would be considered normal. I’ve written about this extensively in last year: How did these 14 kids die? showing the CDC never explained the unusual causes of death. Now take a look at Slide 9 of my FDA presentation that I made on 10-26-21. Joel and I had the exact same reaction to this VAERS report: we both cried when we read it.
6. 4X increase in long term disability for airline pilots. The pilots union at a major US airline internally reports a 300 percent rise in long-term disability claims this year among its members, who are nearly all vaccinated. That’s statistically very unlikely. It couldn’t be COVID. What is novel that would have affected most of the pilots? Hmmmm…
7. A huge number of people in comedy are dying, 22 since September 2021. These deaths are easy to track since they are in plain sight.
8. This is a huge Black Swan event: 5 doctors in Ontario (plus one in Saskatchewan) died within 2 weeks of getting the 4th dose of the vaccine. Here are the stories: First three, fourth, fifth in Ontario, sixth in Saskatchewan. Number of unexpected deaths in 2020: zero (that I know of). These are happening everywhere of course, but are being buried. It would have been buried in Ontario as well, but someone put together the pattern. Notice this isn’t on any mainstream media. “[The] cause of death wasn’t shared in the memo, but how many times have 3 doctors died in 1 week, days after the hospital started administering the 4th shot to staff.” In the Greater Toronto area, there are now 7 deaths of doctors in a two week period. There are normally 0 unexpected deaths like this in a year. All the doctors were vaccinated with a fourth dose of the vaccine. See also: Four doctors in Ontario died right after the fourth dose.
9. See "Open your eyes. This is happening everywhere." The subhead says: Pushback over the deaths in Scotland and Italy; Wayne Allan Root has lost 33 friends—all "vaccinated"—to death or illness in the last 18 months; & TV presenter Kate McCann keels over, live!
10. Non-Covid excess deaths: why are they rising?Experts call for probe as mortality rates in England and Wales climb despite drop in coronavirus deaths
11. Excess deaths are on the rise – but not because of Covid
    Office for National Statistics data leads health experts to call for urgent investigation into what is causing the excess mortality
12. England: Excess Deaths on the Rise But NOT because of COVID – Experts Call for Investigation
13. It’s happening in Ireland too! How can heart disease explode in kids only after they roll out the vaccines for kids? Experts are baffled as to what might be causing a sudden increase in heart disease for kids that is happening only in places that have rolled out the COVID vaccines for kids. It’s not happening to kids anymore in Uruguay for some reason (perhaps the judge stopping the vaccine program might have something to do with it).

1. Unknown causes is now the leading cause of death in Alberta, Canada. It wasn’t that way before….

MORE AT THE LINK.
The "safe and effective" narrative is falling apart

The Irish Light in Ireland is an embarrassing publication by Gemma O'Doherty... The fucking bitch is a fruit cake...
She spent most of COVID loosing in court... In Ireland they found her to be a national embarrassment, she told lies while thousands people died int he country.

This woman is hated, if you said anything else in the pub expect your next actions to be staggering around picking up your teeth..

 

[Grumblenuts]

It is and it is failing, that is why the cap needs to be raised or eliminated! That alone will make the program solvent!

Never any genuine logic to having such a cap in the first place. It's just been a disgusting Appease Up / Punch Down political argument from Day 1.