Guns rarely used for self defence

[Correll]

Total crap because they only consider homicides to be "usage". The overwhelming majority of defensive uses of firearms the trigger is never pulled. Bad guys, amazingly enough, don't like to get shot.

For those usages, wouldn't a toy gun work just as well?

Right up till the bad guy figures you're a paper tiger and he pounds you to death. So...no.

Justifiable homicides with a fire arm account for 250 instances a year. Literal one in a million events. You're about two and a half times more likely to be struck by lighting.

I personally know two people who have used handguns for self defense.

Both were white guys attacked by multiple black guys.

Both were able to deter violence/further violence by merely showing their handguns.

OF course they didn't fire their guns. THey didn't kill any of their attackers.

So, according to your slanted stats, nothing happened and they don't exist.

Except that if they did not have those guns, they would have at least been badly beaten.

The one and only time I had to use a gun in self defense was when two beaners thought they were going to pull a home invasion on me.
They tried to pull the broken down car ploy to get me to open the door.
I've never seen a so called broken down car go so fast.

Did you fire your gun? Did you kill them?

Then according to Sklar nothing happened.

It doesn't matter that you at least saved yourself from being beaten and robbed.

Was there other people in your home too?

 

[Rozman]

Libs would rather we don't have guns for defense.....
Because there really aren't sick fucks out there.
It's all made up....

 

[Correll]

Totally untrue. Those numbers were shown to be fraudulent so why do you still quote them?

Shown to be fraudulent by who? The CDC puts fire arms suicides alone at 21,000 a year. Its literally 80 times more likely that you or a family member will kill yourself with a gun than you'll kill an intruder.

There were almost 600 accidental gun deaths in 2011 per the CDC. Putting the odds of accidental shooting at more than double shooting an intruder.

These aren't subtle numbers.

You would laugh if someone offered you those odds in Vegas. Why would you double down on them for yourself and your family? It just doesn't make sense.

Who wants to kill an intruder?

I just want them to go away.

 

[westwall]

Totally untrue. Those numbers were shown to be fraudulent so why do you still quote them?

Shown to be fraudulent by who? The CDC puts fire arms suicides alone at 21,000 a year. Its literally 80 times more likely that you or a family member will kill yourself with a gun than you'll kill an intruder.

There were almost 600 accidental gun deaths in 2011 per the CDC. Putting the odds of accidental shooting at more than double shooting an intruder.

These aren't subtle numbers.

You would laugh if someone offered you those odds in Vegas. Why would you double down on them for yourself and your family? It just doesn't make sense.

Suicide should be removed for one thing. Anyone who uses a gun to commit suicide is going to succeed. They will jump off of a building or they can be an asshole and fly 149 people into the ground with them. I would hazard a bet that those 149 victims and their families would have far preferred for that prick to get a gun and just kill himself. Don't you think?

And here you go with the debunking of that crap study.


"The "43 times" claim was based upon a small-scale study of firearms deaths in King County, Washington (Seattle and Bellevue) covering the period 1978-83. The authors state,"

Keep and Bear Arms - Gun Owners Home Page - 2nd Amendment Supporters


"Mortality studies such as ours do not include cases in which burglars or intruders are wounded or frightened away by the use or display of a firearm. Cases in which would-be intruders may have purposely avoided a house known to be armed are also not identified…A complete determination of firearm risks versus benefits would require that these figures be known."

Having said this, these authors proceed anyway to exclude those same instances where a potential criminal was not killed but was thwarted.

 

[SmarterThanTheAverageBear]

Total crap because they only consider homicides to be "usage". The overwhelming majority of defensive uses of firearms the trigger is never pulled. Bad guys, amazingly enough, don't like to get shot.

For those usages, wouldn't a toy gun work just as well?

Right up till the bad guy figures you're a paper tiger and he pounds you to death. So...no.

Justifiable homicides with a fire arm account for 250 instances a year. Literal one in a million events. You're about twice as likely to be struck by lighting.

And yet, were I one of those who used a gun to save my life, I would be happy as hell. So would my wife and child.

You're far, far more likely to be one of those that hurts yourself, is involved in an accidental shooting, has a bullet go through the wall and hit a sleeping neighbor or inadvertently put a shell into a family member. Or even more darkly, quite intentionally put a round in yourself.

And I don't think you'd be happy about that. Nor would you wife and child. As the doctors may be digging your round at one of them.

For me its a numbers game. Guns used for self defense are far more likely to hurt you and yours than some intruder. Its like swinging a sword by the blade.

Actually, you are far, far, far more likely to never have ANYONE get shot by one of your guns than you are to either have a family member shot by, OR have to use one to defend yourself.

Most guns are never used to shoot ANYONE

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

For those usages, wouldn't a toy gun work just as well?

Right up till the bad guy figures you're a paper tiger and he pounds you to death. So...no.

Justifiable homicides with a fire arm account for 250 instances a year. Literal one in a million events. You're about two and a half times more likely to be struck by lighting.

I personally know two people who have used handguns for self defense.

Both were white guys attacked by multiple black guys.

Both were able to deter violence/further violence by merely showing their handguns.

OF course they didn't fire their guns. THey didn't kill any of their attackers.

So, according to your slanted stats, nothing happened and they don't exist.

Except that if they did not have those guns, they would have at least been badly beaten.

The one and only time I had to use a gun in self defense was when two beaners thought they were going to pull a home invasion on me.
They tried to pull the broken down car ploy to get me to open the door.
I've never seen a so called broken down car go so fast.

Did you fire your gun? Did you kill them?

Then according to Sklar nothing happened.

It doesn't matter that you at least saved yourself from being beaten and robbed.

Was there other people in your home too?

All it took was me dropping the barrel of the shorty 870 into view and they scrambled like a bunch scalded apes. Could have easily shot em though.
And yes the wife was home at the time.

 

[Vandalshandle]

Still, i think that I will risk going to the airport without a locked and loaded AR-15. I have always been a gambler....

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Still, i think that I will risk going to the airport without a locked and loaded AR-15. I have always been a gambler....

Make sure it's stolen with the serial numbers filed off...

 

[Skylar]

Suicide should be removed for one thing. Anyone who uses a gun to commit suicide is going to succeed.

Thus the 'guns are more dangerous' point I made. As someone who attempts suicide with a toy gun is far less likely to succeed. You're literally arguing that guns should be removed from the list in a discussion of how dangerous they are....

...because they're so dangerous and likely to kill you.

Um, no. They're exactly where they should be. And the odds of you or a member of your family killing themselves with a gun is more than 80 times higher than shooting an intruder.

Worse, having a gun in the house dramatically increases the rate of suicide in that house. It effectively doubles the likelihood of suicide over homes without guns.

Firearm Access is a Risk Factor for Suicide Means Matter Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health

Why would you want to subject your family to that? For the literal 1 in a 1,000,000 chance of shooting an actual intruder? Those are shit odds.

"The "43 times" claim was based upon a small-scale study of firearms deaths in King County, Washington (Seattle and Bellevue) covering the period 1978-83. The authors state,"

Keep and Bear Arms - Gun Owners Home Page - 2nd Amendment Supporters

You're debunking a study I'm not citing. So...strawman much?

 

[Roadrunner]

People should have the right to a gun for self defense but it's a shame we can't screen out the fucking idiots:

Boy 3 fatally shoots self with mom s gun she tells 911 His eyes are open but he s out Fox News

We have laws to screen out a lot of the idiots; BATF can't be bothered when called by gun stores reporting straw buyers.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Guns rarely used for self-defense in US - Yahoo News

For every justifiable homicide involving a gun, 32 criminal homicides carried out with a firearm occurred. Also, gun owners are far more likely to hurt themselves or others, than to use them for self defense.

So stupid.....
If a criminal comes to your home and you have nothing with which to defend yourself, what is the most likely scenario?
Same crook, you have a gun and you make that clear....Now what?

 

[thereisnospoon]

Off-duty officer shoots ex-wife dead after New Jersey car chase - Yahoo News

Driving an SUV, Phillip Seidle, 51, was pursuing his recently divorced wife, Tamara Seidle, in her car when she crashed into another vehicle in Asbury Park, New Jersey, said Charles Webster, spokesman of the Monmouth County Prosecutor’s Office.

Seidle, a 22-year veteran of New Jersey's Neptune Township Police Department, got out with his service weapon, a .40-caliber Glock handgun, and fired several shots into his ex-wife's car from the driver's side, Webster said.

He then made his way to the front of the car and fired more shots at her through the windshield, Webster said.​

The Gun Fetishists now have to explain how he was just "defending himself" against his unarmed ex-wife and 7 year old daughter.

Another batch of stupidity.
You gun grabbers are so desperate

 

[thereisnospoon]

Off-duty officer shoots ex-wife dead after New Jersey car chase - Yahoo News

Driving an SUV, Phillip Seidle, 51, was pursuing his recently divorced wife, Tamara Seidle, in her car when she crashed into another vehicle in Asbury Park, New Jersey, said Charles Webster, spokesman of the Monmouth County Prosecutor’s Office.

Seidle, a 22-year veteran of New Jersey's Neptune Township Police Department, got out with his service weapon, a .40-caliber Glock handgun, and fired several shots into his ex-wife's car from the driver's side, Webster said.

He then made his way to the front of the car and fired more shots at her through the windshield, Webster said.​

The Gun Fetishists now have to explain how he was just "defending himself" against his unarmed ex-wife and 7 year old daughter.

And lookey here, it's morons like you who think that only cops should have guns.

And they also think the cops don't have a right to use them. Under any circumstances..
Ironically, the libs will support criminals who use guns to commit crimes because they are pick one from the list....Disadvantaged. Disenfranchised. Oppressed. Economically challenged,. Poor upbringing. And other other number of lame ass excuses..
These anti gun better red than dead libs ignore the fact that criminals don't give a shit about gun laws. These libs also think that by outlawing gun ownership, the weapons will go "poof" disappearing like a fart in the wind.

 

[westwall]

Suicide should be removed for one thing. Anyone who uses a gun to commit suicide is going to succeed.

Thus the 'guns are more dangerous' point I made. As someone who attempts suicide with a toy gun is far less likely to succeed. You're literally arguing that guns should be removed from the list in a discussion of how dangerous they are....

...because they're so dangerous and likely to kill you.

Um, no. They're exactly where they should be. And the odds of you or a member of your family killing themselves with a gun is more than 80 times higher than shooting an intruder.

Worse, having a gun in the house dramatically increases the rate of suicide in that house. It effectively doubles the likelihood of suicide over homes without guns.

Firearm Access is a Risk Factor for Suicide Means Matter Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health

Why would you want to subject your family to that? For the literal 1 in a 1,000,000 chance of shooting an actual intruder? Those are shit odds.

"The "43 times" claim was based upon a small-scale study of firearms deaths in King County, Washington (Seattle and Bellevue) covering the period 1978-83. The authors state,"

Keep and Bear Arms - Gun Owners Home Page - 2nd Amendment Supporters

You're debunking a study I'm not citing. So...strawman much?

Totally ignored the pilot who murdered all those people didn't you. Intellectual dishonesty is a trait prevalent in almost every anti gun person I have ever seen. You do not fail to follow up the tradition.

 

[OKTexas]

Total crap because they only consider homicides to be "usage". The overwhelming majority of defensive uses of firearms the trigger is never pulled. Bad guys, amazingly enough, don't like to get shot.

For those usages, wouldn't a toy gun work just as well?

Right up till the bad guy figures you're a paper tiger and he pounds you to death. So...no.

Justifiable homicides with a fire arm account for 250 instances a year. Literal one in a million events. You're about twice as likely to be struck by lighting.

And yet, were I one of those who used a gun to save my life, I would be happy as hell. So would my wife and child.

You're far, far more likely to be one of those that hurts yourself, is involved in an accidental shooting, has a bullet go through the wall and hit a sleeping neighbor or inadvertently put a shell into a family member. Or even more darkly, quite intentionally put a round in yourself.

And I don't think you'd be happy about that. Nor would you wife and child. As the doctors may be digging your round at one of them.

For me its a numbers game. Guns used for self defense are far more likely to hurt you and yours than some intruder. Its like swinging a sword by the blade.

Bull shit.

Guns in America Facts and statistics about firearms in the USA

 

[thereisnospoon]

Total crap because they only consider homicides to be "usage". The overwhelming majority of defensive uses of firearms the trigger is never pulled. Bad guys, amazingly enough, don't like to get shot.

For those usages, wouldn't a toy gun work just as well?

Yer kidding right?.....The first lesson a responsible gun owner learns is "never display your weapon unless you intend to use it."

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Total crap because they only consider homicides to be "usage". The overwhelming majority of defensive uses of firearms the trigger is never pulled. Bad guys, amazingly enough, don't like to get shot.

For those usages, wouldn't a toy gun work just as well?

Yer kidding right?.....The first lesson a responsible gun owner learns is "never display your weapon unless you intend to use it."

I would have to say the majority of the time just showing it will do the trick.
It's those pesky times when they call you on it that would suck.

 

[Vandalshandle]

Suicide should be removed for one thing. Anyone who uses a gun to commit suicide is going to succeed.

Thus the 'guns are more dangerous' point I made. As someone who attempts suicide with a toy gun is far less likely to succeed. You're literally arguing that guns should be removed from the list in a discussion of how dangerous they are....

...because they're so dangerous and likely to kill you.

Um, no. They're exactly where they should be. And the odds of you or a member of your family killing themselves with a gun is more than 80 times higher than shooting an intruder.

Worse, having a gun in the house dramatically increases the rate of suicide in that house. It effectively doubles the likelihood of suicide over homes without guns.

Firearm Access is a Risk Factor for Suicide Means Matter Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health

Why would you want to subject your family to that? For the literal 1 in a 1,000,000 chance of shooting an actual intruder? Those are shit odds.

"The "43 times" claim was based upon a small-scale study of firearms deaths in King County, Washington (Seattle and Bellevue) covering the period 1978-83. The authors state,"

Keep and Bear Arms - Gun Owners Home Page - 2nd Amendment Supporters

You're debunking a study I'm not citing. So...strawman much?

And a battered spouse is 5 times more likely to be killed by her husband if he owns a gun.

 

[Vandalshandle]

Guns rarely used for self-defense in US - Yahoo News

For every justifiable homicide involving a gun, 32 criminal homicides carried out with a firearm occurred. Also, gun owners are far more likely to hurt themselves or others, than to use them for self defense.

So stupid.....
If a criminal comes to your home and you have nothing with which to defend yourself, what is the most likely scenario?
Same crook, you have a gun and you make that clear....Now what?

And yet, experts agree that he most effective gun to use to protect your home is a shotgun. It is guaranteed to disable or kill, almost impossible to miss the target, and probably will not go through walls to harm your family.

so, you have a shotgun in your home, right?

 

[Correll]

Right up till the bad guy figures you're a paper tiger and he pounds you to death. So...no.

Justifiable homicides with a fire arm account for 250 instances a year. Literal one in a million events. You're about two and a half times more likely to be struck by lighting.

I personally know two people who have used handguns for self defense.

Both were white guys attacked by multiple black guys.

Both were able to deter violence/further violence by merely showing their handguns.

OF course they didn't fire their guns. THey didn't kill any of their attackers.

So, according to your slanted stats, nothing happened and they don't exist.

Except that if they did not have those guns, they would have at least been badly beaten.

The one and only time I had to use a gun in self defense was when two beaners thought they were going to pull a home invasion on me.
They tried to pull the broken down car ploy to get me to open the door.
I've never seen a so called broken down car go so fast.

Did you fire your gun? Did you kill them?

Then according to Sklar nothing happened.

It doesn't matter that you at least saved yourself from being beaten and robbed.

Was there other people in your home too?

All it took was me dropping the barrel of the shorty 870 into view and they scrambled like a bunch scalded apes. Could have easily shot em though.
And yes the wife was home at the time.

I'm very glad that neither of you were hurt.

I had a friend who was a visiting nurse who had an elderly couple that she went to see one day.

They had been home invaded.

Both have been beaten and tied up and left.

The husband died from the trauma and being tied up. THe wife had to sit there with her dead husband for hours.

My friend got to be the one to tell her, that yes, indeed, your husband is dead.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Justifiable homicides with a fire arm account for 250 instances a year. Literal one in a million events. You're about two and a half times more likely to be struck by lighting.

I personally know two people who have used handguns for self defense.

Both were white guys attacked by multiple black guys.

Both were able to deter violence/further violence by merely showing their handguns.

OF course they didn't fire their guns. THey didn't kill any of their attackers.

So, according to your slanted stats, nothing happened and they don't exist.

Except that if they did not have those guns, they would have at least been badly beaten.

The one and only time I had to use a gun in self defense was when two beaners thought they were going to pull a home invasion on me.
They tried to pull the broken down car ploy to get me to open the door.
I've never seen a so called broken down car go so fast.

Did you fire your gun? Did you kill them?

Then according to Sklar nothing happened.

It doesn't matter that you at least saved yourself from being beaten and robbed.

Was there other people in your home too?

All it took was me dropping the barrel of the shorty 870 into view and they scrambled like a bunch scalded apes. Could have easily shot em though.
And yes the wife was home at the time.

I'm very glad that neither of you were hurt.

I had a friend who was a visiting nurse who had an elderly couple that she went to see one day.

They had been home invaded.

Both have been beaten and tied up and left.

The husband died from the trauma and being tied up. THe wife had to sit there with her dead husband for hours.

My friend got to be the one to tell her, that yes, indeed, your husband is dead.

Thats seriously F'd up!!
I will say I learned a valuable lessen that day. Never assume anything.