Do only Christians go to heaven?

[Weatherman2020]

Again you seem desperate to deny the divinity of Yeshua. You must hold very strongly to that deception.

Desperate? I don't think so. Jesus never claimed divinity. If he did he was either a false prophet or insane. I provided to you a quotation from Jesus himself that shows that he neither thought of himself as God nor claimed to be God..John 17:10

The religion that you belong to take three sentences out of context without applying the logic of a grade school child to make the false claim that Jesus was God in the flesh which desecrates his teaching and brings the name of Jesus into disrepute among intelligent people.

One would have to throw the entire teaching of the law and the prophets, not to mention logic and reason, in the trash to swallow your deception.

There never was and never will be a human being that was God or became God either before, during or after their human existence.

Who can forgive sin but God Himself? Jesus did.
Who is the Alpha and the Omega? In Isaiah, it's God Himself. Jesus is as well.
Who is the I am? To Moses, it is God Himself. Jesus is as well.

The apostles were given the power to forgive or condemn.

Did that make them God too?



C'mon Hadit, its time to fold and go home before you lose it all.

You are out of chips and you have no credit and Im not interested in your pocket watch or owning your soul.

The apostles were given the power to forgive or condemn.

Is that from the Yougottabekidding translation?

The only thing that even comes close is that passage in Matthew 16 and again in 18. Neither one says they have the power to forgive or condemn.

Most deniers misrepresent Scripture. Satan loves to do that.

 

[hobelim]

Desperate? I don't think so. Jesus never claimed divinity. If he did he was either a false prophet or insane. I provided to you a quotation from Jesus himself that shows that he neither thought of himself as God nor claimed to be God..John 17:10

The religion that you belong to take three sentences out of context without applying the logic of a grade school child to make the false claim that Jesus was God in the flesh which desecrates his teaching and brings the name of Jesus into disrepute among intelligent people.

One would have to throw the entire teaching of the law and the prophets, not to mention logic and reason, in the trash to swallow your deception.

There never was and never will be a human being that was God or became God either before, during or after their human existence.

Who can forgive sin but God Himself? Jesus did.
Who is the Alpha and the Omega? In Isaiah, it's God Himself. Jesus is as well.
Who is the I am? To Moses, it is God Himself. Jesus is as well.

The apostles were given the power to forgive or condemn.

Did that make them God too?



C'mon Hadit, its time to fold and go home before you lose it all.

You are out of chips and you have no credit and Im not interested in your pocket watch or owning your soul.

The apostles were given the power to forgive or condemn.

Is that from the Yougottabekidding translation?

The only thing that even comes close is that passage in Matthew 16 and again in 18. Neither one says they have the power to forgive or condemn.

Most deniers misrepresent Scripture. Satan loves to do that.

To the authority given to the apostles to bind and loose is exactly about punishment or pardoning.

 

[Weatherman2020]

Who can forgive sin but God Himself? Jesus did.
Who is the Alpha and the Omega? In Isaiah, it's God Himself. Jesus is as well.
Who is the I am? To Moses, it is God Himself. Jesus is as well.

The apostles were given the power to forgive or condemn.

Did that make them God too?



C'mon Hadit, its time to fold and go home before you lose it all.

You are out of chips and you have no credit and Im not interested in your pocket watch or owning your soul.

The apostles were given the power to forgive or condemn.

Is that from the Yougottabekidding translation?

The only thing that even comes close is that passage in Matthew 16 and again in 18. Neither one says they have the power to forgive or condemn.

Most deniers misrepresent Scripture. Satan loves to do that.

To the authority given to the apostles to bind and loose is exactly about punishment or pardoning.

Jesus called His twelve disciples to Him and gave them authority over uncleanspirits, to drive them out and to heal every disease and sickness.

Only God can condemn a person to hell.

 

[hobelim]

The apostles were given the power to forgive or condemn.

Did that make them God too?



C'mon Hadit, its time to fold and go home before you lose it all.

You are out of chips and you have no credit and Im not interested in your pocket watch or owning your soul.

The apostles were given the power to forgive or condemn.

Is that from the Yougottabekidding translation?

The only thing that even comes close is that passage in Matthew 16 and again in 18. Neither one says they have the power to forgive or condemn.

Most deniers misrepresent Scripture. Satan loves to do that.

To the authority given to the apostles to bind and loose is exactly about punishment or pardoning.

Jesus called His twelve disciples to Him and gave them authority over uncleanspirits, to drive them out and to heal every disease and sickness.

Only God can condemn a person to hell.

divine wisdom love and justice define the boundaries of hell.

Only a person can condemn themselves to it.

Exposing the confusion and illogical contradictions to scripture expressed in a persons own words and obstinate stupidity in defiantly persisting in that which God has openly and clearly promised leads to destruction is not condemning anyone to anything but revealing what already is, that they are already under the condemnation of God and have their reward already.

 

[Weatherman2020]

Is that from the Yougottabekidding translation?

The only thing that even comes close is that passage in Matthew 16 and again in 18. Neither one says they have the power to forgive or condemn.

Most deniers misrepresent Scripture. Satan loves to do that.

To the authority given to the apostles to bind and loose is exactly about punishment or pardoning.

Jesus called His twelve disciples to Him and gave them authority over uncleanspirits, to drive them out and to heal every disease and sickness.

Only God can condemn a person to hell.

divine wisdom love and justice define the boundaries of hell.

Only a person can condemn themselves to it.

Exposing the confusion and illogical contradictions to scripture expressed in a persons own words and obstinate stupidity in defiantly persisting in that which God has openly and clearly promised leads to destruction is not condemning anyone to anything but revealing what already is, that they are already under the condemnation of God and have their reward already.

Wrong. Separation from God is hell.
Scripture says so.

 

[hadit]

Then you have a problem with Scripture.

Nah, scripture and I get along perfectly.

You seem to the one having a problem......

Then why do you deny that Jesus claimed to be God?

 

[hobelim]

The only thing that even comes close is that passage in Matthew 16 and again in 18. Neither one says they have the power to forgive or condemn.

Most deniers misrepresent Scripture. Satan loves to do that.

To the authority given to the apostles to bind and loose is exactly about punishment or pardoning.

Jesus called His twelve disciples to Him and gave them authority over uncleanspirits, to drive them out and to heal every disease and sickness.

Only God can condemn a person to hell.

divine wisdom love and justice define the boundaries of hell.

Only a person can condemn themselves to it.

Exposing the confusion and illogical contradictions to scripture expressed in a persons own words and obstinate stupidity in defiantly persisting in that which God has openly and clearly promised leads to destruction is not condemning anyone to anything but revealing what already is, that they are already under the condemnation of God and have their reward already.

Wrong. Separation from God is hell.
Scripture says so.

OK, separation from God is hell.

I can accept that.

If so, when was the last time you heard anything at all directly from God to you? Never?

What ever could that mean?

 

[hobelim]

Then you have a problem with Scripture.

Nah, scripture and I get along perfectly.

You seem to the one having a problem......

Then why do you deny that Jesus claimed to be God?

Because he didn't.

Why do you perpetuate the lie created by his enemies to slander and discredit Jesus?

just like today, even in the first century anyone who claimed to be a god was insane.

 

[Weatherman2020]

Most deniers misrepresent Scripture. Satan loves to do that.

To the authority given to the apostles to bind and loose is exactly about punishment or pardoning.

Jesus called His twelve disciples to Him and gave them authority over uncleanspirits, to drive them out and to heal every disease and sickness.

Only God can condemn a person to hell.

divine wisdom love and justice define the boundaries of hell.

Only a person can condemn themselves to it.

Exposing the confusion and illogical contradictions to scripture expressed in a persons own words and obstinate stupidity in defiantly persisting in that which God has openly and clearly promised leads to destruction is not condemning anyone to anything but revealing what already is, that they are already under the condemnation of God and have their reward already.

Wrong. Separation from God is hell.
Scripture says so.

OK, separation from God is hell.

I can accept that.

If so, when was the last time you heard anything at all directly from God to you? Never?

What ever could that mean?

You have never talked to God? How sad.

 

[hobelim]

To the authority given to the apostles to bind and loose is exactly about punishment or pardoning.

Jesus called His twelve disciples to Him and gave them authority over uncleanspirits, to drive them out and to heal every disease and sickness.

Only God can condemn a person to hell.

divine wisdom love and justice define the boundaries of hell.

Only a person can condemn themselves to it.

Exposing the confusion and illogical contradictions to scripture expressed in a persons own words and obstinate stupidity in defiantly persisting in that which God has openly and clearly promised leads to destruction is not condemning anyone to anything but revealing what already is, that they are already under the condemnation of God and have their reward already.

Wrong. Separation from God is hell.
Scripture says so.

OK, separation from God is hell.

I can accept that.

If so, when was the last time you heard anything at all directly from God to you? Never?

What ever could that mean?

You have never talked to God? How sad.

Talk to God all you like but if you never do what he commands or do what he forbids he will hide his face from you and silence will be your only reply, even if you have confused your own unrestrained imagination and cacophony of conflicting thoughts with a reply from God.

I always do exactly as God commands.

If ever you get around to doing what God commands he will come to you and make himself known to you before you even think of asking for anything.

 

[nicoleivy5]

agreed

Most deniers misrepresent Scripture. Satan loves to do that.

To the authority given to the apostles to bind and loose is exactly about punishment or pardoning.

Jesus called His twelve disciples to Him and gave them authority over uncleanspirits, to drive them out and to heal every disease and sickness.

Only God can condemn a person to hell.

divine wisdom love and justice define the boundaries of hell.

Only a person can condemn themselves to it.

Exposing the confusion and illogical contradictions to scripture expressed in a persons own words and obstinate stupidity in defiantly persisting in that which God has openly and clearly promised leads to destruction is not condemning anyone to anything but revealing what already is, that they are already under the condemnation of God and have their reward already.

Wrong. Separation from God is hell.
Scripture says so.

OK, separation from God is hell.

I can accept that.

If so, when was the last time you heard anything at all directly from God to you? Never?

What ever could that mean?

d

 

[The Irish Ram]

Accept the gift that Christ offered you from the cross. I don't care what you call yourself, Jesus Christ is the only way to Heaven. NO ONE goes to the Father except through Him.
I don't know how much clearer He could have made it.

 

[Andylusion]

Who can forgive sin but God Himself? Jesus did.
Who is the Alpha and the Omega? In Isaiah, it's God Himself. Jesus is as well.
Who is the I am? To Moses, it is God Himself. Jesus is as well.

The apostles were given the power to forgive or condemn.

Did that make them God too?



C'mon Hadit, its time to fold and go home before you lose it all.

You are out of chips and you have no credit and Im not interested in your pocket watch or owning your soul.

The apostles were given the power to forgive or condemn.

Is that from the Yougottabekidding translation?

The only thing that even comes close is that passage in Matthew 16 and again in 18. Neither one says they have the power to forgive or condemn.

Most deniers misrepresent Scripture. Satan loves to do that.

To the authority given to the apostles to bind and loose is exactly about punishment or pardoning.

Most deniers misrepresent Scripture. Satan loves to do that.

To the authority given to the apostles to bind and loose is exactly about punishment or pardoning.

Jesus called His twelve disciples to Him and gave them authority over uncleanspirits, to drive them out and to heal every disease and sickness.

Only God can condemn a person to hell.

divine wisdom love and justice define the boundaries of hell.

Only a person can condemn themselves to it.

Exposing the confusion and illogical contradictions to scripture expressed in a persons own words and obstinate stupidity in defiantly persisting in that which God has openly and clearly promised leads to destruction is not condemning anyone to anything but revealing what already is, that they are already under the condemnation of God and have their reward already.

Wrong. Separation from God is hell.
Scripture says so.

OK, separation from God is hell.

I can accept that.

If so, when was the last time you heard anything at all directly from God to you? Never?

What ever could that mean?

I can say with absolute certainty that I have heard from G-d. Not every day. Not every week. Not every year.

But yes, I have heard from the Lord in Heaven. He is alive, and well. He does, when he chooses to, answer his people.

Now if you talk to some nut that says they hear from G-d in a big booming voice in the clouds, every Thursday after Yoga.... write them off as being nuts. Every person that has told me their hear from 'god' all the time, their lives are always disasters.

G-d in heaven does at rare times speak to his people. I can think of about 3 times in my life, where G-d spoke to me, in as real of an answer as you posting a reply.

That's why, as the blind man in the Bible said:
John 9
"One thing I do know. I was blind but now I see!"

All this other stuff we can bicker over. But one thing I do know. G-d is alive in Heaven, and he does speak to his people.

If you have never heard from G-d in your life, not one time ever... you need to read 2 Corinthians 13:5, and evaluate yourself.

"Examine yourselves to see whether you are in the faith; test yourselves. Do you not realize that Christ Jesus is in you—unless, of course, you fail the test?"

Because you could be one of the people Jesus talked about in Matthew 7:22

"Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?'

Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'"

If you are a Christian, that should put the fear of hell into all of us. Including myself.

 

[Andylusion]

No one goes to heaven because it doesn't exist

Prove it?

You haven't proven there is a heaven so you first

Between the two of us, which openly has a belief system of faith?

I'm not standing around trying to claim that I can empirically prove the existence of Heaven, because my belief system is based on faith.

You on the other hand are saying that there is no Heaven, as if it is a provable fact. If it is, then do so.

If you can't, and you are taking it on faith alone that there is no Heaven, which means your view is no more or less valid, than my own view.

There is no empirical proof of heaven.
When there is I'll admit I was wrong

There is no evidence that a supreme being exists
When there is I will admit I was wrong

But you will never say you are wrong because no matter what evidence is given you you will refuse to believe it

That's an easy claim to make when you have not, nor has anyone else, given evidence that proves your claim.

You made a statement: There is no Heaven.

I said prove it.

You said "You go first".

Why should I go first, when I have not made a claim to you.

You said there is no Heaven. I said nothing to you before this.

You made the claim. It's your job to prove the claim. Can you prove the claim or not?

Now you are saying that you are not going to provide proof, because you supposedly have the omniscient ability to read minds, and know I would not accept proof.

That just makes you a bigot. If that is your only argument, and you consider that argument valid.... ok....

Well sir, I have proof of Heaven, but I'm not going to give it to you because I know you will just refuse to believe it.

There we go. If that's a valid argument for you, it is also a valid argument for me.

Cheers mate.

 

[Skull Pilot]

No one goes to heaven because it doesn't exist

Prove it?

You haven't proven there is a heaven so you first

Between the two of us, which openly has a belief system of faith?

I'm not standing around trying to claim that I can empirically prove the existence of Heaven, because my belief system is based on faith.

You on the other hand are saying that there is no Heaven, as if it is a provable fact. If it is, then do so.

If you can't, and you are taking it on faith alone that there is no Heaven, which means your view is no more or less valid, than my own view.

There is no empirical proof of heaven.
When there is I'll admit I was wrong

There is no evidence that a supreme being exists
When there is I will admit I was wrong

But you will never say you are wrong because no matter what evidence is given you you will refuse to believe it

That's an easy claim to make when you have not, nor has anyone else, given evidence that proves your claim.

You made a statement: There is no Heaven.

I said prove it.

You said "You go first".

Why should I go first, when I have not made a claim to you.

You said there is no Heaven. I said nothing to you before this.

You made the claim. It's your job to prove the claim. Can you prove the claim or not?

Now you are saying that you are not going to provide proof, because you supposedly have the omniscient ability to read minds, and know I would not accept proof.

That just makes you a bigot. If that is your only argument, and you consider that argument valid.... ok....

Well sir, I have proof of Heaven, but I'm not going to give it to you because I know you will just refuse to believe it.

There we go. If that's a valid argument for you, it is also a valid argument for me.

Cheers mate.

you do know that you can't prove a negative

there is no evidence that a heaven exists
there is no evidence that god or satan exist

until there is I will not believe any of them exist

 

[Mudda]

No, it's possible that your invisible friend who you think made this universe is also bound by the same laws. Admit it, it's a possibility.

It is not unless He chooses to limit Himself.

So give me three examples of the best "God" encounters you've ever heard of, so I can see what you're trying to say happened.

Okay, from the Bible itself:

Acts 1

1 In my former book, Theophilus, I wrote about all that Jesus began to do and to teach 2 until the day he was taken up to heaven, after giving instructions through the Holy Spirit to the apostles he had chosen. 3 After his suffering, he presented himself to them and gave many convincing proofs that he was alive. He appeared to them over a period of forty days and spoke about the kingdom of God. 4 On one occasion, while he was eating with them, he gave them this command: “Do not leave Jerusalem, but wait for the gift my Father promised, which you have heard me speak about. 5 For John baptized with[a] water, but in a few days you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.”

6 Then they gathered around him and asked him, “Lord, are you at this time going to restore the kingdom to Israel?”

7 He said to them: “It is not for you to know the times or dates the Father has set by his own authority. 8 But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit comes on you; and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the ends of the earth.”

9 After he said this, he was taken up before their very eyes, and a cloud hid him from their sight.

10 They were looking intently up into the sky as he was going, when suddenly two men dressed in white stood beside them. 11 “Men of Galilee,” they said, “why do you stand here looking into the sky? This same Jesus, who has been taken from you into heaven, will come back in the same way you have seen him go into heaven.”

If you're willing to grant credibility to UFO abduction stories, this is a convincing encounter with the resurrected Jesus, who appeared multiple times after His death and resurrection.

Youtube is loaded with testimonies from people who encountered God. Here's one.



Here's another.



I focus on Muslims' encounters with Jesus because they have a very powerful incentive to deny such encounters. Remember, to convert from Islam to Christianity is to be apostate, which carries the death penalty. If you honestly are curious about God encounters and not just trying to disprove God's existence, Google it or look on Youtube. You'll find more people who encountered God than claim they were abducted by aliens. Now, keep in mind that you are willing to lend credibility to alien abduction because of the stories, so I will not accept "They're all lying" as a good reason to discount all of these.

1) The bible is third-hand hearsay.
2) People coming back from near a death experience might be only experiencing what their brain is conditioned to show them. Sort of like wishful thinking that hasn't yet been proven otherwise.
3) That guy is a fucking fool, lol. He read the koran every 10 days and has totally ZERO cred. He's laughable.

Got anything more credible?

And you have zero proof that your god isn't restrained by the laws of this universe. Nothing at all to point to that.

Yet people who claim to have been abducted by aliens are credible?

Way more credible than the nonsense you just put forward.

And just as verifiable. You give them more credibility because you want to believe them and don't want to believe those who have encountered God.

You have yet to give even 3 examples of people meeting god for real.
Actually, there is tons of film footage of UFOs. Even the (unverifiable) stories of being abducted or simply encountering aliens or their spaceships, taken as a whole, are pretty fucking believable, even to this massive skeptic. But yes, missing actual proof of aliens, like...well... an alien, lol. But I'd say that without a doubt, aliens are not only more likely to exist than the god of the bible, but they are closer to being proven as well.

 

[Mudda]

No, you read a book that clearly condemns what you do as an expression of religious devotion.

Either you do not have ears to hear what is clearly written or your devotion to idolatry and rebellion against the Law of God is a deliberate choice.

Again you seem desperate to deny the divinity of Yeshua. You must hold very strongly to that deception.

Desperate? I don't think so. Jesus never claimed divinity. If he did he was either a false prophet or insane. I provided to you a quotation from Jesus himself that shows that he neither thought of himself as God nor claimed to be God..John 17:10

The religion that you belong to take three sentences out of context without applying the logic of a grade school child to make the false claim that Jesus was God in the flesh which desecrates his teaching and brings the name of Jesus into disrepute among intelligent people.

One would have to throw the entire teaching of the law and the prophets, not to mention logic and reason, in the trash to swallow your deception.

There never was and never will be a human being that was God or became God either before, during or after their human existence.

Who can forgive sin but God Himself? Jesus did.
Who is the Alpha and the Omega? In Isaiah, it's God Himself. Jesus is as well.
Who is the I am? To Moses, it is God Himself. Jesus is as well.

The apostles were given the power to forgive or condemn.

Did that make them God too?



C'mon Hadit, its time to fold and go home before you lose it all.

You are out of chips and you have no credit and Im not interested in your pocket watch or owning your soul.

The Jews took up stones to throw at Jesus because He forgave sin. He also claimed to be I am and the Alpha and Omega. He also didn't think equality with God was something to hold on to, and He said that He and the Father are one.

Face it, Jesus claimed to be God.

So if Jesus already paid for our sins on the cross, we can sin all we want now because that bill is already paid? Cool.

 

[hobelim]

All this other stuff we can bicker over. But one thing I do know. G-d is alive in Heaven, and he does speak to his people.

If you have never heard from G-d in your life, not one time ever... you need to read 2 Corinthians 13:5, and evaluate yourself.

"Examine yourselves to see whether you are in the faith; test yourselves. Do you not realize that Christ Jesus is in you—unless, of course, you fail the test?"

Remember when Jesus said that he would be lifted up like Moses lifted up the bronze serpent for people to turn to for healing during the time of testing in the wilderness?

Remember Jesus warning his disciple to pray to be spared the test when he found them all sleeping in Gethsemane?


Would you think it was reasonable to conclude that anyone who worships Jesus as a god has failed that test Just like everyone who turned to the statue of a serpent that God told Moses to make failed the test until Hezekiah came, the subject of a young maiden with child, did what was right in Gods eyes, and destroyed it?

If it was right in Gods eyes to destroy the bronze serpent then it was never right to turn to it for healing.


"Here lies the test; The light has come into the world but men preferred darkness to light because their deeds were evil...."

 

[hobelim]

It is not unless He chooses to limit Himself.

Okay, from the Bible itself:

Acts 1
If you're willing to grant credibility to UFO abduction stories, this is a convincing encounter with the resurrected Jesus, who appeared multiple times after His death and resurrection.

Youtube is loaded with testimonies from people who encountered God. Here's one.



Here's another.



I focus on Muslims' encounters with Jesus because they have a very powerful incentive to deny such encounters. Remember, to convert from Islam to Christianity is to be apostate, which carries the death penalty. If you honestly are curious about God encounters and not just trying to disprove God's existence, Google it or look on Youtube. You'll find more people who encountered God than claim they were abducted by aliens. Now, keep in mind that you are willing to lend credibility to alien abduction because of the stories, so I will not accept "They're all lying" as a good reason to discount all of these.

1) The bible is third-hand hearsay.
2) People coming back from near a death experience might be only experiencing what their brain is conditioned to show them. Sort of like wishful thinking that hasn't yet been proven otherwise.
3) That guy is a fucking fool, lol. He read the koran every 10 days and has totally ZERO cred. He's laughable.

Got anything more credible?

And you have zero proof that your god isn't restrained by the laws of this universe. Nothing at all to point to that.

Yet people who claim to have been abducted by aliens are credible?

Way more credible than the nonsense you just put forward.

And just as verifiable. You give them more credibility because you want to believe them and don't want to believe those who have encountered God.

You have yet to give even 3 examples of people meeting god for real.
Actually, there is tons of film footage of UFOs. Even the (unverifiable) stories of being abducted or simply encountering aliens or their spaceships, taken as a whole, are pretty fucking believable, even to this massive skeptic. But yes, missing actual proof of aliens, like...well... an alien, lol. But I'd say that without a doubt, aliens are not only more likely to exist than the god of the bible, but they are closer to being proven as well.

What do you suppose a bronze age shepherd would call what you would call an alien encounter where a being that "resembled a human" with a "semblance of a hand" came down from the sky and told them about a higher order of intelligent life?

A divine visitation? An angel came down from the sky with a message from the Lord of heaven?

 

[hobelim]

Accept the gift that Christ offered you from the cross. I don't care what you call yourself, Jesus Christ is the only way to Heaven. NO ONE goes to the Father except through Him.
I don't know how much clearer He could have made it.

He could have made it a lot clearer, but, then again, there was no such thing as freedom of expression.

Since its all so clear to you why not explain what Jesus meant?

Exactly how does a person goes through Jesus to go to the Father?

Pray to Jesus as if he was God and then you will go on to the Father?

Eat Jesus crackers and drink Jesus juice every other sunday and high holy day until you are dead and then you will see God?


Take your time........