Health Care - we gotta fix this shit...

[Remodeling Maidiac]

The OP is smokin sumthin and it ain't libs...

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

You misread. I might have mentioned supplemental plans, but the point of the article is that the top five insurance companies are getting 60% of the revenue from the plans they serve up to Medicare and Medicaid. Read it again, perhaps without an incorrect assumption guiding you. The government sub-contracts Medicare and Medicaid to private for-profit insurance companies. This is an established fact.

I wouldn't make such a fuss about this, but a lot of people think that Medicare for All will take private insurance out of the equation, when the fact of the matter is it won't. They are deeply embedded in Medicare and Medicaid. Medicare for all will just force us to buy their insurance, whether we want to or not - much like ACA.

Single-payer wouldn't be an end-run around insurance companies, it would be a funnel forcing us to support them.

Whereas I understand that Medicare/Caid are using ins. company infrastructure to deliver care to patients, said patients are only paying for their supplemental coverage that isn't covered under their Medicare plan...which costs little or nothing. Are you saying that insurers are taking Fed money, and pocketing the bulk of that money as profits?

Exactly. Do you really think an insurance company is going to give you a low or no premium Medicare Advantage plan out of the goodness of their hearts? Nope, the government gives them upwards towards or a little more than $10000.00 per person per year just to handle your health insurance. The higher the star rating of a plan the more money they get.

Granted, the Medicare pool is the highest risk demographic, but $10k/year is more than a policy on the exchange.

Which further bolsters my point that putting younger/healthier people into the Medicare pool pays dividends.

The only way to put those younger people into that kind of coverage is to mandate it, which was the major flaw in Obamacare!

 

[Flopper]

You misread. I might have mentioned supplemental plans, but the point of the article is that the top five insurance companies are getting 60% of the revenue from the plans they serve up to Medicare and Medicaid. Read it again, perhaps without an incorrect assumption guiding you. The government sub-contracts Medicare and Medicaid to private for-profit insurance companies. This is an established fact.

I wouldn't make such a fuss about this, but a lot of people think that Medicare for All will take private insurance out of the equation, when the fact of the matter is it won't. They are deeply embedded in Medicare and Medicaid. Medicare for all will just force us to buy their insurance, whether we want to or not - much like ACA.

Single-payer wouldn't be an end-run around insurance companies, it would be a funnel forcing us to support them.

Whereas I understand that Medicare/Caid are using ins. company infrastructure to deliver care to patients, said patients are only paying for their supplemental coverage that isn't covered under their Medicare plan...which costs little or nothing. Are you saying that insurers are taking Fed money, and pocketing the bulk of that money as profits?

Exactly. Do you really think an insurance company is going to give you a low or no premium Medicare Advantage plan out of the goodness of their hearts? Nope, the government gives them upwards towards or a little more than $10000.00 per person per year just to handle your health insurance. The higher the star rating of a plan the more money they get.

According to the law Medadvantage plans are paid by Medicare to insure members. The amount the plan receives is determined by the number of members and is suppose to be no more than Medicare would pay to provide healthcare if they were Medicare beneficiaries. The insurance companies must cover the same things that Medicare covers. However, the insurance companies are given great latitude as how they will cover them, through private networks, through their own healthcare facilities, etc. The insurance company also become the one to determine whether a procedure is medically necessary, not Medicare.

The way the companies make their money is by offering incentives that will attack younger healthier retirees such as gym membership, discounts on sporting goods, discounts on travel, and most important low or zero premiums. Insurance companies know that healthy people don't pay a lot attention to their share of medical cost. As the members grow older they see their costs rising sharply and they are not able to take advantage of the perks the plans often. The insurance companies often scrutinize the need for procedures, pressure hospitals for early release, and deny coverage for various reason. If a member becomes dissatisfied and wants to go back to regular medicare with a supplement, they find they will probably be subject to medical underwriting which makes it impossible for most people, so they're stuck in the Medadvantage world.

 

[dblack]

Insurance companies would be removed from the equation, save for those who want to pay for private insurance as a backup plan, or a primary plan.

Uh, no. That's not how Medicare works. They just farm it out to private insurance companies who have lobbied government for the favor.

Big 5 insurers depend on Medicare, Medicaid for growth in enrollment, profits

Medicare Advantage plans operated by private insurance companies now cover 33% of Medicare beneficiaries. For most people, the alternative is original Medicare or original Medicare plus a supplement and possibly a part D drug plan.

For the beneficiary, there are advantages and disadvantages to all three routes. For the government, MedAdvantage plans can control cost in ways original Medicare can not.

Medicare Advantage plans are great for retirees with few healthcare problems since they have low and often zero premiums. Unfortunately, as you age and your healthcare problems increase, these plans can become not only costly but put the beneficiary in a mountain of medical bills for copays and coinsurance which vary with every type healthcare service. The plans are mostly HMOs which means referrals by a primary care doctor and staying in network. Often there is no coverage at all except emergency care if you travel outside your local community.

Premiums medicare with a supplement is expensive but there are virtually no medical bills to pay. You can go to any doctor or hospital that accepts Medicare anywhere in the country which are about 98% of healthcare providers and there is no cost.

Once you are in a MedAdvantage going back to Medicare with a supplement is nearly impossible for most people because they will be subject to medical underwriting.

So what?

The point is that MedAdvantage plans are reducing coverage by forcing the subscriber to pay more and more. In the end they becomes just another insurance company subsidized by the government. They attract customers with their zero premiums. Once a person signs up for one these of these plans they can not transfer to a supplement or a standalone drug plan. This is not how Medicare was suppose to be.

Huh. How about that?. It looked like you were responding to my post, so I thought maybe your post had something to do with what I was talking about. Guess not.

 

[francoHFW]

That is lack of socialism. Socialism would give them a living wage and Medicaid and housing, not GOP suffering and discrimination and lack of services d u h....

Lol
American Indians that live on the pine ridge Ridge Indian reservation depend 100% on socialism, you fucking moron.
There is no such thing as capitalism on the Pineridge Indian reservation...
Like I have always said Progressives are fucked in the head.

Obviously our socialism in the United States is crap GOP socialism, dumbass. No suffering or sacrifice is too great to protect the greedy idiot GOP Rich from paying their fair share...

Get it through your thick skull you infant, There is no capitalism at all on the Pineridge Indian reservation it is 100% government run socialism...
Socialism has to depend on taxes far too much, because it is a system developed by and for fucking morons.
There is a reason why socialism has a 100% failure rate long-term… Fucking morons like yourself keep on trying it thinking “this time” it’s gonna work...

You are talking about communism, certainly not socialism as defined now, which is fair capitalism well regulated with a good safety thing that is always democratic. Reservations are a disgrace and you can thank the GOP, nothing is worth doing if we can save the rich from paying their fair share.

Fair is everyone paying the same dollar amount... No matter how much or how little they make. Progressive taxation is for fucking losers

It just turns the country into a Banana Republic... Every country ever has had a progressive tax system, otherwise it's a total give away to the rich and screws the rest.

 

[Flopper]

Complex issue. But you are correct. A 'for profit' healthcare system doesn't work.

How do people that are retired have 5% taken from their paychecks? Do self employed people pay 10%? Medicare fraud is perpetrated by providers, not patients.

Start with a public option, when anyone can purchase Medicare plans to rival private insurance. It will help Medicare, and it will be a great option for younger/healthier people who don't use doctors/meds at the same rate as others.

You do realize that Medicare has both deductibles and coinsurance. Plus the premiums would have to be much, much higher for women to make it work, and you know we can't have that!

.

All insurance has deductibles and coinsurance. The difference with Medicare, is that the admin. fees are a fraction of those in the private insurance sector.

Hell, it ought to be. If we move to "Medicare for All" the insurance companies will no longer have to appeal to customers to make a profit, they'll just have to lobby government, an
d they're pretty good at that. That should represent a significant savings. Should. But whadya bet they pocket most of it as windfall? Why not, they'll have a captive customer base.

More than likely the government would make a bigger push than they already do to encourage Medicare Advantage plans and let the insurance companies basically take it over.

And I for one am very happy with my Medicare Advantage plan!
My advantage plan does MORE for me than plain Medicare and that's why 36% of the 60 million are
using MA plans. For example plain Medicare subtracts $134/mo from peoples' SS. My MA pays SS that
deduction. My MA calls me every month to make sure I've seen my doctor. They also provide me $50/mo in OTC supplies, toothpaste, etc. And the best part is these MAs pay Federal taxes on their profits!

So really ignorant people about Medicare have no idea how it works why the MAs were the best thing to come from the Medicare Modernization Act of 2003!

Medicaid, Medicare reflect 59% of revenue for 5 largest commercial insurers

Don't be fooled. Medicare for All doesn't deny insurance companies their profits. It guarantees them. Medicare is insurance that government buys for us, with tax dollars, from private vendors - generally the same bastards who have been screwing us all in the traditional insurance market. The only difference is that we don't have any say in it. The government sits down with insurance industry lobbyists and decides what kind of health care we'll get. Pretty much the same as ACA, albeit with even less input from consumers.

Medicare for all mean original Medicare, not MedAdvantage plans. 2/3 of the people on Medicare opt for original Medicare and 70% purchase a supplement. I have original Medicare plus a supplement. To me this is the way healthcare should be in this country. I can go to essentially any doctor and any hospital in the country. I pay nothing. I don't get any medical bills. I don't worry about copays, co-insurance, deductibles, or referrals. I don't have to ask permission from anyone to go to a doctor. I never have to change doctors because the insurance company's network changes. The only question I need to ask a healthcare provider is do you take Medicare. If the answer is yes, which it in over 97% of the healthcare facilities in the US, then I get the care my doctor thinks I need, not what an insurance company believes is needed or what the plan covers. When you have a serious healthcare problem, the last thing you need is a battle with your insurance company to get the care your doctor says you need when you needed.

The cost of original Medicare with a supplement is not cheap but to me it's worth the extra cost.

 

[Flopper]

Insurance companies would be removed from the equation, save for those who want to pay for private insurance as a backup plan, or a primary plan.

Uh, no. That's not how Medicare works. They just farm it out to private insurance companies who have lobbied government for the favor.

Big 5 insurers depend on Medicare, Medicaid for growth in enrollment, profits

Medicare Advantage plans operated by private insurance companies now cover 33% of Medicare beneficiaries. For most people, the alternative is original Medicare or original Medicare plus a supplement and possibly a part D drug plan.

For the beneficiary, there are advantages and disadvantages to all three routes. For the government, MedAdvantage plans can control cost in ways original Medicare can not.

Medicare Advantage plans are great for retirees with few healthcare problems since they have low and often zero premiums. Unfortunately, as you age and your healthcare problems increase, these plans can become not only costly but put the beneficiary in a mountain of medical bills for copays and coinsurance which vary with every type healthcare service. The plans are mostly HMOs which means referrals by a primary care doctor and staying in network. Often there is no coverage at all except emergency care if you travel outside your local community.

Premiums medicare with a supplement is expensive but there are virtually no medical bills to pay. You can go to any doctor or hospital that accepts Medicare anywhere in the country which are about 98% of healthcare providers and there is no cost.

Once you are in a MedAdvantage going back to Medicare with a supplement is nearly impossible for most people because they will be subject to medical underwriting.

So what?

The point is that MedAdvantage plans are reducing coverage by forcing the subscriber to pay more and more. In the end they becomes just another insurance company subsidized by the government. They attract customers with their zero premiums. Once a person signs up for one these of these plans they can not transfer to a supplement or a standalone drug plan. This is not how Medicare was suppose to be.

Huh. How about that?. It looked like you were responding to my post, so I thought maybe your post had something to do with what I was talking about. Guess not.

Not directly. Sometimes I get the posts the mixed up.
BTW, 2/3 of Medicare beneficiaries are covered by Medicare, not an insurance company. Their Medicare covered expenses are paid by CMS, a federal agency within HHS that administers Medicare.

 

[Howard Roark]

The only way to put those younger people into that kind of coverage is to mandate it, which was the major flaw in Obamacare!

If you want to do away with Reagan's EMTALA, you can also do away with the mandate. Hospitals should greet people with 'cash, credit,or insurance?'

When I say 'younger', I mean people in their forties and fifties who are smart enough to have insurance, but don't want to pay $6k/year in premiums when they only go to the doctor once/year.

 

[Redfish]

which party passed the across the board tax cut that cut the tax rate of everyone that pays taxes? Which party has created middle class jobs over the last two years? Which party is responsible for the growth in your 401K account? hint: not the dems.

Which party almost passed a bogus healthcare bill that would have taken access away from millions of people? They needed to kill ACA in order to do away with that pesky 3.8% cap gains tax on high earners.

Your claims about the tax cut are laughable, and your 401k value changes like the weather in this unstable market.
Hint...trump's job creation in the last two years still doesn't match Obama's in his last two years in office.

Obozocare was/is the worst legislation in the history of the USA. It would be history but for the arrogance of McCain. No one is denied medical care in the USA, now, before ACA, or after ACA. Obozocare was a failed attempt to have the government take over 1/5 of the economy and force healthy young people to pay huge premiums for insurance that they neither wanted or needed.

Capital gains tax is double taxation and should be eliminated. The tax cuts cut taxes for every tax paying American, probably not for you since its impossible to pay less than zero.

The unemployment rate is at record lows, especially for blacks and Hispanics. Your claim about obozo and jobs is bullshit.

 

[Redfish]

You misread. I might have mentioned supplemental plans, but the point of the article is that the top five insurance companies are getting 60% of the revenue from the plans they serve up to Medicare and Medicaid. Read it again, perhaps without an incorrect assumption guiding you. The government sub-contracts Medicare and Medicaid to private for-profit insurance companies. This is an established fact.

I wouldn't make such a fuss about this, but a lot of people think that Medicare for All will take private insurance out of the equation, when the fact of the matter is it won't. They are deeply embedded in Medicare and Medicaid. Medicare for all will just force us to buy their insurance, whether we want to or not - much like ACA.

Single-payer wouldn't be an end-run around insurance companies, it would be a funnel forcing us to support them.

Whereas I understand that Medicare/Caid are using ins. company infrastructure to deliver care to patients, said patients are only paying for their supplemental coverage that isn't covered under their Medicare plan...which costs little or nothing. Are you saying that insurers are taking Fed money, and pocketing the bulk of that money as profits?

Exactly. Do you really think an insurance company is going to give you a low or no premium Medicare Advantage plan out of the goodness of their hearts? Nope, the government gives them upwards towards or a little more than $10000.00 per person per year just to handle your health insurance. The higher the star rating of a plan the more money they get.

According to the law Medadvantage plans are paid by Medicare to insure members. The amount the plan receives is determined by the number of members and is suppose to be no more than Medicare would pay to provide healthcare if they were Medicare beneficiaries. The insurance companies must cover the same things that Medicare covers. However, the insurance companies are given great latitude as how they will cover them, through private networks, through their own healthcare facilities, etc. The insurance company also become the one to determine whether a procedure is medically necessary, not Medicare.

The way the companies make their money is by offering incentives that will attack younger healthier retirees such as gym membership, discounts on sporting goods, discounts on travel, and most important low or zero premiums. Insurance companies know that healthy people don't pay a lot attention to their share of medical cost. As the members grow older they see their costs rising sharply and they are not able to take advantage of the perks the plans often. The insurance companies often scrutinize the need for procedures, pressure hospitals for early release, and deny coverage for various reason. If a member becomes dissatisfied and wants to go back to regular medicare with a supplement, they find they will probably be subject to medical underwriting which makes it impossible for most people, so they're stuck in the Medadvantage world.

your last sentence is incorrect. you can change plans or go back to basic medicare until March 30 or each year regardless of which plan you sign up for the previous year, and there is no penalty or limitation on doing so.

 

[Redfish]

You do realize that Medicare has both deductibles and coinsurance. Plus the premiums would have to be much, much higher for women to make it work, and you know we can't have that!

.

All insurance has deductibles and coinsurance. The difference with Medicare, is that the admin. fees are a fraction of those in the private insurance sector.

Hell, it ought to be. If we move to "Medicare for All" the insurance companies will no longer have to appeal to customers to make a profit, they'll just have to lobby government, an
d they're pretty good at that. That should represent a significant savings. Should. But whadya bet they pocket most of it as windfall? Why not, they'll have a captive customer base.

More than likely the government would make a bigger push than they already do to encourage Medicare Advantage plans and let the insurance companies basically take it over.

And I for one am very happy with my Medicare Advantage plan!
My advantage plan does MORE for me than plain Medicare and that's why 36% of the 60 million are
using MA plans. For example plain Medicare subtracts $134/mo from peoples' SS. My MA pays SS that
deduction. My MA calls me every month to make sure I've seen my doctor. They also provide me $50/mo in OTC supplies, toothpaste, etc. And the best part is these MAs pay Federal taxes on their profits!

So really ignorant people about Medicare have no idea how it works why the MAs were the best thing to come from the Medicare Modernization Act of 2003!

Medicaid, Medicare reflect 59% of revenue for 5 largest commercial insurers

Don't be fooled. Medicare for All doesn't deny insurance companies their profits. It guarantees them. Medicare is insurance that government buys for us, with tax dollars, from private vendors - generally the same bastards who have been screwing us all in the traditional insurance market. The only difference is that we don't have any say in it. The government sits down with insurance industry lobbyists and decides what kind of health care we'll get. Pretty much the same as ACA, albeit with even less input from consumers.

Medicare for all mean original Medicare, not MedAdvantage plans. 2/3 of the people on Medicare opt for original Medicare and 70% purchase a supplement. I have original Medicare plus a supplement. To me this is the way healthcare should be in this country. I can go to essentially any doctor and any hospital in the country. I pay nothing. I don't get any medical bills. I don't worry about copays, co-insurance, deductibles, or referrals. I don't have to ask permission from anyone to go to a doctor. I never have to change doctors because the insurance company's network changes. The only question I need to ask a healthcare provider is do you take Medicare. If the answer is yes, which it in over 97% of the healthcare facilities in the US, then I get the care my doctor thinks I need, not what an insurance company believes is needed or what the plan covers. When you have a serious healthcare problem, the last thing you need is a battle with your insurance company to get the care your doctor says you need when you needed.

The cost of original Medicare with a supplement is not cheap but to me it's worth the extra cost.

that's your decision and that's just fine. I have been on medicare advantage since I was eligible and have been totally satisfied with the coverage, the doctors, the hospitals and the 0 or very small premiums. But to each his own, there is no right and wrong about this, its a choice.

 

[dblack]

Not directly. Sometimes I get the posts the mixed up.
BTW, 2/3 of Medicare beneficiaries are covered by Medicare, not an insurance company. Their Medicare covered expenses are paid by CMS, a federal agency within HHS that administers Medicare.

Medicare for all mean original Medicare, not MedAdvantage plans....

You got more than your posts mixed up. I'm talking about Medicare, not Medicare Advantage. Medicare is insurance, provided by insurance companies. It's just another group policy, fundamentally no different than a group policy that an employer buys for their employees. Except it's the government buying the policy for taxpayers.

The insurance companies are still making profits, still processing the claims, still denying as many as they can in the name of maximizing shareholder returns. These are the same companies selling policies to employers, and they're making even more money from Medicare than they are on their "private" plans.

33. Medicare is a Private–Public Partnership || Center for Medicare Advocacy

Nearly 60 percent of top health insurers' revenue comes from Medicare and Medicaid

 

[Silhouette]

Yep. As you age, killing you off in a thousand subtle or not so subtle ways becomes the preferred way of doing business. An HMO murdered my father in collusion with his grifting spouse in 2014. Took him four days to die drowning in his own fluids. I would've preferred he died more humanely being water boarded at Gitmo.

HMOs have cleverly eliminated what little vestige of intervention there was between hospitals & insurers as to saving patients lives from the talons of the bottom line. If you belong to an HMO & are over 40, grow a pair of eyes in the back of your head.

 

[healthmyths]

"Absorb'? You mean the costs for administration just disappear from the books?"
"Absorb" meant the normal claim processing costs, salaries, computers, buildings, telecommunications, etc. are ALL expensed by the MACs.
If there weren't any MACs then Medicare would have nearly 100,000 people for which they paid salaries, PLUS payroll taxes, as well as office buildings etc.
Instead idiots don't comprehend that the bragging about Medicare's low cost of handling totally forget these costs are absorbed by the MACs and
Medicare pays the yearly contract.

Take the hundreds of millions in CEO pay for insurance companies, add the advertising/lobbying, and you can fund any infrastructure that Medicare would need if you create a public option.

When younger/healthier people are buying a Medicare plan, it bolsters the coffers, and lowers per capita cost. Cost sharing in Medicare.

What an idiot!
"Take the hundred of millions in CEO pay"
Right.... that will make a gigantic difference!

WOW how disgusting idiots like you complain...
Wow...
But wait...Tell me something...
Why aren't you pissed about these guys??
What kind of life changing decisions that CEOs make DAILY do these guys that you idiots pay good money to watch?
These guys you have NO complaints about HOW much more they make then their handlers, etc.
These guys make no decisions about buildings, hiring thousands of people, and more importantly signing financial documents that if are untrue,
these CEOs will be imprisoned! But you idiots don't complain them.
Finally how what % of the gross revenue of these companies went to these CEOs?

Health insurance CEOs earned $342.6M in 2017 | FierceHealthcare

Top 5 Largest Health Insurance Payers in the United States
These five grossed $431 billion in revenues so let's look at each CEOs compensation: $121 million! Which is 2/10ths of 1%!!!!
And you guys bitch about that !

 

[Toro]

I'm a conservative.
But even I realize that our health Care system is screwed.
Pharmacutical companies are gouging us out of our retirement savings.
Insurance companies are gouging us out of our 401k's.
Doctors and hospitals are performing unneeded procedures and prescribing unneeded drugs for profit.
I'm all about profit - but not profit over deceit.
And not profit over the well-being of American citizens.
I always thought the federal government was fundamental for our national defense, and national defense only.
Not any more.
Get rid of Medicare and Medicaid. Both systems are abused and bankrupt.
Have a single payer system. Tack on 5% on our paychecks and have the government have oversight.
Everybody has health care.
I hate to say it, but that's what it's come down to.

Wow. That’s very leftist of you.

As a naturalized American from Canada, I will tell you this - the American system is better for upper middle class people and higher, the Canadian system is better for lower middle class and lower.

 

[Toro]

My coverage in retirement is fantastic, and since I paid for those before me, I want my cut.

I am almost 50, I will never see a penny from any socialist entitlement programs I have paid in all my adult life... I want to cut bait and get the fuck out of that shit I don’t want to pay anymore into the shit...

You are being alarmist.

If you retire at 65, you will receive benefits from the socialist entitlement programs Americans love so much.

 

[Toro]

Thats because your mind is hoped up on rightwing hysterics.

Out here in the real world a lot of developed democracies have single payer healthcare systems (see Canada, Great Britain etc.) and they have ZERO interest in pursuing the American model.

Which is perfectly fine with me, but no one should be forced into socialize medicine.
Millions of conservative would benefit in no way from socialized medicine, In fact it would make their lives a living hell

....Single Payer, by definition is a system where government pays for everyone's healthcare, financed by INVOLANTARY taxation.

So when you say "perfectly fine with me" but then follow it up with, "but no one should be forced into it" you aren't making any sense.

It should be an opt in, that’s easy.
Sign up for the shit if you want it automatically Excluded if you don’t want it

Doesn't work - people simply don't participate in the system untill they get older and sicker or simply because they are totally irresponsible and when shit hits the fan...what? we are supposed to just let them die or get deformed because they can't afford the care?

See that’s unacceptable, you can’t force people into shit that They do not want, cannot afford, and will never benefit from.

The only way that would work is if you made a one-time choice when you entered the workforce and never had the option to opt-in after that.

Otherwise, you’d have a bunch of people opting not to pay taxes into the system, then choosing to opt in once they got sick.

Such a system would bankrupt the country faster than what we have now.

 

[Toro]

if the government "managed" all healthcare for all americans it would be a huge increase of govt power and would require a new huge beauocracy to administer it. Do you really want you medical decisions made by some ignorant GS7 in a basement cubicle in DC?

Not at all an expansion of power, Redfish; it would just be Medicare covering more people than they already do. You don't talk about a huge expansion of government power in case Washington buys a new aircraft carrier group, along with the personnel to operate it, do you?

And no, there would not be a huge new bureaucracy; you may wish to compare Medicare's bureaucratic overhead to any insurance corp's.

And yes, some "medical decisions", if you want to call it that, are being made by some bureaucrats. You would rather these decisions be made by someone who has but one aim, that is, to profit from you?

But thanks for relaying the Insurance Corp's propaganda message anyway. Not that we haven't heard it all before, but still...

medicare for all would be the VA for all. Careful what you ask for, you might get it. Ask any Brit or Canadian how they like their "free" medical care. Ask them how they like waiting 6 months for a routine procedure. Ask them why they come to the US for treatment if they have a serious illness.

your naivety is amazing.

Most Canadians would rather have the Canadian system than the American system, flaws and all.

 

[Toro]

I'm a conservative.
But even I realize that our health Care system is screwed.
Pharmacutical companies are gouging us out of our retirement savings.
Insurance companies are gouging us out of our 401k's.
Doctors and hospitals are performing unneeded procedures and prescribing unneeded drugs for profit.
I'm all about profit - but not profit over deceit.
And not profit over the well-being of American citizens.
I always thought the federal government was fundamental for our national defense, and national defense only.
Not any more.
Get rid of Medicare and Medicaid. Both systems are abused and bankrupt.
Have a single payer system. Tack on 5% on our paychecks and have the government have oversight.
Everybody has health care.
I hate to say it, but that's what it's come down to.

Oh perfect! The government can do oversight!

Rather than your boss having oversight or the insurance companies making for profit decisions?

Ask old people how they like Medicare

Ask old people how many years they paid into Medicare before they drew a dime! Get back to me.

Most seniors take more out of the system than they put in. That’s a big reason why Medicare is in dire shape. It’s simple math.

 

[WillowTree]

I'm a conservative.
But even I realize that our health Care system is screwed.
Pharmacutical companies are gouging us out of our retirement savings.
Insurance companies are gouging us out of our 401k's.
Doctors and hospitals are performing unneeded procedures and prescribing unneeded drugs for profit.
I'm all about profit - but not profit over deceit.
And not profit over the well-being of American citizens.
I always thought the federal government was fundamental for our national defense, and national defense only.
Not any more.
Get rid of Medicare and Medicaid. Both systems are abused and bankrupt.
Have a single payer system. Tack on 5% on our paychecks and have the government have oversight.
Everybody has health care.
I hate to say it, but that's what it's come down to.

Oh perfect! The government can do oversight!

Rather than your boss having oversight or the insurance companies making for profit decisions?

Ask old people how they like Medicare

Ask old people how many years they paid into Medicare before they drew a dime! Get back to me.

Most seniors take more out of the system than they put in. That’s a big reason why Medicare is in dire shape. It’s simple math.

Bull! Many die before using a dime! The system is in dire shape because demoncraps use it as a slush fund. They helped themselves to 960 billion Medicare dollars to fund Obamacare!