James Hansen Wishes he Wasn’t So Right about Global Warming

[ding]

So your opinion is the following.

The sun which radiates constantly the same amount of radiation has somehow caused the oceans to rapidly warm because it’s constant.

And then those same constantly warmed oceans distribute more warming to our planet.

Have I got your idiot position right.

Maybe read these papers.

Deep Atlantic Circulation During the Last Glacial Maximum and Deglaciation​

https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/epdf/10.1029/PA005i004p00469

Collapse and rapid resumption of Atlantic meridional circulation linked to deglacial climate changes - Nature​

https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1029/2010PA002032

How the ocean distributes heat can cause cooling through glaciation of the northern hemisphere even with constant sunshine being received. How else do you think bipolar glaciation began?

Today the currents are such that the planet is naturally warming and the NH is deglaciating. Been going on for 20,000 years. And will continue going on until heat transport from the Atlantic to the Arctic gets disrupted due to density changes which affect ocean currents. It's called the thermohaline circulation. Maybe look it up.

 

[otto105]

Maybe read these papers.

Deep Atlantic Circulation During the Last Glacial Maximum and Deglaciation​

https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/epdf/10.1029/PA005i004p00469

Collapse and rapid resumption of Atlantic meridional circulation linked to deglacial climate changes - Nature​

https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1029/2010PA002032

I asked if that is your position.

Can you answer

 

[ding]

I asked if that is your position.

Can you answer

See the text below the links, dummy.

 

[otto105]

See the text below the links, dummy.

Answer the question, have I stated your position.

 

[mamooth]

The planet is warming because heat from the Atlantic is warming the Arctic. Thus the earth is naturally warming

That theory would require that the Atlantic Ocean be cooling. Since the Atlantic Ocean is warming strongly, your theory is disproved.

Conservation of energy is not optional. Your theories violate it, so your theories are wrong. It doesn't matter how strong your faith in them is, or how upset you get when they're debunked. Physics says your theories are wrong, so they're wrong.

 

[ding]

Answer the question, have I stated your position.

No. That's why I stated it again for you, dummy.

 

[otto105]

No. That's why I stated it again for you, dummy.

Answer the question, have I stated your posts correctly.

 

[ding]

That theory would require that the Atlantic Ocean be cooling. Since the Atlantic Ocean is warming strongly, your theory is disproved.

Conservation of energy is not optional. Your theories violate it, so your theories are wrong.

No, the Atlantic won't be cooling until heat transport from the Atlantic to the Arctic shuts down and extensive continental glaciation occurs in the northern hemisphere.

You do realize we have proxies for the mean ocean temperature for glacial and interglacial periods. Those proxies prove that the ocean warms during interglacial periods and then cools in glacial periods. They cool because of the extensive continental glaciation that occurs in the NH.

 

[ding]

Answer the question, have I stated your posts correctly.

I did answer, dummy. No. You did not. Here is my position.

How the ocean distributes heat can cause cooling through glaciation of the northern hemisphere even with constant sunshine being received. How else do you think bipolar glaciation began?

Today the currents are such that the planet is naturally warming and the NH is deglaciating. Been going on for 20,000 years. And will continue going on until heat transport from the Atlantic to the Arctic gets disrupted due to density changes which affect ocean currents. It's called the thermohaline circulation. Maybe look it up.

Here are the papers which support this position.

Deep Atlantic Circulation During the Last Glacial Maximum and Deglaciation​

https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/epdf/10.1029/PA005i004p00469

Collapse and rapid resumption of Atlantic meridional circulation linked to deglacial climate changes - Nature​

https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1029/2010PA002032

 

[ding]

You people are idiots

 

[mamooth]

No, the Atlantic won't be cooling

Under your theory, it would have to.

You just said it recently started transferring more heat to the Arctic. It wasn't transferring that heat before, so the additional heat going to the Arctic has to come from somewhere.

There's no new heat source in the Atlantic making up for that heat, so that means the Atlantic would have to cool down. Since the Atlantic isn't cooling down, your theory is disproved.

The rest of your stuff is a red herring, not relevant, an evasion.

And that would be why your theory is not taking the world of science by storm. There's no conspiracy. Your theory is just delusional.

 

[otto105]

I did answer, dummy. No. You did not. Here is my position.

How the ocean distributes heat can cause cooling through glaciation of the northern hemisphere even with constant sunshine being received. How else do you think bipolar glaciation began?

Today the currents are such that the planet is naturally warming and the NH is deglaciating. Been going on for 20,000 years. And will continue going on until heat transport from the Atlantic to the Arctic gets disrupted due to density changes which affect ocean currents. It's called the thermohaline circulation. Maybe look it up.

Here are the papers which support this position.

Deep Atlantic Circulation During the Last Glacial Maximum and Deglaciation​

https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/epdf/10.1029/PA005i004p00469

Collapse and rapid resumption of Atlantic meridional circulation linked to deglacial climate changes - Nature​

https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1029/2010PA002032

This is not an answer to the question.

Why are you avoiding the question?

 

[ding]

Under your theory, it would have to.

You just said it recently started transferring more heat to the Arctic. It wasn't transferring that heat before, so the additional heat going to the Arctic has to come from somewhere.

There's no new heat source in the Atlantic making up for that heat, so that means the Atlantic would have to cool down. Since the Atlantic isn't cooling down, your theory is disproved.

The rest of your stuff is a red herring, not relevant, an evasion.

And that would be why your theory is not taking the world of science by storm. There's no conspiracy. Your theory is just delusional.

It's not my theory. Did you fail to see the papers on it? I did not say it started recently. Either heat is being transported to the Arctic or it isn't. When it isn't the NH glaciates and the entire planet including the ocean begins to cool. That is not happening today. Today heat is being transported from the Atlantic to the Arctic and the NH is thawing from the last glacial event. The planet will continue to warm until the heat transport from the Atlantic to the Arctic gets disrupted because of density changes which alter the ocean's circulation patterns. It's happened over 30 times in the last 3 million years.

You don't know the first thing about this science because you are a political hack on a mission.

 

[ding]

This is not an answer to the question.

Why are you avoiding the question?

It was.

How the ocean distributes heat can cause cooling through glaciation of the northern hemisphere even with constant sunshine being received. How else do you think bipolar glaciation began?

Today the currents are such that the planet is naturally warming and the NH is deglaciating. Been going on for 20,000 years. And will continue going on until heat transport from the Atlantic to the Arctic gets disrupted due to density changes which affect ocean currents. It's called the thermohaline circulation. Maybe look it up.

Here are the papers which support this position.

Deep Atlantic Circulation During the Last Glacial Maximum and Deglaciation​

https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/epdf/10.1029/PA005i004p00469

Collapse and rapid resumption of Atlantic meridional circulation linked to deglacial climate changes - Nature​

https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1029/2010PA002032

 

[mamooth]

How else do you think bipolar glaciation began?

It's the CO2.

A bit of cooling causes the oceans to absorb more CO2, which drops temps, so the oceans cool, so temps drop more, and the cycle continues.

Today the currents are such that the planet is naturally warming

That's a nonsense statement. The currents haven't changed at all in the span where the fast warming started. They were just the same when the planet was cooling pre-1970s.

and the NH is deglaciating. Been going on for 20,000 years.

The temperature peak happened 6000 - 8000 years ago. The earth has been in slow cooling every since. While the shrinkage of mountain glaciers lags behind the peak by thousands of years, their albedo affect is insignicant, so "glacier shrinkage" has no effect climate.

And will continue going on until heat transport from the Atlantic to the Arctic gets disrupted due to density changes which affect ocean currents. It's called the thermohaline circulation. Maybe look it up.

Here are the papers which support this position.

No, they don't. Not one bit. You have no idea of what you're babbling about. You're just mashing together various buzzwords in a senseless manner.

 

[otto105]

It's not my theory. Did you fail to see the papers on it? I did not say it started recently. Either heat is being transported to the Arctic or it isn't. When it isn't the NK glaciates and the entire planet including the ocean begins to cool. That is not happening today. Today heat is being transported from the Atlantic to the Arctic and the NH is thawing from the last glacial event. The planet will continue to warm until the heat transport from the Atlantic to the Arctic gets disrupted because of density changes which alter the ocean's circulation patterns.

You don't know the first thing about this science because you are a political hack on a mission.

Stop avoiding the question answer it

 

[ding]

It's the CO2.

A bit of cooling causes the oceans to absorb more CO2, which drops temps, so the oceans cool, so temps drop more, and the cycle continues.


That's a nonsense statement. The currents haven't changed at all in the span where the fast warming started. They were just the same when the planet was cooling pre-1970s.


The temperature peak happened 6000 - 8000 years ago. The earth has been in slow cooling every since. While the shrinkage of mountain glaciers lags behind the peak by thousands of years, their albedo affect is insignicant, so "glacier shrinkage" has no effect climate.


No, they don't. Not one bit. You have no idea of what you're babbling about. You're just mashing together various buzzwords in a senseless manner.

CO2 lagged temperature by 800 to 1000 years. So, no. Not the CO2.

 

[otto105]

CO2 lagged temperature by 800 to 1000 years. So, no. Not the CO2.

Answer the question have I correctly stated your position

 

[mamooth]

It's not my theory. Did you fail to see the papers on it?

Yeah, the papers that say nothing like what you claim they say. That's not a big win on your part.

I did not say it started recently.

But the data says that the warming started recently, so your theory is wrong.

The planet will continue to warm

You mean the planet that was cooling for the past 6000 - 8000 years, thus disproving your theory?

You don't know the first thing about this science because you are a political hack on a mission.

I'm not the one that the world correctly defines as a cult crank. Preach on. Just don't expect anyone to listen.

 

[mamooth]

CO2 lagged temperature by 800 to 1000 years. So, no. Not the CO2.

CO2 both lags and leads.

This is basic stuff, and you always fail at it.