Democrats Fast-Track Bill To Override Hobby Lobby Decision

[dblack]

If we still want to repeal ACA, we should all hope that the Dems succeed in overriding the decision.

 

[Manonthestreet]

Funny coming from the party who claims we cant legislate Ocare out of existence because court "ruled" it legal.

 

[Mathbud1]

[
I never had any issues with insurance. It was working well. Until this year. This year I have spent hours on the phone over and over again dealing with insurance and doctors.

?

¿Did I mention Obama?

¿

 

[daveman]

Actually, you could put all the "bonuses" VA managers got, and they wouldn't add up to the retirement package Ed Hanaway got for leaving Cigna.

That's the point, guy.

And it's not like I've seen your side come up with any solutions after you created the problem to start with.

You need to get a new schtick. Your "The Man is keeping me down!!" act is threadworn.

How many veterans could those VA manager bonuses have treated?

Not that you give a shit, of course.

Probably not all that many. The total number of bonuses given out were 108 million over a three year period to thousands of managers. Some of those managers probably actually made decisions and took actions that were valid. The average bonus was a whopping $1848.00. The top bonus was $62,000.

"Probably not all that many." So why bother, right? They're just veterans. Mostly Republicans. Fuck 'em, right?

By comparison, Ed Hanaway got 100 million to retire on.

And you're not entitled to any of it, no matter how much you stamp your feet and pout.

And I really love how guys like you and Mudwhistle just hate you the government while grabbing that government money with both hands. It amuses the shit out of me.

I don't hate the government; just because you operate solely on emotion doesn't mean everyone else does.

Yes, I'm a government employee. And I get frustrated when I see government waste. People being poor stewards of the taxpayer's money.

I got a performance bonus this year...$900. How did I earn it? By doing myself stuff they used to have to contract out -- my boss estimated I saved the taxpayers $20K.

You're welcome.

 

[JoeB131]

[

Yes, I'm a government employee. And I get frustrated when I see government waste. People being poor stewards of the taxpayer's money.

I got a performance bonus this year...$900. How did I earn it? By doing myself stuff they used to have to contract out -- my boss estimated I saved the taxpayers $20K.

You're welcome.

Uh, guy, I've saved my company $500,000 in cost reductions in the last six years. Puh-lease.

So what you are saying is that you are convinced these VA managers who worked in hospitals all over the country were personally responsible for other hospitals where they were cooking the books (and should be fired) and there's just no possibility they earned those benefits.

 

[JoeB131]

[

By comparison, Ed Hanaway got 100 million to retire on.

And you're not entitled to any of it, no matter how much you stamp your feet and pout. .

It's not a matter of what I am "entitled" to. It's a matter of what Nataline Sarkisyan is entitled to.

Nataline's dad worked for insurance and paid his co-payments, and he had a reasonable expectation that when his daughter got leukemia, and the doctors said a liver transplant might save her life, that Cigna would pay for that operation.

Instead, Cigna went to court, claimed it was an "experimental" procedure, and then said that Nataline's dad had no standing to sue them because their contract was with his employer, Lexus. (Maker of overpriced Cars driven by Douchebags since 1984!)

he was a genius, saving the company all that money. Yeah, I mean you had dead Nataline and probably some other dead people we never got to hear about. But he totally deserved that 108 Million in retirement pay.

 

[daveman]

[

Yes, I'm a government employee. And I get frustrated when I see government waste. People being poor stewards of the taxpayer's money.

I got a performance bonus this year...$900. How did I earn it? By doing myself stuff they used to have to contract out -- my boss estimated I saved the taxpayers $20K.

You're welcome.

Uh, guy, I've saved my company $500,000 in cost reductions in the last six years. Puh-lease.

I don't know what your company is, but it probably has zero impact on my life.

But if you pay taxes, my work has impacted yours.

You're welcome. Don't you wish every government employee was as conscientious as me?

So what you are saying is that you are convinced these VA managers who worked in hospitals all over the country were personally responsible for other hospitals where they were cooking the books (and should be fired) and there's just no possibility they earned those benefits.

Being wrong is your default mode, isn't it?

VA bonuses went to officials at delay-prone hospitals

More than $380,000 in bonuses were awarded last year to directors and top executives at 38 VA hospitals where investigators are looking into claims of falsified appointment records or where there have been excessive delays in patient care, according to agency documents provided by an investigating House committee.

--

Specifically, the bonuses might have led VA workers to alter wait-time records to make it appear veterans were being seen by doctors sooner than they actually were, according to the June 27 findings presented to President Obama by White House Deputy Chief of Staff Ron Nabors. Wait-time data for years have been a part of performance reviews on which bonuses are based.

The House Veterans' Affairs Committee Thursday provided documents showing the bonuses awarded to hospital officials who reported wait times far shorter than how long veterans were actually waiting to see doctors.

One case is the VA Palo Alto Health Care System in California where the director, Elizabeth Freeman, received a $12,579 bonus in February.

Her facility reported wait times of fewer than 18 days for new patients. But more recent numbers uncovered by the VA show an average wait of 63 days.​

Do you think she earned that bonus?

 

[dblack]

[

By comparison, Ed Hanaway got 100 million to retire on.

And you're not entitled to any of it, no matter how much you stamp your feet and pout. .

It's not a matter of what I am "entitled" to. It's a matter of what Nataline Sarkisyan is entitled to.

Nataline's dad worked for insurance and paid his co-payments, and he had a reasonable expectation that when his daughter got leukemia, and the doctors said a liver transplant might save her life, that Cigna would pay for that operation.

Instead, Cigna went to court, claimed it was an "experimental" procedure, and then said that Nataline's dad had no standing to sue them because their contract was with his employer, Lexus. (Maker of overpriced Cars driven by Douchebags since 1984!)

he was a genius, saving the company all that money. Yeah, I mean you had dead Nataline and probably some other dead people we never got to hear about. But he totally deserved that 108 Million in retirement pay.

Well, if he's fucking people over, let's not quibble about how much money he's making. Let's put him in jail.

That's what this whole 'income inequality' conceit tries to sell us. They want us to simply assume that people making lots of money are doing illicit shit to get it. Some of them probably are, and we should definitely try to figure out who and prosecute them. That would be justice, and we have a system in place to deal with bad actors. But justice isn't really what they're after, is it?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

[

You mean the teenager that UCSF said wouldn't be eligible for an transplant because it would be a waste of limited resources (a healthy liver) that should be used for people with a better chance of survival?

Maybe you should figure out a better example of the evils of insurance companies, especially considering that Cigna faced no out of pocket expenses if they had approved the surgery.

Actually, as usual, you don't know what you are talking about.

She wasn't being treated at UCSF, so why should what they had to say make any difference? She was being treated at

Death of Nataline Sarkisyan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Diagnosed with leukemia at age 14, Sarkisyan had health insurance coverage under the employer coverage of her parents. Physicians informed the family and insurance company[when?], Cigna HealthCare, that patients in similar circumstances have a six-month survival rate of 65% after a liver transplant.[

The chief of the Baylor Regional Transplant Institute in Dallas, Dr. Goran Klintmalm, said[when?] this particular operation was a "very high-risk transplant." Dr. Klintmalm did state that he would consider the same operation on a similar patient


UCLA declined two livers while waiting for insurance approval from Cigna.

As usual, you are assuming you are smarter than I am.

I never said she was being treated at UCSF, I pointed out that there were medical arguments against the transplant that she didn't get. If you think medical opinions are invalid in a discussion about medical treatment I really have no time to waste on your ignorance.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

[

The point is that you trust a government that has been proven to not care about anyone or anything but itself.

By the way, the government is the one that created the problem. That includes your side, not mine.

Uh, no, we arent' the ones who started a war with a country that wasn't our enemy over weapons that didn't exist, and then send men in to fight it with inadequate body and vehicle armor.

That wasn't the government? How the fuck did we get involved?

 

[daveman]

[

By comparison, Ed Hanaway got 100 million to retire on.

And you're not entitled to any of it, no matter how much you stamp your feet and pout. .

It's not a matter of what I am "entitled" to. It's a matter of what Nataline Sarkisyan is entitled to.

Nataline's dad worked for insurance and paid his co-payments, and he had a reasonable expectation that when his daughter got leukemia, and the doctors said a liver transplant might save her life, that Cigna would pay for that operation.

Instead, Cigna went to court, claimed it was an "experimental" procedure, and then said that Nataline's dad had no standing to sue them because their contract was with his employer, Lexus. (Maker of overpriced Cars driven by Douchebags since 1984!)

he was a genius, saving the company all that money. Yeah, I mean you had dead Nataline and probably some other dead people we never got to hear about. But he totally deserved that 108 Million in retirement pay.

You know what you can do about it?

Nothing except bitch impotently on the internet.

 

[JoeB131]

I don't know what your company is, but it probably has zero impact on my life.

But if you pay taxes, my work has impacted yours.

You're welcome. Don't you wish every government employee was as conscientious as me?

No, not really. Frankly, divided amongst hundreds of millions of taxpayers, my share of that $20,000 you saved what I'm assuming is DoD comes out to less than a penny.

Now, if we stopped fighting wars for the Zionists and Oil Companies, or make those worthless fucks fight their own damned wars, we'd probably save some real money. Just saying.

Do you think she earned that bonus?

Probably no more than you did. I mean, shit, you can make anything look great on paper.

 

[daveman]

[

And you're not entitled to any of it, no matter how much you stamp your feet and pout. .

It's not a matter of what I am "entitled" to. It's a matter of what Nataline Sarkisyan is entitled to.

Nataline's dad worked for insurance and paid his co-payments, and he had a reasonable expectation that when his daughter got leukemia, and the doctors said a liver transplant might save her life, that Cigna would pay for that operation.

Instead, Cigna went to court, claimed it was an "experimental" procedure, and then said that Nataline's dad had no standing to sue them because their contract was with his employer, Lexus. (Maker of overpriced Cars driven by Douchebags since 1984!)

he was a genius, saving the company all that money. Yeah, I mean you had dead Nataline and probably some other dead people we never got to hear about. But he totally deserved that 108 Million in retirement pay.

Well, if he's fucking people over, let's not quibble about how much money he's making. Let's put him in jail.

That's what this whole 'income inequality' conceit tries to sell us. They want us to simply assume that people making lots of money are doing illicit shit to get it. Some of them probably are, and we should definitely try to figure out who and prosecute them. That would be justice, and we have a system in place to deal with bad actors. But justice isn't really what they're after, is it?

When they say, "We want economic and social justice!!", they mean, "We want free shit we didn't earn!!"

 

[JoeB131]

[
You know what you can do about it?

Nothing except bitch impotently on the internet.

And work for politicians who pass things like the ACA that keeps that shit from happening.

Oh, wait. That totally happened.

Eventually, we'll get to single payer, and everyone will be better off for it.

 

[daveman]

I don't know what your company is, but it probably has zero impact on my life.

But if you pay taxes, my work has impacted yours.

You're welcome. Don't you wish every government employee was as conscientious as me?

No, not really. Frankly, divided amongst hundreds of millions of taxpayers, my share of that $20,000 you saved what I'm assuming is DoD comes out to less than a penny.

Now, if we stopped fighting wars for the Zionists and Oil Companies, or make those worthless fucks fight their own damned wars, we'd probably save some real money. Just saying.

Just repeating mindless prog talking points, you mean.

Do you think she earned that bonus?

Probably no more than you did. I mean, shit, you can make anything look great on paper.

Yeah. I could have said I'd saved my company a half a million dollars, when all I've ever accomplished in life is to be a little bitch on the internet.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Actually, you could put all the "bonuses" VA managers got, and they wouldn't add up to the retirement package Ed Hanaway got for leaving Cigna.

That's the point, guy.

And it's not like I've seen your side come up with any solutions after you created the problem to start with.

You need to get a new schtick. Your "The Man is keeping me down!!" act is threadworn.

How many veterans could those VA manager bonuses have treated?

Not that you give a shit, of course.

Probably not all that many. The total number of bonuses given out were 108 million over a three year period to thousands of managers. Some of those managers probably actually made decisions and took actions that were valid. The average bonus was a whopping $1848.00. The top bonus was $62,000.

By comparison, Ed Hanaway got 100 million to retire on.

And I really love how guys like you and Mudwhistle just hate you the government while grabbing that government money with both hands. It amuses the shit out of me.

Damn, you are hopeless, aren't you? You do understand that the bonuses actually went to managers of hospitals that had serious problems, don't you? Does the fact that they got less than a man who actually earned his income somehow justifies that?

 

[JoeB131]

As usual, you are assuming you are smareter than I am.

I never said she was being treated at UCSF, I pointed out that there were medical arguments against the transplant that she didn't get. If you think medical opinions are invalid in a discussion about medical treatment I really have no time to waste on your ignorance.

Guy, I'm always smarter than you are.
And I'm not batshit insane like you are.

Medical opinions from someone who never met the patient or treated her are pretty useless.

The people who WERE treating her said she needed that transplant.

 

[JoeB131]

Damn, you are hopeless, aren't you? You do understand that the bonuses actually went to managers of hospitals that had serious problems, don't you? Does the fact that they got less than a man who actually earned his income somehow justifies that?

You see, the thing is, I don't know what those bonuses were for. Some of them were probably based on fraudulent claims of reduced wait times, and those people should be fired and prosecuted.

And some of them were based on real improvements at their facilities.

And sorry, Ed Hanaway didn't earn anything. He put into place policies intended to wait patients out until they FUCKING DIED.

Don't take that from me, his own Vice President, Wendell Potter said as much.

 

[daveman]

[
You know what you can do about it?

Nothing except bitch impotently on the internet.

And work for politicians who pass things like the ACA that keeps that shit from happening.

Oh, wait. That totally happened.

Eventually, we'll get to single payer, and everyone will be better off for it.

You don't have a single clue about the consequences of what you want.

The government will totally own your ass. Idiot you just KNOWS they'll be kind and benevolent.

You say KKKorporations make medical decisions based solely on money. What makes you think the government will be any different?

Instead of the IRS selectively enforcing the rules based on political considerations, it will be the Federal Medical Board deciding who gets treated and who dies...based on political considerations.

You don't have to believe me. But if we make the supreme mistake of going single-payer, that's exactly what's going to happen.

 

[JoeB131]

[
Yeah. I could have said I'd saved my company a half a million dollars, when all I've ever accomplished in life is to be a little bitch on the internet.

Yeah, you just bitch about the Negro in the White HOuse.

We all know that burns you.