Health Care - we gotta fix this shit...

[candycorn]

I'm a conservative.
But even I realize that our health Care system is screwed.
Pharmacutical companies are gouging us out of our retirement savings.
Insurance companies are gouging us out of our 401k's.
Doctors and hospitals are performing unneeded procedures and prescribing unneeded drugs for profit.
I'm all about profit - but not profit over deceit.
And not profit over the well-being of American citizens.
I always thought the federal government was fundamental for our national defense, and national defense only.
Not any more.
Get rid of Medicare and Medicaid. Both systems are abused and bankrupt.
Have a single payer system. Tack on 5% on our paychecks and have the government have oversight.
Everybody has health care.
I hate to say it, but that's what it's come down to.

Wow. That’s very leftist of you.

As a naturalized American from Canada, I will tell you this - the American system is better for upper middle class people and higher, the Canadian system is better for lower middle class and lower.

It has always seemed to be the case. I see it up close every week.

When I was in the public sector working for the health department, we have capabilities here that those patients would have benefitted greatly from but simply did not have access to. If you’re talking about the difference between a Lincoln and a Hyundai, you’re still getting from point A to B. But in healthcare, the difference is quite literally life and death in some cases. The only deciding factor is the means of the patient. One of the great shortcomings of capitalism.

 

[Dana7360]

You are a liberal darling. Sorry to dissapoint.

5% number is bad - Medicare-Medicaid is already 4.35% and you want to cover everyone for 5%?

Not a lib.

You want government run healthcare because you don't think free market can solve this issue --right?

That's a (very) liberal position.

Don't be ashamed SmakeALib

but the free market plan hasn't been working for the consumer/patient. It only works for those involved in the health care system such as Pharma, Dr's, investors, etc.to get richer. I won't even go so far as to include insurance companies since they have to pay for it all.

Well I'm not as liberal as SmokeAlib and belive America CAN do it better than other countries, in our own way.

If Republicans would stop trying to sabotage Obamacare because it happens to be passed by Obama and instead work constructively with Democrats we can fix this (and much more).

Obamacare is hardly the answer. Have you ever logged onto their website and checked their rates, for shits and giggles?
I have.
Bronze plan, family of 5, income 75k.
10k deductible.
2500/month.
WTF?

That's one of the reasons why we need single payer.

When things are privatized they always cost more because there has to be a profit for the private company.

In my opinion the only people who should be making a profit off this are the doctors, nurses and health care workers. They actually do something and help people. All an insurance company does is pay the bills. If you're lucky. Usually it's a long drawn out fight to get them to pay the bills. Which I will never understand why people think it's a good idea to give a company thousands of our hard earned dollars for health care then the company turn around and tell you that you can't use your own money to pay your medical bills. While that company puts at least 30% of your hard earned money in their pockets.

One of the biggest reasons why insurance costs so much more now is because since the reagan years when he deregulated the medical and insurance businesses, there were very few regulations on the insurance companies and medical facilities so they got to set their own rules.

Insurance all of a sudden was able to kick millions of sick people or people who become sick off using that preexisting condition clause and the 1 million dollar cap.

Now a lot of those millions have insurance and can actually see a doctor. That costs money. If they had not been kicked off insurance in the first place, everyone could have had much lower insurance premiums because their problems would have been addressed long before they became serious and very expensive to treat. We would have had more people paying into the insurance pool. We also wouldn't have had billions in unpaid bills.

I was in a serious accident in Maui in 2009. They had socialized medicine at the time. No medical bill went unpaid. I was in an ICU unit in a coma for a week. Went through ER first. When the bill for the hospital came both the ex and I thought it would be at the very least 40 thousand dollars.

The bill from the hospital was 26 thousand dollars. The reason why is because the hospitals and doctors in Hawaii didn't have millions in unpaid bills that they "cost shifted" to those who could pay the bills. People had not been thrown off insurance leaving thousands without a way to pay their bills thus not have a way to see a doctor for their medical problems.

People need to wake up and see the reality of our health care situation.

We're doing it the most expensive and least efficient way.

 

[Toro]

I'm a conservative.
But even I realize that our health Care system is screwed.
Pharmacutical companies are gouging us out of our retirement savings.
Insurance companies are gouging us out of our 401k's.
Doctors and hospitals are performing unneeded procedures and prescribing unneeded drugs for profit.
I'm all about profit - but not profit over deceit.
And not profit over the well-being of American citizens.
I always thought the federal government was fundamental for our national defense, and national defense only.
Not any more.
Get rid of Medicare and Medicaid. Both systems are abused and bankrupt.
Have a single payer system. Tack on 5% on our paychecks and have the government have oversight.
Everybody has health care.
I hate to say it, but that's what it's come down to.

Wow. That’s very leftist of you.

As a naturalized American from Canada, I will tell you this - the American system is better for upper middle class people and higher, the Canadian system is better for lower middle class and lower.

And I have NO problem with Canada single payer with a population of 36.7 million of which 83.8% are Caucasian...
Versus the USA...327.7 million... nearly 9 times!
But see this is where the ONE size fits all concept of single payer breaks down!
Canada with less then 1/9th the population can manage it and with 10 providences versus 50 states?
So why not get YOUR state to have single payer health insurance and let me in my state make up whether I want single payer?
I don't understand that this "one size fits all" mentality because people in Florida hardly freeze to death versus Minnesota!!
And people in Texas probably have a different health issues than Iowa.

So why this need for "one size fits all"? Comparing a country with less than 1/9th the population as a model? Get real!

Canada’s system has its problems, no doubt about it. I think the US system is better, especially as an upper income earner. But after being in both systems, if I were lower middle class, I’d move back to Canada.

FYI in Canada, the system is run by the provinces, not the Federal government. The Federal government sets the standards and provides funding, but the provinces run the program.

But the size doesn’t really matter. Germany and Japan are large nations with single payer systems.

 

[Siete]

lets just use Trumps healthcare plan -

 

[debbiedowner]

My coverage in retirement is fantastic, and since I paid for those before me, I want my cut.

I am almost 50, I will never see a penny from any socialist entitlement programs I have paid in all my adult life... I want to cut bait and get the fuck out of that shit I don’t want to pay anymore into the shit...

You are being alarmist.

If you retire at 65, you will receive benefits from the socialist entitlement programs Americans love so much.

social security and medicare are not entitlements, we paid for them with our money our entire working lives. Money that was taken out of our paychecks without our permission. Its ours. The government owes it to us. Its not welfare or charity or entitlement its the return of forced savings (taxes)

Well then you better educate the younger right.

 

[Rustic]

My coverage in retirement is fantastic, and since I paid for those before me, I want my cut.

I am almost 50, I will never see a penny from any socialist entitlement programs I have paid in all my adult life... I want to cut bait and get the fuck out of that shit I don’t want to pay anymore into the shit...

You are being alarmist.

If you retire at 65, you will receive benefits from the socialist entitlement programs Americans love so much.

social security and medicare are not entitlements, we paid for them with our money our entire working lives. Money that was taken out of our paychecks without our permission. Its ours. The government owes it to us. Its not welfare or charity or entitlement its the return of forced savings (taxes)

Well then you better educate the younger right.

That why they must be abolished, depending on the collective is a lost cause...

 

[Rustic]

lets just use Trumps healthcare plan -

How about people take care of their own shit, And tell the nanny state to fuck off.

 

[Howard Roark]

"Absorb'? You mean the costs for administration just disappear from the books?"
"Absorb" meant the normal claim processing costs, salaries, computers, buildings, telecommunications, etc. are ALL expensed by the MACs.
If there weren't any MACs then Medicare would have nearly 100,000 people for which they paid salaries, PLUS payroll taxes, as well as office buildings etc.
Instead idiots don't comprehend that the bragging about Medicare's low cost of handling totally forget these costs are absorbed by the MACs and
Medicare pays the yearly contract.

Take the hundreds of millions in CEO pay for insurance companies, add the advertising/lobbying, and you can fund any infrastructure that Medicare would need if you create a public option.

When younger/healthier people are buying a Medicare plan, it bolsters the coffers, and lowers per capita cost. Cost sharing in Medicare.

What an idiot!
"Take the hundred of millions in CEO pay"
Right.... that will make a gigantic difference!

WOW how disgusting idiots like you complain...
Wow...
But wait...Tell me something...
Why aren't you pissed about these guys??
What kind of life changing decisions that CEOs make DAILY do these guys that you idiots pay good money to watch?
These guys you have NO complaints about HOW much more they make then their handlers, etc.
These guys make no decisions about buildings, hiring thousands of people, and more importantly signing financial documents that if are untrue,
these CEOs will be imprisoned! But you idiots don't complain them.
Finally how what % of the gross revenue of these companies went to these CEOs?

Health insurance CEOs earned $342.6M in 2017 | FierceHealthcare
View attachment 228338


Top 5 Largest Health Insurance Payers in the United States
These five grossed $431 billion in revenues so let's look at each CEOs compensation: $121 million! Which is 2/10ths of 1%!!!!
And you guys bitch about that !

Before I add you to my ignore list, I find it interesting that you throw the word 'idiot' around so easily, when in fact you are clearly the board moron. If you can't distinguish between a performer's salary, and how insignificant it is in society, compared to CEO pay for Pharma/Ins/Oil executives that directly affect what we have to pay out of pocket for essential goods/services, then you're too stupid to engage with me anymore.

See ya!

 

[Howard Roark]

wrong, they may have had to pay a higher premium, much like you pay more for car insurance if you have a bunch of wrecks and tickets, but no one was denied insurance. that is a left wing lie.

What obozocare did was raise premiums for everyone so that healthy young people were better off paying the penalty than paying the premiums for coverages that they did not want or need. Why did obozocare require a healthy 25 year old male to buy a policy that included maternity benefits? It was the absolute worst piece of legislation in the history of this country. and but for bitter old McCain it would have been repealed last year.

Incorrect. If you let insurance lapse for 30 days or more, you lost the ability to be covered for pre existing conditions.

 

[Siete]

lets just use Trumps healthcare plan -

How about people take care of their own shit, And tell the nanny state to fuck off.

how about RW's stfu and get over the healthcare laws ..

 

[Howard Roark]

Maybe they weren't denied health care but they sure were denied health insurance before obamacare for pre x medical conditions.

Correct. Most people don't understand the market, as they were never stuck in the individual market as I was for 40 years.

 

[Howard Roark]

What obozocare did was raise premiums for everyone so that healthy young people were better off paying the penalty than paying the premiums for coverages that they did not want or need. Why did obozocare require a healthy 25 year old male to buy a policy that included maternity benefits? It was the absolute worst piece of legislation in the history of this country. and but for bitter old McCain it would have been repealed last year.

Clearly, you don't understand cost sharing, which is how every type of insurance works.

 

[Howard Roark]

Obozocare was/is the worst legislation in the history of the USA. It would be history but for the arrogance of McCain. No one is denied medical care in the USA, now, before ACA, or after ACA. Obozocare was a failed attempt to have the government take over 1/5 of the economy and force healthy young people to pay huge premiums for insurance that they neither wanted or needed.

I kept young people on their parents' insurance until they were out of college. You can thank Reagan for the mandate. If not for EMTALA, nobody would walk into a hospital and expect to get treated for free.

Capital gains tax is double taxation and should be eliminated.

Incorrect. Cap gains taxation is a reduced tax on investments, rental income, etc. You don't pay twice on investment. Principal is never taxed as cap gains. No different than not paying tax on principal when you are taxed on dividends.

The tax cuts cut taxes for every tax paying American, probably not for you since its impossible to pay less than zero.

Yea...where is the $4000-$6000/year that middle income earners were promised? It was a tax giveaway to the wealthy, and corporations. Watch the debt now.

The unemployment rate is at record lows, especially for blacks and Hispanics. Your claim about obozo and jobs is bullshit.

LMAO! Do us a favor...post a graph of unemployment rates for non whites. You might be in for a surprise. SMH

 

[Rustic]

I'm a conservative.
But even I realize that our health Care system is screwed.
Pharmacutical companies are gouging us out of our retirement savings.
Insurance companies are gouging us out of our 401k's.
Doctors and hospitals are performing unneeded procedures and prescribing unneeded drugs for profit.
I'm all about profit - but not profit over deceit.
And not profit over the well-being of American citizens.
I always thought the federal government was fundamental for our national defense, and national defense only.
Not any more.
Get rid of Medicare and Medicaid. Both systems are abused and bankrupt.
Have a single payer system. Tack on 5% on our paychecks and have the government have oversight.
Everybody has health care.
I hate to say it, but that's what it's come down to.

Wow. That’s very leftist of you.

As a naturalized American from Canada, I will tell you this - the American system is better for upper middle class people and higher, the Canadian system is better for lower middle class and lower.

And I have NO problem with Canada single payer with a population of 36.7 million of which 83.8% are Caucasian...
Versus the USA...327.7 million... nearly 9 times!
But see this is where the ONE size fits all concept of single payer breaks down!
Canada with less then 1/9th the population can manage it and with 10 providences versus 50 states?
So why not get YOUR state to have single payer health insurance and let me in my state make up whether I want single payer?
I don't understand that this "one size fits all" mentality because people in Florida hardly freeze to death versus Minnesota!!
And people in Texas probably have a different health issues than Iowa.

So why this need for "one size fits all"? Comparing a country with less than 1/9th the population as a model? Get real!

Canada’s system has its problems, no doubt about it. I think the US system is better, especially as an upper income earner. But after being in both systems, if I were lower middle class, I’d move back to Canada.

FYI in Canada, the system is run by the provinces, not the Federal government. The Federal government sets the standards and provides funding, but the provinces run the program.

But the size doesn’t really matter. Germany and Japan are large nations with single payer systems.

You did not answer the question, why must everyone be forced into the collective wheather want to participate or not?

 

[Rustic]

What obozocare did was raise premiums for everyone so that healthy young people were better off paying the penalty than paying the premiums for coverages that they did not want or need. Why did obozocare require a healthy 25 year old male to buy a policy that included maternity benefits? It was the absolute worst piece of legislation in the history of this country. and but for bitter old McCain it would have been repealed last year.

Clearly, you don't understand cost sharing, which is how every type of insurance works.

Fuck the collective, the Collective always fucks over the individual

 

[Rustic]

lets just use Trumps healthcare plan -

How about people take care of their own shit, And tell the nanny state to fuck off.

how about RW's stfu and get over the healthcare laws ..

Fuck the nanny state...

 

[Siete]

lets just use Trumps healthcare plan -

How about people take care of their own shit, And tell the nanny state to fuck off.

how about RW's stfu and get over the healthcare laws ..

Fuck the nanny state...

that's a minority opinion .. the majority wants healthcare.

 

[Rustic]

lets just use Trumps healthcare plan -

How about people take care of their own shit, And tell the nanny state to fuck off.

how about RW's stfu and get over the healthcare laws ..

Fuck the nanny state...

that's a minority opinion .. the majority wants healthcare.

Insurance is not healthcare

 

[Siete]

lets just use Trumps healthcare plan -

How about people take care of their own shit, And tell the nanny state to fuck off.

how about RW's stfu and get over the healthcare laws ..

Fuck the nanny state...

that's a minority opinion .. the majority wants healthcare.

Insurance is not healthcare

riiiiiiiiiiiight - having medical insurance covers hail damaged cars.

 

[Rustic]

How about people take care of their own shit, And tell the nanny state to fuck off.

how about RW's stfu and get over the healthcare laws ..

Fuck the nanny state...

that's a minority opinion .. the majority wants healthcare.

Insurance is not healthcare

riiiiiiiiiiiight - having medical insurance covers hail damaged cars.

Lol
Only a fool would depend on and trust insurance companies