Green New Deal

[easyt65]

No taxation or wealth redistribution schemes? So, they gave up on that idea? .

 

[RealDave]

In 10 years....

Upgrade or rebuild EVERY BUILDING IN THE UNITED STATES.

100% abandonment of fossil fuels (oil, coal, natural gas) and fossil fuel product

100% abandonment of nuclear energy

100% reliance on alternate energy forms that produces 11% of the energy we now use

High speed Rail / Inter-continental high speed rail

Dependence on Technology that does not exist yet

100% unionized workers building and doing all of this

No taxation or wealth redistribution schemes?

So, they gave up on that idea?

.

You don't like the Republicans wealth redistribution efforts?

 

[iceberg]

folks round here in Indiana think global warming is a HOAX!

You ekected Mike Pence. Not surprised

man, i've not ekected anyone since 1983.

didn't know that was still a thing.

 

[RealDave]

WTF? Franco...were you dropped on your head recently?

Are you trying to say you DIDN'T want Hillary to win, that you DIDN'T want Single Payer, that you DIDN'T want Kavanaugh to be stopped, that you DIDN'T want Trump to be stopped...

NOW LOOK WHO'S LYING.....

Hillary was not a criminal, just total garbage propaganda. You need three doctors to say the baby is unviable or will kill the mother ....duh. everything you know is wrong

I like your passion but for what it is worth... you need to stop chasing those white rabbits they toss out and stick to the green economy. They’re distracting you with bullshit because they have nothing to refute the green deal beyond platitudes and whatever crap they dig out of Rush’s ass.

Platitudes? Have you read the bill? It's basically a list of platitudes.

and you don't believe in global warming so your opinion, actually brainwashed garbage, makes your opinion worthless.

Some of us prefer to look at the actual science behind claims as opposed to sheepishly getting in line at the slaughter house.

No denier has looked at the science.

 

[iceberg]

Hillary was not a criminal, just total garbage propaganda. You need three doctors to say the baby is unviable or will kill the mother ....duh. everything you know is wrong

I like your passion but for what it is worth... you need to stop chasing those white rabbits they toss out and stick to the green economy. They’re distracting you with bullshit because they have nothing to refute the green deal beyond platitudes and whatever crap they dig out of Rush’s ass.

Platitudes? Have you read the bill? It's basically a list of platitudes.

and you don't believe in global warming so your opinion, actually brainwashed garbage, makes your opinion worthless.

Some of us prefer to look at the actual science behind claims as opposed to sheepishly getting in line at the slaughter house.

No denier has looked at the science.

i am. i have.

next bit-o-bullshit?

 

[RealDave]

I like your passion but for what it is worth... you need to stop chasing those white rabbits they toss out and stick to the green economy. They’re distracting you with bullshit because they have nothing to refute the green deal beyond platitudes and whatever crap they dig out of Rush’s ass.

Platitudes? Have you read the bill? It's basically a list of platitudes.

and you don't believe in global warming so your opinion, actually brainwashed garbage, makes your opinion worthless.

Some of us prefer to look at the actual science behind claims as opposed to sheepishly getting in line at the slaughter house.

the lying scumbag GOP and it's silly dupes are the only political party and people in the world who deny global warming at this point. Great job! Everything you know is garbage propaganda and a disgrace, super dupers.

You moron, even the IPCC has given up on the term "global warming". It's now "climate change". You could at least keep up on your own propaganda.

Global Warming us a form of climate change.

This way, we don't hsave to put up with every one of you dumbasses having a freak out on cold days.

 

[RealDave]

I like your passion but for what it is worth... you need to stop chasing those white rabbits they toss out and stick to the green economy. They’re distracting you with bullshit because they have nothing to refute the green deal beyond platitudes and whatever crap they dig out of Rush’s ass.

Platitudes? Have you read the bill? It's basically a list of platitudes.

and you don't believe in global warming so your opinion, actually brainwashed garbage, makes your opinion worthless.

Some of us prefer to look at the actual science behind claims as opposed to sheepishly getting in line at the slaughter house.

No denier has looked at the science.

i am. i have.

next bit-o-bullshit?

So you looked & couldn't understand it?

AHG deniers are dumber than shit.

 

[RealDave]

folks round here in Indiana think global warming is a HOAX!

climate change happens, regardless.

what is your opinion of upgrading some existing underground cities for modern times?

The total dupes of the GOP propaganda machine, anyway.... The only people in the world who don't believe in global warming at this point...

the Science of Astronomy, gainsays their opinion. Ice Ages are cyclial and related to Earth's tilt toward the sun.

WOW, You better phone the climatolists & tell them because I am sure they don't know about the planets history or that the Earth has a tilt.

Thank you for being soooooooo smart.

 

[baileyn45]

Hillary was not a criminal, just total garbage propaganda. You need three doctors to say the baby is unviable or will kill the mother ....duh. everything you know is wrong

I like your passion but for what it is worth... you need to stop chasing those white rabbits they toss out and stick to the green economy. They’re distracting you with bullshit because they have nothing to refute the green deal beyond platitudes and whatever crap they dig out of Rush’s ass.

Platitudes? Have you read the bill? It's basically a list of platitudes.

and you don't believe in global warming so your opinion, actually brainwashed garbage, makes your opinion worthless.

Some of us prefer to look at the actual science behind claims as opposed to sheepishly getting in line at the slaughter house.

No denier has looked at the science.

The simple fact that you use the term "denier", speaks volumes.A more apt term would be skeptic. Any scientist that isn't skeptical has no place in science.

 

[RealDave]

If you are going to be rude enough to but into others conversations

Yes. This is a forum. Therefore I butt in.

Franco's exact words were that the GOP and conservatives are 'the only political party and people in the world who deny global warming at this point'.

I know what Franco said. You want to toss out white rabbits for others to chase.

I’m asking you, do you believe in global warming. Yes? No?

That is the root of this thread and conversation no? Why have a new green deal? Because of global warming.

Now you either believe in global warming or you don’t. Whether the GOP and conservatives are the ONLY ones to not believe in global warming is not germane to the central question, that being does global warming exist.

And I’m asking you does global warming exist?

i believe our climate does change.
i believe our continents drift and change
i believe at one time the arctic was green and pleasant.
> i don't believe we were there to make it freeze
i believe we should at all times keep our environment in mind for now and into the future.
i believe in clean water and air for everyone
i believe if we try to mess with shit we don't understand we WILL harm our environment by trying to fix it in a forced nature
i believe al gore is full of shit
i believe dicaprio needs to do more than tell others to do what he says. he should
i believe all environmentalists should. many do but the ones who flaunt it - live it
i believe our environment has been changing since it began
i believe our environment will keep changing long after we're gone
i believe we should clean up after ourselves and start in the oceans and quit using it for dumping grounds

i don't believe we have the impact over it that the fanatical left says we do
i don't believe keeping cows from farting will have a positive impact. least of all on the cow.
> i do believe it would be a comic effort watching the left try that would leave PETA at a loss for what to do
i don't believe we should try and alter an environment we don't fully understand
i don't believe we're going to get anywhere positive in yet another 10 years because the left keeps demanding panic type attention
i don't believe the right will respond positively to that. i know i don't.
i don't believe anyone who suggests 10 years is enough to get anything positive done knows what they are talking about.

So, you believe that the crap we have been spewing into the atmosphere has had no effect on CO2 levels?

 

[RealDave]

I like your passion but for what it is worth... you need to stop chasing those white rabbits they toss out and stick to the green economy. They’re distracting you with bullshit because they have nothing to refute the green deal beyond platitudes and whatever crap they dig out of Rush’s ass.

Platitudes? Have you read the bill? It's basically a list of platitudes.

and you don't believe in global warming so your opinion, actually brainwashed garbage, makes your opinion worthless.

Some of us prefer to look at the actual science behind claims as opposed to sheepishly getting in line at the slaughter house.

No denier has looked at the science.

The simple fact that you use the term "denier", speaks volumes.A more apt term would be skeptic. Any scientist that isn't skeptical has no place in science.

The science is clear. You deny what it says.

 

[baileyn45]

Platitudes? Have you read the bill? It's basically a list of platitudes.

and you don't believe in global warming so your opinion, actually brainwashed garbage, makes your opinion worthless.

Some of us prefer to look at the actual science behind claims as opposed to sheepishly getting in line at the slaughter house.

the lying scumbag GOP and it's silly dupes are the only political party and people in the world who deny global warming at this point. Great job! Everything you know is garbage propaganda and a disgrace, super dupers.

You moron, even the IPCC has given up on the term "global warming". It's now "climate change". You could at least keep up on your own propaganda.

Global Warming us a form of climate change.

This way, we don't hsave to put up with every one of you dumbasses having a freak out on cold days.

Here's a challenge. Give a link or a suggestion as to where I can find solid evidence that human released GHGs are the primary driver of climate change. No opinion, I want scientific evidence.

 

[iceberg]

Platitudes? Have you read the bill? It's basically a list of platitudes.

and you don't believe in global warming so your opinion, actually brainwashed garbage, makes your opinion worthless.

Some of us prefer to look at the actual science behind claims as opposed to sheepishly getting in line at the slaughter house.

No denier has looked at the science.

i am. i have.

next bit-o-bullshit?

So you looked & couldn't understand it?

AHG deniers are dumber than shit.

moving the goal posts i see.

 

[baileyn45]

Platitudes? Have you read the bill? It's basically a list of platitudes.

and you don't believe in global warming so your opinion, actually brainwashed garbage, makes your opinion worthless.

Some of us prefer to look at the actual science behind claims as opposed to sheepishly getting in line at the slaughter house.

No denier has looked at the science.

The simple fact that you use the term "denier", speaks volumes.A more apt term would be skeptic. Any scientist that isn't skeptical has no place in science.

The science is clear. You deny what it says.

Nonsense.You keep making this claim and yet no one, NO ONE, can supply us with clear evidence that man made GHGs are the primary driver of climate change.

 

[iceberg]

If you are going to be rude enough to but into others conversations

Yes. This is a forum. Therefore I butt in.

Franco's exact words were that the GOP and conservatives are 'the only political party and people in the world who deny global warming at this point'.

I know what Franco said. You want to toss out white rabbits for others to chase.

I’m asking you, do you believe in global warming. Yes? No?

That is the root of this thread and conversation no? Why have a new green deal? Because of global warming.

Now you either believe in global warming or you don’t. Whether the GOP and conservatives are the ONLY ones to not believe in global warming is not germane to the central question, that being does global warming exist.

And I’m asking you does global warming exist?

i believe our climate does change.
i believe our continents drift and change
i believe at one time the arctic was green and pleasant.
> i don't believe we were there to make it freeze
i believe we should at all times keep our environment in mind for now and into the future.
i believe in clean water and air for everyone
i believe if we try to mess with shit we don't understand we WILL harm our environment by trying to fix it in a forced nature
i believe al gore is full of shit
i believe dicaprio needs to do more than tell others to do what he says. he should
i believe all environmentalists should. many do but the ones who flaunt it - live it
i believe our environment has been changing since it began
i believe our environment will keep changing long after we're gone
i believe we should clean up after ourselves and start in the oceans and quit using it for dumping grounds

i don't believe we have the impact over it that the fanatical left says we do
i don't believe keeping cows from farting will have a positive impact. least of all on the cow.
> i do believe it would be a comic effort watching the left try that would leave PETA at a loss for what to do
i don't believe we should try and alter an environment we don't fully understand
i don't believe we're going to get anywhere positive in yet another 10 years because the left keeps demanding panic type attention
i don't believe the right will respond positively to that. i know i don't.
i don't believe anyone who suggests 10 years is enough to get anything positive done knows what they are talking about.

So, you believe that the crap we have been spewing into the atmosphere has had no effect on CO2 levels?

never said anything about that did i?

why must you project your assholioness onto others?

 

[Flopper]

Let me explain it too you in GW Bush speak so you understand.

Rich billionaire makes 100 million a year doing whatever.

The little ole socialist in me comes along and snatches say 3/4 of it, i’ll make the math simple so as not confound you.

Billionaire is left with 25 million. Is he going to suffer?

I don’t think so.

Now I take that 75 million and start investing and or subsidizing, renewable energy and our electrical infrastructure, Fission energy development etc.

We start training Joe six-pack to work on this 21st century renewable energy infrastructure. Employment goes up, wages go up and as a result that people are making more money.... they’re spending more money.

Is this good for the economy? Yes it is.

Is this good for the billionaire? I don’t see how it’s not. If the economy is going up and people have more money to spend he can’t BUT HELP make money lest he’s an idiot like Trump.

We can build a green economy for the 21st century. It’s not socialism. It’s just common sense. We just move money we’re spending on old polluting technologies and move it to the green side.

A simple first step?

Institute a carbon tax.

And then raise taxes on the wealthy. They’re not going to miss it and they’ll get it back on the back side of our new economy.

People who make money are not solely in it for the money. Money is just a measure of success.

So you invest all your hard earned money, spend a lifetime creating your product or service, and now you make 10 million a year.

You say the federal government should take 7 million a year. Now what about state and local? That's easily another 15% So now you make 10 million a year, and you end up with 85% of your money confiscated by various governments. Out of that 10 million, you only get 1.5 million depending on your local and state tax rate.

So the question that comes to mind is, was it worth taking all those risks, working all those hours, traveling all over the country or even the world, only to have government take almost all of your money? Would you even go to work tomorrow if you knew you are only going to get 15% of what you earned?

The link I provided earlier explains it best. The wealthy cannot support this country and spending yet alone add trillions more in free college, global warming, and Medicare for all. Read it! The rich have no ability to support all that.

If the federal tax rate were 0%, the federal government would collect 0 dollars. If the federal tax rate were 100%, the federal government would still collect 0 dollars because who would be stupid enough to create wealth?

"Just how much is YOUR fair share of what somebody else worked for?"
Thomas Sowell

What makes you think taxing them at 70% is going to make them a failure.... when they’re going to make the money back on the back side of a new green economy! AS I’VE ALREADY EXPLAINED!

Do you not think that would also be a measure of success? The wealthy are NOT GOING TO LOSE OUT ON THIS!

All I’m hearing from you Trumpies is rationalizing doing nothing.

And I’ve already told you.... doing nothing is not an option.

WE DON’T HAVE THAT LUXURY.... ANY MORE TO SET AROUND WITH OUR THUMBS UP OUR ASS!

Global warming IS HAPPENING. It is the existential threat OF OUR TIME AND GENERATION. And we BY GOD have to meet this head on and DO WHATEVER IT TAKES to address this.

If it means throwing some billionaires and millionaires on the sacrificial TAX THEIR ASS ALTAR...... then SO BE IT!

If you have a better plan then spill it! Otherwise.... it’s AOC time.

But make no mistake....... one way or the other..... this is going to happen.

Your problem is you are brainwashed. You believe more in this climate change thing than God himself. You really think that a planet that's possibly hundreds of millions years old can rely on temperature changes that took place the past couple hundreds of years, and say that those changes are indicative of something.

Let me ask: how many factories were there at the end of the ice age? How many cars were around at that time?

If green anything were able to produce the jobs, the energy, the results you think, private industry would have capitalized on it decades ago. You wouldn't need government promoting or subsidizing it. But the facts are that we are not going to put our country in such a hole that it can't ever dig out because of you (and your ilk) beliefs.

So tell me, how many windmills do you have on your property? How many times a year do you use mass transit? How many times do you use your electric car? I would be willing to bet you don't participate in any of those things. Instead, you want government to force everybody else to.

I think what you don't realize is that a very small change in the average temperature of the earth by only a few degrees Celsius can create major changes in the environment. It has risen only about 4 degrees in the last million years but .7 degree in less than a century. For example, just a few degrees average rise in the sea temperature would eradicate thousands of species including oysters, crab, and coral which in turn would disrupt the food supply for a host of small creatures which are the food source for many of fish that humans and other creatures depend on.

The huge cost of dealing with climate change is nothing compared to the cost of doing nothing.

I guess that depends on who you ask.

Nocookies

2018 was the fourth-warmest year on record behind 2016, 2015 and 2017. Even more concerning, the World Methodological Organization predicts a 5- to 9-degree temperature rise by the end of the century.
A picture is worth a thousand words.

 

[danielpalos]

folks round here in Indiana think global warming is a HOAX!

climate change happens, regardless.

what is your opinion of upgrading some existing underground cities for modern times?

The total dupes of the GOP propaganda machine, anyway.... The only people in the world who don't believe in global warming at this point...

the Science of Astronomy, gainsays their opinion. Ice Ages are cyclial and related to Earth's tilt toward the sun.

WOW, You better phone the climatolists & tell them because I am sure they don't know about the planets history or that the Earth has a tilt.

Thank you for being soooooooo smart.

The point is, Climate Change happens, Regardless. Why not develop better technologies at lower cost to better cope with it.

 

[Flopper]

Trains are electric so that is where it ended up..

DERP

No stupid, some subway systems are electric, virtually ALL trains are diesel. Hybrid technology started in trains, using 2000 HP Rolls Royce diesels to run generators to drive electric motors on passenger trains is where it all started. But they are still diesel.

That is why there is a move to electrify the rail system. The only thing standing in the way is capitalist who do not want change but they die and things change anyway.

You didn't claim "a move" by a group of enviro wackos, you made the statement that "trains are electric." They are not.

So what some are electric and some are not. Electric motors have a usde you people think everything should be internal combustion driven yet that is not the state of the world.

The point is that electric motors have a VERY LIMITED use, because the technology is nowhere near advanced enough to let it go any further, and certainly not to let it replace more traditional engines in ten years.

Very limited?
It's a 122 billion dollar market growing at 6.5% rate per year. It doesn't sound very limited to me.

 

[Flopper]

Yes electric cars are coming…..but not everyone will have one in tens yrs,,,,not possible...……
now how are you going to charge them when she shuts off the electricity

No one is shutting off the electricity.,

But there is wind & solar

neither of which can meet our demands of today. while we should continue to develop and subsidize these industries for future energy needs, it's fucking idiotic to say GET OFF THEM IN 10 YEARS!!!

but then just about everything in her plan was idiotic.

I guess we are still discussing the new green deal bill since it's suppose to be the subject of this thread. The bill sets a goal of being off fossil fuels by 2050 which became 30 years, then 20 years, now 10 years on this thread. Maybe this is why big oil is investing billions into renewable energy.
Big Oil Is Investing Billions in Renewable Energy. Here's Where and How. -- The Motley Fool

 

[Flopper]

notice how all the libs left the thread when facts overruled their foolish theories?

I think they left the thread because the opposition is not discussing the bill. Most of the claims about what's in the bill is just not there.
Text - H.Res.109 - 116th Congress (2019-2020): Recognizing the duty of the Federal Government to create a Green New Deal.