Good News in the fight for 15.

[Slade3200]

Two separate issues... Of course wages for the middle class need to go up, but that is a different
discussion.

Again, the PURPOSE of the $15 MW is to erode the purchasing power of the middle. This is simply part of the war that democrats are waging on the middle class.

To all those who rose to $30K, you are now in poverty, thanks to the democrats. That boot to your face pushing you down to minimum, yeah, that's the left stomping you off the ladder of success.

We are talking about providing a minimum standard to help our poor.

Well, Mexico's poor at any rate.

I just broke down what $7.25 an hour is... $290 a week, $14,500 a year. I don't care if you are flipping burgers or digging trenches, that is not a wage that anybody can support themselves or their family with.

Nor is it meant to be. It is the wage paid to high school students and entry level workers.

With that wage we the tax payers pick up the slack.

Only with illegal aliens. High school kids live at home and are just making some extra money.

You may say "then get another job" but when there are millions that are unemployed and demand far outweighs supply then not everybody has that luxury. And in this country if you want to do business then you need to provide a minimum set of standards for your employees. $7.25 an hour is far below that standard... I've said this many times, $10-$12 an hour is where we should be and I really don't understand why yall are fighting it so hard. It's common sense.

Minimum wage is not for raising a family. Nor should unskilled labor be the basis for raising a family.

Wow man, you are out of touch... Not sure if it's worth my time trying to counter argue with absurdity. You go on believing the entire goal of the left is to destroy the middle class cause we all just can't wait to be controlled by the big bad government... haha, that hamster spinning the wheel in your head must have a cramp.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Charts have also been posted showing how many people are being paid the minimum wage and many are trying to support themselves or their families on it.

We corrupted the market by importing third world peasants who lack marketable skills.

So the tax payers pick up the slack. Many states have been responsible and upped their minimum to a more realistic standard. I still think this should be the case, but there shouldn't be this much resistance for the Feds to set a national standard at $10-$12 and letting the states take it from there.

Once again, this erodes the purchasing power of the middle class. It harms the middle greatly by putting those in the lower middle class back into poverty. A worker who has struggled up to $30K is suddenly back at minimum wage.

Because the value added by minimum wage workers will not increase, the purchasing power of that formerly middle class worker will drop to $7.25.

 

[Slade3200]

Charts have also been posted showing how many people are being paid the minimum wage and many are trying to support themselves or their families on it.

We corrupted the market by importing third world peasants who lack marketable skills.

So the tax payers pick up the slack. Many states have been responsible and upped their minimum to a more realistic standard. I still think this should be the case, but there shouldn't be this much resistance for the Feds to set a national standard at $10-$12 and letting the states take it from there.

Once again, this erodes the purchasing power of the middle class. It harms the middle greatly by putting those in the lower middle class back into poverty. A worker who has struggled up to $30K is suddenly back at minimum wage.

Because the value added by minimum wage workers will not increase, the purchasing power of that formerly middle class worker will drop to $7.25.

Great logic man... so according to you if we really want to help our middle class we should lower the minimum wage, right? To what... $5 an hour? How about $2 an hour... The lower we go the stronger the middle class gets, right? I think you're onto something, you should run for office.

 

[Fair&Balanced]

So mr. Know it all I have started six businesses, tell us how a small business with maybe a few employees and a small profit margin is going to meet the expectations of a fifteen dollar an hour wage? Should the owner work for nothing?

Small business is a tough situation. I'd say if wages are below minimum standards, which they mostly are in the start up phase, then workers would receive a profit share, equity, or bonus plan. I never claimed to know it all, but I get tired of dumbshits in this forum calling me ignorant while they spout off mindless talking points. I listen to everybody's ideas objectively.

And yes, as a biz owner I've worked many years for no pay

If you have worked as a business owner for "many years" for no pay you are a seriously one of the stupidest people ever to be born.

No stupid. I asked the question "What do you expect small business to do? Work without profit?"

If you can't afford $10-11 an hour for an employee, you need to ask yourself if you NEED that employee.

Ergo.. Wendy's auto service kiosks!
After strikes and the demand that the minimum wage be raised to $15/hour, fast food chains have decided that instead of paying someone $15 to push buttons with pictures of food on them, it would be much more cost effective for companies to just roll out self-service kiosks that they can pay $0.00 an hour without benefits so customers can push buttons with pictures of food themselves.

Problem solved.
Real Minimum Wage Is $0: Wendy's to Roll out Idiocracy-Style Self-Service Kiosks This Year | The Daily Sheeple

Do you really imagine this technology wasn't coming either way?

And again, you don't seem to understand that as fast food jobs are replaced by machines, other jobs will become minimum wage jobs and yes those jobs will pay at or near the minimum b/c companies are always doing what they are supposed to be doing, cutting costs as much as legally possible.

 

[Jackson]

Only an idiot would think the move to automation has anything to do with wages.

????? Are you for real?

 

[Jackson]

Only an idiot would think the move to automation has anything to do with wages.

What a fucking retard.

Do you really think they made a spur of the moment decision about this, or that they have been studying the possibility long enough to make a logical business plan? They are a big business. They don't do anything on a whim.

And increasing minimum wage was not done on a whim either. Fights have been going on in many states prompting businesses to address that issue.

 

[Jackson]

How is $15 per hour unsustainable or overpriced?

Because a Wendy's single burger isn't worth $12 to most Americans. A $15 an hour wage under current conditions will push them to that level. People will simple stop buying.

I do think that it should be a state decision but if the Feds need to set a bar than at least $10-$12. But $7.25 is a joke no matter where you are in the US. Companies like McDonalds have plenty of money to put towards their labor force. Nobody is going broke at the top.

So do you advocate the state (or feds) owning Wendy's directly?

Heaven forbid if the owners and execs of Wendy's have to lose a point out of their profit share. Prices wouldn't go to $12 a burger because they need to remain competitive im their market. Fast food companies like in and out have shown that they can run a successful business model while taking good care of their employees. We are the USA, we hold our country and businesses to higher standards which means we don't allow child labor, sweatshops or companies to pay their employees wages that keeps them under poverty level.

I'd think getting more people on a livable wage and off of welfare would be of interest to you.

And I would think that finishing school and developing a trade would be of interest to people who do not want to remain on the bottom rung of the wage earner ladder.

Fast food jobs are for kids just starting out or trying to pay for their first cars and paying for gas while living with mom and pop.

 

[Slade3200]

How is $15 per hour unsustainable or overpriced?

Because a Wendy's single burger isn't worth $12 to most Americans. A $15 an hour wage under current conditions will push them to that level. People will simple stop buying.

I do think that it should be a state decision but if the Feds need to set a bar than at least $10-$12. But $7.25 is a joke no matter where you are in the US. Companies like McDonalds have plenty of money to put towards their labor force. Nobody is going broke at the top.

So do you advocate the state (or feds) owning Wendy's directly?

Heaven forbid if the owners and execs of Wendy's have to lose a point out of their profit share. Prices wouldn't go to $12 a burger because they need to remain competitive im their market. Fast food companies like in and out have shown that they can run a successful business model while taking good care of their employees. We are the USA, we hold our country and businesses to higher standards which means we don't allow child labor, sweatshops or companies to pay their employees wages that keeps them under poverty level.

I'd think getting more people on a livable wage and off of welfare would be of interest to you.

And I would think that finishing school and developing a trade would be of interest to people who do not want to remain on the bottom rung of the wage earner ladder.

Fast food jobs are for kids just starting out or trying to pay for their first cars and paying for gas while living with mom and pop.

That's fine and dandy but only 50% of min wage workers are under 24. So until more jobs are available people are going to take whatever they can get. Nobody wants to be on the bottom rung but the reality is theres many people that are and theres no reason why they should be getting 7.25 and government assistance as a full time employee.

 

[Jackson]

How is $15 per hour unsustainable or overpriced?

Because a Wendy's single burger isn't worth $12 to most Americans. A $15 an hour wage under current conditions will push them to that level. People will simple stop buying.

I do think that it should be a state decision but if the Feds need to set a bar than at least $10-$12. But $7.25 is a joke no matter where you are in the US. Companies like McDonalds have plenty of money to put towards their labor force. Nobody is going broke at the top.

So do you advocate the state (or feds) owning Wendy's directly?

Heaven forbid if the owners and execs of Wendy's have to lose a point out of their profit share. Prices wouldn't go to $12 a burger because they need to remain competitive im their market. Fast food companies like in and out have shown that they can run a successful business model while taking good care of their employees. We are the USA, we hold our country and businesses to higher standards which means we don't allow child labor, sweatshops or companies to pay their employees wages that keeps them under poverty level.

I'd think getting more people on a livable wage and off of welfare would be of interest to you.

And I would think that finishing school and developing a trade would be of interest to people who do not want to remain on the bottom rung of the wage earner ladder.

Fast food jobs are for kids just starting out or trying to pay for their first cars and paying for gas while living with mom and pop.

That's fine and dandy but only 50% of min wage workers are under 24. So until more jobs are available people are going to take whatever they can get. Nobody wants to be on the bottom rung but the reality is theres many people that are and theres no reason why they should be getting 7.25 and government assistance as a full time employee.

I understand where you are coming from and we definitely need more jobs, especially those that can be a cornerstone to a lucrative career. So, first of all we have to get manufacturing back to the US and pay proper wages to skill of the employee. It doesn't make any difference the age of the employee, they didn't acquire a degree or certification of skills to warrant higher paying jobs. The bottom line is you make your own future...don't depend on government.

 

[Uncensored2008]

IF the number of workers at minimum wage is historically low, why would you care about a change? LOL partisans are so stupid.

How many people are under $11 an hour.

I care because of the deep impact it has on the purchasing power of those who make more than minimum. The reason your party is pushing this is to pull the ladder of success out from under those in the middle.

 

[Slade3200]

How is $15 per hour unsustainable or overpriced?

Because a Wendy's single burger isn't worth $12 to most Americans. A $15 an hour wage under current conditions will push them to that level. People will simple stop buying.

I do think that it should be a state decision but if the Feds need to set a bar than at least $10-$12. But $7.25 is a joke no matter where you are in the US. Companies like McDonalds have plenty of money to put towards their labor force. Nobody is going broke at the top.

So do you advocate the state (or feds) owning Wendy's directly?

Heaven forbid if the owners and execs of Wendy's have to lose a point out of their profit share. Prices wouldn't go to $12 a burger because they need to remain competitive im their market. Fast food companies like in and out have shown that they can run a successful business model while taking good care of their employees. We are the USA, we hold our country and businesses to higher standards which means we don't allow child labor, sweatshops or companies to pay their employees wages that keeps them under poverty level.

I'd think getting more people on a livable wage and off of welfare would be of interest to you.

And I would think that finishing school and developing a trade would be of interest to people who do not want to remain on the bottom rung of the wage earner ladder.

Fast food jobs are for kids just starting out or trying to pay for their first cars and paying for gas while living with mom and pop.

That's fine and dandy but only 50% of min wage workers are under 24. So until more jobs are available people are going to take whatever they can get. Nobody wants to be on the bottom rung but the reality is theres many people that are and theres no reason why they should be getting 7.25 and government assistance as a full time employee.

I understand where you are coming from and we definitely need more jobs, especially those that can be a cornerstone to a lucrative career. So, first of all we have to get manufacturing back to the US and pay proper wages to skill of the employee. It doesn't make any difference the age of the employee, they didn't acquire a degree or certification of skills to warrant higher paying jobs. The bottom line is you make your own future...don't depend on government.

I agree... We are in a very tough situation as we try to bring company's back to the US as that comes with an inflation of prices for our consumer goods. To be competitive in the market we would need to apply tariffs on cheap goods made over seas... This messes with free trade agreements and would effect exports. As prices go up wages would need to increase around the board which means more money needs to circulate in our economy. There are many different philosophies on how to make this happen (cut taxes and regulations)... Stimulus spend and incentivize private sector spending... Like I said there is a domino effect of issues that need to be addressed... One of those dominos is the minimum wage

 

[Slade3200]

IF the number of workers at minimum wage is historically low, why would you care about a change? LOL partisans are so stupid.

How many people are under $11 an hour.

I care because of the deep impact it has on the purchasing power of those who make more than minimum. The reason your party is pushing this is to pull the ladder of success out from under those in the middle.

No, thats not even close to the reason why... how can any rational human believe that suppressing the middle class is the motive behind raising the minimum wage?? I bet you also make the argument that Obama hates blacks and the poor. You are in imbecile who can't tell the different behind motive and presumptive effects. There is a disagreement on effects, why do you bring motive and intent into the discussion.

 

[Fair&Balanced]

IF the number of workers at minimum wage is historically low, why would you care about a change? LOL partisans are so stupid.

How many people are under $11 an hour.

I care because of the deep impact it has on the purchasing power of those who make more than minimum. The reason your party is pushing this is to pull the ladder of success out from under those in the middle.

My party? LOL I'm more conservative than you are idiot. And as such I understand that a higher minimum wage = less welfare to working poor.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Wow man, you are out of touch... Not sure if it's worth my time trying to counter argue with absurdity. You go on believing the entire goal of the left is to destroy the middle class cause we all just can't wait to be controlled by the big bad government... haha, that hamster spinning the wheel in your head must have a cramp.

How much is a dollar worth? In 1977, minimum wage was $2.50 an hour. Why are those making $7.25 not living in luxury? If simply increasing the dollars works, why do people not drive BMW's?

Perhaps it has something to do with what a dollar is worth, and the idea that value is not created by fiat currency?

Leftism is predicated on abject ignorance of economic principle.

 

[Fair&Balanced]

Wow man, you are out of touch... Not sure if it's worth my time trying to counter argue with absurdity. You go on believing the entire goal of the left is to destroy the middle class cause we all just can't wait to be controlled by the big bad government... haha, that hamster spinning the wheel in your head must have a cramp.

How much is a dollar worth? In 1977, minimum wage was $2.50 an hour. Why are those making $7.25 not living in luxury? If simply increasing the dollars works, why do people not drive BMW's?

Perhaps it has something to do with what a dollar is worth, and the idea that value is not created by fiat currency?

Leftism is predicated on abject ignorance of economic principle.

In terms of real dollars (that means adjusted for inflation) the minimum wage in 1977 was $9.62 an hour.

Thanks for playing.

 

[Slade3200]

IF the number of workers at minimum wage is historically low, why would you care about a change? LOL partisans are so stupid.

How many people are under $11 an hour.

I care because of the deep impact it has on the purchasing power of those who make more than minimum. The reason your party is pushing this is to pull the ladder of success out from under those in the middle.

My party? LOL I'm more conservative than you are idiot. And as such I understand that a higher minimum wage = less welfare to working poor.

In the few discussions i've had with Fair&Balanced, i've seen him lean very much on the conservative side. I haven't agreed with everything he says, as I lean more on the progressive side, but I do give him credit for not playing the petty partisan games and he takes each issue at face value... Gotta respect that.
The mindless partisan talking point parrots out there are predictable and boring...

 

[Uncensored2008]

No, thats not even close to the reason why...

In fact it is the reason. That it isn't what the hate sites told you is irrelevant.

how can any rational human believe that suppressing the middle class is the motive behind raising the minimum wage??

By having a basic grasp of economic principles.

I bet you also make the argument that Obama hates blacks and the poor. You are in imbecile who can't tell the different behind motive and presumptive effects. There is a disagreement on effects, why do you bring motive and intent into the discussion.

No, but I can make the argument that you never made it past high school for your education.

 

[Slade3200]

Wow man, you are out of touch... Not sure if it's worth my time trying to counter argue with absurdity. You go on believing the entire goal of the left is to destroy the middle class cause we all just can't wait to be controlled by the big bad government... haha, that hamster spinning the wheel in your head must have a cramp.

How much is a dollar worth? In 1977, minimum wage was $2.50 an hour. Why are those making $7.25 not living in luxury? If simply increasing the dollars works, why do people not drive BMW's?

Perhaps it has something to do with what a dollar is worth, and the idea that value is not created by fiat currency?

Leftism is predicated on abject ignorance of economic principle.

I love it when people making ignorant statements call others ignorant... Appreciation and inflation are part of our economy. You may not agree with our fiat currency system but it's a reality. If you really don't understand why a dollar isn't worth the same now as it was in 1977 then you need to hit the books and educate yourself.

 

[Slade3200]

No, but I can make the argument that you never made it past high school for your education.

Yes, please make that argument and it will fall inline with the rest of your arguments... Baseless and completely inaccurate

 

[Fair&Balanced]

IF the number of workers at minimum wage is historically low, why would you care about a change? LOL partisans are so stupid.

How many people are under $11 an hour.

I care because of the deep impact it has on the purchasing power of those who make more than minimum. The reason your party is pushing this is to pull the ladder of success out from under those in the middle.

My party? LOL I'm more conservative than you are idiot. And as such I understand that a higher minimum wage = less welfare to working poor.

In the few discussions i've had with Fair&Balanced, i've seen him lean very much on the conservative side. I haven't agreed with everything he says, as I lean more on the progressive side, but I do give him credit for not playing the petty partisan games and he takes each issue at face value... Gotta respect that.
The mindless partisan talking point parrots out there are predictable and boring...

I am conservative. I believe that in every instance possible we should keep the government out of our lives. I just also happen to recognize that obviously government does have a legitimate , albeit limited, purpose.

And I do take every issue on face value, it isn't ever simply a matter of "conservatives are always right" or "liberals are always right" People like me , who believe that we all have rights but those rights end where others begin, we're the ones who are always right. Used to be we were the majority, obviously now we are the minority.