How do you explain a ordered universe without a Creator?

[zaangalewa]

Maybe our Universe isn't orderly.
Some rules exist and because of those rules certain things happen as a result. You know like the speed of light etc. But that doesn't mean someone created those rules, they just are.

If the universe was not orderly, then science would not exist. The scientific method relies on repeatable experiments. Without a ordered universe, this would not be possible.

Science proves truths through mathematical equations...

Natural science proves with predictions in experiments ("If I will do so, then this will happen") - not with mathematical equations. Mathematics helps only to find such quantifyable, measurable "prophecies". But mathematics itselve is not a natural science. Mathematics creates theories about structures without any form of reality. Just for fun for example mathematicians are doing something and find interesting structures. But suddenly we are able to find structures of mathematics in the reality. How is this possible?

And how does one even explain the existence of mathematics without a Creator? It is not something that we invented. We simply discovered it.

I don't know. In case a circle existed not in the very first moment of the universe and we use a formula which contains in any form a circle (or "pi"(=3,14159...) or ... ) - what would physics really say in such a case?

 

[zaangalewa]

What is happening is that, with the discoveries of modern science (specifically quantum physics), we are confronted by realities for which we have no vocabulary. The relative world we evolved in and created language in has no parallels from which to draw. We cannot, for example, hear that the universe started at 0 some time in the past without automatically asking what preceded. Further, we cannot accept the concept that nothing preceded. We are caught in linguistics.

It's pretty simple. In the beginning was the Word.

"In the beginning was the word" - Anton Zeilinger, 01/21/2015.

"Im Anfang war das Wort. Und wer hätte geahnt, dass diese Aussage in den modernen Überlegungen der Physik jetzt eine ganz andere Bedeutung bekommen könnte. Es gibt immer mehr Leute in der Quantenphysik, die der Meinung sind, das Grundkonzept über das wir sprechen, ist die Information. Die Information als Möglichkeit des Gewinns von Wissen. Wenn das das fundamentale Konzept unserer Weltbeschreibung ist, dann ist das nicht weit weg von ‚Im Anfang war das Wort‘“.

source: Diözese Linz

... Nobody gives a fuck about the jews, we're talking about the bible. 6 days means 6 fucking days.

Whatever could be the opposit of "Nobody gives a fuck about the Jews." without to attack any Jew: that's exactly my choice, Nazi, US-¿Anti?-American one. God made the world in six days. Nothing to discuss about with Nazis.

So now I have to give a fuck about Jews to not be a nazi?
I don't give a fuck about you either.

I doubt about. Nazis never let other people live in peace. If you are wrong then you will explode like Little Boy and Fat Man on no other reason than your own wrongness.

You're so obsessed with nazis that the mere mention of Jews sends you into a Hitler frenzy. I don't care what Jews do, doesn't mean I want them all dead. That would be you.

No comment, Nazi.

 

[zaangalewa]

How do you explain a ordered universe without a Creator?

You can't.

So how do you explain the Creator without a Creator of the Creator?

With "creation". Nothing was before god created everything - including existance.

So who created god?

You did not understand, what I said into the crying loudness of your supreme existance, where everyone is a subhuman idiot, if he's not you, Nazi.

 

[Mudda]

How do you explain a ordered universe without a Creator?

You can't.

So how do you explain the Creator without a Creator of the Creator?

With "creation". Nothing was before god created everything - including existance.

So who created god?

You did not understand, what I said into the crying loudness of your supreme existance, where everyone is a subhuman idiot, if he's not you, Nazi.

So who created god?

 

[zaangalewa]

Who "ordered" a universe?

All I called out for was a pizza.

Pizza "wIth everything" is with universe.

 

[Sbiker]

How do you explain a ordered universe without a Creator?

You can't.

So how do you explain the Creator without a Creator of the Creator?

With "creation". Nothing was before god created everything - including existance.

So who created god?

You did not understand, what I said into the crying loudness of your supreme existance, where everyone is a subhuman idiot, if he's not you, Nazi.

So who created god?

Maybe, another god?

Or god is an incarnation of baron Munchhausen and able to create itself?

 

[zaangalewa]

How do you explain a ordered universe without a Creator?

You can't.

So how do you explain the Creator without a Creator of the Creator?

With "creation". Nothing was before god created everything - including existance.

So who created god?

You did not understand, what I said into the crying loudness of your supreme existance, where everyone is a subhuman idiot, if he's not you, Nazi.

So who created god?

no comment, Nazi

 

[Divine Wind]

An unproven theory.

A very plausible theory backed by evidence in other instances such as the Earth and Moon.

Giant-impact hypothesis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Why does Venus rotate backwards from the other planets?

 

[Divine Wind]

I see, you are always right even when you are wrong.

Do you look in a mirror when you say that? Anomalies exist in nature, but all are still explained by natural law. Not a single one can only be explained by magic. You are free to believe in magic as an answer to the mysteries of the Universe.

 

[zaangalewa]

Nothing that science understands about the "Big Bang" implies a need for your gawds or anyone else's gawds.

What explanation can you provide to suggest that your gawds had a magic "waving of hand" moment to "poof" existence?

Need I remind you that I am the one who asked for an explanation? No one has provided one. Why is that? It's because no one knows. That is a simple fact. Atheists believe in a naturalistic origin for the universe. This belief is based on faith, just as my belief in God is based on faith. Who are you to say that I am wrong?

Need I remind you that special pleading to a "God of the gaps" fallacy is pointless and time wasting?

It may come as a shock to you but there is no requirement for atheism to accept a natural cause for the existence of the universe. There is no requirement for faith to accept a naturally occurring universe.

There is, however, a typical need for religious dogma that defines those who insist one or more partisan gawds magically poofed all of existence.

And yet no one has provided an answer to my question. This isn't about who is correct. I'm simply asking for an explanation for the existence of the universe other than a Creator. Do you have one?

Sure. It's what science calls the Big Bang.

Oh yes. The mythical big bang. You do know that no one saw it happen, right? It's nothing more than a theory. Furthermore, the math for this theory breaks down before they reach the actual event itself. Try again.

If the universe expands then it was in former times much more little when this expansion started. Sure that's a theory because we are only able to travel in our thoughts back in a time billions of years ago. But is it plausible to think this expansion stopped in the past? I'm convinced god is not a liar. He gives us not wrong informations and I would not know, why he should hide what he did, when he created the universe. We are only able to misunderstand or to misinterpret. The math breaks down in a so called "singularity", where the universe had the same energy but had a size less then an atom.

It's by the way for Christians not essential to believe in a special form of creation theory. Who cares? In the first few hundred years people asked us: "What made god, before he created the world?" But what to say about, if there was no time before god created the world?



PS: The universe has no outside.

 

[Divine Wind]

So who created god?

IF the Universe had proved to be an Oscillating Universe, would you be questioning "Who created the Universe"?

 

[Divine Wind]

Oh yes. The mythical big bang. You do know that no one saw it happen, right? It's nothing more than a theory. Furthermore, the math for this theory breaks down before they reach the actual event itself. Try again.

Not mythical. There is a lot of evidence supporting the Big Bang. Are you saying God couldn't have created the Universe in this manner? Are you saying God couldn't know that, 13.77 BILLLION years ago, God couldn't have said, in effect, "Let there be light!" in a big bang and created the Universe in a flash knowing that, billions of years later, life would develop?

 

[TimothysAlaska]

Simple question, really. Why do so many people have a problem with it? Think about it. Order cannot come from chaos. At least not in this universe. Every bit of scientific knowledge we possess says it just can't happen. The universe is extremely ordered. It also contains vast amounts of information. Information has one source. Intelligence. Earthly intelligence is also the result of information. Can you say catch 22? This proves that information has a source that is outside this universe. What is this source? I believe that it is God. Can you come up with any other explanation?

Physics. That is your answer. I suggest taking a physics class. I can debate you but if you do not understand the fundamental principles of the universe, as you clearly do not from the questions you are asking, than you are closed minded and rooted in your fundamental beliefs, which is similar to aristonian philosophy of which was the first attempt at science that we know about. But was flawed as proven by Newton and others. Basically it all mathematics and we are still learning, such as the hypothesis of gravitational waves, which they just recently proved exist.

 

[zaangalewa]

So who created god?

IF the Universe had proved to be an Oscillating Universe, would you be questioning "Who created the Universe"?

I heard an oscillating universe would not be able to reset the entropy. So if an endless row of universes would exist the entropy here would be endlees. But the entropy is growing here.

I gave him by the way the answer: God created everything - also existance! Before he created everything was nothing - also not existance. His question is senseless.

 

[Mudda]

So who created god?

IF the Universe had proved to be an Oscillating Universe, would you be questioning "Who created the Universe"?

I heard an oscilating universe would not be able to reset the entropy. So if an endles rwo ofn uhnicese woud Exit before teh entroyp would be endlees. But uit is it endless. I gave him by the way the answer. God created everything - before he created everything was nothing.

So god created everything and before that there was nothing. Not even a god?

 

[Mudda]

So how do you explain the Creator without a Creator of the Creator?

With "creation". Nothing was before god created everything - including existance.

So who created god?

You did not understand, what I said into the crying loudness of your supreme existance, where everyone is a subhuman idiot, if he's not you, Nazi.

So who created god?

no comment, Nazi

You don't know who created god. Got it.

 

[Mudda]

So who created god?

IF the Universe had proved to be an Oscillating Universe, would you be questioning "Who created the Universe"?

I think that it's interesting to explore the why of the universe and potentially if someone actually made it. But if someone made it, then that person has to have come from someone/somewhere.

 

[Divine Wind]

I heard an oscillating universe would not be able to reset the entropy. .....

If there was enough mass, it would collapse on itself. The problem now is that dark energy and dark matter are causing the Universe to accelerate in its expansion.

Hubble clocks faster cosmic expansion - BBC News
These include the unseen matter in galaxies (dark matter), and the vacuum energy (dark energy) postulated to be driving an acceleration in the expansion.

The gap could also be plugged by the existence of another, but hitherto undetected, particle.

The often-hypothesised fourth type, or flavour, of neutrino would fit the bill.

"This would change the balance of energy in the Universe and it would speed it up," Dr Riess said.

 

[Divine Wind]

I think that it's interesting to explore the why of the universe and potentially if someone actually made it. But if someone made it, then that person has to have come from someone/somewhere.

God isn't a "someone". Not a "he" nor a "her". God is God. Not a "being", but an eternal power that is beyond this Universe yet we are all part of it.

 

[Mudda]

I think that it's interesting to explore the why of the universe and potentially if someone actually made it. But if someone made it, then that person has to have come from someone/somewhere.

God isn't a "someone". Not a "he" nor a "her". God is God. Not a "being", but an eternal power that is beyond this Universe yet we are all part of it.

Have any proof for what you claim or is it just fartsmoke?