How much is a fair share?

[Cuyo]

Agreed. We should repeal Bush's child tax credit.

 

[Big Fitz]

Agreed. We should repeal Bush's child tax credit.

Actually, we should repeal all credits as well as all progressive tax brackets and subsidies for all Americans and businesses.

Flat percentage only for everyone on all profit earned.

Of course, the tax savings would be enormous. So we can pay off the debt, and then then cut the collected taxes to all Americans letting them keep their own money. They can then invest, give charitably or save or spend all their money in the manner they see fit.

A win/win situation.

You willing to do the right thing and go this far? Or is failed social engineering still the priority?

 

[Zander]

I like Herman Cain's 9-9-9 plan. Simple and fair.

 

[Zander]

and i forgot, South Carolina. You have tons of poor people living down there.
My boss works down there and tells us stories of people living in ten x ten slabs ( some with holes in the roof), living 5, 6, 10 people to a small house( thats maybe one to two rooms total.
They make shit for money.


so you dumb fuck people to live on 10k or less.

If theuy're living 10 to a house then obviously they are not the head of household.
Thanks for proving yourself a worthless fucking liar and general no-goodnik.

you seriously are a fucking moron. These are POOR families. Mothers and father who cant make enough to move up. They live in shacks. This is an actual fact.

these people live in 10x10 houses with holes in their roofs.

You want to live in your fantasy world where poor people dont exist in america? Fine, have a ball in La, la land. The rest of us will realize this is really true.

It is sad that some people live in a 10 x 10 pallet house with a leaky roof, but that is their problem. If the people that live in the states or towns where these people are squatting decide that they want to help these poor schlubs - that is their choice. It is not a Federal issue.

PS- a pup tent with a rain fly costs about $20.00 and doesn't leak.

 

[Flopper]

Dear Leader wants "rich" people to pay their "fair share" in income tax while 47% of Americans pay zero in income tax.

No matter how you try to spin it, income tax is only one federal tax, not all of them. The fact that someone pays zero income tax, by itself, means nothing. Presenting this fact in isolation, without considering what other taxes they pay, in order to create the false impression that they are undertaxed, is dishonest.

I agree however, the federal tax codes do attempt to take into account other taxes by allowing a deduction for both sales tax, state income tax, and property tax. Possibly instead of a deduction a credit would be in order, but to keep the total revenue the same rates would have to rise. I doubt this would shift tax the burden very much.

 

[Flopper]

interesting concept but not sure if it is well thought out.
Take this scenario:

Person A earns 75K a year....after taxes, he nets 50K a year

Person B earns 5 Million a year.....

what amount of take home would you deem an equal burden to 25K of a gross of 75K?

Take home 1 million? 2 million?

Furthermore, who makes that decision and what is it based on?

The highest amount that would not lower economy productive. That amount is decided by Congress.

I see.
So congress decides what that number is...the "productive/non productive" fine line.

Curious...is this the same congress that ignored warnings about Fannie and Freddy? The same congress that allows the purchasing of $16 muffins? Pays out over a billion dollars in retitrement benefits to dead people? The same congress that lent 500 million dollars to a company that was analyzed and predicted to be out of cash by 9/2011..the exact date they were out of cash?

That congress?

Yes, Congress should decide what the tax rates should be. Who else is going to?

 

[The T]

I like Herman Cain's 9-9-9 plan. Simple and fair.

Can't REP again at this time...

 

[Kuros]

It is sad that some people live in a 10 x 10 pallet house with a leaky roof, but that is their problem. If the people that live in the states or towns where these people are squatting decide that they want to help these poor schlubs - that is their choice. It is not a Federal issue.

PS- a pup tent with a rain fly costs about $20.00 and doesn't leak.

How do you think that pup tent will weather a hurricane?

I am very skeptical when it comes to government, but I will never ever be a right-winger. I simply cannot comprehend the staggering lack of empathy. We should not underestimate the challenge of poverty or the dangers of economic intervention. But we shouldn't make dick statements like the above, either.

 

[Flopper]

interesting concept but not sure if it is well thought out.
Take this scenario:

Person A earns 75K a year....after taxes, he nets 50K a year

Person B earns 5 Million a year.....

what amount of take home would you deem an equal burden to 25K of a gross of 75K?

Take home 1 million? 2 million?

Furthermore, who makes that decision and what is it based on?

The highest amount that would not lower economy productive. That amount is decided by Congress.

Okaaaaay, so why president doesn't let Congress to decide?

The president can only propose and veto. Congress makes the decision.

 

[Flopper]

In fact I do not think the rich derive most of their income from investment income. I have never seen anything to that effect.

As we move to the top 5%, we see that a larger share of income comes from business ownership and investment real estate.

It really kicks in for the top 1%. Plus they have built up enough assets to get a significant boost from selling those assets for a profit.

How the Rich Make Money | Bigg Success

 

[The Rabbi]

In fact I do not think the rich derive most of their income from investment income. I have never seen anything to that effect.

As we move to the top 5%, we see that a larger share of income comes from business ownership and investment real estate.

It really kicks in for the top 1%. Plus they have built up enough assets to get a significant boost from selling those assets for a profit.

How the Rich Make Money | Bigg Success

OK, so I was right. They do not derive a majority of their income from investment in the classic sense.
Thanks for looking that up.

 

[The T]

you seriously are a fucking moron. These are POOR families. Mothers and father who cant make enough to move up. They live in shacks. This is an actual fact.

these people live in 10x10 houses with holes in their roofs.

You want to live in your fantasy world where poor people dont exist in america? Fine, have a ball in La, la land. The rest of us will realize this is really true.

It is sad that some people live in a 10 x 10 pallet house with a leaky roof, but that is their problem. If the people that live in the states or towns where these people are squatting decide that they want to help these poor schlubs - that is their choice. It is not a Federal issue.

PS- a pup tent with a rain fly costs about $20.00 and doesn't leak.

i never claimed it was Rabbi's problem, I was simply saying we have people in this nation who make under 10k and are the heads of their households.

Um one thing, they are not squatting, unless you mean that in another sense?

And WHY are they only making that much? Could it be that they need to try a little harder Plasmadork? NAH...couldn't be that...the MAN is keeping them down...right?

 

[The Rabbi]

you seriously are a fucking moron. These are POOR families. Mothers and father who cant make enough to move up. They live in shacks. This is an actual fact.

these people live in 10x10 houses with holes in their roofs.

You want to live in your fantasy world where poor people dont exist in america? Fine, have a ball in La, la land. The rest of us will realize this is really true.

It is sad that some people live in a 10 x 10 pallet house with a leaky roof, but that is their problem. If the people that live in the states or towns where these people are squatting decide that they want to help these poor schlubs - that is their choice. It is not a Federal issue.

PS- a pup tent with a rain fly costs about $20.00 and doesn't leak.

i never claimed it was Rabbi's problem, I was simply saying we have people in this nation who make under 10k and are the heads of their households.

Um one thing, they are not squatting, unless you mean that in another sense?

You have yet to show any of that. In fact your own posts contradict the point, as I mentioned.
Time to get a new gig.

 

[Ame®icano]

The highest amount that would not lower economy productive. That amount is decided by Congress.

Okaaaaay, so why president doesn't let Congress to decide?

The president can only propose and veto. Congress makes the decision.

Are you reading what I am saying?

He's not letting them to decide. He wrote a bill, he's asking them to pass it right away. He's running around the country promoting his bill and already blaming Congress for not passing it.

What happen with "all spending bills shall be originated in the Congress"?

 

[Ame®icano]

It is sad that some people live in a 10 x 10 pallet house with a leaky roof, but that is their problem. If the people that live in the states or towns where these people are squatting decide that they want to help these poor schlubs - that is their choice. It is not a Federal issue.

PS- a pup tent with a rain fly costs about $20.00 and doesn't leak.

How do you think that pup tent will weather a hurricane?

I am very skeptical when it comes to government, but I will never ever be a right-winger. I simply cannot comprehend the staggering lack of empathy. We should not underestimate the challenge of poverty or the dangers of economic intervention. But we shouldn't make dick statements like the above, either.

Actually, the tent will handle hurricane better then a 10X10 pallet house.

 

[Ernie S.]

Personally, I think it's immoral to tax a man's labor and if the federal government lived within the confines of the Constitution, we would not need an income tax. That said, if you're going to tax labor, a progressive tax is anything but fair. I don't buy the "rich got the most from society" bullshit argument. A low flat tax applied to all is the only fair income tax.

The rich do benefit from society, but they pay more that their fair share. The poor get everything from society and pay nothing.
Raising taxes on the top 5% and redistributing their wealth to the rest is no more than an attempt to buy 95 votes out of every 100.

 

[Ame®icano]

fair share is when the largest part of wealth for rich people (which is passive investment income) is taxed at the same rate as income.

don't you think that's fair?

fair share is when exxon/mobil pays the same percentage on it's PROFITS as I would pay on my income... certainly not less.

in reality, it isn't really that complicated. fair is getting rid of the bush tax cuts. we did fine with them when clinton was president... and it's been disasterous for us since they were imposed.

you don't think that's unfair, do you?

also, when people post graphs, i think it's important to say where the graphs came from. not all source material is equal.

And don't forget the part of ALL CITIZENS paying... I would whole heartedly agree to removing loopholes (corporate and personal), counting capital gains as income etc... as long as every dollar is taxed the exact same rate, no matter if it is dollar 1 or dollar 100000001

really? you think people should be unable to eat or pay rent?

how about taxing estates from the first dollar?

We're not talking about that, we're talking about Obama's proposed "fair share" of taxes.

Do you support his proposal and if you do, can you tell us what exactly is a "fair share" that rich should pay?

 

[Intense]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAD6Obi7Cag]Dire Straits - Money For Nothing music video (Good quality, all countries) - YouTube[/ame]
Dire Straits - Money For Nothing music video

 

[Flopper]

Okaaaaay, so why president doesn't let Congress to decide?

The president can only propose and veto. Congress makes the decision.

Are you reading what I am saying?

He's not letting them to decide. He wrote a bill, he's asking them to pass it right away. He's running around the country promoting his bill and already blaming Congress for not passing it.

What happen with "all spending bills shall be originated in the Congress"?

This president and every president uses the bully pulpit to campaign for legislation. Ultimately the decision is with Congress.

 

[Big Fitz]

you seriously are a fucking moron. These are POOR families. Mothers and father who cant make enough to move up. They live in shacks. This is an actual fact.

these people live in 10x10 houses with holes in their roofs.

You want to live in your fantasy world where poor people dont exist in america? Fine, have a ball in La, la land. The rest of us will realize this is really true.

I live in a ghetto, but thankfully not for much longer. The only people who are living 10 to a single room here are illegal aliens you seek want to protect their right to live in such conditions. They are often not families either, but day laborers working sub minimum wage jobs or very low wage jobs compared to the market and cutting the legs out from legitimate Americans looking for honest wages. This 'crisis' which really doesn't exist in this nation anymore. I know people who have been homeless and in shelters and totally bankrupt. Three things I do know from them in this regard.

1. Those who are currently this impoverished do not STAY this impoverished UNLESS...

2. Those who stay impoverished have other bigger issues and often should be wards of the state.

3. They are incapable of getting charitable OR government help because of criminal past or previous fraud or exceeding their benefits.

You cry for the "babby mamas" all you want. I've met a few and most of them who last that way have problems with addiction or other mental issues that would exist and destroy any bit of wealth or job or socially responsible position they would have. They are money pits that may as well be wards of the state. Are they the majority of the poor? Not hardly. I've been poor for extended periods of time, and have been slowly improving all my life.

Poverty is almost NEVER a permanent state for anyone, especially children. That is not a fantasy. That is actuality.

wow i see a whole lot of projection and whining in this post.

Shrug

THAT is your rebuttal????? Projection? Whining? When the premise gets shredded in 5 sentences?

So you got nothing competent intelligent OR witty to say? Not even a snappy rejoinder? A snide criticism?

Really? You didn't even bother to play the race card OR call me a nazi, even? Come on! How about a 'hate filled conservatard bastard' for old time's sake?

You just threw in the sponge once again in the face of superior arguments? Such a disappointment from what used to be a decent libtard troll who had at least a modicum of entertainment value and intellectual bankruptcy.

I mean really?