Eviscerating 'The Roosevelt Alibi'

[JakeStarkey]

So you tell us every so often, Unkotare.

 

[toxicmedia]

That scumbag FDR was easily the worst scoundrel to ever occupy the White House

God, what is it with you people?

The most revered Presidents have simply become targets for GOP strategists.

FDR united the country in necessary ways during a fearful time for the American people, when we actually did face genuine existential threats

 

[Unkotare]

That scumbag FDR was easily the worst scoundrel to ever occupy the White House

God, what is it with you people?

The most revered Presidents have simply become targets for GOP strategists.

FDR united the country in necessary ways during a fearful time for the American people, when we actually did face genuine existential threats

That scumbag lied to the American people (not to mention his wife), played throw-spaghetti-at-the-wall with economic programs, burdened future generations with impossible obligations, threatened our very form of government, threw over 100,000 innocent people - mostly American citizens - into concentration camps on American soil, and played the willing, useful idiot to communist murderers.

 

[toxicmedia]

That scumbag FDR was easily the worst scoundrel to ever occupy the White House

God, what is it with you people?

The most revered Presidents have simply become targets for GOP strategists.

FDR united the country in necessary ways during a fearful time for the American people, when we actually did face genuine existential threats

That scumbag lied to the American people (not to mention his wife), played throw-spaghetti-at-the-wall with economic programs, burdened future generations with impossible obligations, threatened our very form of government, threw over 100,000 innocent people - mostly American citizens - into concentration camps on American soil, and played the willing, useful idiot to communist murderers.

Between the time he took office, and the time he left office (the hard way)....

America went from ......... to .............

Fill in the blanks.

I would fill them in as follows.

America went from economic upheaval to being the strongest nation on Earth, ever.

Are you going to tell me he had nothing to do with that?

But let's take your complaints one by one.

Name a president that never lied to his wife or the American people. Did Regan not lie to the American people about Iran Contra? Nixon lie about Watergate?

What you call "throw-spaghetti-at-the-wall with economic programs" were economic programs that created infrastructure we still have today, and not for much longer if the Republicans refuse to allow the maintenance of it.

The 100,000 Japanese that were put in interment camps were not subject to extermination and starvation like the Jews were in concentration camps. In fact, before the war was over units of Japanese soldiers were recruited from the internment camps, and served with distinction in Italy. Resentments from those interned still exist for some today. I know, I live here in the Sacramento Valley where they cleared them all out in 1941, but you can't blame all of it happening on Roosevelt, and you can't blame him for not putting a stop to it when it happened. It's no different than how George Bush invaded Iraq on bad intelligence, except for the fact that 4000 Japanese didn't die because of what turned out to be a mistake.

Your "useful idiot to communist murderers' is both foundationless and irrational

 

[Statistikhengst]

If the Soviet Union had never been attacked by Germany, Great Britain and the US would never have been able to invade the continent absent the development and deployment of the atomic bomb.

This is just false. The U.S. had landed in North Africa within months, and in Italy soon after. We didn't need a bomb in Europe; we were already inland and crossing the Rhine in '45. More German troops from the Eastern Front would have been useless to Hitler; he didn't have the fuel or food to maintain them in the first place. They would have just been denser fodder for U.S. bombers and artillery. The delay due to extra units would have been mere months. Yes, it would have saved some American lives, but at the cost of losing Poland and half of Germany and the slavic states. It would have been worth the trade off. Hitler couldn't have taken England; he didn't have the resources to, so D-Day would have been possible along, Russia or no Russia.

And besides, claiming they tied up German forces supposes the U.S. threat in the West didn't tie up forces that could be sent East. It's not an valid argument; it works both ways, except the U.S. was supplying all fronts, not just their own, and the Soviet front couldn't have broken out without Lend-Lease while the U.S. could fight without the Soviets, and could even have opened up it's own eastern front into Greece or anywhere along the Black Sea if it so chose to do so.

Even if Britain had fallen early we had the entire Med and Black Sea coastline to pick from for fronts to open up. The historical fact is Hitler was toast and on the defensive by Feb. of '43, and Stalin had yet to launch an offensive. He had to wait on Lend-Lease materiel.

So, unbelievably wrong on all fronts, you are.

Hitler was anything but toast.

After we entered WWII, Hitler was still on the march through 1943, even after Stalingrad. Stalin couldn't launch a counteroffensive for 18+ months after Germany started Barbarossa because he got taken so by surprise and was whipped so badly, the only thing that saved his ass was the re-opening of a second front in the West because of our entrance into the war. Stalin had the USA to thank that we took enough pressure off of him by forcing the Jerrys to move battalions and armament from the Eastern front westward in expectation of an allied landing in France, and had to fortify their anti-aircraft measures because of US- and this gave Stalin the time he desperately to reorganize suppy lines from as far as Vladivostok to finally launch a counteroffensive. Without our entrance into WWII, Hitler would surely have taken Moscow and beyond and all of the assets around the Black Sea, all of them. Russia would surely have fallen and Ibet Hitelr would have murdered at least 50-60 million Russians.

Stupid fools like you like to try to re-write history, but I will not let you.

FDR did the right thing at the right time and as a result of his actions, the USA emerged from WWII as the dominant superpower.

So, go suck an egg.

 

[Correll]

That scumbag FDR was easily the worst scoundrel to ever occupy the White House

God, what is it with you people?

The most revered Presidents have simply become targets for GOP strategists.

FDR united the country in necessary ways during a fearful time for the American people, when we actually did face genuine existential threats

That scumbag lied to the American people (not to mention his wife), played throw-spaghetti-at-the-wall with economic programs, burdened future generations with impossible obligations, threatened our very form of government, threw over 100,000 innocent people - mostly American citizens - into concentration camps on American soil, and played the willing, useful idiot to communist murderers.

Between the time he took office, and the time he left office (the hard way)....

America went from ......... to .............

Fill in the blanks.

I would fill them in as follows.

America went from economic upheaval to being the strongest nation on Earth, ever.

Are you going to tell me he had nothing to do with that?

But let's take your complaints one by one.

Name a president that never lied to his wife or the American people. Did Regan not lie to the American people about Iran Contra? Nixon lie about Watergate?

What you call "throw-spaghetti-at-the-wall with economic programs" were economic programs that created infrastructure we still have today, and not for much longer if the Republicans refuse to allow the maintenance of it.

The 100,000 Japanese that were put in interment camps were not subject to extermination and starvation like the Jews were in concentration camps. In fact, before the war was over units of Japanese soldiers were recruited from the internment camps, and served with distinction in Italy. Resentments from those interned still exist for some today. I know, I live here in the Sacramento Valley where they cleared them all out in 1941, but you can't blame all of it happening on Roosevelt, and you can't blame him for not putting a stop to it when it happened. It's no different than how George Bush invaded Iraq on bad intelligence, except for the fact that 4000 Japanese didn't die because of what turned out to be a mistake.

Your "useful idiot to communist murderers' is both foundationless and irrational

Running for re election on a "He kept us out of war" theme, when he knew he wanted to get us into WWII, is a pretty big lie.


And his apparent lack of concern for the Post War balance of power is both founded and completely rational.

It seems he was completely focused on the short term, ie winning the war against the Nazi.

Which is sort of understandable. WWII, tens of thousands of Americans dying...


BUT...

He was President. Looking at the big picture and the long term was his job more than anyone else's.

He did seem to drop the ball on that one.

 

[rightwinger]

That scumbag FDR was easily the worst scoundrel to ever occupy the White House

God, what is it with you people?

The most revered Presidents have simply become targets for GOP strategists.

FDR united the country in necessary ways during a fearful time for the American people, when we actually did face genuine existential threats

That scumbag lied to the American people (not to mention his wife), played throw-spaghetti-at-the-wall with economic programs, burdened future generations with impossible obligations, threatened our very form of government, threw over 100,000 innocent people - mostly American citizens - into concentration camps on American soil, and played the willing, useful idiot to communist murderers.

Between the time he took office, and the time he left office (the hard way)....

America went from ......... to .............

Fill in the blanks.

I would fill them in as follows.

America went from economic upheaval to being the strongest nation on Earth, ever.

Are you going to tell me he had nothing to do with that?

But let's take your complaints one by one.

Name a president that never lied to his wife or the American people. Did Regan not lie to the American people about Iran Contra? Nixon lie about Watergate?

What you call "throw-spaghetti-at-the-wall with economic programs" were economic programs that created infrastructure we still have today, and not for much longer if the Republicans refuse to allow the maintenance of it.

The 100,000 Japanese that were put in interment camps were not subject to extermination and starvation like the Jews were in concentration camps. In fact, before the war was over units of Japanese soldiers were recruited from the internment camps, and served with distinction in Italy. Resentments from those interned still exist for some today. I know, I live here in the Sacramento Valley where they cleared them all out in 1941, but you can't blame all of it happening on Roosevelt, and you can't blame him for not putting a stop to it when it happened. It's no different than how George Bush invaded Iraq on bad intelligence, except for the fact that 4000 Japanese didn't die because of what turned out to be a mistake.

Your "useful idiot to communist murderers' is both foundationless and irrational

Running for re election on a "He kept us out of war" theme, when he knew he wanted to get us into WWII, is a pretty big lie.


And his apparent lack of concern for the Post War balance of power is both founded and completely rational.

It seems he was completely focused on the short term, ie winning the war against the Nazi.

Which is sort of understandable. WWII, tens of thousands of Americans dying...


BUT...

He was President. Looking at the big picture and the long term was his job more than anyone else's.

He did seem to drop the ball on that one.

You keep harping on the Post War balance of power nonsense

Postwar, the US had.....

The strongest military and dominant Navy
The only untouched economy in the world
Massive production capability
The only atomic bomb

How much more in the balance of power did you want FDR to give you?

 

[JakeStarkey]

Picaro, please answer this.

Tell you what, Picaro.

Take an AH or an SPI board strategy game.

Bring all Allied units in 1944 from NA and Italy to Great Britain. Might as well because the Axis would taken NA no later than December 1941 if it had not invaded the USSR.

Increase the sea lift and beach breach capacity by 50% for the Allies into Normandy while increasing the Axis defensive power by 2.5.

How much you want to bet you don't even stay 24 hours in a sector?

 

[Correll]

That scumbag FDR was easily the worst scoundrel to ever occupy the White House

God, what is it with you people?

The most revered Presidents have simply become targets for GOP strategists.

FDR united the country in necessary ways during a fearful time for the American people, when we actually did face genuine existential threats

That scumbag lied to the American people (not to mention his wife), played throw-spaghetti-at-the-wall with economic programs, burdened future generations with impossible obligations, threatened our very form of government, threw over 100,000 innocent people - mostly American citizens - into concentration camps on American soil, and played the willing, useful idiot to communist murderers.

Between the time he took office, and the time he left office (the hard way)....

America went from ......... to .............

Fill in the blanks.

I would fill them in as follows.

America went from economic upheaval to being the strongest nation on Earth, ever.

Are you going to tell me he had nothing to do with that?

But let's take your complaints one by one.

Name a president that never lied to his wife or the American people. Did Regan not lie to the American people about Iran Contra? Nixon lie about Watergate?

What you call "throw-spaghetti-at-the-wall with economic programs" were economic programs that created infrastructure we still have today, and not for much longer if the Republicans refuse to allow the maintenance of it.

The 100,000 Japanese that were put in interment camps were not subject to extermination and starvation like the Jews were in concentration camps. In fact, before the war was over units of Japanese soldiers were recruited from the internment camps, and served with distinction in Italy. Resentments from those interned still exist for some today. I know, I live here in the Sacramento Valley where they cleared them all out in 1941, but you can't blame all of it happening on Roosevelt, and you can't blame him for not putting a stop to it when it happened. It's no different than how George Bush invaded Iraq on bad intelligence, except for the fact that 4000 Japanese didn't die because of what turned out to be a mistake.

Your "useful idiot to communist murderers' is both foundationless and irrational

Running for re election on a "He kept us out of war" theme, when he knew he wanted to get us into WWII, is a pretty big lie.


And his apparent lack of concern for the Post War balance of power is both founded and completely rational.

It seems he was completely focused on the short term, ie winning the war against the Nazi.

Which is sort of understandable. WWII, tens of thousands of Americans dying...


BUT...

He was President. Looking at the big picture and the long term was his job more than anyone else's.

He did seem to drop the ball on that one.

You keep harping on the Post War balance of power nonsense

Postwar, the US had.....

The strongest military and dominant Navy
The only untouched economy in the world
Massive production capability
The only atomic bomb

How much more in the balance of power did you want FDR to give you?

"Balance of Power nonsense"?

The soviet occupation of Eastern Europe, with it's huge army, that was only possible because of the manpower freed up by Lend Lease, led directly to the Cold War and generations of nuclear standoff.

If something had every gone wrong, it could have been the End of the World.


NOt to mention the Korean and Vietnamese Wars, and dozens of little proxy conflicts that destroyed whole nations.

 

[JakeStarkey]

"Balance of Power nonsense"?

The soviet occupation of Eastern Europe, with it's huge army, that was only possible because of the manpower freed up by Lend Lease, led directly to the Cold War and generations of nuclear standoff.

If something had every gone wrong, it could have been the End of the World.

NOt to mention the Korean and Vietnamese Wars, and dozens of little proxy conflicts that destroyed whole nations.

You are as uneducated in geo-politics and as subjective in belief as PoliticChic. You really have no idea about what you are writing.

The reds would have occupied Eastern Europe with our without lend lease.

 

[rightwinger]

God, what is it with you people?

The most revered Presidents have simply become targets for GOP strategists.

FDR united the country in necessary ways during a fearful time for the American people, when we actually did face genuine existential threats

That scumbag lied to the American people (not to mention his wife), played throw-spaghetti-at-the-wall with economic programs, burdened future generations with impossible obligations, threatened our very form of government, threw over 100,000 innocent people - mostly American citizens - into concentration camps on American soil, and played the willing, useful idiot to communist murderers.

Between the time he took office, and the time he left office (the hard way)....

America went from ......... to .............

Fill in the blanks.

I would fill them in as follows.

America went from economic upheaval to being the strongest nation on Earth, ever.

Are you going to tell me he had nothing to do with that?

But let's take your complaints one by one.

Name a president that never lied to his wife or the American people. Did Regan not lie to the American people about Iran Contra? Nixon lie about Watergate?

What you call "throw-spaghetti-at-the-wall with economic programs" were economic programs that created infrastructure we still have today, and not for much longer if the Republicans refuse to allow the maintenance of it.

The 100,000 Japanese that were put in interment camps were not subject to extermination and starvation like the Jews were in concentration camps. In fact, before the war was over units of Japanese soldiers were recruited from the internment camps, and served with distinction in Italy. Resentments from those interned still exist for some today. I know, I live here in the Sacramento Valley where they cleared them all out in 1941, but you can't blame all of it happening on Roosevelt, and you can't blame him for not putting a stop to it when it happened. It's no different than how George Bush invaded Iraq on bad intelligence, except for the fact that 4000 Japanese didn't die because of what turned out to be a mistake.

Your "useful idiot to communist murderers' is both foundationless and irrational

Running for re election on a "He kept us out of war" theme, when he knew he wanted to get us into WWII, is a pretty big lie.


And his apparent lack of concern for the Post War balance of power is both founded and completely rational.

It seems he was completely focused on the short term, ie winning the war against the Nazi.

Which is sort of understandable. WWII, tens of thousands of Americans dying...


BUT...

He was President. Looking at the big picture and the long term was his job more than anyone else's.

He did seem to drop the ball on that one.

You keep harping on the Post War balance of power nonsense

Postwar, the US had.....

The strongest military and dominant Navy
The only untouched economy in the world
Massive production capability
The only atomic bomb

How much more in the balance of power did you want FDR to give you?

"Balance of Power nonsense"?

The soviet occupation of Eastern Europe, with it's huge army, that was only possible because of the manpower freed up by Lend Lease, led directly to the Cold War and generations of nuclear standoff.

If something had every gone wrong, it could have been the End of the World.


NOt to mention the Korean and Vietnamese Wars, and dozens of little proxy conflicts that destroyed whole nations.

The Soviets occupied Eastern Europe because their armies conquered it. Removing them from that territory would have killed a million American soldiers

As it is, the Soviet empire crumbled without a shot

Looks like FDR was right again



.

 

[Correll]

That scumbag lied to the American people (not to mention his wife), played throw-spaghetti-at-the-wall with economic programs, burdened future generations with impossible obligations, threatened our very form of government, threw over 100,000 innocent people - mostly American citizens - into concentration camps on American soil, and played the willing, useful idiot to communist murderers.

Between the time he took office, and the time he left office (the hard way)....

America went from ......... to .............

Fill in the blanks.

I would fill them in as follows.

America went from economic upheaval to being the strongest nation on Earth, ever.

Are you going to tell me he had nothing to do with that?

But let's take your complaints one by one.

Name a president that never lied to his wife or the American people. Did Regan not lie to the American people about Iran Contra? Nixon lie about Watergate?

What you call "throw-spaghetti-at-the-wall with economic programs" were economic programs that created infrastructure we still have today, and not for much longer if the Republicans refuse to allow the maintenance of it.

The 100,000 Japanese that were put in interment camps were not subject to extermination and starvation like the Jews were in concentration camps. In fact, before the war was over units of Japanese soldiers were recruited from the internment camps, and served with distinction in Italy. Resentments from those interned still exist for some today. I know, I live here in the Sacramento Valley where they cleared them all out in 1941, but you can't blame all of it happening on Roosevelt, and you can't blame him for not putting a stop to it when it happened. It's no different than how George Bush invaded Iraq on bad intelligence, except for the fact that 4000 Japanese didn't die because of what turned out to be a mistake.

Your "useful idiot to communist murderers' is both foundationless and irrational

Running for re election on a "He kept us out of war" theme, when he knew he wanted to get us into WWII, is a pretty big lie.


And his apparent lack of concern for the Post War balance of power is both founded and completely rational.

It seems he was completely focused on the short term, ie winning the war against the Nazi.

Which is sort of understandable. WWII, tens of thousands of Americans dying...


BUT...

He was President. Looking at the big picture and the long term was his job more than anyone else's.

He did seem to drop the ball on that one.

You keep harping on the Post War balance of power nonsense

Postwar, the US had.....

The strongest military and dominant Navy
The only untouched economy in the world
Massive production capability
The only atomic bomb

How much more in the balance of power did you want FDR to give you?

"Balance of Power nonsense"?

The soviet occupation of Eastern Europe, with it's huge army, that was only possible because of the manpower freed up by Lend Lease, led directly to the Cold War and generations of nuclear standoff.

If something had every gone wrong, it could have been the End of the World.


NOt to mention the Korean and Vietnamese Wars, and dozens of little proxy conflicts that destroyed whole nations.

The Soviets occupied Eastern Europe because their armies conquered it. Removing them from that territory would have killed a million American soldiers

As it is, the Soviet empire crumbled without a shot

Looks like FDR was right again

DId FDR have any leverage over Stalin?

 

[rightwinger]

Between the time he took office, and the time he left office (the hard way)....

America went from ......... to .............

Fill in the blanks.

I would fill them in as follows.

America went from economic upheaval to being the strongest nation on Earth, ever.

Are you going to tell me he had nothing to do with that?

But let's take your complaints one by one.

Name a president that never lied to his wife or the American people. Did Regan not lie to the American people about Iran Contra? Nixon lie about Watergate?

What you call "throw-spaghetti-at-the-wall with economic programs" were economic programs that created infrastructure we still have today, and not for much longer if the Republicans refuse to allow the maintenance of it.

The 100,000 Japanese that were put in interment camps were not subject to extermination and starvation like the Jews were in concentration camps. In fact, before the war was over units of Japanese soldiers were recruited from the internment camps, and served with distinction in Italy. Resentments from those interned still exist for some today. I know, I live here in the Sacramento Valley where they cleared them all out in 1941, but you can't blame all of it happening on Roosevelt, and you can't blame him for not putting a stop to it when it happened. It's no different than how George Bush invaded Iraq on bad intelligence, except for the fact that 4000 Japanese didn't die because of what turned out to be a mistake.

Your "useful idiot to communist murderers' is both foundationless and irrational

Running for re election on a "He kept us out of war" theme, when he knew he wanted to get us into WWII, is a pretty big lie.


And his apparent lack of concern for the Post War balance of power is both founded and completely rational.

It seems he was completely focused on the short term, ie winning the war against the Nazi.

Which is sort of understandable. WWII, tens of thousands of Americans dying...


BUT...

He was President. Looking at the big picture and the long term was his job more than anyone else's.

He did seem to drop the ball on that one.

You keep harping on the Post War balance of power nonsense

Postwar, the US had.....

The strongest military and dominant Navy
The only untouched economy in the world
Massive production capability
The only atomic bomb

How much more in the balance of power did you want FDR to give you?

"Balance of Power nonsense"?

The soviet occupation of Eastern Europe, with it's huge army, that was only possible because of the manpower freed up by Lend Lease, led directly to the Cold War and generations of nuclear standoff.

If something had every gone wrong, it could have been the End of the World.


NOt to mention the Korean and Vietnamese Wars, and dozens of little proxy conflicts that destroyed whole nations.

The Soviets occupied Eastern Europe because their armies conquered it. Removing them from that territory would have killed a million American soldiers

As it is, the Soviet empire crumbled without a shot

Looks like FDR was right again

DId FDR have any leverage over Stalin?

Yes

Allowing Stalin to do most of the fighting and dying

 

[Correll]

Running for re election on a "He kept us out of war" theme, when he knew he wanted to get us into WWII, is a pretty big lie.


And his apparent lack of concern for the Post War balance of power is both founded and completely rational.

It seems he was completely focused on the short term, ie winning the war against the Nazi.

Which is sort of understandable. WWII, tens of thousands of Americans dying...


BUT...

He was President. Looking at the big picture and the long term was his job more than anyone else's.

He did seem to drop the ball on that one.

You keep harping on the Post War balance of power nonsense

Postwar, the US had.....

The strongest military and dominant Navy
The only untouched economy in the world
Massive production capability
The only atomic bomb

How much more in the balance of power did you want FDR to give you?

"Balance of Power nonsense"?

The soviet occupation of Eastern Europe, with it's huge army, that was only possible because of the manpower freed up by Lend Lease, led directly to the Cold War and generations of nuclear standoff.

If something had every gone wrong, it could have been the End of the World.


NOt to mention the Korean and Vietnamese Wars, and dozens of little proxy conflicts that destroyed whole nations.

The Soviets occupied Eastern Europe because their armies conquered it. Removing them from that territory would have killed a million American soldiers

As it is, the Soviet empire crumbled without a shot

Looks like FDR was right again

DId FDR have any leverage over Stalin?

Yes

Allowing Stalin to do most of the fighting and dying

FDR had nothing to do with the Soviet Union being the biggest battle ground of WWII.

That was on STalin when he allied with Hitler to divide up Poland and gave himself a common border with Nazi Germany, a great idea that.


When the US entered the War, there were already millions of Nazi insider of the SU.

THere was never any danger of Germans actually attacking the United States physical territory.

THe US was able to produce and prepare for war in complete safety while the SU was moving factories to get them away from the Nazi advance.

The Soviets were the one who desperately needed aid so that they could drive genocidal invaders from their land.

THe US was the one in a position to help them tremendously. Or not.

This should have resulted in FDR having enormous leverage over Stalin.

Looking at history, I see no sign that FDR ever attempted to use that to the advantage of the US.

 

[toxicmedia]

God, what is it with you people?

The most revered Presidents have simply become targets for GOP strategists.

FDR united the country in necessary ways during a fearful time for the American people, when we actually did face genuine existential threats

That scumbag lied to the American people (not to mention his wife), played throw-spaghetti-at-the-wall with economic programs, burdened future generations with impossible obligations, threatened our very form of government, threw over 100,000 innocent people - mostly American citizens - into concentration camps on American soil, and played the willing, useful idiot to communist murderers.

Between the time he took office, and the time he left office (the hard way)....

America went from ......... to .............

Fill in the blanks.

I would fill them in as follows.

America went from economic upheaval to being the strongest nation on Earth, ever.

Are you going to tell me he had nothing to do with that?

But let's take your complaints one by one.

Name a president that never lied to his wife or the American people. Did Regan not lie to the American people about Iran Contra? Nixon lie about Watergate?

What you call "throw-spaghetti-at-the-wall with economic programs" were economic programs that created infrastructure we still have today, and not for much longer if the Republicans refuse to allow the maintenance of it.

The 100,000 Japanese that were put in interment camps were not subject to extermination and starvation like the Jews were in concentration camps. In fact, before the war was over units of Japanese soldiers were recruited from the internment camps, and served with distinction in Italy. Resentments from those interned still exist for some today. I know, I live here in the Sacramento Valley where they cleared them all out in 1941, but you can't blame all of it happening on Roosevelt, and you can't blame him for not putting a stop to it when it happened. It's no different than how George Bush invaded Iraq on bad intelligence, except for the fact that 4000 Japanese didn't die because of what turned out to be a mistake.

Your "useful idiot to communist murderers' is both foundationless and irrational

Running for re election on a "He kept us out of war" theme, when he knew he wanted to get us into WWII, is a pretty big lie.


And his apparent lack of concern for the Post War balance of power is both founded and completely rational.

It seems he was completely focused on the short term, ie winning the war against the Nazi.

Which is sort of understandable. WWII, tens of thousands of Americans dying...


BUT...

He was President. Looking at the big picture and the long term was his job more than anyone else's.

He did seem to drop the ball on that one.

You keep harping on the Post War balance of power nonsense

Postwar, the US had.....

The strongest military and dominant Navy
The only untouched economy in the world
Massive production capability
The only atomic bomb

How much more in the balance of power did you want FDR to give you?

"Balance of Power nonsense"?

The soviet occupation of Eastern Europe, with it's huge army, that was only possible because of the manpower freed up by Lend Lease, led directly to the Cold War and generations of nuclear standoff.

If something had every gone wrong, it could have been the End of the World.


NOt to mention the Korean and Vietnamese Wars, and dozens of little proxy conflicts that destroyed whole nations.

Do you know what you're doing?

Because I do.

What you are doing, is simply blaming every mistake FDR ever made, and any unintended negative consequence that came out of a global conflict, squarely on FDR...just exactly like the GOP does today with Obama. And why not, the same GOP strategy organizations came up with all these revisions of history, dictate the campaigns against Democrats today. What you're saying is not being said by historians or journalists, it's being contrived by political consultants with communications degrees hired by the GOP.

Look at what you wrote again.

You blamed Vietnam on FDR.

Vietnam played out the way it did because of French reluctance to admit their colonial claims to the region were not viable post war. Then Eisenhower, and then Kennedy.

 

[rightwinger]

You keep harping on the Post War balance of power nonsense

Postwar, the US had.....

The strongest military and dominant Navy
The only untouched economy in the world
Massive production capability
The only atomic bomb

How much more in the balance of power did you want FDR to give you?

"Balance of Power nonsense"?

The soviet occupation of Eastern Europe, with it's huge army, that was only possible because of the manpower freed up by Lend Lease, led directly to the Cold War and generations of nuclear standoff.

If something had every gone wrong, it could have been the End of the World.


NOt to mention the Korean and Vietnamese Wars, and dozens of little proxy conflicts that destroyed whole nations.

The Soviets occupied Eastern Europe because their armies conquered it. Removing them from that territory would have killed a million American soldiers

As it is, the Soviet empire crumbled without a shot

Looks like FDR was right again

DId FDR have any leverage over Stalin?

Yes

Allowing Stalin to do most of the fighting and dying

FDR had nothing to do with the Soviet Union being the biggest battle ground of WWII.

That was on STalin when he allied with Hitler to divide up Poland and gave himself a common border with Nazi Germany, a great idea that.


When the US entered the War, there were already millions of Nazi insider of the SU.

THere was never any danger of Germans actually attacking the United States physical territory.

THe US was able to produce and prepare for war in complete safety while the SU was moving factories to get them away from the Nazi advance.

The Soviets were the one who desperately needed aid so that they could drive genocidal invaders from their land.

THe US was the one in a position to help them tremendously. Or not.

This should have resulted in FDR having enormous leverage over Stalin.

Looking at history, I see no sign that FDR ever attempted to use that to the advantage of the US.

THe US was the one in a position to help them tremendously. Or not.
This should have resulted in FDR having enormous leverage over Stalin.
Looking at history, I see no sign that FDR ever attempted to use that to the advantage of the US.

That is an advantage? Allowing Hitler to win on the Eastern Front?

 

[JakeStarkey]

Correll, you don't just get WWII history and its consequences; I suspect that is the case because you are a follower of far right subjective revisionism.

FDR was quite willing to let 60 Soviets die or be injured to every one of ours. Yeah, FDR had a heck of a lot of leverage through military aid and delaying the second front in Western Europe.

 

[Correll]

That scumbag lied to the American people (not to mention his wife), played throw-spaghetti-at-the-wall with economic programs, burdened future generations with impossible obligations, threatened our very form of government, threw over 100,000 innocent people - mostly American citizens - into concentration camps on American soil, and played the willing, useful idiot to communist murderers.

Between the time he took office, and the time he left office (the hard way)....

America went from ......... to .............

Fill in the blanks.

I would fill them in as follows.

America went from economic upheaval to being the strongest nation on Earth, ever.

Are you going to tell me he had nothing to do with that?

But let's take your complaints one by one.

Name a president that never lied to his wife or the American people. Did Regan not lie to the American people about Iran Contra? Nixon lie about Watergate?

What you call "throw-spaghetti-at-the-wall with economic programs" were economic programs that created infrastructure we still have today, and not for much longer if the Republicans refuse to allow the maintenance of it.

The 100,000 Japanese that were put in interment camps were not subject to extermination and starvation like the Jews were in concentration camps. In fact, before the war was over units of Japanese soldiers were recruited from the internment camps, and served with distinction in Italy. Resentments from those interned still exist for some today. I know, I live here in the Sacramento Valley where they cleared them all out in 1941, but you can't blame all of it happening on Roosevelt, and you can't blame him for not putting a stop to it when it happened. It's no different than how George Bush invaded Iraq on bad intelligence, except for the fact that 4000 Japanese didn't die because of what turned out to be a mistake.

Your "useful idiot to communist murderers' is both foundationless and irrational

Running for re election on a "He kept us out of war" theme, when he knew he wanted to get us into WWII, is a pretty big lie.


And his apparent lack of concern for the Post War balance of power is both founded and completely rational.

It seems he was completely focused on the short term, ie winning the war against the Nazi.

Which is sort of understandable. WWII, tens of thousands of Americans dying...


BUT...

He was President. Looking at the big picture and the long term was his job more than anyone else's.

He did seem to drop the ball on that one.

You keep harping on the Post War balance of power nonsense

Postwar, the US had.....

The strongest military and dominant Navy
The only untouched economy in the world
Massive production capability
The only atomic bomb

How much more in the balance of power did you want FDR to give you?

"Balance of Power nonsense"?

The soviet occupation of Eastern Europe, with it's huge army, that was only possible because of the manpower freed up by Lend Lease, led directly to the Cold War and generations of nuclear standoff.

If something had every gone wrong, it could have been the End of the World.


NOt to mention the Korean and Vietnamese Wars, and dozens of little proxy conflicts that destroyed whole nations.

Do you know what you're doing?

What you are doing, is simply blaming every mistake FDR ever made, and any unintended negative consequence that came out of a global conflict, squarely on FDR...just exactly like the GOP does today with Obama. And why not, the same GOP strategy organizations came up with all these revisions of history, dictate the campaigns against Democrats today. What you're saying is not being said by historians or journalists, it's being contrived by political consultants with communications degrees hire by the GOP.

Look at what you wrote again.

You blamed Vietnam on FDR.

Vietnam played out the way it did because of French reluctance to admit their colonial claims to the region were not viable post war. Then Eisenhower, and then Kennedy.

The Cold War grew out of the end of WWII.

Looking back I can see no evidence that FDR gave any thought to the post war balance of power.


Presidents are supposed to think ahead.

 

[toxicmedia]

You keep harping on the Post War balance of power nonsense

Postwar, the US had.....

The strongest military and dominant Navy
The only untouched economy in the world
Massive production capability
The only atomic bomb

How much more in the balance of power did you want FDR to give you?

"Balance of Power nonsense"?

The soviet occupation of Eastern Europe, with it's huge army, that was only possible because of the manpower freed up by Lend Lease, led directly to the Cold War and generations of nuclear standoff.

If something had every gone wrong, it could have been the End of the World.


NOt to mention the Korean and Vietnamese Wars, and dozens of little proxy conflicts that destroyed whole nations.

The Soviets occupied Eastern Europe because their armies conquered it. Removing them from that territory would have killed a million American soldiers

As it is, the Soviet empire crumbled without a shot

Looks like FDR was right again

DId FDR have any leverage over Stalin?

Yes

Allowing Stalin to do most of the fighting and dying

FDR had nothing to do with the Soviet Union being the biggest battle ground of WWII.

That was on STalin when he allied with Hitler to divide up Poland and gave himself a common border with Nazi Germany, a great idea that.


When the US entered the War, there were already millions of Nazi insider of the SU.

THere was never any danger of Germans actually attacking the United States physical territory.

THe US was able to produce and prepare for war in complete safety while the SU was moving factories to get them away from the Nazi advance.

The Soviets were the one who desperately needed aid so that they could drive genocidal invaders from their land.

THe US was the one in a position to help them tremendously. Or not.

This should have resulted in FDR having enormous leverage over Stalin.

Looking at history, I see no sign that FDR ever attempted to use that to the advantage of the US.

THere was never any danger of Germans actually attacking the United States physical territory

Buuut.........ummmmmmmm..........Germany declared war on the United States

 

[Correll]

"Balance of Power nonsense"?

The soviet occupation of Eastern Europe, with it's huge army, that was only possible because of the manpower freed up by Lend Lease, led directly to the Cold War and generations of nuclear standoff.

If something had every gone wrong, it could have been the End of the World.


NOt to mention the Korean and Vietnamese Wars, and dozens of little proxy conflicts that destroyed whole nations.

The Soviets occupied Eastern Europe because their armies conquered it. Removing them from that territory would have killed a million American soldiers

As it is, the Soviet empire crumbled without a shot

Looks like FDR was right again

DId FDR have any leverage over Stalin?

Yes

Allowing Stalin to do most of the fighting and dying

FDR had nothing to do with the Soviet Union being the biggest battle ground of WWII.

That was on STalin when he allied with Hitler to divide up Poland and gave himself a common border with Nazi Germany, a great idea that.


When the US entered the War, there were already millions of Nazi insider of the SU.

THere was never any danger of Germans actually attacking the United States physical territory.

THe US was able to produce and prepare for war in complete safety while the SU was moving factories to get them away from the Nazi advance.

The Soviets were the one who desperately needed aid so that they could drive genocidal invaders from their land.

THe US was the one in a position to help them tremendously. Or not.

This should have resulted in FDR having enormous leverage over Stalin.

Looking at history, I see no sign that FDR ever attempted to use that to the advantage of the US.

THe US was the one in a position to help them tremendously. Or not.
This should have resulted in FDR having enormous leverage over Stalin.
Looking at history, I see no sign that FDR ever attempted to use that to the advantage of the US.

That is an advantage? Allowing Hitler to win on the Eastern Front?

Leverage. I said leverage.

The Soviets were the ones in direct trouble with millions of genocidal invaders in their homeland killing their people.

The Americans were the ones who were in a position to help them.

This should have resulted in FDR having enormous leverage over Stalin.

Looking at history I see no sign that FDR ever attempted to use that to the advantage of the US.