Do You View Socialism Positively?

[SAYIT]

100% of all taxpayers pay FICA taxes which is funding government spending.

Woo, Disingenuous much?
FICA taxes are Social Security and Medicare, both gov't mandated INSURANCE policies.
The money that pays for our roads, parks, military, gov't operations, etc., etc., etc., is confiscated from the top 50% of earners and corporations. The bottom 50% and all non-earners get a free ride.

Woo, Disingenuous much?

Ironic!

Don't all you servile liberal turds all claim that FICA taxes don't go into the general fund?

Though there seems little to keep our elected officials from doing just that, FICA "taxes" are actually federally mandated retirement insurance premiums and are not to be used for any other purpose. Technically the gov't "borrows" FICA funds to cover current budget shortfalls.
Derido's claim that FICA funds are used for general expenditures (his way of "proving" that all taxpayers fund fed expenses) is just not true.
Roughly the bottom 50% of fed tax payers get a free ride on the backs of corporations and the upper 50%.

Derido's claim that FICA funds are used for general expenditures (his way of "proving" that all taxpayers fund fed expenses) is just not true.

So you cannot refute the FACT that 100% of all taxpayers do pay taxes. Furthermore you cannot refute the FACT that tax funds are not specifically allocated therefore everyone is paying a share of all spending.

And yes, failing to be honest about those FACTS does make you disingenuous!

You claimed all taxpayers share the federal expenditure tax load and you disingenuously used FICA to "prove" it but, as we both know, FICA is not general funds but rather retirement INSURANCE premiums. Only corporations and the top 50% of earners pay federal income tax. The bottom 50% get a free ride.

 

[Derideo_Te]

Money is fungible. There is no "lockbox" that says that taxes collected under FICA can only be spent for a single purpose.

And this is why SS is a total Ponzi Scam. You're right, there is no lockbox because it is just stuffed with IOUs to tax future generation for spending today.

The vast majority of taxpayers would have been much better off having personal investment accounts that actually earned something than this Fake Lockbox Ponzi Scheme.

Once upon a time pension schemes were provided for workers that were professionally managed investments for retirement. The big scam was converting those into 401K's so that the Wall Street Casino bosses could plunder them at will. Converting SS into a national pension scheme again where people could make additional voluntary contributions would be a great way to ensure that retirement would no longer to subject to the whims of politicians or the Wall Street Casino in my opinion.

 

[Rikurzhen]

Mega rich Pubs who lead the GOP are a-holes. Their ignorant followers, hater dupes, are, politically, brainwashed FUNCTIONAL jackasses, fools, idiots, and, sorry a-holes, when they look down on blacks, hispanics, the French, feminists, women, gays, Muslims, people on assistance, etc etc etc. They are misinformed.

While mega-rich libs who lead the Dems are not? Racism and bigotry are not part of either party's platform and are present in some INDIVIDUALS in both parties. While I agree that both are wrong-headed, I also believe sweeping generalizations such as those you promote are downright stupid and self-serving.

You rarely see liberals getting upset when USMB nutters accuse them of being racist. You don't see liberals justifying racism in their tent by saying that the guys in the other tent are racist too.

I wonder why that is?

Because liberals are mentally ill. Let me walk you though a liberals thought process.

-Liberal does something racist.
-Someone accuses a liberal of being a racist.
-A liberal hears the charge and runs through a mental checklist.
-I'm a good person, I'm a liberal, to be liberal means that one is never wrong and never racist.
-Concludes that he is not a racist.
-Laughs at the person who leveled the charge.

To be a liberal means that one never has to think oneself wrong.

 

[boedicca]

Money is fungible. There is no "lockbox" that says that taxes collected under FICA can only be spent for a single purpose.

And this is why SS is a total Ponzi Scam. You're right, there is no lockbox because it is just stuffed with IOUs to tax future generation for spending today.

The vast majority of taxpayers would have been much better off having personal investment accounts that actually earned something than this Fake Lockbox Ponzi Scheme.

Once upon a time pension schemes were provided for workers that were professionally managed investments for retirement. The big scam was converting those into 401K's so that the Wall Street Casino bosses could plunder them at will. Converting SS into a national pension scheme again where people could make additional voluntary contributions would be a great way to ensure that retirement would no longer to subject to the whims of politicians or the Wall Street Casino in my opinion.

This is absolute nonsense. I've been the trustee for several 401Ks. A proper 401K plan has a variety of investment options ranging from very conservative to higher risk/reward. The accounts belong to the individuals and cannot be "plundered" without breaking the law.

 

[boedicca]

100% of all taxpayers pay FICA taxes which is funding government spending.

Woo, Disingenuous much?
FICA taxes are Social Security and Medicare, both gov't mandated INSURANCE policies.
The money that pays for our roads, parks, military, gov't operations, etc., etc., etc., is confiscated from the top 50% of earners and corporations. The bottom 50% and all non-earners get a free ride.

Woo, Disingenuous much?

Ironic!

Don't all you servile liberal turds all claim that FICA taxes don't go into the general fund?

Though there seems little to keep our elected officials from doing just that, FICA "taxes" are actually federally mandated retirement insurance premiums and are not to be used for any other purpose. Technically the gov't "borrows" FICA funds to cover current budget shortfalls.
Derido's claim that FICA funds are used for general expenditures (his way of "proving" that all taxpayers fund fed expenses) is just not true.
Roughly the bottom 50% of fed tax payers get a free ride on the backs of corporations and the upper 50%.

Derido's claim that FICA funds are used for general expenditures (his way of "proving" that all taxpayers fund fed expenses) is just not true.

So you cannot refute the FACT that 100% of all taxpayers do pay taxes. Furthermore you cannot refute the FACT that tax funds are not specifically allocated therefore everyone is paying a share of all spending.

And yes, failing to be honest about those FACTS does make you disingenuous!

Why does Social Security have Trustees if it is not supposed to be a separate pool of funds?

 

[Derideo_Te]

Woo, Disingenuous much?
FICA taxes are Social Security and Medicare, both gov't mandated INSURANCE policies.
The money that pays for our roads, parks, military, gov't operations, etc., etc., etc., is confiscated from the top 50% of earners and corporations. The bottom 50% and all non-earners get a free ride.

Woo, Disingenuous much?

Ironic!

Don't all you servile liberal turds all claim that FICA taxes don't go into the general fund?

Though there seems little to keep our elected officials from doing just that, FICA "taxes" are actually federally mandated retirement insurance premiums and are not to be used for any other purpose. Technically the gov't "borrows" FICA funds to cover current budget shortfalls.
Derido's claim that FICA funds are used for general expenditures (his way of "proving" that all taxpayers fund fed expenses) is just not true.
Roughly the bottom 50% of fed tax payers get a free ride on the backs of corporations and the upper 50%.

Derido's claim that FICA funds are used for general expenditures (his way of "proving" that all taxpayers fund fed expenses) is just not true.

So you cannot refute the FACT that 100% of all taxpayers do pay taxes. Furthermore you cannot refute the FACT that tax funds are not specifically allocated therefore everyone is paying a share of all spending.

And yes, failing to be honest about those FACTS does make you disingenuous!

You claimed all taxpayers share the federal expenditure tax load and you disingenuously used FICA to "prove" it but, as we both know, FICA is not general funds but rather retirement INSURANCE premiums. Only corporations and the top 50% of earners pay federal income tax. The bottom 50% get a free ride.

FICA is FEDERAL taxation. Semantic squirming on your part isn't going to alter the FACT that 100% of all taxpayers are paying FEDERAL FICA taxes.

 

[Rikurzhen]

No, mega rich Dems are NOT greedy idiot a-holes. They want to raise taxes on themselves, control pollution and help the nonrich etc etc. Contrast Gates, Soros, and Buffett with Kochs, Adelson, Murdoch. Racism and bigotry, bs propaganda, greed, and hate are generally limited to the GOP. Change the channel.

Warren Buffet could take a salary of $1 billion per year and pay INCOME TAXES on his salary but he instead chooses to take a salary of only $100,000 per year in order to minimize his income taxes and then he takes the rest of his income as capital gains and pays a lower tax rate.

Sell that bull somewhere else. Every single guy there could pay a higher tax rate without government compelling him to.

If I want to do a good deed for an old lady, to help her across the street, I can do that of my own volition, I don't need to use government to compel every citizen to also perform my same good deed and I don't withhold my aid until everyone else is also compelled to help old ladies cross the street.

Buffet paying higher taxes to fund the government he claims to love is not dependent on everyone else also being compelled to do the same.

 

[boedicca]

Ironic!

Don't all you servile liberal turds all claim that FICA taxes don't go into the general fund?

Though there seems little to keep our elected officials from doing just that, FICA "taxes" are actually federally mandated retirement insurance premiums and are not to be used for any other purpose. Technically the gov't "borrows" FICA funds to cover current budget shortfalls.
Derido's claim that FICA funds are used for general expenditures (his way of "proving" that all taxpayers fund fed expenses) is just not true.
Roughly the bottom 50% of fed tax payers get a free ride on the backs of corporations and the upper 50%.

Derido's claim that FICA funds are used for general expenditures (his way of "proving" that all taxpayers fund fed expenses) is just not true.

So you cannot refute the FACT that 100% of all taxpayers do pay taxes. Furthermore you cannot refute the FACT that tax funds are not specifically allocated therefore everyone is paying a share of all spending.

And yes, failing to be honest about those FACTS does make you disingenuous!

You claimed all taxpayers share the federal expenditure tax load and you disingenuously used FICA to "prove" it but, as we both know, FICA is not general funds but rather retirement INSURANCE premiums. Only corporations and the top 50% of earners pay federal income tax. The bottom 50% get a free ride.

FICA is FEDERAL taxation. Semantic squirming on your part isn't going to alter the FACT that 100% of all taxpayers are paying FEDERAL FICA taxes.

Not really. Someone who lives on interest or investment income doesn't pay FICA.

 

[Derideo_Te]

Money is fungible. There is no "lockbox" that says that taxes collected under FICA can only be spent for a single purpose.

And this is why SS is a total Ponzi Scam. You're right, there is no lockbox because it is just stuffed with IOUs to tax future generation for spending today.

The vast majority of taxpayers would have been much better off having personal investment accounts that actually earned something than this Fake Lockbox Ponzi Scheme.

Once upon a time pension schemes were provided for workers that were professionally managed investments for retirement. The big scam was converting those into 401K's so that the Wall Street Casino bosses could plunder them at will. Converting SS into a national pension scheme again where people could make additional voluntary contributions would be a great way to ensure that retirement would no longer to subject to the whims of politicians or the Wall Street Casino in my opinion.

This is absolute nonsense. I've been the trustee for several 401Ks. A proper 401K plan has a variety of investment options ranging from very conservative to higher risk/reward. The accounts belong to the individuals and cannot be "plundered" without breaking the law.

I am talking about individual 401k accounts that are invested in stocks. The Wall Street Casino can plunder a 401k by devaluing a stock therefore depriving the retiree of funds. Note the Wall Street Casino Bosses use Hedge Funds to protect themselves before they devalue a stock so only individual investors are the losers here.

 

[Derideo_Te]

Woo, Disingenuous much?
FICA taxes are Social Security and Medicare, both gov't mandated INSURANCE policies.
The money that pays for our roads, parks, military, gov't operations, etc., etc., etc., is confiscated from the top 50% of earners and corporations. The bottom 50% and all non-earners get a free ride.

Woo, Disingenuous much?

Ironic!

Don't all you servile liberal turds all claim that FICA taxes don't go into the general fund?

Though there seems little to keep our elected officials from doing just that, FICA "taxes" are actually federally mandated retirement insurance premiums and are not to be used for any other purpose. Technically the gov't "borrows" FICA funds to cover current budget shortfalls.
Derido's claim that FICA funds are used for general expenditures (his way of "proving" that all taxpayers fund fed expenses) is just not true.
Roughly the bottom 50% of fed tax payers get a free ride on the backs of corporations and the upper 50%.

Derido's claim that FICA funds are used for general expenditures (his way of "proving" that all taxpayers fund fed expenses) is just not true.

So you cannot refute the FACT that 100% of all taxpayers do pay taxes. Furthermore you cannot refute the FACT that tax funds are not specifically allocated therefore everyone is paying a share of all spending.

And yes, failing to be honest about those FACTS does make you disingenuous!

Why does Social Security have Trustees if it is not supposed to be a separate pool of funds?

Because you were correct when you said that it has been turned into a Ponzi Scheme. The trustees were/are party to the scheme.

 

[Rikurzhen]

Socialism is an economic tool. National Parks are socialistic. As are police departments, fire departments, and the military. All are supported and ran by the government. Our Interstate System is a creation of socialism.

I don't agree that's what socialism is. Those parks are funded by the private sector, capitalism, not state ownership. The state doesn't create any wealth, it doesn't fund jack shit, that's the people's money. The people fund the state, that's capitalism.

Your ignorance as to the definition of socialism doesn't alter the definition.

National Parks, police, fire depts, etc are all socialist by definition. Parks used to belong only to the wealthy, police forces were there to protect the wealthy from the rabble, the military was there to do the bidding of the wealthy.

Today We the People have formed a society where we have our own socialized parks, police, fire and military for our mutual benefit.

You might not understand this concept but it is socialism by it's very nature.

Go back to you knitting old lady. You've just defined government as socialism. The very basis of government is common defense. When you expand socialism to include the functions of government then you've shot yourself in the foot with respect to the a.) people treating you seriously, and b.) you've totally negated the "argument" that socialism is an economic tool, for how is establishment of a park or the creation of an army an economic act.

 

[boedicca]

Money is fungible. There is no "lockbox" that says that taxes collected under FICA can only be spent for a single purpose.

And this is why SS is a total Ponzi Scam. You're right, there is no lockbox because it is just stuffed with IOUs to tax future generation for spending today.

The vast majority of taxpayers would have been much better off having personal investment accounts that actually earned something than this Fake Lockbox Ponzi Scheme.

Once upon a time pension schemes were provided for workers that were professionally managed investments for retirement. The big scam was converting those into 401K's so that the Wall Street Casino bosses could plunder them at will. Converting SS into a national pension scheme again where people could make additional voluntary contributions would be a great way to ensure that retirement would no longer to subject to the whims of politicians or the Wall Street Casino in my opinion.

This is absolute nonsense. I've been the trustee for several 401Ks. A proper 401K plan has a variety of investment options ranging from very conservative to higher risk/reward. The accounts belong to the individuals and cannot be "plundered" without breaking the law.

I am talking about individual 401k accounts that are invested in stocks. The Wall Street Casino can plunder a 401k by devaluing a stock therefore depriving the retiree of funds. Note the Wall Street Casino Bosses use Hedge Funds to protect themselves before they devalue a stock so only individual investors are the losers here.

Excuse me, but 401K account holders don't have to put their money into stocks unless they choose to.

 

[Derideo_Te]

Don't all you servile liberal turds all claim that FICA taxes don't go into the general fund?

Though there seems little to keep our elected officials from doing just that, FICA "taxes" are actually federally mandated retirement insurance premiums and are not to be used for any other purpose. Technically the gov't "borrows" FICA funds to cover current budget shortfalls.
Derido's claim that FICA funds are used for general expenditures (his way of "proving" that all taxpayers fund fed expenses) is just not true.
Roughly the bottom 50% of fed tax payers get a free ride on the backs of corporations and the upper 50%.

Derido's claim that FICA funds are used for general expenditures (his way of "proving" that all taxpayers fund fed expenses) is just not true.

So you cannot refute the FACT that 100% of all taxpayers do pay taxes. Furthermore you cannot refute the FACT that tax funds are not specifically allocated therefore everyone is paying a share of all spending.

And yes, failing to be honest about those FACTS does make you disingenuous!

You claimed all taxpayers share the federal expenditure tax load and you disingenuously used FICA to "prove" it but, as we both know, FICA is not general funds but rather retirement INSURANCE premiums. Only corporations and the top 50% of earners pay federal income tax. The bottom 50% get a free ride.

FICA is FEDERAL taxation. Semantic squirming on your part isn't going to alter the FACT that 100% of all taxpayers are paying FEDERAL FICA taxes.

Not really. Someone who lives on interest or investment income doesn't pay FICA.

That is why I specifically used the term taxpayers meaning those who are earning wages.

 

[MrDVS1]

Interesting. Can you look favorably on not providing education and healthcare to children whose parents cannot otherwise pay for it?

Why would America be a better place when only those who can pay for the full cost of education and healthcare receive it?

Capitalists have wanted an educated healthy workforce for many years. What planet are you from?

That's in the past, the current right wing just isn't as smart as their predecessors and apparently there aren't enough leftist capitalists to matter.

 

[boedicca]

Though there seems little to keep our elected officials from doing just that, FICA "taxes" are actually federally mandated retirement insurance premiums and are not to be used for any other purpose. Technically the gov't "borrows" FICA funds to cover current budget shortfalls.
Derido's claim that FICA funds are used for general expenditures (his way of "proving" that all taxpayers fund fed expenses) is just not true.
Roughly the bottom 50% of fed tax payers get a free ride on the backs of corporations and the upper 50%.

Derido's claim that FICA funds are used for general expenditures (his way of "proving" that all taxpayers fund fed expenses) is just not true.

So you cannot refute the FACT that 100% of all taxpayers do pay taxes. Furthermore you cannot refute the FACT that tax funds are not specifically allocated therefore everyone is paying a share of all spending.

And yes, failing to be honest about those FACTS does make you disingenuous!

You claimed all taxpayers share the federal expenditure tax load and you disingenuously used FICA to "prove" it but, as we both know, FICA is not general funds but rather retirement INSURANCE premiums. Only corporations and the top 50% of earners pay federal income tax. The bottom 50% get a free ride.

FICA is FEDERAL taxation. Semantic squirming on your part isn't going to alter the FACT that 100% of all taxpayers are paying FEDERAL FICA taxes.

Not really. Someone who lives on interest or investment income doesn't pay FICA.

That is why I specifically used the term taxpayers meaning those who are earning wages.

All TAXPAYERS do not earn wages. Some pay taxes on investments, excise taxes, and all the hidden taxes the Feds have shoved into most everything we purchase.

 

[Rikurzhen]

Can anyone name a country that made Marxian communism work?

Stuff the sophistry. A definition of socialism isn't dependent upon it working. The Marxist vision is unworkable by design because the theory doesn't mesh with human nature. This means it will never, ever work. It also means that every attempt to make it work is an attempt to apply socialist principles.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Socialism, well managed, is far superior to capitalism, unmanaged.

 

[Rikurzhen]

Suppose, when Marx had looked about for a name to give to his program to transition capitalism to communism he had selected "scientific capitalism" instead of scientific socialism? Would all this furor that socialism leads to communism have existed; I wonder if we would have spent the last 100 years or so dreading capitalism? Marx gave us another good one and we were even afraid to read and learn how stupid the whole communistic set up or we would be afraid of being labeled a communist. I remember taking a college course on comparative economic practices and I kept one textbook covered so the title with Marx could not be seen. Students were not above accusing one of being a communist if they carried a textbook about Marx and communism to class.
After the 1917 revolution the USSR dropped the scientific-socialist thing pretty quick, and then dropped the whole communist program, it didn't work-except to frighten. Can anyone name a country that made Marxian communism work?

It isn't the name, it's the system people live under. Call it whatever you want, I want to minimize what the state takes from me to redistribute to others and pet projects. We were not formed as a socialist country, capitalism made us number one and moving away from it is lowering quality of life and freedom for most of us. Putting a happy face on socialism to sell to the masses isn't going to improve our economy.

It doesn't matter how the nation was formed, the socialists are on the winning track - we see this everywhere in the West. When the socialist ideal isn't popular with the people who hold true to the idea which formed the nation, then liberals/socialist just import a new people and give them a vote.

It's no surprise that the Democrats are gaining strength since the 70s with the tens of millions of poor people raised on socialist ideals that they've forced us to import.

 

[SAYIT]

Ironic!

Don't all you servile liberal turds all claim that FICA taxes don't go into the general fund?

Though there seems little to keep our elected officials from doing just that, FICA "taxes" are actually federally mandated retirement insurance premiums and are not to be used for any other purpose. Technically the gov't "borrows" FICA funds to cover current budget shortfalls.
Derido's claim that FICA funds are used for general expenditures (his way of "proving" that all taxpayers fund fed expenses) is just not true.
Roughly the bottom 50% of fed tax payers get a free ride on the backs of corporations and the upper 50%.

Derido's claim that FICA funds are used for general expenditures (his way of "proving" that all taxpayers fund fed expenses) is just not true.

So you cannot refute the FACT that 100% of all taxpayers do pay taxes. Furthermore you cannot refute the FACT that tax funds are not specifically allocated therefore everyone is paying a share of all spending.

And yes, failing to be honest about those FACTS does make you disingenuous!

You claimed all taxpayers share the federal expenditure tax load and you disingenuously used FICA to "prove" it but, as we both know, FICA is not general funds but rather retirement INSURANCE premiums. Only corporations and the top 50% of earners pay federal income tax. The bottom 50% get a free ride.

FICA is FEDERAL taxation. Semantic squirming on your part isn't going to alter the FACT that 100% of all taxpayers are paying FEDERAL FICA taxes.

I never said all earners don't pay FICA. I correctly pointed out that the bottom 50% of earners do not help pay the federal expenditure load and to argue otherwise is disingenuous at best.

 

[Derideo_Te]

Socialism is an economic tool. National Parks are socialistic. As are police departments, fire departments, and the military. All are supported and ran by the government. Our Interstate System is a creation of socialism.

I don't agree that's what socialism is. Those parks are funded by the private sector, capitalism, not state ownership. The state doesn't create any wealth, it doesn't fund jack shit, that's the people's money. The people fund the state, that's capitalism.

Your ignorance as to the definition of socialism doesn't alter the definition.

National Parks, police, fire depts, etc are all socialist by definition. Parks used to belong only to the wealthy, police forces were there to protect the wealthy from the rabble, the military was there to do the bidding of the wealthy.

Today We the People have formed a society where we have our own socialized parks, police, fire and military for our mutual benefit.

You might not understand this concept but it is socialism by it's very nature.

Go back to you knitting old lady. You've just defined government as socialism. The very basis of government is common defense. When you expand socialism to include the functions of government then you've shot yourself in the foot with respect to the a.) people treating you seriously, and b.) you've totally negated the "argument" that socialism is an economic tool, for how is establishment of a park or the creation of an army an economic act.

Gotta at Pastor Rikurzhen preaching his perverted "Gospel of Conservatism" without any understanding of what he is actually saying!

The very basis of government is common defense

Common defense, common ownership, common wealth, common interests, common legal systems, common roads, common parks, etc.

Socialism is about what we as a SOCIETY do in COMMON because it benefits us all. Common defense is a socialist concept because We the People are pooling our funds to provide for our common defense. Equally we are pooling our funds to provide roads, police forces and fire departments because they serve our COMMON interests.

Too bad your home schooling never included the foundation of what constitutes the purpose of a government.