Do you know left wingers still blame the 2008 housing bubble on just Booooosh?

[Fueri]

Video is BS, those particular warnings were irrelevant as to the causes of the of real estate market crash.

What were the causes of the crash?

As I previously stated primary view of economists is that it was general market exuberance combined with poor risk management.

There is of course some disagreement on the causes but we can say with a lot of certianty that what is in that youtube compilation was not it. It takes politico right wingers specifically to claim that the crash stemmed from poor accounting at GSE's.

As I previously stated primary view of economists is that it was general market exuberance combined with poor risk management.

Not related to the repeal of parts of Glass-Steagall?

It takes politico right wingers specifically to claim that the crash stemmed from poor accounting at GSE's

The poor accounting allowed corrupt Dems at the GSEs to get bonuses they did not deserve.

Did the GSEs add to the bubble by buying a lot of the crappy mortgages?

Exactly, it wasn't poor accounting, it was fraudulent accounting. They were cooking the hell out of the books to maintain earnings levels to allow management to rake in bonuses, which were contingent on earnings.

the regulator's statement:

As described by OFHEO later, “management of Fannie Mae set earnings-per-share targets. And every quarter, they manipulated — or every year, they manipulated the earnings to hit those numbers because their bonuses were based on them. And every year, they got their maximum bonuses…Fannie Mae’s executives were precisely managing earnings to the one-hundredth of a penny to maximize their bonuses.”

 

[ClosedCaption]

What is interesting to note here, the S&P has doubled since BO took office. Think about that. The president who talks about spreading the wealth and lifting the downtrodden has presided over an economy that has made the rich even richer through a rising stock market, while wages and growth for "his people" have been stagnant. How do we reconcile this? I know - blame it on Bush.

Darn that socialism!!

So CC, we should assume you are happy with an all time high stock market and depressed worker wages? Please explain.

Explain what? How you threw in a negative with a positive? I cant explain it.

Its like saying "Tell me how much you like apple pie and dead apple trees"

Sorry it confused you. I'll try to make it simpler. Under BO - The stock market is near an all time high. Are you happy about that, and has it helped the less fortunate? Worker wages are depressed. Are you happy about that? The wealth gap has continued to widen after nearly 8 years of a BO presidency. Are you happy about that?

The stock market isnt designed to help the less fortunate silly. Yes, I'm glad they are doing better than before. Only you see a positive as someone elses negative. Like the apple pie and apple tree. The wealth gap continues to increase, no I'm not happy about that.

What has the Republican house and Senate proposed to stop it? Nothing? So are you happy about that?

In fact when Obama spoke on Income inequality Republicans denounced it. Are you saying republicans were wrong and now want to support Obama?

Naaaw, you just using it to hit Obama for it, you have no solution...hell most repubs deny its even happening.

 

[francoHFW]

What is interesting to note here, the S&P has doubled since BO took office. Think about that. The president who talks about spreading the wealth and lifting the downtrodden has presided over an economy that has made the rich even richer through a rising stock market, while wages and growth for "his people" have been stagnant. How do we reconcile this? I know - blame it on Bush.

Darn that socialism!!

So CC, we should assume you are happy with an all time high stock market and depressed worker wages? Please explain.

Explain what? How you threw in a negative with a positive? I cant explain it.

Its like saying "Tell me how much you like apple pie and dead apple trees"

Sorry it confused you. I'll try to make it simpler. Under BO - The stock market is near an all time high. Are you happy about that, and has it helped the less fortunate? Worker wages are depressed. Are you happy about that? The wealth gap has continued to widen after nearly 8 years of a BO presidency. Are you happy about that?

And 8 years of mindless GOP obstruction of usual solutions. Great job. Reaganism's ruin of the middle class rolls on...sees sig

 

[AntonToo]

Exactly, it wasn't poor accounting, it was fraudulent accounting

It was not accounting PERIOD.

Accounting does not cause AAA holding to revert to Junk as real estate prices drop.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

As I previously stated primary view of economists is that it was general market exuberance combined with poor risk management.

Not related to the repeal of parts of Glass-Steagall?

I don't think you understand that government regulation and GSE are part of the general market.

It takes politico right wingers specifically to claim that the crash stemmed from poor accounting at GSE's

The poor accounting allowed corrupt Dems at the GSEs to get bonuses they did not deserve.

Did the GSEs add to the bubble by buying a lot of the crappy mortgages?

Silly, even if what you claim is true, democrat bonuses did not cause the real estate collapse.

And like I said GSEs are part of the general market, but for their part they were late to the sub-prime securities party compared to private institutions. In 2003 Bush admin has even specifically criticized them for it.

If your securitized holdings go from Tripple A to Junk overnight then no amount of proper accounting could have saved you and GSE's were always highly leveraged and will continue to be so, backed by the good faith in US of A.

democrat bonuses did not cause the real estate collapse.

Didn't say they caused the collapse.
The poor accounting you mentioned allowed Dem insiders to commit fraud without consequence.

And like I said GSEs are part of the general market, but for their part they were late to the sub-prime securities party compared to private institutions.

When they got to the party, did they add to the bubble? A little? A lot?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Exactly, it wasn't poor accounting, it was fraudulent accounting

It was not accounting PERIOD.

Accounting does not cause AAA holding to revert to Junk as real estate prices drop.

We're talking about the accounting well before the crash.
The accounting fraud that enriched Franklin Raines and other Dem insiders.

 

[francoHFW]

Video is BS, those particular warnings were irrelevant as to the causes of the of real estate market crash.

What were the causes of the crash?

As I previously stated primary view of economists is that it was general market exuberance combined with poor risk management.

There is of course some disagreement on the causes but we can say with a lot of certianty that what is in that youtube compilation was not it. It takes politico right wingers specifically to claim that the crash stemmed from poor accounting at GSE's.

As I previously stated primary view of economists is that it was general market exuberance combined with poor risk management.

Not related to the repeal of parts of Glass-Steagall?

It takes politico right wingers specifically to claim that the crash stemmed from poor accounting at GSE's

The poor accounting allowed corrupt Dems at the GSEs to get bonuses they did not deserve.

Did the GSEs add to the bubble by buying a lot of the crappy mortgages?

Exactly, it wasn't poor accounting, it was fraudulent accounting. They were cooking the hell out of the books to maintain earnings levels to allow management to rake in bonuses, which were contingent on earnings.

the regulator's statement:

As described by OFHEO later, “management of Fannie Mae set earnings-per-share targets. And every quarter, they manipulated — or every year, they manipulated the earnings to hit those numbers because their bonuses were based on them. And every year, they got their maximum bonuses…Fannie Mae’s executives were precisely managing earnings to the one-hundredth of a penny to maximize their bonuses.”

Funny how F+F's share of the market was at least halved while GOP cronies like Countrywide were selling toxic mortgages to flippers and the unemployed...

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Video is BS, those particular warnings were irrelevant as to the causes of the of real estate market crash.

What were the causes of the crash?

As I previously stated primary view of economists is that it was general market exuberance combined with poor risk management.

There is of course some disagreement on the causes but we can say with a lot of certianty that what is in that youtube compilation was not it. It takes politico right wingers specifically to claim that the crash stemmed from poor accounting at GSE's.

As I previously stated primary view of economists is that it was general market exuberance combined with poor risk management.

Not related to the repeal of parts of Glass-Steagall?

It takes politico right wingers specifically to claim that the crash stemmed from poor accounting at GSE's

The poor accounting allowed corrupt Dems at the GSEs to get bonuses they did not deserve.

Did the GSEs add to the bubble by buying a lot of the crappy mortgages?

Exactly, it wasn't poor accounting, it was fraudulent accounting. They were cooking the hell out of the books to maintain earnings levels to allow management to rake in bonuses, which were contingent on earnings.

the regulator's statement:

As described by OFHEO later, “management of Fannie Mae set earnings-per-share targets. And every quarter, they manipulated — or every year, they manipulated the earnings to hit those numbers because their bonuses were based on them. And every year, they got their maximum bonuses…Fannie Mae’s executives were precisely managing earnings to the one-hundredth of a penny to maximize their bonuses.”

Funny how F+F's share of the market was at least halved while GOP cronies like Countrywide were selling toxic mortgages to flippers and the unemployed...

Funny how F+F's share of the market was at least halved

How many crappy mortgages did F+F buy? Did they add to the bubble?

 

[francoHFW]

As I previously stated primary view of economists is that it was general market exuberance combined with poor risk management.

Not related to the repeal of parts of Glass-Steagall?

I don't think you understand that government regulation and GSE are part of the general market.

It takes politico right wingers specifically to claim that the crash stemmed from poor accounting at GSE's

The poor accounting allowed corrupt Dems at the GSEs to get bonuses they did not deserve.

Did the GSEs add to the bubble by buying a lot of the crappy mortgages?

Silly, even if what you claim is true, democrat bonuses did not cause the real estate collapse.

And like I said GSEs are part of the general market, but for their part they were late to the sub-prime securities party compared to private institutions. In 2003 Bush admin has even specifically criticized them for it.

If your securitized holdings go from Tripple A to Junk overnight then no amount of proper accounting could have saved you and GSE's were always highly leveraged and will continue to be so, backed by the good faith in US of A.

democrat bonuses did not cause the real estate collapse.

Didn't say they caused the collapse.
The poor accounting you mentioned allowed Dem insiders to commit fraud without consequence.

And like I said GSEs are part of the general market, but for their part they were late to the sub-prime securities party compared to private institutions.

When they got to the party, did they add to the bubble? A little? A lot?

When they finally did, 25%, their halved share of the market. GOP finally got them involved in their scam.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

As I previously stated primary view of economists is that it was general market exuberance combined with poor risk management.

Not related to the repeal of parts of Glass-Steagall?

I don't think you understand that government regulation and GSE are part of the general market.

It takes politico right wingers specifically to claim that the crash stemmed from poor accounting at GSE's

The poor accounting allowed corrupt Dems at the GSEs to get bonuses they did not deserve.

Did the GSEs add to the bubble by buying a lot of the crappy mortgages?

Silly, even if what you claim is true, democrat bonuses did not cause the real estate collapse.

And like I said GSEs are part of the general market, but for their part they were late to the sub-prime securities party compared to private institutions. In 2003 Bush admin has even specifically criticized them for it.

If your securitized holdings go from Tripple A to Junk overnight then no amount of proper accounting could have saved you and GSE's were always highly leveraged and will continue to be so, backed by the good faith in US of A.

democrat bonuses did not cause the real estate collapse.

Didn't say they caused the collapse.
The poor accounting you mentioned allowed Dem insiders to commit fraud without consequence.

And like I said GSEs are part of the general market, but for their part they were late to the sub-prime securities party compared to private institutions.

When they got to the party, did they add to the bubble? A little? A lot?

When they finally did, 25%, their halved share of the market. GOP finally got them involved in their scam.

When they finally did, 25%

They bought 25% of the crappy mortgages? Dollar wise, how much?

GOP finally got them involved in their scam.

Did they pass a law? Link?

 

[AntonToo]

We're talking about the accounting well before the crash.
The accounting fraud that enriched Franklin Raines and other Dem insiders.

ok, but which part of someone getting enriched didn't cause market-wide price collapse did you not understand?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

We're talking about the accounting well before the crash.
The accounting fraud that enriched Franklin Raines and other Dem insiders.

ok, but which part of someone getting enriched didn't cause market-wide price collapse did you not understand?

Ok, but which part of "I never claimed that", do you not understand?

 

[AntonToo]

We're talking about the accounting well before the crash.
The accounting fraud that enriched Franklin Raines and other Dem insiders.

ok, but which part of someone getting enriched didn't cause market-wide price collapse did you not understand?

Ok, but which part of "I never claimed that", do you not understand?

What I am saying is what you DID claim, is irrelevant as to the conversation about the causes of Great Recession.

 

[jillian]

Of course we know that. Aren't they pathetic?

you mean rightwingnut loons still pretend bush didn't crash the economy.

sad ignorant uneducated winger.

 

[Fueri]

Exactly, it wasn't poor accounting, it was fraudulent accounting

It was not accounting PERIOD.

Accounting does not cause AAA holding to revert to Junk as real estate prices drop.

nobody said it was the sole cause.

your statement that accounting is not accounting is absurd.

there is a mountain of evidence that these people were cooking their books to rake in bonuses.

then congress is looking at those earnings and shrugging, not seeing the problem, refusing the recommendations of regulators over the course of years to do something. This further compounds the problem, and the end result of that, amid other factors, is what causes AAA to revert to junk.

claiming that if the accounting was right it would have had no impact is absurd. Beyond the fact that this statement it is speculative at best, the true picture was obscured for years as a result of those accounting practices, resulting in delayed action despite the repeated recommendations of regulators over the course of years..

 

[easyt65]

Fannie Mae
Freddie Mack
'People should have a home even if they can't afford it'
Pressure onbanks to give money on hish-risk loans

Not judged on RESULTS, Libs demand to be judged on their GOOD INTENTIONS.

 

[AntonToo]

nobody said it was the sole cause.

your statement that accounting is not accounting is absurd.

If my statement was that "accounting is not accounting' then yes it would be absurd.

but my statement was actually that "accounting is not risk management and does not set securities valuations"

Risk management - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Hedging and Pricing of Real Estate Securities under Market Incompleteness

 

[BuckToothMoron]

Darn that socialism!!

So CC, we should assume you are happy with an all time high stock market and depressed worker wages? Please explain.

Explain what? How you threw in a negative with a positive? I cant explain it.

Its like saying "Tell me how much you like apple pie and dead apple trees"

Sorry it confused you. I'll try to make it simpler. Under BO - The stock market is near an all time high. Are you happy about that, and has it helped the less fortunate? Worker wages are depressed. Are you happy about that? The wealth gap has continued to widen after nearly 8 years of a BO presidency. Are you happy about that?

The stock market isnt designed to help the less fortunate silly. Yes, I'm glad they are doing better than before. Only you see a positive as someone elses negative. Like the apple pie and apple tree. The wealth gap continues to increase, no I'm not happy about that.

What has the Republican house and Senate proposed to stop it? Nothing? So are you happy about that?

In fact when Obama spoke on Income inequality Republicans denounced it. Are you saying republicans were wrong and now want to support Obama?

Naaaw, you just using it to hit Obama for it, you have no solution...hell most repubs deny its even happening.

STRAWMAN ALERT!
I never said the stock market was designed to help the less fortunate. And it is the liberals who generally believe that the rich get richer at the expense of the less fortunate, or as you put it - see a positive as someone else's negative, e.g. Corporate profits versus depressed wages.

I will answer your fair question regarding then GOP congress, which has had controlled both houses less than 2 years for the BO presidency. No, I am very unhappy how they have served the people's interest.

With regard to solutions- I would prefer the federal government, no matter who is incumbent, to quit trying to "fix" the economy. Most of them are attorneys who make money by pandering to special interest. They are not economist and shouldn't be trying to fix something they don't understand. You wouldn't take your car to a baker for service.

 

[Theowl32]

Do you know that smelly jillian girl thinks Booooosh crashed the economy?

 

[Fueri]

nobody said it was the sole cause.

your statement that accounting is not accounting is absurd.

If my statement was that "accounting is not accounting' then yes it would be absurd.

but my statement was actually that "accounting is not risk management and does not set securities valuations"

Risk management - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Hedging and Pricing of Real Estate Securities under Market Incompleteness

From your own link:

"Risk management is the identification, assessment, and prioritization of risks"

And how then is risk management supposed to fulfill it's purpose if the accounting numbers are incorrect and they are therefore acting on bad information, with the true picture obscured due to fraudulent accounting.