End religious tax-exemption

[USNavyVet]

So how much do you think they make and how much do you think they should make?

From my experience and knowledge, even the smallest churches (200 or less members) the Pastor makes over $90k a year. If you are really living for God, you should be willing to live in a very basic manner. A church is not really a "business" in the secular sense.

A true man of God will live minimalisticly in the best interests of his church and congregation, not making much money and giving of his self and time to others liberally......

my research has shown that the average salary is around $55K which is about right for a professional with experience. I don't know where your $90K came from. Also, that's the average and a large amount of pastors either work for no or little pay due to the size of the congregation.

Your ideal pastor sounds good but I don't find it reasonable. Many pastors make very little and receive no benefits like health insurance, etc.

When it comes to matters of God, there is no reasonable. there I only living for God.
$55k sounds fair

Ok now how about those pastors living on almost nothing? Is that ok too? And if $55K is the average, is it ok for some to make $90K to balance it out? And why is it your choice what they make since you're not part of the congregation? Aren't they the ones who should make the decision?

I don't mean to get pissy with you but it seems like you made a knee jerk reaction and now don't want to think about the issues.

So the taxpayer should subsidize their choice to become a religious shaman? , A witch doctor?

I currently live in the south also known as jesusland , seems every one and his brother claims to be a preacher, then they set up a shack for a church, call it a long name like "church of the true word of holy ghost anointing and four square primitive baptist slain in the spirit Church" and bingo!!! Then a few weeks later at church someone looks a someone else cross eyed leaves and starts their own church, and the property of the new churches are taken off the tax rolls. Taxes that are needed to fund schools and services in their town

Your hatred of organized religion is noted. Have a nice day.

 

[guno]

The building, salary all tax free, Why tax free?

 

[tyroneweaver]

If people would do their jobs properly it wouldn't be an issue.
Like audits. Well done audits.
Same is true with a lot of problems in our country, once rules start to be "bended" when they are "broken" it's not as noticeable and people ignore them (think, illegal immigration...)

I was financial clerk for my church. Twice a year someone higher up in the church would come and audit our finances for the year
Second. The church I belong is lay ministry . My immediate pastor doesn't receive a dime.

 

[tyroneweaver]

The building, salary all tax free, Why tax free?

Because God was here before taxes

 

[Bonzi]

Organized religion is fine, if done in someone's house - Jesus didn't even really have a "home" -
Church has become a business - it's wrong and not how it was laid out in the Bible to be.....

 

[Bonzi]

If people would do their jobs properly it wouldn't be an issue.
Like audits. Well done audits.
Same is true with a lot of problems in our country, once rules start to be "bended" when they are "broken" it's not as noticeable and people ignore them (think, illegal immigration...)

I was financial clerk for my church. Twice a year someone higher up in the church would come and audit our finances for the year
Second. The church I belong is lay ministry . My immediate pastor doesn't receive a dime.

Not every church is corrupt and poorly run. But so many are.
I am of the belief that it should not be run as a business at all...

 

[guno]

From my experience and knowledge, even the smallest churches (200 or less members) the Pastor makes over $90k a year. If you are really living for God, you should be willing to live in a very basic manner. A church is not really a "business" in the secular sense.

A true man of God will live minimalisticly in the best interests of his church and congregation, not making much money and giving of his self and time to others liberally......

my research has shown that the average salary is around $55K which is about right for a professional with experience. I don't know where your $90K came from. Also, that's the average and a large amount of pastors either work for no or little pay due to the size of the congregation.

Your ideal pastor sounds good but I don't find it reasonable. Many pastors make very little and receive no benefits like health insurance, etc.

When it comes to matters of God, there is no reasonable. there I only living for God.
$55k sounds fair

Ok now how about those pastors living on almost nothing? Is that ok too? And if $55K is the average, is it ok for some to make $90K to balance it out? And why is it your choice what they make since you're not part of the congregation? Aren't they the ones who should make the decision?

I don't mean to get pissy with you but it seems like you made a knee jerk reaction and now don't want to think about the issues.

So the taxpayer should subsidize their choice to become a religious shaman? , A witch doctor?

I currently live in the south also known as jesusland , seems every one and his brother claims to be a preacher, then they set up a shack for a church, call it a long name like "church of the true word of holy ghost anointing and four square primitive baptist slain in the spirit Church" and bingo!!! Then a few weeks later at church someone looks a someone else cross eyed leaves and starts their own church, and the property of the new churches are taken off the tax rolls. Taxes that are needed to fund schools and services in their town

Your hatred of organized religion is noted. Have a nice day.

No, asking a question, why tax free?

Seems like you cannot seem to answer it can you?

 

[tyroneweaver]

Organized religion is fine, if done in someone's house - Jesus didn't even really have a "home" -
Church has become a business - it's wrong and not how it was laid out in the Bible to be.....

How else is a church suppose to function without mammon. Heating bills etc.
Even Judas Iscariot was the financial clerk for the 12 and Jesus.

 

[Bonzi]

Organized religion is fine, if done in someone's house - Jesus didn't even really have a "home" -
Church has become a business - it's wrong and not how it was laid out in the Bible to be.....

How else is a church suppose to function without mammon. Heating bills etc.
Even Judas Iscariot was the financial clerk for the 12 and Jesus.

Don't need a building... just some place to gather. Could be someone's home .... I could be wrong, this is just how I envision things - very minimalistically. With most of our energy spent on evangelism and relationship with others. Visiting people. Reaching out to the community. Things that do not cost money.

Maybe the churches in the New Testament DID have buildings they met in and were run like business. I didn't get that impression.

I find that having a Church in a building and being a "member" lends itself to a "country club" feel, and, people tend to internalize in that type of environment... just thinking aloud here....

 

[tyroneweaver]

If people would do their jobs properly it wouldn't be an issue.
Like audits. Well done audits.
Same is true with a lot of problems in our country, once rules start to be "bended" when they are "broken" it's not as noticeable and people ignore them (think, illegal immigration...)

I was financial clerk for my church. Twice a year someone higher up in the church would come and audit our finances for the year
Second. The church I belong is lay ministry . My immediate pastor doesn't receive a dime.

Not every church is corrupt and poorly run. But so many are.
I am of the belief that it should not be run as a business at all...

TV evangelism has a real problem . these nuts live mansions. And are worth billions. Puts a bad light on the honest in heart.

 

[guno]

The building, salary all tax free, Why tax free?

Because God was here before taxes

Which god? The christian god or the kolobian god? And why tax free?

 

[guno]

From my experience and knowledge, even the smallest churches (200 or less members) the Pastor makes over $90k a year. If you are really living for God, you should be willing to live in a very basic manner. A church is not really a "business" in the secular sense.

A true man of God will live minimalisticly in the best interests of his church and congregation, not making much money and giving of his self and time to others liberally......

my research has shown that the average salary is around $55K which is about right for a professional with experience. I don't know where your $90K came from. Also, that's the average and a large amount of pastors either work for no or little pay due to the size of the congregation.

Your ideal pastor sounds good but I don't find it reasonable. Many pastors make very little and receive no benefits like health insurance, etc.

When it comes to matters of God, there is no reasonable. there I only living for God.
$55k sounds fair

Ok now how about those pastors living on almost nothing? Is that ok too? And if $55K is the average, is it ok for some to make $90K to balance it out? And why is it your choice what they make since you're not part of the congregation? Aren't they the ones who should make the decision?

I don't mean to get pissy with you but it seems like you made a knee jerk reaction and now don't want to think about the issues.

So the taxpayer should subsidize their choice to become a religious shaman? , A witch doctor?

I currently live in the south also known as jesusland , seems every one and his brother claims to be a preacher, then they set up a shack for a church, call it a long name like "church of the true word of holy ghost anointing and four square primitive baptist slain in the spirit Church" and bingo!!! Then a few weeks later at church someone looks a someone else cross eyed leaves and starts their own church, and the property of the new churches are taken off the tax rolls. Taxes that are needed to fund schools and services in their town

Your hatred of organized religion is noted. Have a nice day.

“Religion was invented when the first con man met the first fool.”

― Mark Twain

 

[tyroneweaver]

Organized religion is fine, if done in someone's house - Jesus didn't even really have a "home" -
Church has become a business - it's wrong and not how it was laid out in the Bible to be.....

How else is a church suppose to function without mammon. Heating bills etc.
Even Judas Iscariot was the financial clerk for the 12 and Jesus.

Don't need a building... just some place to gather. Could be someone's home .... I could be wrong, this is just how I envision things - very minimalistically. With most of our energy spent on evangelism and relationship with others. Visiting people. Reaching out to the community. Things that do not cost money.

Maybe the churches in the New Testament DID have buildings they met in and were run like business. I didn't get that impression.

I find that having a Church in a building and being a "member" lends itself to a "country club" feel, and, people tend to internalize in that type of environment... just thinking aloud here....

There was the synagogue,but ya don't see much how the Christian met. Some talk about gatherings but no mention of buildings.
But money is definately involved in the NT. Tithing and Alms were required.

 

[tyroneweaver]

The building, salary all tax free, Why tax free?

Because God was here before taxes

Which god? The christian god or the kolobian god? And why tax free?

Knock it off Guno. Go pedal your addiction problem somewhere else.

 

[Bonzi]

Organized religion is fine, if done in someone's house - Jesus didn't even really have a "home" -
Church has become a business - it's wrong and not how it was laid out in the Bible to be.....

How else is a church suppose to function without mammon. Heating bills etc.
Even Judas Iscariot was the financial clerk for the 12 and Jesus.

Don't need a building... just some place to gather. Could be someone's home .... I could be wrong, this is just how I envision things - very minimalistically. With most of our energy spent on evangelism and relationship with others. Visiting people. Reaching out to the community. Things that do not cost money.

Maybe the churches in the New Testament DID have buildings they met in and were run like business. I didn't get that impression.

I find that having a Church in a building and being a "member" lends itself to a "country club" feel, and, people tend to internalize in that type of environment... just thinking aloud here....

There was the synagogue,but ya don't see much how the Christian met. Some talk about gatherings but no mention of buildings.
But money is definately involved in the NT. Tithing and Alms were required.

I do agree with that... you need money to eat, survive - I understand from reading/hearing sermons that Jesus talked more of money than heaven and hell combined... Obviously, it's an important topic.

 

[tyroneweaver]

Organized religion is fine, if done in someone's house - Jesus didn't even really have a "home" -
Church has become a business - it's wrong and not how it was laid out in the Bible to be.....

How else is a church suppose to function without mammon. Heating bills etc.
Even Judas Iscariot was the financial clerk for the 12 and Jesus.

Don't need a building... just some place to gather. Could be someone's home .... I could be wrong, this is just how I envision things - very minimalistically. With most of our energy spent on evangelism and relationship with others. Visiting people. Reaching out to the community. Things that do not cost money.

Maybe the churches in the New Testament DID have buildings they met in and were run like business. I didn't get that impression.

I find that having a Church in a building and being a "member" lends itself to a "country club" feel, and, people tend to internalize in that type of environment... just thinking aloud here....

There was the synagogue,but ya don't see much how the Christian met. Some talk about gatherings but no mention of buildings.
But money is definately involved in the NT. Tithing and Alms were required.

I do agree with that... you need money to eat, survive - I understand from reading/hearing sermons that Jesus talked more of money than heaven and hell combined... Obviously, it's an important topic.

It all belongs to God anyway. I'm only renting stuff.

 

[Wyatt earp]

Alaska town is right to tax churches


Estimates vary, but studies show exempting religion from taxes in America costs the taxpayers between $71 billion and $83.5 billion a year, according to the New Civil Rights Movement. For comparison, America’s food stamp program costs about $75-80 billion a year.

Giving churches special tax exemptions violates the separation of church and state. By providing a financial benefit to religious institutions, government is supporting religion.

A tax break for churches forces all American taxpayers to support religion, even if they oppose some or all religious doctrines:

No church property is taxed and so the infidel and the atheist and the man without religion are taxed to make up the deficit in the public income thus caused.

- Mark Twain


Alaska town is right to tax churches

Giving churches special tax exemptions violates the separation of church and state.by providing a financial benefit to religious institutions, government is supporting religion

Lmao talk about spin..... By them not collecting taxes is honoring seperation of church and state.

 

[guno]

Alaska town is right to tax churches


Estimates vary, but studies show exempting religion from taxes in America costs the taxpayers between $71 billion and $83.5 billion a year, according to the New Civil Rights Movement. For comparison, America’s food stamp program costs about $75-80 billion a year.

Giving churches special tax exemptions violates the separation of church and state. By providing a financial benefit to religious institutions, government is supporting religion.

A tax break for churches forces all American taxpayers to support religion, even if they oppose some or all religious doctrines:

No church property is taxed and so the infidel and the atheist and the man without religion are taxed to make up the deficit in the public income thus caused.

- Mark Twain


Alaska town is right to tax churches

Giving churches special tax exemptions violates the separation of church and state.by providing a financial benefit to religious institutions, government is supporting religion

Lmao talk about spin..... By them not collecting taxes is honoring seperation of church and state.

So why should the public support shamanism with their tax dollars? What gives it the special place?

 

[guno]

As much as one quarter or one-half of a typical U.S. city may be made up of tax-exempt property, much of that churches or church schools.


Other types of subsidy
Churches, which do not pay property taxes, often receive more benefits than individuals and businesses which do pay their fair share. This can include expensive, individualized traffic control by police and extra security checks, not to mention other types of police and fire protection. FFRF has received and investigated complaints whereby city snow removal crews are regularly clearing huge parking lots and sidewalks for churches.

Tax Exemption of Churches - Freedom From Religion Foundation

 

[Wyatt earp]

Alaska town is right to tax churches


Estimates vary, but studies show exempting religion from taxes in America costs the taxpayers between $71 billion and $83.5 billion a year, according to the New Civil Rights Movement. For comparison, America’s food stamp program costs about $75-80 billion a year.

Giving churches special tax exemptions violates the separation of church and state. By providing a financial benefit to religious institutions, government is supporting religion.

A tax break for churches forces all American taxpayers to support religion, even if they oppose some or all religious doctrines:

No church property is taxed and so the infidel and the atheist and the man without religion are taxed to make up the deficit in the public income thus caused.

- Mark Twain


Alaska town is right to tax churches

Giving churches special tax exemptions violates the separation of church and state.by providing a financial benefit to religious institutions, government is supporting religion

Lmao talk about spin..... By them not collecting taxes is honoring seperation of church and state.

So why should the public support shamanism with their tax dollars? What gives it the special place?

How are they supporting them?
To tax them means their is no seperation between church and state.