Honest and open debate on gun control

[M14 Shooter]

Perhaps you can elaborate on how banning semi auto weapons will make them unavailable.

Especially if the scores of millions of existing weapons are not confiscated.
Never mind the question as to how such a thing does not violate the constitution.

 

[Liminal]

Perhaps you can elaborate on how banning semi auto weapons will make them unavailable.

Especially if the scores of millions of existing weapons are not confiscated.
Never mind the question as to how such a thing does not violate the constitution.

I have guns that are over a hundred years old in perfect working condition. Those guns will be shooting a hundred years from now.

 

[M14 Shooter]

Perhaps you can elaborate on how banning semi auto weapons will make them unavailable.

Especially if the scores of millions of existing weapons are not confiscated.
Never mind the question as to how such a thing does not violate the constitution.

I have guns that are over a hundred years old in perfect working condition. Those guns will be shooting a hundred years from now.

I have semi-automatic guns that are over 100 years old

 

[RKMBrown]

No one has a 2A right to an ICBM.
what a foolish response

What does an anti-gun loon do when he has nothing of substance to add to the conversation?
He brings up nuclear weapons.

It proves two things. First, the argument that weapons are reserved to fight the federal government is patently ridiculous. The Feds have really really potent weaponry and holding the Fourth Armored Division with Glocks and AR-15s is just the wet dream of Rambo wannabes, not serious scholars of constitutional law.

Second, it points out the lunacy of the "no restrictions" on a citizen's right to bear arms. Citizens cannot bear all the arms in the Defense Department arsenal. No citizen can bear a thermonuclear device, an aircraft carrier or a battleship.

Um.....are you unaware that the Soviet Union was driven out of Afghanistan by tribesmen armed with small arms and other equipment The soviets had tanks, jets and attack helicopters.....and that in Iraq and Afganistan they fought the U.S. military to the point our political leadership just got tired and walked away and we have the most advanced military in the world...with little more than small arms and IEDs.......and yet you guys think that a well armed American Population will just submit to a murdererous U.S. government....

And besides, the whole point to an armed society is to make them decide it wouldn't be worth trying in the firs place...

lol "and other equipment"... Uhm yeah they had shoulder fired rockets provided by America that were used to take down tanks, jets, and attack helicopters

 

[Ame®icano]

 

[Liminal]

Ban all weapons with semi or fully automatic firing systems. Such weapons belong in the hands of 'well regulated militias', not on the streets. Permit long barrel rifles and shotguns for sporting purposes. Permit revolvers. Ban handguns equipped with magazines holding more than nine rounds.

The death tolls from mass shootings is directly attributable to weapons which can fire greater than nine rounds. Such weaponry was designed to be used on a battlefield, not on the street. After a few years, these bans will result in criminals no longer able to obtain such weapons.

Crack down on the manufacturers. Keep them from making commercially available weapons of war. Incentivize them by giving them tax credits for units of sporting weapons produced and fine them heavily for producing weapons of warfare for commercial sale.

Bans have been shown to not work. Machineguns are illegal in Mexico yet they are everywhere. Bans only affect the law abiding as has been shown over and over and over.

Banning these weapons will make them prohibitively expensive and therefore out of reach for street thugs and maniacs bent on killing the innocent.

Oh how nice for you, street thugs won't get guns but your friends will. Are you completely stupid? It's the street thugs who will be selling illegal weapons to dilettantes like you.

 

[RKMBrown]

What is it exactly that you wish to do with an automatic weapon? Please explain.

There are any number of traditionally legal uses for a gun; an automatic weapon is suitable for use in any number of them.

You can't go hunting with it....

I hunt with an AR-15 - why can't I hunt with an M16A2?

doesn't make you any safer in defending yourself or your property

I have a semi-auto M1928 Thompson for home defense -- how is the full-auto version any less effective to that end?

The only reason for a person in our current day society would WANT an automatic weapon, is to commit such atrocities like what happened in the movie theater in Denver.

That's the ONLY reason, eh?
Explain how/why none of the legal machine guns in the US have been used for this purpose?

The reason is the folks in power want to make sure they have sufficient superior firepower over the people.

 

[Liminal]

Perhaps you can elaborate on how banning semi auto weapons will make them unavailable.

Especially if the scores of millions of existing weapons are not confiscated.
Never mind the question as to how such a thing does not violate the constitution.

I have guns that are over a hundred years old in perfect working condition. Those guns will be shooting a hundred years from now.

I have semi-automatic guns that are over 100 years old

Really! Don't tell me you have a Mondragon.

 

[M14 Shooter]

Perhaps you can elaborate on how banning semi auto weapons will make them unavailable.

Especially if the scores of millions of existing weapons are not confiscated.
Never mind the question as to how such a thing does not violate the constitution.

I have guns that are over a hundred years old in perfect working condition. Those guns will be shooting a hundred years from now.

I have semi-automatic guns that are over 100 years old

Really! Don't tell me you have a Mondragon.

M1911 and Savage .22

 

[PratchettFan]

You have posted long rants about what the militia is or is not. And you posted that most people do not understand what the Supreme Court has said. I covered both with one sentence.

The issue about whether the 2A is individual or collective is rather a silly one. The left make the argument because they don't understand the amendment. HOWEVER, the amendment is not simply one of "it's ind

We are now on page 20 of the thread and there still has not been a single supported reason provided. The closest thing was the statement that no one needs an automatic weapon. Not that there is anything to show having one is an issue, only that it is not needed. I don't need to wear black jeans, but I expect some argument stronger than that before I accept a law preventing me from wearing them.

This just shows that laws addressing guns do nothing to impact the actual problem - violence. The only benefit these laws provide is that they are simplistic and relatively cheap, so politicians can use them to pretend they are doing something.

You didn't read what I wrote then? No one replied to it, hardly surprising, people just stick to what they're comfortable with.

It is distinctly possible I missed something you wrote. We don't agree on every subject, but I'd say we are in sync on this one.

 

[Liminal]

Perhaps you can elaborate on how banning semi auto weapons will make them unavailable.

Especially if the scores of millions of existing weapons are not confiscated.
Never mind the question as to how such a thing does not violate the constitution.

I have guns that are over a hundred years old in perfect working condition. Those guns will be shooting a hundred years from now.

I have semi-automatic guns that are over 100 years old

Really! Don't tell me you have a Mondragon.

M1911 and Savage .22

Of course, I was thinking about semi auto rifles. I have a 1911, but not that old. I have a Luger and a P-38 too, but those are both WW2 production.

 

[Liminal]

What is it exactly that you wish to do with an automatic weapon? Please explain.

There are any number of traditionally legal uses for a gun; an automatic weapon is suitable for use in any number of them.

You can't go hunting with it....

I hunt with an AR-15 - why can't I hunt with an M16A2?

doesn't make you any safer in defending yourself or your property

I have a semi-auto M1928 Thompson for home defense -- how is the full-auto version any less effective to that end?

The only reason for a person in our current day society would WANT an automatic weapon, is to commit such atrocities like what happened in the movie theater in Denver.

That's the ONLY reason, eh?
Explain how/why none of the legal machine guns in the US have been used for this purpose?

The reason is the folks in power want to make sure they have sufficient superior firepower over the people.

The police can't really protect you, the best they can do is investigate the crime after you've already been made a victim.

 

[M14 Shooter]

Especially if the scores of millions of existing weapons are not confiscated.
Never mind the question as to how such a thing does not violate the constitution.

I have guns that are over a hundred years old in perfect working condition. Those guns will be shooting a hundred years from now.

I have semi-automatic guns that are over 100 years old

Really! Don't tell me you have a Mondragon.

M1911 and Savage .22

Of course, I was thinking about semi auto rifles. I have a 1911, but not that old. I have a Luger and a P-38 too, but those are both WW2 production.

Roger that.
Both belonged to my great grandfather. God only knows where he got them.

 

[Liminal]

I have guns that are over a hundred years old in perfect working condition. Those guns will be shooting a hundred years from now.

I have semi-automatic guns that are over 100 years old

Really! Don't tell me you have a Mondragon.

M1911 and Savage .22

Of course, I was thinking about semi auto rifles. I have a 1911, but not that old. I have a Luger and a P-38 too, but those are both WW2 production.

Roger that.
Both belonged to my great grandfather. God only knows where he got them.

I inherited mine too. Got a couple of good stories around that as well. The Luger has all matching numbers, original magazines and holster. When my dad was in the army during the Korean War he bought it for five bucks from a sergeant who took it from a captured German officer. It's still in about 99% condition.
The P-38 belonged to my grandfather, it was a gift from a friend returning from Europe in 1945, he had taken it off a dead German officer. It sat in my Grandfathers sock drawer for forty years before I got it, also all original numbers, magazines and holster in perfect condition.

 

[M14 Shooter]

I have semi-automatic guns that are over 100 years old

Really! Don't tell me you have a Mondragon.

M1911 and Savage .22

Of course, I was thinking about semi auto rifles. I have a 1911, but not that old. I have a Luger and a P-38 too, but those are both WW2 production.

Roger that.
Both belonged to my great grandfather. God only knows where he got them.

I inherited mine too. Got a couple of good stories around that as well. The Luger has all matching numbers, original magazines and holster. When my dad was in the army during the Korean War he bought it for five bucks from a sergeant who took it from a captured German officer. It's still in about 99% condition.
The P-38 belonged to my grandfather, it was a gift from a friend returning from Europe in 1945, he had taken it off a dead German officer. It sat in my Grandfathers sock drawer for forty years before I got it, also all original numbers, magazines and holster in perfect condition.

Wow! Very nice. Keepers, both.

 

[Liminal]

Really! Don't tell me you have a Mondragon.

M1911 and Savage .22

Of course, I was thinking about semi auto rifles. I have a 1911, but not that old. I have a Luger and a P-38 too, but those are both WW2 production.

Roger that.
Both belonged to my great grandfather. God only knows where he got them.

I inherited mine too. Got a couple of good stories around that as well. The Luger has all matching numbers, original magazines and holster. When my dad was in the army during the Korean War he bought it for five bucks from a sergeant who took it from a captured German officer. It's still in about 99% condition.
The P-38 belonged to my grandfather, it was a gift from a friend returning from Europe in 1945, he had taken it off a dead German officer. It sat in my Grandfathers sock drawer for forty years before I got it, also all original numbers, magazines and holster in perfect condition.

Wow! Very nice. Keepers, both.

I would never sell them, they will be passed on to my children. Just a small example of the kind fire power that would continue to be available long after guns are made illegal.

 

[LTCArmyRet]

What is it exactly that you wish to do with an automatic weapon? Please explain.

There are any number of traditionally legal uses for a gun; an automatic weapon is suitable for use in any number of them.

You can't go hunting with it....

I hunt with an AR-15 - why can't I hunt with an M16A2?

doesn't make you any safer in defending yourself or your property

I have a semi-auto M1928 Thompson for home defense -- how is the full-auto version any less effective to that end?

The only reason for a person in our current day society would WANT an automatic weapon, is to commit such atrocities like what happened in the movie theater in Denver.

That's the ONLY reason, eh?
Explain how/why none of the legal machine guns in the US have been used for this purpose?

The reason is the folks in power want to make sure they have sufficient superior firepower over the people.

The police can't really protect you, the best they can do is investigate the crime after you've already been made a victim.

You keep asking me to explain things to you. One thing I have learned over the years is I can't fix other people's ignorance.

If you know so much about home defense and the use of weapons, why don't you enlighten the audience here? I know why none of the LEGAL automatic weapons have been used for this purpose, do you? Answer this Einstein, what must be done to the weapon in order to legally own it?

 

[Liminal]

What is it exactly that you wish to do with an automatic weapon? Please explain.

There are any number of traditionally legal uses for a gun; an automatic weapon is suitable for use in any number of them.

You can't go hunting with it....

I hunt with an AR-15 - why can't I hunt with an M16A2?

doesn't make you any safer in defending yourself or your property

I have a semi-auto M1928 Thompson for home defense -- how is the full-auto version any less effective to that end?

The only reason for a person in our current day society would WANT an automatic weapon, is to commit such atrocities like what happened in the movie theater in Denver.

That's the ONLY reason, eh?
Explain how/why none of the legal machine guns in the US have been used for this purpose?

The reason is the folks in power want to make sure they have sufficient superior firepower over the people.

The police can't really protect you, the best they can do is investigate the crime after you've already been made a victim.

You keep asking me to explain things to you. One thing I have learned over the years is I can't fix other people's ignorance.

If you know so much about home defense and the use of weapons, why don't you enlighten the audience here? I know why none of the LEGAL automatic weapons have been used for this purpose, do you? Answer this Einstein, what must be done to the weapon in order to legally own it?

Who are you and why are you talking to me?

 

[WinterBorn]

What is it exactly that you wish to do with an automatic weapon? Please explain.

There are any number of traditionally legal uses for a gun; an automatic weapon is suitable for use in any number of them.

You can't go hunting with it....

I hunt with an AR-15 - why can't I hunt with an M16A2?

doesn't make you any safer in defending yourself or your property

I have a semi-auto M1928 Thompson for home defense -- how is the full-auto version any less effective to that end?

The only reason for a person in our current day society would WANT an automatic weapon, is to commit such atrocities like what happened in the movie theater in Denver.

That's the ONLY reason, eh?
Explain how/why none of the legal machine guns in the US have been used for this purpose?

The reason is the folks in power want to make sure they have sufficient superior firepower over the people.

The police can't really protect you, the best they can do is investigate the crime after you've already been made a victim.

You keep asking me to explain things to you. One thing I have learned over the years is I can't fix other people's ignorance.

If you know so much about home defense and the use of weapons, why don't you enlighten the audience here? I know why none of the LEGAL automatic weapons have been used for this purpose, do you? Answer this Einstein, what must be done to the weapon in order to legally own it?

I'm curious what has to be done to an automatic weapon in order to legally own it.

Please explain.

 

[M14 Shooter]

You keep asking me to explain things to you. One thing I have learned over the years is I can't fix other people's ignorance.

It is up to you to defend and explain your points when questioned.
If you cannot do that, then your points will not sway any thinking person.

So, please begin:
-I hunt with an AR-15 - why can't I hunt with an M16A2?
-I have a semi-auto M1928 Thompson for home defense -- how is the full-auto version any less effective to that end?

I know why none of the LEGAL automatic weapons have been used for this purpose, do you?

According to you the only reason for a person in our current day society would WANT an automatic weapon, is to commit atrocities like what happened in the movie theater in Denver. --- so yes, please do explain why none of the legal machine guns in the US have been used for this purpose.