Do Muslims believe in the separation of Church and State?

[Two Thumbs]

They make it really clear in their actions.

they are either under a king
a ruthless dictator
or they can elect a person that the mullahs picked

and good luck observing another religion or getting a fair trial if you aren't.

OK but what about those coming here? Don't they have to pledge allegiance to the flag of the USA and the Republic for which it stands? If you look at the Nos, Muslims who believe as they do cannot take the oath.

those born here never have to say it.
not all immigrants become citizens
and it's not just ok to lie to non-muslims, it's encouraged in many situations.

 

[Two Thumbs]

I'm more interested in whether Christians believe in separation of church and state in America. Whether they do or don't is more important because of their numbers and influence in our country.

I don't buy your claim to only be seeking knowledge. If that were the case you'd be talking to Muslims instead of reading whatever backs your bias against them.

If it was a real concern that christians would rid of of sep of church and state, it would have happened by now.

so did you lie in your accusation or are you truly that ignorant?

 

[Muhammed]

It's a bash thread.

Many schools of Muslims eat kittens for superfun.

 

[Muhammed]

It's a bash thread.

Many schools of Muslims eat kittens for superfun.

Some kittens are super yummy!


Yummy yummy yummy yummy yummy!!!!!

 

[Coloradomtnman]

I'm more interested in whether Christians believe in separation of church and state in America. Whether they do or don't is more important because of their numbers and influence in our country.

I don't buy your claim to only be seeking knowledge. If that were the case you'd be talking to Muslims instead of reading whatever backs your bias against them.

If it was a real concern that christians would rid of of sep of church and state, it would have happened by now.

so did you lie in your accusation or are you truly that ignorant?

It happens all the time. When Christians push for school prayer, for creationism to be taught in schools, by pushing legislation that is bible-based (such as laws prohibiting SSM or opposing laws which protect homosexuals from discrimination), by voting only for Christian candidates (not that that is unconstitutional).

Here are some well known and not so well known Christian organizations that don't fully respect the separation of church and state:

Cause for Concern (Church/State)

Johnston Family

Stand to Reason | Church and State: The Separation Illusion

Separation of Church and State | Christian Faith in America

The Truth About Separation of Church and State

The Real Strategy – The Real Strategy

 

[JQPublic1]

in islam religion is state you fucking idiot.

My dear fallow American. Is that any way to start the new year? The premise that you assume is mine belongs to one of the two groups I have presented here. Your response, therefore, is consistent with that of Dr, Idris....Thank you.

 

[JQPublic1]

They make it really clear in their actions.

they are either under a king
a ruthless dictator
or they can elect a person that the mullahs picked

and good luck observing another religion or getting a fair trial if you aren't.

OK but what about those coming here? Don't they have to pledge allegiance to the flag of the USA and the Republic for which it stands? If you look at the Nos, Muslims who believe as they do cannot take the oath.

those born here never have to say it.
not all immigrants become citizens
and it's not just ok to lie to non-muslims, it's encouraged in many situations.

1. Darn it, you are right about native born Muslims. Some Americans are converted and radicalized right through the INTERNET like Trump says. Now I am not a victim of Trumpmania by any means but he got my attention when he said that.
Still,that method is risky since the Feds are constantly monitoring the INTERNET. ISPs, however, protective of their customer's privacy, may or may not be compliant with assisting monitoring their traffic. I suspect most do comply, though.

2. Again, you have scored a hit. Not all immigrants become citizens. That is another flaw in our national security that has not been addressed... But maybe our Intelligence operative are really doing a good job. In any case the source of H-IB and associated programs emanates from the
Immigration and Nationality Act (INA), signed into law By President Johnson in 1965. A bi-partisan congress passed it by the way.

U.S. organizations are , under the auspices of the INA, permitted to employ foreign workers either temporarily or permanently to fulfill certain types of job requirement. Obviously, our elected leaders back then didn't think much of the native born workforce. But coercion was needed to force businesses to hire foreign workers to bridge the gap of qualified and skilled labor in certain business areas. That was accomplished via the requirement for businesses be certified by the FEDs to do business. If you didn't agree to the provisions of certification ,which included the hiring of foreign nationals for certain work, you didn't get to operate your business.

The Employment and Training Administration (ETA) was formed under the department of Labor to leverage the hiring of foreign workers


H-1B and H-1B1 Specialty (Professional) Workers

H-2A Agricultural Workers

H-2B Non-agricultural Workers

D-1 Crewmembers

Permanent Employment of Aliens


3. You are referring to Taqiyya. I am aware of the ramifications with that. But there are ways around it. For example, Some Muslim immigrants have proven themselves by joining one of the US armed forces to combat ISIS and Al Queda. Surely these Muslim vets can be put to good use in the screening process to circumvent Taqiyya. This plan may already be the source of good information gleaned from captives.

 

[Two Thumbs]

I'm more interested in whether Christians believe in separation of church and state in America. Whether they do or don't is more important because of their numbers and influence in our country.

I don't buy your claim to only be seeking knowledge. If that were the case you'd be talking to Muslims instead of reading whatever backs your bias against them.

If it was a real concern that christians would rid of of sep of church and state, it would have happened by now.

so did you lie in your accusation or are you truly that ignorant?

It happens all the time. When Christians push for school prayer, for creationism to be taught in schools, by pushing legislation that is bible-based (such as laws prohibiting SSM or opposing laws which protect homosexuals from discrimination), by voting only for Christian candidates (not that that is unconstitutional).

Here are some well known and not so well known Christian organizations that don't fully respect the separation of church and state:

Cause for Concern (Church/State)

Johnston Family

Stand to Reason | Church and State: The Separation Illusion

Separation of Church and State | Christian Faith in America

The Truth About Separation of Church and State

The Real Strategy – The Real Strategy

the push for prayer is the push to be allowed to pray, as in the First.
creationism is just a theory, like evolution is a theory, pushing one and not allowing the other is wrong
yea, thou shalt not murder is such a religious thing
we have property rights unless someone can claim to be a victim


have any of those groups gone on a killing spree? Tried to push for laws that would end in death for many?

No?


shocking revelation.

 

[Two Thumbs]

They make it really clear in their actions.

they are either under a king
a ruthless dictator
or they can elect a person that the mullahs picked

and good luck observing another religion or getting a fair trial if you aren't.

OK but what about those coming here? Don't they have to pledge allegiance to the flag of the USA and the Republic for which it stands? If you look at the Nos, Muslims who believe as they do cannot take the oath.

those born here never have to say it.
not all immigrants become citizens
and it's not just ok to lie to non-muslims, it's encouraged in many situations.

1. Darn it, you are right about native born Muslims. Some Americans are converted and radicalized right through the INTERNET like Trump says. Now I am not a victim of Trumpmania by any means but he got my attention when he said that.
Still,that method is risky since the Feds are constantly monitoring the INTERNET. ISPs, however, protective of their customer's privacy, may or may not be compliant with assisting monitoring their traffic. I suspect most do comply, though.

2. Again, you have scored a hit. Not all immigrants become citizens. That is another flaw in our national security that has not been addressed... But maybe our Intelligence operative are really doing a good job. In any case the source of H-IB and associated programs emanates from the
Immigration and Nationality Act (INA), signed into law By President Johnson in 1965. A bi-partisan congress passed it by the way.

U.S. organizations are , under the auspices of the INA, permitted to employ foreign workers either temporarily or permanently to fulfill certain types of job requirement. Obviously, our elected leaders back then didn't think much of the native born workforce. But coercion was needed to force businesses to hire foreign workers to bridge the gap of qualified and skilled labor in certain business areas. That was accomplished via the requirement for businesses be certified by the FEDs to do business. If you didn't agree to the provisions of certification ,which included the hiring of foreign nationals for certain work, you didn't get to operate your business.

The Employment and Training Administration (ETA) was formed under the department of Labor to leverage the hiring of foreign workers


H-1B and H-1B1 Specialty (Professional) Workers

H-2A Agricultural Workers

H-2B Non-agricultural Workers

D-1 Crewmembers

Permanent Employment of Aliens


3. You are referring to Taqiyya. I am aware of the ramifications with that. But there are ways around it. For example, Some Muslim immigrants have proven themselves by joining one of the US armed forces to combat ISIS and Al Queda. Surely these Muslim vets can be put to good use in the screening process to circumvent Taqiyya. This plan may already be the source of good information gleaned from captives.

3. There's very few muslims in the military, never met nor suspected anyone of being one, not that I put any effort into finding out.

but when we went to Desert Shield, a few muslims refused to deploy (treason) b/c now they were objectors. They swore to defend the country, not defend the country except..

I'd like to know how many of our muslim in the military are in combat and how many are behind the lines.

 

[JQPublic1]

They make it really clear in their actions.

they are either under a king
a ruthless dictator
or they can elect a person that the mullahs picked

and good luck observing another religion or getting a fair trial if you aren't.

OK but what about those coming here? Don't they have to pledge allegiance to the flag of the USA and the Republic for which it stands? If you look at the Nos, Muslims who believe as they do cannot take the oath.

those born here never have to say it.
not all immigrants become citizens
and it's not just ok to lie to non-muslims, it's encouraged in many situations.

1. Darn it, you are right about native born Muslims. Some Americans are converted and radicalized right through the INTERNET like Trump says. Now I am not a victim of Trumpmania by any means but he got my attention when he said that.
Still,that method is risky since the Feds are constantly monitoring the INTERNET. ISPs, however, protective of their customer's privacy, may or may not be compliant with assisting monitoring their traffic. I suspect most do comply, though.

2. Again, you have scored a hit. Not all immigrants become citizens. That is another flaw in our national security that has not been addressed... But maybe our Intelligence operative are really doing a good job. In any case the source of H-IB and associated programs emanates from the
Immigration and Nationality Act (INA), signed into law By President Johnson in 1965. A bi-partisan congress passed it by the way.

U.S. organizations are , under the auspices of the INA, permitted to employ foreign workers either temporarily or permanently to fulfill certain types of job requirement. Obviously, our elected leaders back then didn't think much of the native born workforce. But coercion was needed to force businesses to hire foreign workers to bridge the gap of qualified and skilled labor in certain business areas. That was accomplished via the requirement for businesses be certified by the FEDs to do business. If you didn't agree to the provisions of certification ,which included the hiring of foreign nationals for certain work, you didn't get to operate your business.

The Employment and Training Administration (ETA) was formed under the department of Labor to leverage the hiring of foreign workers


H-1B and H-1B1 Specialty (Professional) Workers

H-2A Agricultural Workers

H-2B Non-agricultural Workers

D-1 Crewmembers

Permanent Employment of Aliens


3. You are referring to Taqiyya. I am aware of the ramifications with that. But there are ways around it. For example, Some Muslim immigrants have proven themselves by joining one of the US armed forces to combat ISIS and Al Queda. Surely these Muslim vets can be put to good use in the screening process to circumvent Taqiyya. This plan may already be the source of good information gleaned from captives.

3. There's very few muslims in the military, never met nor suspected anyone of being one, not that I put any effort into finding out.

but when we went to Desert Shield, a few muslims refused to deploy (treason) b/c now they were objectors. They swore to defend the country, not defend the country except..

I'd like to know how many of our muslim in the military are in combat and how many are behind the lines.

On December 14, 1993, the Army Chief of Chaplains requested that an insignia be created to represent Muslim chaplains, and the design (a crescent) was completed January 8, 1993.[2]

In 2011 there were approximately 3500 American Muslims serving in the United States military.[3]

Monje Malak Abd al-Muta Noel Jr, or Monje Malak Abd al-Muta'Ali, Jr.) is "frocked" by U.S. Navy Chaplain Arnold E. Resnicoff in a ceremony held at the U.S. Naval Submarine Base New London where Noel, then a "chaplain-candidate," was receiving training by Chaplain Resnicoff for future service in the Chaplain Corps,

Muslims in the United States military - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Two Thumbs]

wow, that's a tiny number

 

[JQPublic1]

wow, that's a tiny number

But obviously more than you first thought!

 

[Tilly]

Not in Iran.

 

[Tilly]

I'm more interested in whether Christians believe in separation of church and state in America. Whether they do or don't is more important because of their numbers and influence in our country.

I don't buy your claim to only be seeking knowledge. If that were the case you'd be talking to Muslims instead of reading whatever backs your bias against them.

Presently, Christian extremists do not present a viable threat to our national security. I think we both can agree that Islamic extremists here and abroad do represent a viable terrorist threat. We cannot readily tell by looking at Muslims whether they are good or bad. If we do not address that reality we are inviting disaster. Given the views of Dr. Idris prefacing the op, I wondered how those who believed as he does ever become citizens of the USA. Obviously according to Idris, the doctrine of SOCAS is anathema to the ISLAMIC faith. Therefore when the pledge of allegiance is administered, how do Muslims like Idris get around it?Do you think the pledge should NOT be given to Muslim immigrants as a condition for citizenship?

They get around it by employing al taqiyya. And good post.

 

[Mudda]

Muslims believe in the separation of your head from your body.

 

[dani67]

SOME MOSLEM YES.SOME MOSLEM NO
some moslem drink wine
some moslem dont drink wine
some moslem are jihadist
some moslem arent jihadist
like christian like jewish like atheist

 

[dani67]

From what I know of Islam, there does not seem to be a discernible secular component to it at all.
In a brief search for the answer to that question I have come across varied Muslim offerings on the matter.

The "No's"

Dr. Ja`far Sheikh Idris at Islaam.com posits:

"So how are Muslims to approach the modern trend of separation of religion and state? The basic belief in Islam is that the Qur’an is one hundred percent the word of Allah, and the Sunna was also as a result of the guidance of Allah to the Prophet sallallahu allayhe wasalam. Islam cannot be separated from the state because it guides us through every detail of running the state and our lives. Muslims have no choice but to reject secularism for it excludes the law of Allah."

Does that sound ominous?Hold on, Dr. Idris attempt to put us at ease with:

"What needs to be pointed out is that under the law of Islam, other religions are not prohibited. At the same time, people are provided with doctrines for legislation and running of state that will protect people of all faiths living in the state."

OK, I feel much better now knowing that not all Muslims are out to convert or kill all people of other faiths. Hopefully this revelation by Idris is not some form of Taqiyya.. The recent story of Muslims protecting Christians in Kenya lends some credence to his words.

Continuing with more excerpts from Dr. Idris's narrative:

"Secularists in the West will agree with this, then they will point out that under Islamic law, people are not all equal. No non-Muslim, for example, could become the president. Well, in response to that fact, in turn, secularism is no different. No Muslim could become president in a secular regime, for in order to pledge loyalty to the constitution, a Muslim would have to abandon part of his belief and embrace the belief of secularism — which is practically another religion. For Muslims, the word ‘religion’ does not only refer to a collection of beliefs and rituals, it refers to a way of life which includes all values, behaviours, and details of living."

There it is. Dr. Idris, has put it succinctly and convincingly: The Separation of Church and State is not an option for Muslims. He is joined in that opinion by

Jamil Hamami:


Jamil Hamami, a Hamas leader and lecturer at Al Quds University, in a May 29, 1999 seminar posted on the Palestinian Academic Society for the Study of International Affairs (PASSIA) website titled "Political Islam in the Arab World," wrote:

"Some people think that talking about political Islam implies that there is a separation between religion and state. An in-depth look at the way and spirit of Islam would show that this is not true. Islam is state, religion and a way of life -- which includes all aspects of the daily life of the Muslim -- combined."



May 29, 1999 - Jamil Hamami

Is Islam Compatible with the Concept of the Separation of Religion and State? - Israeli-Palestinian Conflict - ProCon.org

The Yes men....to be continued......

are all christian believe this bullshit?

ible Commands Christians to Kill Nonbelievers Bible Commands Christians to Kill Nonbelievers | Atheist Revolution

 

[dani67]

 

[longknife]

They make it really clear in their actions.

they are either under a king
a ruthless dictator
or they can elect a person that the mullahs picked

and good luck observing another religion or getting a fair trial if you aren't.

OK but what about those coming here? Don't they have to pledge allegiance to the flag of the USA and the Republic for which it stands? If you look at the Nos, Muslims who believe as they do cannot take the oath.

Their Satanic Cult allows them to take any oath without meaning it in furtherance of their goals of completely dominating any non-Islamic state they're in.

Islam is not a religion - it is a cult dedicated to getting political domination.

 

[Dhara]

Islam bashing thread.

Do you want to grow hate or love in your heart? Your choice. Decide which you choose to feed.