Do Conservatives know what health insurance is?

[Remodeling Maidiac]

If we are forced to cover another's pre-existing condition, IT IS NOT INSURANCE. IT IS WELFARE

THAT IS INSURANCE YOU STUPID IDIOT.

Wrong. That is the law known as Obamacare. Prior to Obamacare that practice did not take place.

 

[Skull Pilot]

No insurance, all insurance, is the spreading of risk not the redistribution of money.

Jesus tap dancing Christ. When you pay an insurance company a premium, your premium goes into an insurance pool with millions of other people who are doing the same thing. Then when you incur health care costs, money from that premium pool you already paid into is then redistributed to your provider to pay for the health care costs you incurred.

This is what I'm talking about when I say that you don't know what health insurance is, you don't know what insurance companies do, and you don't know how it relates to health care delivery.

Which is why it used to be people who posed greater risk paid higher premiums

Fucking idiot. High-risk pools don't work They end up costing the state more than if they just expanded Medicaid. Secondly, in most cases, people have no control over their health care needs as most conditions are genetic and are out of someone's control. Secondly, there are things like appendicitis, which can strike anyone at any time and costs $33K on average to treat.

But the democrats somewhere along the line confused health insurance with health care

No, you guys did. Because you don't understand the concept of health insurance.

No you are pooling your risk with the risk of others so as to minimize potential losses
Those deemed to have a higher risk of loss pay more or are denied insurance or they used to at least as far as health insurance is concerned. It's still that way with life insurance and every other type of insurance.

But the democrats started conflating health care with health insurance and changed the fundamental nature of health insurance by not allowing insurance companies to charge more or to deny coverage for high risk people so that in all reality it is not insurance anymore.

and btw who are "you guys"? I am not have never been and will never be a member of any political party

 

[rightwinger]

It is a product made and sold for profit by the private industry that is forced on Americans by our government.

You're welcome

You ready to give up your health insurance

Most Americans are not

 

[blackhawk]

Your thread title is do conservatives know what health insurance is? So that is exactly what you asked.

And you proved you all didn't know what health insurance is because it's more than just a piece of paper.

It's a contract between the buyer and seller in which the terms are spelled out as to the responsibilities of both. Each party has copy of the contract usually printed on paper you have proven you know nothing thank you and good day to you.

 

[emilynghiem]

Don't forget to compare the costs of failed prison systems to the cost of setting up medical education and programs to serve the greater public.

I think we need to re-examine our priorities as a society, and agree the drug war is useless, pointless, and costly.

Okay The Derp that is where we could form agreements on how to spend less on unconstitutional garbage
and be able to afford the health care and other services such as for Vets we'd rather pay for with those same taxes. Agreed?

 

[Darkwind]

Prior to Obamacare, I could purchase an insurance policy that covered major medical (catastrophic) costs. I did not have to pay for services I did not need. I was still paying insurance and that means I was still sharing the risk with everyone in My risk pool.

OK, but your catastrophic plan had a lifetime cap...which meant it wasn't catastrophic at all because once your catastrophe exceeded the lifetime cap, you were on the hook for 100% of the costs thereafter. The average lifetime cap on a catastrophic plan was about $200K. It costs about half a million dollars to treat prostate cancer between the surgeries, chemo, drugs, etc. A heart transplant costs about $1M. So explain how your catastrophic plan protected you from catastrophe if you had to pay a greater share of the overall bill? How's that a deal for you?

I did not need insurance to cover the costs of office visits, minor procedures, and medication. Just like I don't use insurance to pay for oil changes, spark plug, tire and general upkeep of My car. Those things came out of pocket.

Again, you don't know what the costs will be until after your provider incurs them.

Taking your appendectomy example of 33,000 dollars, I would have had to pay out of pocket the 7,000 dollars and the 20% copay responsibility of 6,600 dollars. Add the yearly cost of 600 dollars and My total cost out of pocket would have been $14,200.

Right, and why do you have to pay the $7K and the 20% co-pay? Because the insurer is trying to make a profit. So remove the insurer's profit motive and suddenly you pay much less. What you described above is exactly why we need single payer.

You're compassion costs American citizens far more than doing away with Obamacare and actually returning insurance to what it should be. A hedge agaisnts something catastrophic occurring and not a "wipe my ass for Me' program.

It's not that right now. And I thought you people wanted everyone to "put more skin in the game". Don't high deductibles and co-insurance accomplish that? Why are you suddenly against it now?

Unless you're some kind of sickly person, the lifetime cap on this would not kick in until after I was eligible for medicare. Something I paid into My entire life. I could then, at a significantly lower rate, purchase gap insurance and end up with the exact same coverage and would still be paying into a risk pool. So, that deal is pretty okay with Me since I'm still paying My way on the back of My lifetime's contribution. Will I incur costs? Yes. That is what happens in life. Pay your way. BTW, do you think that insurance companies should not make a profit?

Again, you seem to have some kind of dense spot here. Do you turn the cost of your auto's oil change into your insurance company? How about a quarterly tune up? Tire rotation, is that covered by your auto insurance? How about bulb replacement, wiper replacement, car wash? You don't seem to understand what insurance is and how it is used. Insurance is not used on the routine upkeep of your auto, nor should it be used on the routine upkeep of your person. Doctor visits, blood tests, minor procedures like sprains, bruises, headaches, etc., should be the price of you pay out of pocket. You don't need an insurance company to wipe your ass every time you get a sniffle. Pay your way.

The problem with higher deductibles higher premiums with government programs is that I have no market to shop around in. Prior, I could tailor an insurance plan based upon My consideration of what I needed and could find. With a large market, I have plenty of choices. This is called freedom. If I felt I needed a better plan, I paid more, if I figured I could get by with the bare minimum, then I paid less. Either way, I understood that the plan had limitations and anything beyond that plan was on Me. It's called paying your own way.

So you see, as a conservative, I DO UNDERSTAND how insurance works.

Do you?

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Your thread title is do conservatives know what health insurance is? So that is exactly what you asked.

And you proved you all didn't know what health insurance is because it's more than just a piece of paper.

It's a contract between the buyer and seller in which the terms are spelled out as to the responsibilities of both. Each party has copy of the contract usually printed on paper you have proven you know nothing thank you and good day to you.

Wondering if he's a millennial. They seem to be an abnormally stupid bunch

 

[frigidweirdo]

On Fox 'n' Friends, Brian Kilmeade lamented that healthy people pay for sick people.

That is literally what health insurance is.

Congrats to the not-presently-on-fire for paying for firefighters.

They think we are cars... they think we can live without our bodies if we can't afford it like we can live without cars.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

On Fox 'n' Friends, Brian Kilmeade lamented that healthy people pay for sick people.

That is literally what health insurance is.

Congrats to the not-presently-on-fire for paying for firefighters.

They think we are cars... they think we can live without our bodies if we can't afford it like we can live without cars.

Naw, even a Pinto is smarter than you idiots.

 

[emilynghiem]

It is a product made and sold for profit by the private industry that is forced on Americans by our government.

You're welcome

You ready to give up your health insurance

Most Americans are not

Dear rightwinger
Some people lost theirs with the last policy change.
Why not change which parties fund which insurance policies?
Let Democrats fund the govt sponsored programs
while Republicans fund the free market options.

Then if there is a budget shortfall, let groups LEND to each other
in exchange for tax breaks. So reward people for INVESTING in
sustainable business plans. Just don't force it through taxation
when there is no accountability or agreement on what services are covered.

Give taxpayers a choice, then the most cost effective policies will win
support and funding, either from taxes, donations, loans or investments.

Look at how Doctors Without Borders and St. Jude's Children's Hospital works.
Why not expand on those models that have proven they provide services and
build clinics and programs to serve regions with high demand and no access.

Also look how the public responded when Red Cross was caught withholding
or misdirecting funds. They had to correct that or else people threatened to stop funding them.
That's the accountability we need for sustainable responsible affordable services.
If these are "automattically funded by govt" despite poor performance and corruption/abuse of funds,
then you end up with the VA mess that is letting Vets die while waiting for procedures
because the backlog and bureaucracy is so bad.

If Democrats want structured health care through govt, why not reform prison facilities
and resources to universalize medical education, programs and health care for the greater public?

If Republicans want to pay for Vets health care first, why not reform the VA and expand
on those facilities and programs to serve the greater populations using the same resources
currently wasted on failed systems?

Give each party their own platform to develop for their own membership.
And quit fighting over public vs. private when both approaches are needed
to serve all people across all states equally. We need both party approaches,
not one or the other, not either or. Let taxpayers choose which to fund, and quit fighting already!!!
We need both to serve their members under the beliefs they support.
We have religious freedom and diversity, to fund and create separate schools and programs without infringing on others
or forcing mandates through govt against people of other groups and beliefs.
why not respect the same for political beliefs by party??

 

[emilynghiem]

On Fox 'n' Friends, Brian Kilmeade lamented that healthy people pay for sick people.

That is literally what health insurance is.

Congrats to the not-presently-on-fire for paying for firefighters.

They think we are cars... they think we can live without our bodies if we can't afford it like we can live without cars.

frigidweirdo
it's the liberals who don't believe health care can be provided through charities, schools and businesses
outside of govt.

That's like saying "all housing" should be regulated by govt because of homelessness.
No, there are charities that work on the housing and mental illness/homeless issues.
Govt does not force everyone to finance Habitat for Humanity
but these programs are doing very well by VOLUNTARY DONATIONS AND PARTICIPATION including labor invested
WITHOUT REQUIRING IT BY GOVT.

Why can't health care be managed the same way by communities
looking to serve needs and govern their resources locally WITHOUT MANDATES BY FEDERAL GOVT.

That is where liberals lack faith, and try to impose this "compelling interest" on everyone else.
frigidweirdo how do you like it when "right to life" people impose those beliefs through GOVT?

Don't you argue for "freedom of choice" even while prolifers
bemoan the millions of unborn babies who die without any protections by law?

So you seem "callous" to prolifers who make liberals out to be "babykillers"
who don't care if unborn individuals die without any protection of their right to life.

As a prochoice advocate, I believe that without force of law but by FREE CHOICE
we can better prevent unwanted sex/pregnancy and unwanted children/abortion
and completely prevent abortion 100% BY FREE CHOICE NOT FORCE OF LAW.

I challenge you to be just as consistent
when it comes to Free choice of health care.

Being prochoice does not mean forcing abortion but choosing to avoid it.
Likewise being prochoice about health care does not mean "wanting people to die without health care"
but believing we can better set up sustainable cost-effective care by FREE CHOICE NOT FORCE OF LAW.

I believe that state govts can set up hospital sites and medical schools such as UTMB that
are public service facilities. But the programs may be a mix of private and public resources,
where medical education is provided for interns and residents who serve in public health.
That way we can afford both the services and the education needed to develop universal care.

That won't happen by forcing it, but by giving people free choice and tax breaks to fund
cost-effective programs. And quit funding programs that burden taxpayers with waste and fraud!

 

[BlueGin]

You really are one stupid son-of-a-bitch.

No, you guys are stupid because you don't know what health insurance is, and you never have. That's why you can't articulate a replacement plan. Because you lack the brain power to understand it. Whether or not you're being deliberately obtuse is a whole other question.

You get a big medical bill and they will put you on a payment program.

Right...they garnish your wages. That's the "payment plan". And when you pay cash, you're paying over-inflated prices that are in the chargemaster. Or they give you a discount, but that discount just gets paid by those on insurance, who have taken personal responsibility.

Thanks for making my point, dickhead. You get a bill for 33K, you sell your car and pay off the hospital.

Math is hard for your guys.

$25K =/= $33K.

So you're still $8K in the hole.

You can set up a payment plan with your doctor OR apply for a grant from a non profit of which there are many ( or hospital charity fund)...that will pay your hospital care. Want to know how a lot of the grants are funded? A huge percentage are paid directly from donations from hospital and healthplan employees taken directly from their pay checks.

You are welcome.

 

[BlueGin]

By buying in insurance policy....duh

OK, but you can't buy an insurance policy in the back of an ambulance as you're taken to Moneybags General Hospital. Conservatives seem to think that health insurance isn't necessary. Then when confronted with a scenario like appendicitis, which strikes quickly and suddenly and needs immediate medical care, suddenly they think going bankrupt is the solution.

If you qualify for Medicaid/Medicare a social worker will be assigned to you...if you qualify you are signed up...if not they will help you fill out the forms to get you a grant or pay for it from the charity fund.

 

[rightwinger]

What Conservatives know about Health Insurance

1. They don't consider it to be a basic human right
2. They don't want poor people to have it
3. They want healthcare to go to the highest bidder
4. They support obscene profits
5. They hate anything with Obama's name on it

 

[BlueGin]

What Conservatives know about Health Insurance

1. They don't consider it to be a basic human right
2. They don't want poor people to have it
3. They want healthcare to go to the highest bidder
4. They support obscene profits
5. They hate anything with Obama's name on it

Many hospital and health plan employees also donate their PTO to the grants for patients that can't pay their hospital bills. FYI

 

[The Derp]

Wrong. That is the law known as Obamacare. Prior to Obamacare that practice did not take place.

All Obamacare does is mandate insurance and set up a marketplace where insurers can offer their plans for consumers to compare.

 

[The Derp]

No you are pooling your risk with the risk of others so as to minimize potential losses Those deemed to have a higher risk of loss pay more or are denied insurance or they used to at least as far as health insurance is concerned. It's still that way with life insurance and every other type of insurance.

Deemed by who? By insurance company executives whose primary motivation is to make a profit. So, it's got nothing to do with your health care and everything to do with their bottom line. So how's that a benefit to you as a patient?

But the democrats started conflating health care with health insurance and changed the fundamental nature of health insurance by not allowing insurance companies to charge more or to deny coverage for high risk people so that in all reality it is not insurance anymore.

It is insurance...definitely. And in your scenario, the minute someone incurs a medical cost, they go into the high-risk pool. That makes no sense, and defeats the purpose of insurance altogether.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Its good that you guys are having the debate.
The rest of the world knows that there is a better way.
Of course it would infringe on your God given right to die because you are poor.
That does need to be factored in.

 

[The Derp]

It's a contract between the buyer and seller in which the terms are spelled out as to the responsibilities of both.

And the responsibility of the insurance company is to do what? Administer payment to your provider after you've already incurred those costs. So how does that benefit you as a patient? Why does it matter who reimburses your provider? Shouldn't the only thing that matters be that the provider is reimbursed? The insurer is determining what they reimburse based not on your health care needs, but on their bottom line. So how is their bottom line detrimental to your health?

 

[The Derp]

Okay The Derp that is where we could form agreements on how to spend less on unconstitutional garbage and be able to afford the health care and other services such as for Vets we'd rather pay for with those same taxes. Agreed?

Totally. We can also increase our revenues to pay for more by raising taxes, particularly on the wealthy.