GOP RESOLUTION: OBAMACARE AS A VIOLATION OF THE 13th AMENDMENT

[g5000]

Another example comes to mind which would have to qualify as "slavery" if we bought into the OP argument: Public education. Childless couples having to pay property taxes to pay for schools. That would have to be considered "slavery", too.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

Regardless, taxes are not theft. Without representation, they're theft. Their only alternative being a place with no Government - is laughable.

Law enforcement comes to mind.

it is theft regardless. it is the practice of taking another individuals property by force. Your only fallback is to claim they voted for it.

That's not a "fallback". It is the very basis of a constitutional republic.

Yes, i realize that all forms of government are based off from the monopoly on the use of violence to exact control over subjects. Whether it be a constitutional republic, or a pure dictatorship. Both use compulsory demands for property.

The Encyclopedia Britannica defines taxation as "that part of the revenues of a state which is obtained by the compulsory dues and charges upon its subjects."

You really do not have a lot of room to argue that it's not theft. By its very definition it is compulsory.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

Another example comes to mind which would have to qualify as "slavery" if we bought into the OP argument: Public education. Childless couples having to pay property taxes to pay for schools. That would have to be considered "slavery", too.

It is.

 

[g5000]

it is not your property when the very entity of which you are paying taxes allows for you to have made the $ in the first place

Nonsense. So you're saying that no production commenced until government came along and allowed it?

No, tard.

I'm saying that the Government issued the currency to begin with.

The currency or other property I possess were acquired through my labors. The currency is just a vehicle of convenience for moving wealth around without having to carry sacks of gold. Taxes are an acquisition of the fruits of my labor. The government did not issue the currency to me. I earned it. Worked for it. It is mine.

The government also taxes my property. My house and other things I posses. I do not give the government a few roof tiles, now do I? Nevertheless, I am surrending a portion of the value of my property when I pay taxes on it.

 

[bendog]

And avatar neg repped me for laughing at this shite. LOL

 

[g5000]

Another example comes to mind which would have to qualify as "slavery" if we bought into the OP argument: Public education. Childless couples having to pay property taxes to pay for schools. That would have to be considered "slavery", too.

It is.

No, it is a social contract. Completely different from slavery.

 

[Jarhead]

Another example comes to mind which would have to qualify as "slavery" if we bought into the OP argument: Public education. Childless couples having to pay property taxes to pay for schools. That would have to be considered "slavery", too.

No.

Property taxes used to pay for schools has a positive affect on the value of ones property; whether they have children or not.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

it is not your property when the very entity of which you are paying taxes allows for you to have made the $ in the first place

Nonsense. So you're saying that no production commenced until government came along and allowed it?

No, tard.

I'm saying that the Government issued the currency to begin with.

The world cannot run on finite resources, or don't you understand?

Like I said - go live without government. I'll be there in a few minutes with a tank and a missile launcher breaking no laws in your lawless land and take everything you own? Or................no one would dare do that eh?

The government DEMANDS that their currency be used exclusively for the theft. People didn't choose the FRN as a base for the storage of wealth or transaction. It was forced upon the people. Another form of slavery - economic slavery.

Defined when - a condition that a person finds themselves in when the totality of their wages only allows them to pay the interest payments on their accumulated debt.

Think about that. Your government,l who forced you to use the currency created by a legislated banking cartel, has run up a 17 trillion and counting debt. A debt that has saddled each individual, at birth, with a burden they never voted for, never participated in at all, and are expected to pitch in on. That's slavery.

 

[g5000]

I am free to give my money to an association which will amplify my voice in opposition to ObamaCare if I wish. I am free to even publish my own diatribes, periodicals, blogs, YouTube videos and the like to give voice to my opposition to ObamaCare. I am free to lobby my representatives to oppose ObamaCare.

I can vote. I can choose politicians who oppose ObamaCare.

If I believe something is unconstitutional, I can take it to our judiciary branch.

Not one of these avenues are available to slaves.

 

[Jarhead]

Regardless, taxes are not theft. Without representation, they're theft. Their only alternative being a place with no Government - is laughable.

Law enforcement comes to mind.

it is theft regardless. it is the practice of taking another individuals property by force. Your only fallback is to claim they voted for it. Even if they did not. At which point you tell them "too fuckin' bad. Someone else voted for it."

It's just authoritarian Statist nonsense to claim taxation isn't theft.

it is not your property when the very entity of which you are paying taxes allows for you to have made the $ in the first place

wow.

 

[g5000]

Nonsense. So you're saying that no production commenced until government came along and allowed it?

No, tard.

I'm saying that the Government issued the currency to begin with.

The world cannot run on finite resources, or don't you understand?

Like I said - go live without government. I'll be there in a few minutes with a tank and a missile launcher breaking no laws in your lawless land and take everything you own? Or................no one would dare do that eh?

The government DEMANDS that their currency be used exclusively for the theft. People didn't choose the FRN as a base for the storage of wealth or transaction. It was forced upon the people. Another form of slavery - economic slavery.

Defined when - a condition that a person finds themselves in when the totality of their wages only allows them to pay the interest payments on their accumulated debt.

Think about that. Your government,l who forced you to use the currency created by a legislated banking cartel, has run up a 17 trillion and counting debt. A debt that has saddled each individual, at birth, with a burden they never voted for, never participated in at all, and are expected to pitch in on. That's slavery.

The American people most certainly did vote for a $17 trillion debt. They demanded it.

"Gimme, gimme, gimme." I have frequently spoken of this. Americans demand no end of gifts from their government and expect someone else to pay for them.

That $17 trillion was spent on mortgage interest deductions, farm subsidies, defense, food stamps, Pell grants, child tax credits, equipment depreciation deductions, employer-sponsored health insurance tax exemptions, roads and bridges, Medicaid, and a zillion other such things.

All of it voted upon and approved by the American people.

I don't even hear very many right wingers demanding the government stop giving them the gifts they receive. "Gimme gimme gimme, and make that guy over there pay for it, and blame those people over there for the debt."

 

[Jarhead]

Nonsense. So you're saying that no production commenced until government came along and allowed it?

No, tard.

I'm saying that the Government issued the currency to begin with.

The world cannot run on finite resources, or don't you understand?

Like I said - go live without government. I'll be there in a few minutes with a tank and a missile launcher breaking no laws in your lawless land and take everything you own? Or................no one would dare do that eh?

The government DEMANDS that their currency be used exclusively for the theft. People didn't choose the FRN as a base for the storage of wealth or transaction. It was forced upon the people. Another form of slavery - economic slavery.

Defined when - a condition that a person finds themselves in when the totality of their wages only allows them to pay the interest payments on their accumulated debt.

Think about that. Your government,l who forced you to use the currency created by a legislated banking cartel, has run up a 17 trillion and counting debt. A debt that has saddled each individual, at birth, with a burden they never voted for, never participated in at all, and are expected to pitch in on. That's slavery.

But it is not the government that has brought them into slavery.

It was a decision made by the parents when they decided to conceive.

 

[rightwinger]

No, tard.

I'm saying that the Government issued the currency to begin with.

The world cannot run on finite resources, or don't you understand?

Like I said - go live without government. I'll be there in a few minutes with a tank and a missile launcher breaking no laws in your lawless land and take everything you own? Or................no one would dare do that eh?

The government DEMANDS that their currency be used exclusively for the theft. People didn't choose the FRN as a base for the storage of wealth or transaction. It was forced upon the people. Another form of slavery - economic slavery.

Defined when - a condition that a person finds themselves in when the totality of their wages only allows them to pay the interest payments on their accumulated debt.

Think about that. Your government,l who forced you to use the currency created by a legislated banking cartel, has run up a 17 trillion and counting debt. A debt that has saddled each individual, at birth, with a burden they never voted for, never participated in at all, and are expected to pitch in on. That's slavery.

The American people most certainly did vote for a $17 trillion debt. They demanded it.

"Gimme, gimme, gimme." I have frequently spoken of this. Americans demand no end of gifts from their government and expect someone else to pay for them.

That $17 trillion was spent on mortgage interest deductions, farm subsidies, defense, food stamps, Pell grants, child tax credits, equipment depreciation deductions, employer-sponsored health insurance tax exemptions, roads and bridges, Medicaid, and a zillion other such things.

All of it voted upon and approved by the American people.

I don't even hear very many right wingers demanding the government stop giving them the gifts they receive. "Gimme gimme gimme, and make that guy over there pay for it, and blame those people over there for the debt."

Our debt is a direct result of the selfishness and lazyness of the American people

They want low taxes and benefit after benefit

Their elected representatives give it to them

 

[g5000]

A trillion dollar government medical entitlement program rammed through Congress and down the throats of the American people.

Oh, wait. We're not talking about the GOP's Medicare Part D?


Sorry about that!

 

[Jarhead]

No, tard.

I'm saying that the Government issued the currency to begin with.

The world cannot run on finite resources, or don't you understand?

Like I said - go live without government. I'll be there in a few minutes with a tank and a missile launcher breaking no laws in your lawless land and take everything you own? Or................no one would dare do that eh?

The government DEMANDS that their currency be used exclusively for the theft. People didn't choose the FRN as a base for the storage of wealth or transaction. It was forced upon the people. Another form of slavery - economic slavery.

Defined when - a condition that a person finds themselves in when the totality of their wages only allows them to pay the interest payments on their accumulated debt.

Think about that. Your government,l who forced you to use the currency created by a legislated banking cartel, has run up a 17 trillion and counting debt. A debt that has saddled each individual, at birth, with a burden they never voted for, never participated in at all, and are expected to pitch in on. That's slavery.

The American people most certainly did vote for a $17 trillion debt. They demanded it.

"Gimme, gimme, gimme." I have frequently spoken of this. Americans demand no end of gifts from their government and expect someone else to pay for them.

That $17 trillion was spent on mortgage interest deductions, farm subsidies, defense, food stamps, Pell grants, child tax credits, equipment depreciation deductions, employer-sponsored health insurance tax exemptions, roads and bridges, Medicaid, and a zillion other such things.

All of it voted upon and approved by the American people.

I don't even hear very many right wingers demanding the government stop giving them the gifts they receive. "Gimme gimme gimme, and make that guy over there pay for it, and blame those people over there for the debt."

excuse me...

Deductions such as mortgage interest, real estate tax, equipment depreciation....are incentives. Not gifts. You do not get them unless you do something; or attempt something that has a positive affect on the economy.

You need to think before you speak.

 

[g5000]

Our debt is a direct result of the selfishness and lazyness of the American people

They want low taxes and benefit after benefit

Their elected representatives give it to them

Amen. Our politicians are spineless crowd pleasers who are expert at giving us exactly what we ask for.

Low taxes vs benefit. We can have one or the other, but not both.

If the American people want low taxes, simply ban all tax expenditures, raise the retirement age to 70 and index it to 9 percent of the population, and cut defense spending.

If they can't handle that, they should shut the fuck up about the debt.

Simple.

 

[emilynghiem]

I noticed the 13th Amendment, as cited above,
clarifies "slavery" SEPARATELY from "involuntary servitude"
which the author of the RESOLUTION defined further by state law.

Damn

And I thought Republicans had played all their repeal Obamacare cards

But equating it to slavery is just getting ridiculous

You may not be the type of liberal who actually invests your own salary and labor
into what you believe, as I do. So maybe that is why you and I have different perceptions.

I have been using my OWN labor (working two jobs) to fund community expenses of local volunteers and nonprofits trying to preserve a FREED SLAVE district, also using their OWN labor. Even when I was paying expenses of volunteers in exchange for their help (so they wouldn't feel like slaves), complained they felt like slaves anyway because so much work was needed to restore the neighborhood, we couldn't do it all. So what does that make me who was working and donating MY labor and salary to pay THEIR costs? If they STILL felt like slaves, then certainly I've been enslaved, too, if I was paying them at my own expense!

I only agreed to invest my OWN LABOR into restitution for govt abuses destroying the national history in our neighborhood, in order to WORK for independence from abusive govt. I did NOT consent for my "servitude" to be ABUSED to FUND MORE ABUSIVE GOVT.

So of course I am against ACA or any other govt requirements to pay MORE MONEY
on top of what I am already paying to fix govt messes.

You may not relate "slavery" to the co-opting of my own labor and salary to pay back the community for damages done by govt abuses not yet recognized much less corrected.

But if people are paying up to 40% in taxes to govt (and only retaining 60% of the benefits from their labor), how is THAT different from being 3/5 free and "2/5 slave?"

Any "taxation without representation" (or co-opting of labor or portion of our salaries under terms we don't consent to as with ACA and business contracts with private insurance) is "involuntary servitude" where the govt continues to abuse people like me against our will.

With me, it is only "voluntary" if it leads to corrections to PAY BACK THE DEBTS AND DAMAGES. So I do NOT agree to paying MORE into ENABLING abusive governmen to continue! The point for me is to CORRECT the problems, and act as an example of RESTITUTION to set up a model program for government to follow to STOP ABUSES.

People should be FREE to invest their labor, time and resources as we WISH.
We should NOT be forced to invest it in govt programs we don't consent to be under.

And in my case, in my community, I and others have had to work to pay costs of restoring community programs after evictions/demolitions were abused CONTINUALLY to disrupt and deny "inalienable" rights of the community to assemble, to petition for redress of grievances, and to pursue and develop preservation plans.

You and I can debate how much of this "service to the community" was "voluntary" or "involuntary" because of course I would much rather have had these "INALIENABLE" rights respected in the first place. Not destroyed, where volunteers like me have to work
two jobs to pay costs to try to restore and rebuild community programs, that every level of govt has been abused to oppress, censor and shut down these programs.

 

[Jarhead]

Our debt is a direct result of the selfishness and lazyness of the American people

They want low taxes and benefit after benefit

Their elected representatives give it to them

Amen. Our politicians are spineless crowd pleasers who are expert at giving us exactly what we ask for.

Low taxes vs benefit. We can have one or the other, but not both.

If the American people want low taxes, simply ban all tax expenditures, raise the retirement age to 70 and index it to 9 percent of the population, and cut defense spending.

If they can't handle that, they should shut the fuck up about the debt.

Simple.

the estimated cost to close Gitmo is 80 million dollars.

80 million dollars to shut the lights, lock the doors and transfer 200 prisoners.

Seems waste is one of our biggest issues.

 

[g5000]

But if people are paying up to 40% in taxes to govt (and only retaining 60% of the benefits from their labor), how is THAT different from being 3/5 free and "2/5 slave?"

Any "taxation without representation" (or co-opting of labor or portion of our salaries under terms we don't consent to as with ACA and business contracts with private insurance) is "involuntary servitude" where the govt continues to abuse people like me against our will.

You have representation. Did you not know this? Sadly for you, your fellow citizens just can't get enough government tit. They demand more and more milk.

You are collectively able to change the ratio of taxation and benefits any time you please.

Therefore, not slaves.



Sorry. I know it is trendy to whine and feel like a victim for a lot of people these days, but the awful hardships of your life just don't bring enough soul to the table to sing the blues.

 

[Contumacious]

Damn

And I thought Republicans had played all their repeal Obamacare cards

But equating it to slavery is just getting ridiculous

1slave
noun \ˈslāv\

: someone who is legally owned by another person and is forced to work for that person without pay

: a person who is strongly influenced and controlled by something

.