Huckabee Backs Denying Abortion To 10-Year-Old Raped By Stepfather

[Faun]

That's the beauty of choice. You get to choose not to have an abortion. What you don't get to do is make that choice for others.

We definitely disagree on what beauty is. My idea of beauty is a baby. An abortionist idea of beauty is that baby laying on a table cut to pieces and sold to the highest bidder.

Then there's the beauty of comprehension, which is severely lacking as I too believe babies are beautiful. I never said otherwise.

 

[playtime]

I'll pray for all you misguided souls.

I don't want your prayers nor need your prayers & i am sure you feel the same about mine in regards to your controlling thought process'.

Psalms 139:13-16
For You formed my inward parts; You wove me in my mother's womb. I will give thanks to You, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made; Wonderful are Your works, And my soul knows it very well. My frame was not hidden from You, When I was made in secret, And skillfully wrought in the depths of the earth.

Psalms 127:3-5
Behold, children are a gift of the LORD, The fruit of the womb is a reward. Like arrows in the hand of a warrior, So are the children of one's youth. How blessed is the man whose quiver is full of them; They will not be ashamed When they speak with their enemies in the gate.

lol, I particularly like this one.

Matthew 6: 5-6 “And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. 6 But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.

& i'll throw in this little passage too, since the Bible does reference abortion, when it comes to just suspecting a woman was unfaithful, & God forbid possibly being impregnated by another man... then it was sanctioned & even had a priests involvement:

Numbers 5: 11-31
11 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,

12 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, If any man's wife go aside, and commit a trespass against him,

13 And a man lie with her carnally, and it be hid from the eyes of her husband, and be kept close, and she be defiled, and there be no witness against her, neither she be taken with the manner;

14 And the spirit of jealousy come upon him, and he be jealous of his wife, and she be defiled: or if the spirit of jealousy come upon him, and he be jealous of his wife, and she be not defiled:

15 Then shall the man bring his wife unto the priest, and he shall bring her offering for her, the tenth part of an ephah of barley meal; he shall pour no oil upon it, nor put frankincense thereon; for it is an offering of jealousy, an offering of memorial, bringing iniquity to remembrance.

16 And the priest shall bring her near, and set her before the LORD:

17 And the priest shall take holy water in an earthen vessel; and of the dust that is in the floor of the tabernacle the priest shall take, and put it into the water:

18 And the priest shall set the woman before the LORD, and uncover the woman's head, and put the offering of memorial in her hands, which is the jealousy offering: and the priest shall have in his hand the bitter water that causeth the curse:

19 And the priest shall charge her by an oath, and say unto the woman, If no man have lain with thee, and if thou hast not gone aside to uncleanness with another instead of thy husband, be thou free from this bitter water that causeth the curse:

20 But if thou hast gone aside to another instead of thy husband, and if thou be defiled, and some man have lain with thee beside thine husband:

21 Then the priest shall charge the woman with an oath of cursing, and the priest shall say unto the woman, The LORD make thee a curse and an oath among thy people, when the LORD doth make thy thigh to rot, and thy belly to swell;

22 And this water that causeth the curse shall go into thy bowels, to make thy belly to swell, and thy thigh to rot: And the woman shall say, Amen, amen.

23 And the priest shall write these curses in a book, and he shall blot them out with the bitter water:

24 And he shall cause the woman to drink the bitter water that causeth the curse: and the water that causeth the curse shall enter into her, and become bitter.

25 Then the priest shall take the jealousy offering out of the woman's hand, and shall wave the offering before the LORD, and offer it upon the altar:

26 And the priest shall take an handful of the offering, even the memorial thereof, and burn it upon the altar, and afterward shall cause the woman to drink the water.

27 And when he hath made her to drink the water, then it shall come to pass, that, if she be defiled, and have done trespass against her husband, that the water that causeth the curse shall enter into her, and become bitter, and her belly shall swell, and her thigh shall rot: and the woman shall be a curse among her people.

28 And if the woman be not defiled, but be clean; then she shall be free, and shall conceive seed.

29 This is the law of jealousies, when a wife goeth aside to another instead of her husband, and is defiled;

30 Or when the spirit of jealousy cometh upon him, and he be jealous over his wife, and shall set the woman before the LORD, and the priest shall execute upon her all this law.

31 Then shall the man be guiltless from iniquity, and this woman shall bear her iniquity.

Nice passage but nowhere does it say anything about the wife being pregnant, not even a hint of her being pregnant. If the wife was guilty of adultery, she would get sick and her belly would swell. If the wife was innocent, God would protect her from the effects of the concoction. There was nothing magical about the concoction. It was entirely a matter of God using the result to demonstrate whether a woman was innocent or guilty. No mention of abortion or even a miscarriage at all.

What do you think was meant by 'the curse'? That meant that she would bleed. Woman have used that term forever in regards to menstruation & that's where the expression originated from. That concoction would make her bleed & therefore miscarry.

 

[playtime]

What crime did that 10 year old girl commit?

Just think 10 years ago they could have legally murdered her in this country.

What crime did she commit that she should be forced to carry a pregnancy to term in her ten year old body?

Thankfully, physically she might be doing well, but is that all you think matters? You don't think a 10 year old who was raped & had a baby is ever going to be psychologically well again? A grown woman who has gone through that same trauma is never the same again. But, ya THE END RESULT is all you seem to care about as far as the birth being completed. As for living in poverty?


Paraguay is one of the most malnourished countries in Latin America and the developing world. Although the region as a whole has made progress in reducing malnutrition, Paraguay is among the Latin American countries that have made little to no progress, especially with regard to chronic malnutrition.

According to the World Health Organization, 1.55 percent of deaths that occur in Paraguay are a result of malnutrition. Additionally, 32 percent of the population in Paraguay lives under the poverty lines, while 17 percent of the population is considered to be in extreme poverty. Among those populations, food insecurity is more prominent and varies from household to household.

Of those living in poverty, 25.5 percent are undernourished. Additionally, statistics reveal that 60,000 of the 150,000 children born in Paraguay will be born in impoverished households. A 2013 U.N. report states that Paraguay is one of the countries with the highest percentage of malnourished and food deprived people in Latin America..."

Malnutrition in Paraguay - The Borgen Project

Housing need in Paraguay

Paraguay is the third poorest country in South America. Of its 6,340,000 inhabitants (2011), more than 35 percent lives in conditions of poverty and nearly 20 percent in extreme poverty, earning less than US $1 per day.

In Paraguay, thousands of farmers and indigenous families have been expelled from the land through corruption. More than 85 percent of the land parcels greater than 500 hectares (1,235 acres) are owned by just 2.6 percent of landowners. This polarization of land tenure is accentuated year after year and directly relates to the housing situation.

An estimated 1.1 million houses are needed in Paraguay, according to the SENAVITAT 2011- PLANHAVI Report, and this number grows every year.

In addition, 43 out of 100 families— 39 percent in urban areas and 50 percent in rural areas — live in an inadequate house, according to a report by the Inter-American Development Bank.

Lack of access to soft credit for housing and the rural exodus — mass migration from rural to urban areas — are the main reasons families are living in unsafe and overcrowded houses. These situations are producing a rapid growth in the housing deficit..."

Paraguay

11-year-old gives birth to girl in Paraguay

By PEDRO SERVIN August 13, 2015 6:05 PM


ASUNCION, Paraguay (AP) — An 11-year-old girl who was denied an abortion after being raped gave birth Thursday, the culmination of a case that put a spotlight on child rape in this poor South American nation and drew criticism from human rights groups.

Elizabeth Torales, a lawyer for the girl's mother, told The Associated Press that the minor gave birth to a baby girl via cesarean in a Red Cross hospital in Asuncion, Paraguay's capital.

11-year-old gives birth to girl in Paraguay

How many permanent Red Cross Hospitals in a nation's capital indicate that it is not a poverty-stricken country? This was the first pic that came up when I typed in 'typical Paraguay poverty'

Take a look at the rest of them , but as long as that baby was birthed, it's all good, right?

paraguay - Google Search

You start off by asking me virtually the same question I asked you.

Reading comprehension is something you need to work on.

You have not proven she was or is from a poverty stricken home.

The fact that she went to a Red Cross Hospital indicates that she had no other means of health care. The odds certainly indicate that she is poverty stricken. Would that have mattered to you at all if she was dirt poor?

Is it your opinion that only the very wealthy should be allowed to have children.

How stupid can that statement be.

I believe in CHOICE. Give the choice of the female whether she wants to bring a child into the world, no matter the financial circumstances.

Is it your opinion that children go hungry & live in dangerous or subpar diseased circumstances as long as their born?

You obviously don't believe in choice if you choose to allow only wealthy people to have children. The poor from what you seem to be saying should abort there preborns.

You obviously have a problem with reading comprehension. The poor should have as much right to choose for THEMSELVES when or if they want children as the wealthy. Go back to school.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

I'll pray for all you misguided souls.

I don't want your prayers nor need your prayers & i am sure you feel the same about mine in regards to your controlling thought process'.

Psalms 139:13-16
For You formed my inward parts; You wove me in my mother's womb. I will give thanks to You, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made; Wonderful are Your works, And my soul knows it very well. My frame was not hidden from You, When I was made in secret, And skillfully wrought in the depths of the earth.

Psalms 127:3-5
Behold, children are a gift of the LORD, The fruit of the womb is a reward. Like arrows in the hand of a warrior, So are the children of one's youth. How blessed is the man whose quiver is full of them; They will not be ashamed When they speak with their enemies in the gate.

lol, I particularly like this one.

Matthew 6: 5-6 “And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. 6 But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.

& i'll throw in this little passage too, since the Bible does reference abortion, when it comes to just suspecting a woman was unfaithful, & God forbid possibly being impregnated by another man... then it was sanctioned & even had a priests involvement:

Numbers 5: 11-31
11 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,

12 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, If any man's wife go aside, and commit a trespass against him,

13 And a man lie with her carnally, and it be hid from the eyes of her husband, and be kept close, and she be defiled, and there be no witness against her, neither she be taken with the manner;

14 And the spirit of jealousy come upon him, and he be jealous of his wife, and she be defiled: or if the spirit of jealousy come upon him, and he be jealous of his wife, and she be not defiled:

15 Then shall the man bring his wife unto the priest, and he shall bring her offering for her, the tenth part of an ephah of barley meal; he shall pour no oil upon it, nor put frankincense thereon; for it is an offering of jealousy, an offering of memorial, bringing iniquity to remembrance.

16 And the priest shall bring her near, and set her before the LORD:

17 And the priest shall take holy water in an earthen vessel; and of the dust that is in the floor of the tabernacle the priest shall take, and put it into the water:

18 And the priest shall set the woman before the LORD, and uncover the woman's head, and put the offering of memorial in her hands, which is the jealousy offering: and the priest shall have in his hand the bitter water that causeth the curse:

19 And the priest shall charge her by an oath, and say unto the woman, If no man have lain with thee, and if thou hast not gone aside to uncleanness with another instead of thy husband, be thou free from this bitter water that causeth the curse:

20 But if thou hast gone aside to another instead of thy husband, and if thou be defiled, and some man have lain with thee beside thine husband:

21 Then the priest shall charge the woman with an oath of cursing, and the priest shall say unto the woman, The LORD make thee a curse and an oath among thy people, when the LORD doth make thy thigh to rot, and thy belly to swell;

22 And this water that causeth the curse shall go into thy bowels, to make thy belly to swell, and thy thigh to rot: And the woman shall say, Amen, amen.

23 And the priest shall write these curses in a book, and he shall blot them out with the bitter water:

24 And he shall cause the woman to drink the bitter water that causeth the curse: and the water that causeth the curse shall enter into her, and become bitter.

25 Then the priest shall take the jealousy offering out of the woman's hand, and shall wave the offering before the LORD, and offer it upon the altar:

26 And the priest shall take an handful of the offering, even the memorial thereof, and burn it upon the altar, and afterward shall cause the woman to drink the water.

27 And when he hath made her to drink the water, then it shall come to pass, that, if she be defiled, and have done trespass against her husband, that the water that causeth the curse shall enter into her, and become bitter, and her belly shall swell, and her thigh shall rot: and the woman shall be a curse among her people.

28 And if the woman be not defiled, but be clean; then she shall be free, and shall conceive seed.

29 This is the law of jealousies, when a wife goeth aside to another instead of her husband, and is defiled;

30 Or when the spirit of jealousy cometh upon him, and he be jealous over his wife, and shall set the woman before the LORD, and the priest shall execute upon her all this law.

31 Then shall the man be guiltless from iniquity, and this woman shall bear her iniquity.

Nice passage but nowhere does it say anything about the wife being pregnant, not even a hint of her being pregnant. If the wife was guilty of adultery, she would get sick and her belly would swell. If the wife was innocent, God would protect her from the effects of the concoction. There was nothing magical about the concoction. It was entirely a matter of God using the result to demonstrate whether a woman was innocent or guilty. No mention of abortion or even a miscarriage at all.

What do you think was meant by 'the curse'? That meant that she would bleed. Woman have used that term forever in regards to menstruation & that's where the expression originated from. That concoction would make her bleed & therefore miscarry.

Your definition of "curse" isn't the Bibles definition.

CURSE
kurs ('alah (Numbers 5:21,23,17, etc.), me'erah (Proverbs 3:33; Malachi 2:2, etc.), klalah (Genesis 27:12,13); katara (Galatians 3:10,13)):
This word as noun and verb renders different Hebrew words, some of them being more or less synonymous, differing only in degree of strength. It is often used in contrast with "bless" or "blessing" (Deuteronomy 11:29). When a curse is pronounced against any person, we are not to understand this as a mere wish, however violent, that disaster should overtake the person in question, any more than we are to understand that a corresponding "blessing" conveys simply a wish that prosperity should be the lot of the person on whom the blessing is invoked. A curse was considered to possess an inherent power of carrying itself into effect. Prayer has been defined as a wish referred to God. Curses (or blessings) were imprecations referred to supernatural beings in whose existence and power to do good or inflict harm primitive man believed. The use of magic and spells of all kinds is based on the belief that it is possible to enlist the support of the superhuman beings with whom the uerse abounds, and to persuade them to carry out the suppliant's wishes. It has been suggested that spells were written on pieces of parchment and cast to the winds in the belief that they would find their way to their proper destination--that some demoniac being would act as postman and deliver them at the proper address. In Zechariah 5:1-3 the "flying roll," with curses inscribed on it "goeth forth over the face of the whole land." It would find its way into the house of every thief and perjurer. But it was not always possible to commit curses to writing, it was enough to utter them aloud. Generally the name of some deity would be coupled with such imprecations, as Goliath cursed David by his gods (1 Samuel 17:43). Such curses once uttered possessed the power of self- realization. It was customary for heads of families in their declining years to bless their children, such a blessing being, not simply a paternal wish that their children should prosper in life, but a potent factor in determining their welfare (Genesis 9:25). in this case Jacob seeks his father's blessing, which was more than his father's good wishes for his future career. Such blessings and curses were independent of moraI considerations. Before moral distinctions played any part in molding theological conceptions it was not necessary, before a spell could be effectual, that the individual against whom the spell was pronounced should be deserving, on moral grounds, of the fate which was invoked on him. It was sufficient that he should be the foe of the author of the curse. We may assume that such curses signalized the commencement of a battle. But in process of time such indiscriminate imprecations would not satisfy enlightened moral judgment. In the dramatic situation depicted in Deuteronomy 11:29; 27:12 f the curse was placed on Mt. Ebal and the blessing. on Mr. Gerizim. But the curse was the penalty for disobedience, as the blessing was the reward for obedience. The Book of Proverbs 26:2 summarily dismisses the traditional belief--"the curse that is causeless alighteth not." "In the discourses of Jesus we find blessings and curses. They are however simply authoritative declarations of the eternal connection between right doing and happiness, wrong doing and misery" (Cheyne).
Whereas curses by ordinary persons were considered more or less efficacious--some god being always only too glad to speed them on their way to their destination--yet special persons--"holy" persons--in virtue of their special relation to Divine beings possessed special powers of pronouncing effectual curses on account of their powers of enlisting supernatural aid. Balaam, according to the narrative in Numbers 22, was an expert in the article Balak was convinced that Balaam's curse would bring about the defeat of the Israelites (see Gray, "Numbers," ICC).
The term--and the thing signified--plays an important part in Paul's interpretation of the cross. In the light of the law all men are guilty. There is no acquittal through appeal to a law that commands and never forgives--prohibits and never relents. The violator of the law is under a curse. His doom has been pronounced. Escape is impossible. But on the cross Jesus Christ endured the curse--for "cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree" (Galatians 3:10,13)--and a curse that has overtaken its victim is a spent force.
Curse - Definition and Meaning, Bible Dictionary

Nothing about "bleeding".

 

[playtime]

I don't want your prayers nor need your prayers & i am sure you feel the same about mine in regards to your controlling thought process'.

Psalms 139:13-16
For You formed my inward parts; You wove me in my mother's womb. I will give thanks to You, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made; Wonderful are Your works, And my soul knows it very well. My frame was not hidden from You, When I was made in secret, And skillfully wrought in the depths of the earth.

Psalms 127:3-5
Behold, children are a gift of the LORD, The fruit of the womb is a reward. Like arrows in the hand of a warrior, So are the children of one's youth. How blessed is the man whose quiver is full of them; They will not be ashamed When they speak with their enemies in the gate.

lol, I particularly like this one.

Matthew 6: 5-6 “And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. 6 But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.

& i'll throw in this little passage too, since the Bible does reference abortion, when it comes to just suspecting a woman was unfaithful, & God forbid possibly being impregnated by another man... then it was sanctioned & even had a priests involvement:

Numbers 5: 11-31
11 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,

12 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, If any man's wife go aside, and commit a trespass against him,

13 And a man lie with her carnally, and it be hid from the eyes of her husband, and be kept close, and she be defiled, and there be no witness against her, neither she be taken with the manner;

14 And the spirit of jealousy come upon him, and he be jealous of his wife, and she be defiled: or if the spirit of jealousy come upon him, and he be jealous of his wife, and she be not defiled:

15 Then shall the man bring his wife unto the priest, and he shall bring her offering for her, the tenth part of an ephah of barley meal; he shall pour no oil upon it, nor put frankincense thereon; for it is an offering of jealousy, an offering of memorial, bringing iniquity to remembrance.

16 And the priest shall bring her near, and set her before the LORD:

17 And the priest shall take holy water in an earthen vessel; and of the dust that is in the floor of the tabernacle the priest shall take, and put it into the water:

18 And the priest shall set the woman before the LORD, and uncover the woman's head, and put the offering of memorial in her hands, which is the jealousy offering: and the priest shall have in his hand the bitter water that causeth the curse:

19 And the priest shall charge her by an oath, and say unto the woman, If no man have lain with thee, and if thou hast not gone aside to uncleanness with another instead of thy husband, be thou free from this bitter water that causeth the curse:

20 But if thou hast gone aside to another instead of thy husband, and if thou be defiled, and some man have lain with thee beside thine husband:

21 Then the priest shall charge the woman with an oath of cursing, and the priest shall say unto the woman, The LORD make thee a curse and an oath among thy people, when the LORD doth make thy thigh to rot, and thy belly to swell;

22 And this water that causeth the curse shall go into thy bowels, to make thy belly to swell, and thy thigh to rot: And the woman shall say, Amen, amen.

23 And the priest shall write these curses in a book, and he shall blot them out with the bitter water:

24 And he shall cause the woman to drink the bitter water that causeth the curse: and the water that causeth the curse shall enter into her, and become bitter.

25 Then the priest shall take the jealousy offering out of the woman's hand, and shall wave the offering before the LORD, and offer it upon the altar:

26 And the priest shall take an handful of the offering, even the memorial thereof, and burn it upon the altar, and afterward shall cause the woman to drink the water.

27 And when he hath made her to drink the water, then it shall come to pass, that, if she be defiled, and have done trespass against her husband, that the water that causeth the curse shall enter into her, and become bitter, and her belly shall swell, and her thigh shall rot: and the woman shall be a curse among her people.

28 And if the woman be not defiled, but be clean; then she shall be free, and shall conceive seed.

29 This is the law of jealousies, when a wife goeth aside to another instead of her husband, and is defiled;

30 Or when the spirit of jealousy cometh upon him, and he be jealous over his wife, and shall set the woman before the LORD, and the priest shall execute upon her all this law.

31 Then shall the man be guiltless from iniquity, and this woman shall bear her iniquity.

Nice passage but nowhere does it say anything about the wife being pregnant, not even a hint of her being pregnant. If the wife was guilty of adultery, she would get sick and her belly would swell. If the wife was innocent, God would protect her from the effects of the concoction. There was nothing magical about the concoction. It was entirely a matter of God using the result to demonstrate whether a woman was innocent or guilty. No mention of abortion or even a miscarriage at all.

What do you think was meant by 'the curse'? That meant that she would bleed. Woman have used that term forever in regards to menstruation & that's where the expression originated from. That concoction would make her bleed & therefore miscarry.

Your definition of "curse" isn't the Bibles definition.

CURSE
kurs ('alah (Numbers 5:21,23,17, etc.), me'erah (Proverbs 3:33; Malachi 2:2, etc.), klalah (Genesis 27:12,13); katara (Galatians 3:10,13)):
This word as noun and verb renders different Hebrew words, some of them being more or less synonymous, differing only in degree of strength. It is often used in contrast with "bless" or "blessing" (Deuteronomy 11:29). When a curse is pronounced against any person, we are not to understand this as a mere wish, however violent, that disaster should overtake the person in question, any more than we are to understand that a corresponding "blessing" conveys simply a wish that prosperity should be the lot of the person on whom the blessing is invoked. A curse was considered to possess an inherent power of carrying itself into effect. Prayer has been defined as a wish referred to God. Curses (or blessings) were imprecations referred to supernatural beings in whose existence and power to do good or inflict harm primitive man believed. The use of magic and spells of all kinds is based on the belief that it is possible to enlist the support of the superhuman beings with whom the uerse abounds, and to persuade them to carry out the suppliant's wishes. It has been suggested that spells were written on pieces of parchment and cast to the winds in the belief that they would find their way to their proper destination--that some demoniac being would act as postman and deliver them at the proper address. In Zechariah 5:1-3 the "flying roll," with curses inscribed on it "goeth forth over the face of the whole land." It would find its way into the house of every thief and perjurer. But it was not always possible to commit curses to writing, it was enough to utter them aloud. Generally the name of some deity would be coupled with such imprecations, as Goliath cursed David by his gods (1 Samuel 17:43). Such curses once uttered possessed the power of self- realization. It was customary for heads of families in their declining years to bless their children, such a blessing being, not simply a paternal wish that their children should prosper in life, but a potent factor in determining their welfare (Genesis 9:25). in this case Jacob seeks his father's blessing, which was more than his father's good wishes for his future career. Such blessings and curses were independent of moraI considerations. Before moral distinctions played any part in molding theological conceptions it was not necessary, before a spell could be effectual, that the individual against whom the spell was pronounced should be deserving, on moral grounds, of the fate which was invoked on him. It was sufficient that he should be the foe of the author of the curse. We may assume that such curses signalized the commencement of a battle. But in process of time such indiscriminate imprecations would not satisfy enlightened moral judgment. In the dramatic situation depicted in Deuteronomy 11:29; 27:12 f the curse was placed on Mt. Ebal and the blessing. on Mr. Gerizim. But the curse was the penalty for disobedience, as the blessing was the reward for obedience. The Book of Proverbs 26:2 summarily dismisses the traditional belief--"the curse that is causeless alighteth not." "In the discourses of Jesus we find blessings and curses. They are however simply authoritative declarations of the eternal connection between right doing and happiness, wrong doing and misery" (Cheyne).
Whereas curses by ordinary persons were considered more or less efficacious--some god being always only too glad to speed them on their way to their destination--yet special persons--"holy" persons--in virtue of their special relation to Divine beings possessed special powers of pronouncing effectual curses on account of their powers of enlisting supernatural aid. Balaam, according to the narrative in Numbers 22, was an expert in the article Balak was convinced that Balaam's curse would bring about the defeat of the Israelites (see Gray, "Numbers," ICC).
The term--and the thing signified--plays an important part in Paul's interpretation of the cross. In the light of the law all men are guilty. There is no acquittal through appeal to a law that commands and never forgives--prohibits and never relents. The violator of the law is under a curse. His doom has been pronounced. Escape is impossible. But on the cross Jesus Christ endured the curse--for "cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree" (Galatians 3:10,13)--and a curse that has overtaken its victim is a spent force.
Curse - Definition and Meaning, Bible Dictionary

Nothing about "bleeding".

The Bible is chock full of euphemisms. You don't believe that meant to 'bleed'. For example: When the Bible talked about Jesus & his 'flock' was that literal for sheep?

You prayed for me even though I said not to. Matthew had that one spot on though.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Psalms 139:13-16
For You formed my inward parts; You wove me in my mother's womb. I will give thanks to You, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made; Wonderful are Your works, And my soul knows it very well. My frame was not hidden from You, When I was made in secret, And skillfully wrought in the depths of the earth.

Psalms 127:3-5
Behold, children are a gift of the LORD, The fruit of the womb is a reward. Like arrows in the hand of a warrior, So are the children of one's youth. How blessed is the man whose quiver is full of them; They will not be ashamed When they speak with their enemies in the gate.

lol, I particularly like this one.

Matthew 6: 5-6 “And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. 6 But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.

& i'll throw in this little passage too, since the Bible does reference abortion, when it comes to just suspecting a woman was unfaithful, & God forbid possibly being impregnated by another man... then it was sanctioned & even had a priests involvement:

Numbers 5: 11-31
11 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,

12 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, If any man's wife go aside, and commit a trespass against him,

13 And a man lie with her carnally, and it be hid from the eyes of her husband, and be kept close, and she be defiled, and there be no witness against her, neither she be taken with the manner;

14 And the spirit of jealousy come upon him, and he be jealous of his wife, and she be defiled: or if the spirit of jealousy come upon him, and he be jealous of his wife, and she be not defiled:

15 Then shall the man bring his wife unto the priest, and he shall bring her offering for her, the tenth part of an ephah of barley meal; he shall pour no oil upon it, nor put frankincense thereon; for it is an offering of jealousy, an offering of memorial, bringing iniquity to remembrance.

16 And the priest shall bring her near, and set her before the LORD:

17 And the priest shall take holy water in an earthen vessel; and of the dust that is in the floor of the tabernacle the priest shall take, and put it into the water:

18 And the priest shall set the woman before the LORD, and uncover the woman's head, and put the offering of memorial in her hands, which is the jealousy offering: and the priest shall have in his hand the bitter water that causeth the curse:

19 And the priest shall charge her by an oath, and say unto the woman, If no man have lain with thee, and if thou hast not gone aside to uncleanness with another instead of thy husband, be thou free from this bitter water that causeth the curse:

20 But if thou hast gone aside to another instead of thy husband, and if thou be defiled, and some man have lain with thee beside thine husband:

21 Then the priest shall charge the woman with an oath of cursing, and the priest shall say unto the woman, The LORD make thee a curse and an oath among thy people, when the LORD doth make thy thigh to rot, and thy belly to swell;

22 And this water that causeth the curse shall go into thy bowels, to make thy belly to swell, and thy thigh to rot: And the woman shall say, Amen, amen.

23 And the priest shall write these curses in a book, and he shall blot them out with the bitter water:

24 And he shall cause the woman to drink the bitter water that causeth the curse: and the water that causeth the curse shall enter into her, and become bitter.

25 Then the priest shall take the jealousy offering out of the woman's hand, and shall wave the offering before the LORD, and offer it upon the altar:

26 And the priest shall take an handful of the offering, even the memorial thereof, and burn it upon the altar, and afterward shall cause the woman to drink the water.

27 And when he hath made her to drink the water, then it shall come to pass, that, if she be defiled, and have done trespass against her husband, that the water that causeth the curse shall enter into her, and become bitter, and her belly shall swell, and her thigh shall rot: and the woman shall be a curse among her people.

28 And if the woman be not defiled, but be clean; then she shall be free, and shall conceive seed.

29 This is the law of jealousies, when a wife goeth aside to another instead of her husband, and is defiled;

30 Or when the spirit of jealousy cometh upon him, and he be jealous over his wife, and shall set the woman before the LORD, and the priest shall execute upon her all this law.

31 Then shall the man be guiltless from iniquity, and this woman shall bear her iniquity.

Nice passage but nowhere does it say anything about the wife being pregnant, not even a hint of her being pregnant. If the wife was guilty of adultery, she would get sick and her belly would swell. If the wife was innocent, God would protect her from the effects of the concoction. There was nothing magical about the concoction. It was entirely a matter of God using the result to demonstrate whether a woman was innocent or guilty. No mention of abortion or even a miscarriage at all.

What do you think was meant by 'the curse'? That meant that she would bleed. Woman have used that term forever in regards to menstruation & that's where the expression originated from. That concoction would make her bleed & therefore miscarry.

Your definition of "curse" isn't the Bibles definition.

CURSE
kurs ('alah (Numbers 5:21,23,17, etc.), me'erah (Proverbs 3:33; Malachi 2:2, etc.), klalah (Genesis 27:12,13); katara (Galatians 3:10,13)):
This word as noun and verb renders different Hebrew words, some of them being more or less synonymous, differing only in degree of strength. It is often used in contrast with "bless" or "blessing" (Deuteronomy 11:29). When a curse is pronounced against any person, we are not to understand this as a mere wish, however violent, that disaster should overtake the person in question, any more than we are to understand that a corresponding "blessing" conveys simply a wish that prosperity should be the lot of the person on whom the blessing is invoked. A curse was considered to possess an inherent power of carrying itself into effect. Prayer has been defined as a wish referred to God. Curses (or blessings) were imprecations referred to supernatural beings in whose existence and power to do good or inflict harm primitive man believed. The use of magic and spells of all kinds is based on the belief that it is possible to enlist the support of the superhuman beings with whom the uerse abounds, and to persuade them to carry out the suppliant's wishes. It has been suggested that spells were written on pieces of parchment and cast to the winds in the belief that they would find their way to their proper destination--that some demoniac being would act as postman and deliver them at the proper address. In Zechariah 5:1-3 the "flying roll," with curses inscribed on it "goeth forth over the face of the whole land." It would find its way into the house of every thief and perjurer. But it was not always possible to commit curses to writing, it was enough to utter them aloud. Generally the name of some deity would be coupled with such imprecations, as Goliath cursed David by his gods (1 Samuel 17:43). Such curses once uttered possessed the power of self- realization. It was customary for heads of families in their declining years to bless their children, such a blessing being, not simply a paternal wish that their children should prosper in life, but a potent factor in determining their welfare (Genesis 9:25). in this case Jacob seeks his father's blessing, which was more than his father's good wishes for his future career. Such blessings and curses were independent of moraI considerations. Before moral distinctions played any part in molding theological conceptions it was not necessary, before a spell could be effectual, that the individual against whom the spell was pronounced should be deserving, on moral grounds, of the fate which was invoked on him. It was sufficient that he should be the foe of the author of the curse. We may assume that such curses signalized the commencement of a battle. But in process of time such indiscriminate imprecations would not satisfy enlightened moral judgment. In the dramatic situation depicted in Deuteronomy 11:29; 27:12 f the curse was placed on Mt. Ebal and the blessing. on Mr. Gerizim. But the curse was the penalty for disobedience, as the blessing was the reward for obedience. The Book of Proverbs 26:2 summarily dismisses the traditional belief--"the curse that is causeless alighteth not." "In the discourses of Jesus we find blessings and curses. They are however simply authoritative declarations of the eternal connection between right doing and happiness, wrong doing and misery" (Cheyne).
Whereas curses by ordinary persons were considered more or less efficacious--some god being always only too glad to speed them on their way to their destination--yet special persons--"holy" persons--in virtue of their special relation to Divine beings possessed special powers of pronouncing effectual curses on account of their powers of enlisting supernatural aid. Balaam, according to the narrative in Numbers 22, was an expert in the article Balak was convinced that Balaam's curse would bring about the defeat of the Israelites (see Gray, "Numbers," ICC).
The term--and the thing signified--plays an important part in Paul's interpretation of the cross. In the light of the law all men are guilty. There is no acquittal through appeal to a law that commands and never forgives--prohibits and never relents. The violator of the law is under a curse. His doom has been pronounced. Escape is impossible. But on the cross Jesus Christ endured the curse--for "cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree" (Galatians 3:10,13)--and a curse that has overtaken its victim is a spent force.
Curse - Definition and Meaning, Bible Dictionary

Nothing about "bleeding".

The Bible is chock full of euphemisms. You don't believe that meant to 'bleed'. For example: When the Bible talked about Jesus & his 'flock' was that literal for sheep?

Definition of FLOCK
1
: a group of animals (as birds or sheep) assembled or herded together
2
: a group under the guidance of a leader; especially : a church congregation

 

[playtime]

lol, I particularly like this one.

Matthew 6: 5-6 “And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. 6 But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.

& i'll throw in this little passage too, since the Bible does reference abortion, when it comes to just suspecting a woman was unfaithful, & God forbid possibly being impregnated by another man... then it was sanctioned & even had a priests involvement:

Numbers 5: 11-31
11 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,

12 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, If any man's wife go aside, and commit a trespass against him,

13 And a man lie with her carnally, and it be hid from the eyes of her husband, and be kept close, and she be defiled, and there be no witness against her, neither she be taken with the manner;

14 And the spirit of jealousy come upon him, and he be jealous of his wife, and she be defiled: or if the spirit of jealousy come upon him, and he be jealous of his wife, and she be not defiled:

15 Then shall the man bring his wife unto the priest, and he shall bring her offering for her, the tenth part of an ephah of barley meal; he shall pour no oil upon it, nor put frankincense thereon; for it is an offering of jealousy, an offering of memorial, bringing iniquity to remembrance.

16 And the priest shall bring her near, and set her before the LORD:

17 And the priest shall take holy water in an earthen vessel; and of the dust that is in the floor of the tabernacle the priest shall take, and put it into the water:

18 And the priest shall set the woman before the LORD, and uncover the woman's head, and put the offering of memorial in her hands, which is the jealousy offering: and the priest shall have in his hand the bitter water that causeth the curse:

19 And the priest shall charge her by an oath, and say unto the woman, If no man have lain with thee, and if thou hast not gone aside to uncleanness with another instead of thy husband, be thou free from this bitter water that causeth the curse:

20 But if thou hast gone aside to another instead of thy husband, and if thou be defiled, and some man have lain with thee beside thine husband:

21 Then the priest shall charge the woman with an oath of cursing, and the priest shall say unto the woman, The LORD make thee a curse and an oath among thy people, when the LORD doth make thy thigh to rot, and thy belly to swell;

22 And this water that causeth the curse shall go into thy bowels, to make thy belly to swell, and thy thigh to rot: And the woman shall say, Amen, amen.

23 And the priest shall write these curses in a book, and he shall blot them out with the bitter water:

24 And he shall cause the woman to drink the bitter water that causeth the curse: and the water that causeth the curse shall enter into her, and become bitter.

25 Then the priest shall take the jealousy offering out of the woman's hand, and shall wave the offering before the LORD, and offer it upon the altar:

26 And the priest shall take an handful of the offering, even the memorial thereof, and burn it upon the altar, and afterward shall cause the woman to drink the water.

27 And when he hath made her to drink the water, then it shall come to pass, that, if she be defiled, and have done trespass against her husband, that the water that causeth the curse shall enter into her, and become bitter, and her belly shall swell, and her thigh shall rot: and the woman shall be a curse among her people.

28 And if the woman be not defiled, but be clean; then she shall be free, and shall conceive seed.

29 This is the law of jealousies, when a wife goeth aside to another instead of her husband, and is defiled;

30 Or when the spirit of jealousy cometh upon him, and he be jealous over his wife, and shall set the woman before the LORD, and the priest shall execute upon her all this law.

31 Then shall the man be guiltless from iniquity, and this woman shall bear her iniquity.

Nice passage but nowhere does it say anything about the wife being pregnant, not even a hint of her being pregnant. If the wife was guilty of adultery, she would get sick and her belly would swell. If the wife was innocent, God would protect her from the effects of the concoction. There was nothing magical about the concoction. It was entirely a matter of God using the result to demonstrate whether a woman was innocent or guilty. No mention of abortion or even a miscarriage at all.

What do you think was meant by 'the curse'? That meant that she would bleed. Woman have used that term forever in regards to menstruation & that's where the expression originated from. That concoction would make her bleed & therefore miscarry.

Your definition of "curse" isn't the Bibles definition.

CURSE
kurs ('alah (Numbers 5:21,23,17, etc.), me'erah (Proverbs 3:33; Malachi 2:2, etc.), klalah (Genesis 27:12,13); katara (Galatians 3:10,13)):
This word as noun and verb renders different Hebrew words, some of them being more or less synonymous, differing only in degree of strength. It is often used in contrast with "bless" or "blessing" (Deuteronomy 11:29). When a curse is pronounced against any person, we are not to understand this as a mere wish, however violent, that disaster should overtake the person in question, any more than we are to understand that a corresponding "blessing" conveys simply a wish that prosperity should be the lot of the person on whom the blessing is invoked. A curse was considered to possess an inherent power of carrying itself into effect. Prayer has been defined as a wish referred to God. Curses (or blessings) were imprecations referred to supernatural beings in whose existence and power to do good or inflict harm primitive man believed. The use of magic and spells of all kinds is based on the belief that it is possible to enlist the support of the superhuman beings with whom the uerse abounds, and to persuade them to carry out the suppliant's wishes. It has been suggested that spells were written on pieces of parchment and cast to the winds in the belief that they would find their way to their proper destination--that some demoniac being would act as postman and deliver them at the proper address. In Zechariah 5:1-3 the "flying roll," with curses inscribed on it "goeth forth over the face of the whole land." It would find its way into the house of every thief and perjurer. But it was not always possible to commit curses to writing, it was enough to utter them aloud. Generally the name of some deity would be coupled with such imprecations, as Goliath cursed David by his gods (1 Samuel 17:43). Such curses once uttered possessed the power of self- realization. It was customary for heads of families in their declining years to bless their children, such a blessing being, not simply a paternal wish that their children should prosper in life, but a potent factor in determining their welfare (Genesis 9:25). in this case Jacob seeks his father's blessing, which was more than his father's good wishes for his future career. Such blessings and curses were independent of moraI considerations. Before moral distinctions played any part in molding theological conceptions it was not necessary, before a spell could be effectual, that the individual against whom the spell was pronounced should be deserving, on moral grounds, of the fate which was invoked on him. It was sufficient that he should be the foe of the author of the curse. We may assume that such curses signalized the commencement of a battle. But in process of time such indiscriminate imprecations would not satisfy enlightened moral judgment. In the dramatic situation depicted in Deuteronomy 11:29; 27:12 f the curse was placed on Mt. Ebal and the blessing. on Mr. Gerizim. But the curse was the penalty for disobedience, as the blessing was the reward for obedience. The Book of Proverbs 26:2 summarily dismisses the traditional belief--"the curse that is causeless alighteth not." "In the discourses of Jesus we find blessings and curses. They are however simply authoritative declarations of the eternal connection between right doing and happiness, wrong doing and misery" (Cheyne).
Whereas curses by ordinary persons were considered more or less efficacious--some god being always only too glad to speed them on their way to their destination--yet special persons--"holy" persons--in virtue of their special relation to Divine beings possessed special powers of pronouncing effectual curses on account of their powers of enlisting supernatural aid. Balaam, according to the narrative in Numbers 22, was an expert in the article Balak was convinced that Balaam's curse would bring about the defeat of the Israelites (see Gray, "Numbers," ICC).
The term--and the thing signified--plays an important part in Paul's interpretation of the cross. In the light of the law all men are guilty. There is no acquittal through appeal to a law that commands and never forgives--prohibits and never relents. The violator of the law is under a curse. His doom has been pronounced. Escape is impossible. But on the cross Jesus Christ endured the curse--for "cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree" (Galatians 3:10,13)--and a curse that has overtaken its victim is a spent force.
Curse - Definition and Meaning, Bible Dictionary

Nothing about "bleeding".

The Bible is chock full of euphemisms. You don't believe that meant to 'bleed'. For example: When the Bible talked about Jesus & his 'flock' was that literal for sheep?

Definition of FLOCK
1
: a group of animals (as birds or sheep) assembled or herded together
2
: a group under the guidance of a leader; especially : a church congregation

The Bible has many interpretations to different words & passages, that's why there are so many denominations.

Example : Some Christian faiths do not recognize 'torment' or 'lake of fire' 'fire & brimstone' as being a literal 'hell'...

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Nice passage but nowhere does it say anything about the wife being pregnant, not even a hint of her being pregnant. If the wife was guilty of adultery, she would get sick and her belly would swell. If the wife was innocent, God would protect her from the effects of the concoction. There was nothing magical about the concoction. It was entirely a matter of God using the result to demonstrate whether a woman was innocent or guilty. No mention of abortion or even a miscarriage at all.

What do you think was meant by 'the curse'? That meant that she would bleed. Woman have used that term forever in regards to menstruation & that's where the expression originated from. That concoction would make her bleed & therefore miscarry.

Your definition of "curse" isn't the Bibles definition.

CURSE
kurs ('alah (Numbers 5:21,23,17, etc.), me'erah (Proverbs 3:33; Malachi 2:2, etc.), klalah (Genesis 27:12,13); katara (Galatians 3:10,13)):
This word as noun and verb renders different Hebrew words, some of them being more or less synonymous, differing only in degree of strength. It is often used in contrast with "bless" or "blessing" (Deuteronomy 11:29). When a curse is pronounced against any person, we are not to understand this as a mere wish, however violent, that disaster should overtake the person in question, any more than we are to understand that a corresponding "blessing" conveys simply a wish that prosperity should be the lot of the person on whom the blessing is invoked. A curse was considered to possess an inherent power of carrying itself into effect. Prayer has been defined as a wish referred to God. Curses (or blessings) were imprecations referred to supernatural beings in whose existence and power to do good or inflict harm primitive man believed. The use of magic and spells of all kinds is based on the belief that it is possible to enlist the support of the superhuman beings with whom the uerse abounds, and to persuade them to carry out the suppliant's wishes. It has been suggested that spells were written on pieces of parchment and cast to the winds in the belief that they would find their way to their proper destination--that some demoniac being would act as postman and deliver them at the proper address. In Zechariah 5:1-3 the "flying roll," with curses inscribed on it "goeth forth over the face of the whole land." It would find its way into the house of every thief and perjurer. But it was not always possible to commit curses to writing, it was enough to utter them aloud. Generally the name of some deity would be coupled with such imprecations, as Goliath cursed David by his gods (1 Samuel 17:43). Such curses once uttered possessed the power of self- realization. It was customary for heads of families in their declining years to bless their children, such a blessing being, not simply a paternal wish that their children should prosper in life, but a potent factor in determining their welfare (Genesis 9:25). in this case Jacob seeks his father's blessing, which was more than his father's good wishes for his future career. Such blessings and curses were independent of moraI considerations. Before moral distinctions played any part in molding theological conceptions it was not necessary, before a spell could be effectual, that the individual against whom the spell was pronounced should be deserving, on moral grounds, of the fate which was invoked on him. It was sufficient that he should be the foe of the author of the curse. We may assume that such curses signalized the commencement of a battle. But in process of time such indiscriminate imprecations would not satisfy enlightened moral judgment. In the dramatic situation depicted in Deuteronomy 11:29; 27:12 f the curse was placed on Mt. Ebal and the blessing. on Mr. Gerizim. But the curse was the penalty for disobedience, as the blessing was the reward for obedience. The Book of Proverbs 26:2 summarily dismisses the traditional belief--"the curse that is causeless alighteth not." "In the discourses of Jesus we find blessings and curses. They are however simply authoritative declarations of the eternal connection between right doing and happiness, wrong doing and misery" (Cheyne).
Whereas curses by ordinary persons were considered more or less efficacious--some god being always only too glad to speed them on their way to their destination--yet special persons--"holy" persons--in virtue of their special relation to Divine beings possessed special powers of pronouncing effectual curses on account of their powers of enlisting supernatural aid. Balaam, according to the narrative in Numbers 22, was an expert in the article Balak was convinced that Balaam's curse would bring about the defeat of the Israelites (see Gray, "Numbers," ICC).
The term--and the thing signified--plays an important part in Paul's interpretation of the cross. In the light of the law all men are guilty. There is no acquittal through appeal to a law that commands and never forgives--prohibits and never relents. The violator of the law is under a curse. His doom has been pronounced. Escape is impossible. But on the cross Jesus Christ endured the curse--for "cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree" (Galatians 3:10,13)--and a curse that has overtaken its victim is a spent force.
Curse - Definition and Meaning, Bible Dictionary

Nothing about "bleeding".

The Bible is chock full of euphemisms. You don't believe that meant to 'bleed'. For example: When the Bible talked about Jesus & his 'flock' was that literal for sheep?

Definition of FLOCK
1
: a group of animals (as birds or sheep) assembled or herded together
2
: a group under the guidance of a leader; especially : a church congregation

The Bible has many interpretations to different words & passages, that's why there are so many denominations.

Example : Some Christian faiths do not recognize 'torment' or 'lake of fire' 'fire & brimstone' as being a literal 'hell'...

True, but you seem to want to interpret the word "curse" to fit your agenda when the word throughout the Bible has never been interpreted in that manner.

 

[bornright]

Just think 10 years ago they could have legally murdered her in this country.

What crime did she commit that she should be forced to carry a pregnancy to term in her ten year old body?

You start off by asking me virtually the same question I asked you.

Reading comprehension is something you need to work on.

You have not proven she was or is from a poverty stricken home.

The fact that she went to a Red Cross Hospital indicates that she had no other means of health care. The odds certainly indicate that she is poverty stricken. Would that have mattered to you at all if she was dirt poor?

Is it your opinion that only the very wealthy should be allowed to have children.

How stupid can that statement be.

I believe in CHOICE. Give the choice of the female whether she wants to bring a child into the world, no matter the financial circumstances.

Is it your opinion that children go hungry & live in dangerous or subpar diseased circumstances as long as their born?

You obviously don't believe in choice if you choose to allow only wealthy people to have children. The poor from what you seem to be saying should abort there preborns.

You obviously have a problem with reading comprehension. The poor should have as much right to choose for THEMSELVES when or if they want children as the wealthy. Go back to school.

If you re-read some of your posts you might agree with my understanding of it. I enjoyed school and I would not mind going back. Where I live now and the work that I do on the farm would make it very difficult. It is good that you push education as we all need more of that.

 

[Coyote]

I would rather see a life not suffer perpetual hunger, disease, pain.... how many have you adopted?

And the mother is being charged with neglect. That is a criminal, not a civil charge, so she very well could be given a public defender.

I raised five children as a single father, four daughters and a son, after my wife passed away giving birth to our twins.

She should be charged with neglect, she should have protected her child.

Using your logic, all these poor children should be euthanized instead of living a poverty stricken life. You're all heart!

If it meant saving your wife's life, would you have prevented or ended the pregnancy so the two of your could have raised your children together? Could you have been happy with just the three kids if it meant keeping your wife?

It is not a question of you not loving your children, but would you have changed things for the love of your wife, for her life?

You could always have adopted if you wanted more children.

Abortion is not about killing children, but caring for the life of the woman and what she needs or wants.
Children should be brought into the world when they are loved and wanted, not as an accident or violation.

It is not about denying life but choosing when to give life. When is it best for both mother and child.

We knew it was a risky pregnancy and we were both wiling to take that risk. We knew the option of abortion was there, we chose not to go that route. I have no regrets and would not have done anything differently.

We decided that being together was better than one raising our children alone. I lost one early and nearly died from our second. As much as I love my children, I would have chosen life and adoption.

Our instructions were made clear to my doctors and family.

We each did what we feel is best, not because someone forced us to. We had that choice. Why should anyone take that from other women or victims of rape?

They have the right to choose, just as you and your wife did.

Each woman has to make the decision that is best for her, not because others force her one way or the other.

When a women gets pregnant, it's no longer just "her" body. If a woman does not want to have a baby, there are solutions other than getting an abortion. But that would require taking some responsibility.

A 10 year old child should not be forced to take that kind of responsibility when she had nothing to do with the act that put her in that position.

 

[Coyote]

Someone makes the final decision over that uterus. Not You. Not the Government. Smaller less intrusive Government is what is always desired by the right, except when it comes to the bedroom, marriage, & a woman's body. Then Big Brother is your buddy.

That once the baby is conceived it is no longer just her body for the next 9 months

Sent from my SM-G386T1 using Tapatalk

Bullshit. She doesn't give up her body just because she gets pregnant. You're fucking crazy.

She shares it with another human

Sent from my SM-G386T1 using Tapatalk

That human has no rights to it.

So you admit that some humans (white) are better then others

Sent from my SM-G386T1 using Tapatalk

????? What are you talking about?

 

[playtime]

What do you think was meant by 'the curse'? That meant that she would bleed. Woman have used that term forever in regards to menstruation & that's where the expression originated from. That concoction would make her bleed & therefore miscarry.

Your definition of "curse" isn't the Bibles definition.

CURSE
kurs ('alah (Numbers 5:21,23,17, etc.), me'erah (Proverbs 3:33; Malachi 2:2, etc.), klalah (Genesis 27:12,13); katara (Galatians 3:10,13)):
This word as noun and verb renders different Hebrew words, some of them being more or less synonymous, differing only in degree of strength. It is often used in contrast with "bless" or "blessing" (Deuteronomy 11:29). When a curse is pronounced against any person, we are not to understand this as a mere wish, however violent, that disaster should overtake the person in question, any more than we are to understand that a corresponding "blessing" conveys simply a wish that prosperity should be the lot of the person on whom the blessing is invoked. A curse was considered to possess an inherent power of carrying itself into effect. Prayer has been defined as a wish referred to God. Curses (or blessings) were imprecations referred to supernatural beings in whose existence and power to do good or inflict harm primitive man believed. The use of magic and spells of all kinds is based on the belief that it is possible to enlist the support of the superhuman beings with whom the uerse abounds, and to persuade them to carry out the suppliant's wishes. It has been suggested that spells were written on pieces of parchment and cast to the winds in the belief that they would find their way to their proper destination--that some demoniac being would act as postman and deliver them at the proper address. In Zechariah 5:1-3 the "flying roll," with curses inscribed on it "goeth forth over the face of the whole land." It would find its way into the house of every thief and perjurer. But it was not always possible to commit curses to writing, it was enough to utter them aloud. Generally the name of some deity would be coupled with such imprecations, as Goliath cursed David by his gods (1 Samuel 17:43). Such curses once uttered possessed the power of self- realization. It was customary for heads of families in their declining years to bless their children, such a blessing being, not simply a paternal wish that their children should prosper in life, but a potent factor in determining their welfare (Genesis 9:25). in this case Jacob seeks his father's blessing, which was more than his father's good wishes for his future career. Such blessings and curses were independent of moraI considerations. Before moral distinctions played any part in molding theological conceptions it was not necessary, before a spell could be effectual, that the individual against whom the spell was pronounced should be deserving, on moral grounds, of the fate which was invoked on him. It was sufficient that he should be the foe of the author of the curse. We may assume that such curses signalized the commencement of a battle. But in process of time such indiscriminate imprecations would not satisfy enlightened moral judgment. In the dramatic situation depicted in Deuteronomy 11:29; 27:12 f the curse was placed on Mt. Ebal and the blessing. on Mr. Gerizim. But the curse was the penalty for disobedience, as the blessing was the reward for obedience. The Book of Proverbs 26:2 summarily dismisses the traditional belief--"the curse that is causeless alighteth not." "In the discourses of Jesus we find blessings and curses. They are however simply authoritative declarations of the eternal connection between right doing and happiness, wrong doing and misery" (Cheyne).
Whereas curses by ordinary persons were considered more or less efficacious--some god being always only too glad to speed them on their way to their destination--yet special persons--"holy" persons--in virtue of their special relation to Divine beings possessed special powers of pronouncing effectual curses on account of their powers of enlisting supernatural aid. Balaam, according to the narrative in Numbers 22, was an expert in the article Balak was convinced that Balaam's curse would bring about the defeat of the Israelites (see Gray, "Numbers," ICC).
The term--and the thing signified--plays an important part in Paul's interpretation of the cross. In the light of the law all men are guilty. There is no acquittal through appeal to a law that commands and never forgives--prohibits and never relents. The violator of the law is under a curse. His doom has been pronounced. Escape is impossible. But on the cross Jesus Christ endured the curse--for "cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree" (Galatians 3:10,13)--and a curse that has overtaken its victim is a spent force.
Curse - Definition and Meaning, Bible Dictionary

Nothing about "bleeding".

The Bible is chock full of euphemisms. You don't believe that meant to 'bleed'. For example: When the Bible talked about Jesus & his 'flock' was that literal for sheep?

Definition of FLOCK
1
: a group of animals (as birds or sheep) assembled or herded together
2
: a group under the guidance of a leader; especially : a church congregation

The Bible has many interpretations to different words & passages, that's why there are so many denominations.

Example : Some Christian faiths do not recognize 'torment' or 'lake of fire' 'fire & brimstone' as being a literal 'hell'...

True, but you seem to want to interpret the word "curse" to fit your agenda when the word throughout the Bible has never been interpreted in that manner.

And you want to interpret it, not to be what it means, but to suit your agenda. To make her belly swell, her thighs rot & have a 'curse' bestowed upon her if she lay with another man, but if no curse is experienced, then she would be considered clean & can then take her husband's seed. (I'm paraphrasing)

Women were considered unclean during menstruation, where they would even have to remove themselves during that time. I am not going to get into a long debate about Bible passages with you, but I will reiterate:
'And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others', like I said at the beginning of this thread turn.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

I raised five children as a single father, four daughters and a son, after my wife passed away giving birth to our twins.

She should be charged with neglect, she should have protected her child.

Using your logic, all these poor children should be euthanized instead of living a poverty stricken life. You're all heart!

If it meant saving your wife's life, would you have prevented or ended the pregnancy so the two of your could have raised your children together? Could you have been happy with just the three kids if it meant keeping your wife?

It is not a question of you not loving your children, but would you have changed things for the love of your wife, for her life?

You could always have adopted if you wanted more children.

Abortion is not about killing children, but caring for the life of the woman and what she needs or wants.
Children should be brought into the world when they are loved and wanted, not as an accident or violation.

It is not about denying life but choosing when to give life. When is it best for both mother and child.

We knew it was a risky pregnancy and we were both wiling to take that risk. We knew the option of abortion was there, we chose not to go that route. I have no regrets and would not have done anything differently.

We decided that being together was better than one raising our children alone. I lost one early and nearly died from our second. As much as I love my children, I would have chosen life and adoption.

Our instructions were made clear to my doctors and family.

We each did what we feel is best, not because someone forced us to. We had that choice. Why should anyone take that from other women or victims of rape?

They have the right to choose, just as you and your wife did.

Each woman has to make the decision that is best for her, not because others force her one way or the other.

When a women gets pregnant, it's no longer just "her" body. If a woman does not want to have a baby, there are solutions other than getting an abortion. But that would require taking some responsibility.

A 10 year old child should not be forced to take that kind of responsibility when she had nothing to do with the act that put her in that position.

No one is forcing her to take responsibility of raising the child. There are other alternatives besides killing an innocent life. There are adoptions, government agencies could and hopefully would help and I'm sure there are other relatives other than her piss poor mother that can help as well.

 

[playtime]

What crime did she commit that she should be forced to carry a pregnancy to term in her ten year old body?

The fact that she went to a Red Cross Hospital indicates that she had no other means of health care. The odds certainly indicate that she is poverty stricken. Would that have mattered to you at all if she was dirt poor?

Is it your opinion that only the very wealthy should be allowed to have children.

How stupid can that statement be.

I believe in CHOICE. Give the choice of the female whether she wants to bring a child into the world, no matter the financial circumstances.

Is it your opinion that children go hungry & live in dangerous or subpar diseased circumstances as long as their born?

You obviously don't believe in choice if you choose to allow only wealthy people to have children. The poor from what you seem to be saying should abort there preborns.

You obviously have a problem with reading comprehension. The poor should have as much right to choose for THEMSELVES when or if they want children as the wealthy. Go back to school.

If you re-read some of your posts you might agree with my understanding of it. I enjoyed school and I would not mind going back. Where I live now and the work that I do on the farm would make it very difficult. It is good that you push education as we all need more of that.

However you interpreted it, I assure you I did not mean it that way.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Your definition of "curse" isn't the Bibles definition.

CURSE
kurs ('alah (Numbers 5:21,23,17, etc.), me'erah (Proverbs 3:33; Malachi 2:2, etc.), klalah (Genesis 27:12,13); katara (Galatians 3:10,13)):
This word as noun and verb renders different Hebrew words, some of them being more or less synonymous, differing only in degree of strength. It is often used in contrast with "bless" or "blessing" (Deuteronomy 11:29). When a curse is pronounced against any person, we are not to understand this as a mere wish, however violent, that disaster should overtake the person in question, any more than we are to understand that a corresponding "blessing" conveys simply a wish that prosperity should be the lot of the person on whom the blessing is invoked. A curse was considered to possess an inherent power of carrying itself into effect. Prayer has been defined as a wish referred to God. Curses (or blessings) were imprecations referred to supernatural beings in whose existence and power to do good or inflict harm primitive man believed. The use of magic and spells of all kinds is based on the belief that it is possible to enlist the support of the superhuman beings with whom the uerse abounds, and to persuade them to carry out the suppliant's wishes. It has been suggested that spells were written on pieces of parchment and cast to the winds in the belief that they would find their way to their proper destination--that some demoniac being would act as postman and deliver them at the proper address. In Zechariah 5:1-3 the "flying roll," with curses inscribed on it "goeth forth over the face of the whole land." It would find its way into the house of every thief and perjurer. But it was not always possible to commit curses to writing, it was enough to utter them aloud. Generally the name of some deity would be coupled with such imprecations, as Goliath cursed David by his gods (1 Samuel 17:43). Such curses once uttered possessed the power of self- realization. It was customary for heads of families in their declining years to bless their children, such a blessing being, not simply a paternal wish that their children should prosper in life, but a potent factor in determining their welfare (Genesis 9:25). in this case Jacob seeks his father's blessing, which was more than his father's good wishes for his future career. Such blessings and curses were independent of moraI considerations. Before moral distinctions played any part in molding theological conceptions it was not necessary, before a spell could be effectual, that the individual against whom the spell was pronounced should be deserving, on moral grounds, of the fate which was invoked on him. It was sufficient that he should be the foe of the author of the curse. We may assume that such curses signalized the commencement of a battle. But in process of time such indiscriminate imprecations would not satisfy enlightened moral judgment. In the dramatic situation depicted in Deuteronomy 11:29; 27:12 f the curse was placed on Mt. Ebal and the blessing. on Mr. Gerizim. But the curse was the penalty for disobedience, as the blessing was the reward for obedience. The Book of Proverbs 26:2 summarily dismisses the traditional belief--"the curse that is causeless alighteth not." "In the discourses of Jesus we find blessings and curses. They are however simply authoritative declarations of the eternal connection between right doing and happiness, wrong doing and misery" (Cheyne).
Whereas curses by ordinary persons were considered more or less efficacious--some god being always only too glad to speed them on their way to their destination--yet special persons--"holy" persons--in virtue of their special relation to Divine beings possessed special powers of pronouncing effectual curses on account of their powers of enlisting supernatural aid. Balaam, according to the narrative in Numbers 22, was an expert in the article Balak was convinced that Balaam's curse would bring about the defeat of the Israelites (see Gray, "Numbers," ICC).
The term--and the thing signified--plays an important part in Paul's interpretation of the cross. In the light of the law all men are guilty. There is no acquittal through appeal to a law that commands and never forgives--prohibits and never relents. The violator of the law is under a curse. His doom has been pronounced. Escape is impossible. But on the cross Jesus Christ endured the curse--for "cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree" (Galatians 3:10,13)--and a curse that has overtaken its victim is a spent force.
Curse - Definition and Meaning, Bible Dictionary

Nothing about "bleeding".

The Bible is chock full of euphemisms. You don't believe that meant to 'bleed'. For example: When the Bible talked about Jesus & his 'flock' was that literal for sheep?

Definition of FLOCK
1
: a group of animals (as birds or sheep) assembled or herded together
2
: a group under the guidance of a leader; especially : a church congregation

The Bible has many interpretations to different words & passages, that's why there are so many denominations.

Example : Some Christian faiths do not recognize 'torment' or 'lake of fire' 'fire & brimstone' as being a literal 'hell'...

True, but you seem to want to interpret the word "curse" to fit your agenda when the word throughout the Bible has never been interpreted in that manner.

And you want to interpret it, not to be what it means, to suits your agenda. To make her belly swell, her thighs rot & have a 'curse' bestowed upon her if she lay with another man, but if no curse is experienced, then she would be considered clean & can then take her husband's seed. (I'm paraphrasing)

Women were considered unclean during menstruation, where she would even have to remove herself during that time. I am not going to get into a long debate about Bible passages with you, but I will say reiterate:
'And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others', like I said at the beginning of this thread turn.

I used the Bible itself to explain how the word "curse" is used. I didn't offer up any sort of definition of my own.

I'm not sure why you're repeating yourself. No one here is praying. I did say I would pray for you and I shall when the time is right.

 

[Coyote]

If it meant saving your wife's life, would you have prevented or ended the pregnancy so the two of your could have raised your children together? Could you have been happy with just the three kids if it meant keeping your wife?

It is not a question of you not loving your children, but would you have changed things for the love of your wife, for her life?

You could always have adopted if you wanted more children.

Abortion is not about killing children, but caring for the life of the woman and what she needs or wants.
Children should be brought into the world when they are loved and wanted, not as an accident or violation.

It is not about denying life but choosing when to give life. When is it best for both mother and child.

We knew it was a risky pregnancy and we were both wiling to take that risk. We knew the option of abortion was there, we chose not to go that route. I have no regrets and would not have done anything differently.

We decided that being together was better than one raising our children alone. I lost one early and nearly died from our second. As much as I love my children, I would have chosen life and adoption.

Our instructions were made clear to my doctors and family.

We each did what we feel is best, not because someone forced us to. We had that choice. Why should anyone take that from other women or victims of rape?

They have the right to choose, just as you and your wife did.

Each woman has to make the decision that is best for her, not because others force her one way or the other.

When a women gets pregnant, it's no longer just "her" body. If a woman does not want to have a baby, there are solutions other than getting an abortion. But that would require taking some responsibility.

A 10 year old child should not be forced to take that kind of responsibility when she had nothing to do with the act that put her in that position.

No one is forcing her to take responsibility of raising the child. There are other alternatives besides killing an innocent life. There are adoptions, government agencies could and hopefully would help and I'm sure there are other relatives other than her piss poor mother that can help as well.

They are forcing her to "take responsibility" by carrying a pregnancy she did not want through to birth and hopefully not lose her life over it. That is a very heavy load for a 10 yr old.

 

[playtime]

The Bible is chock full of euphemisms. You don't believe that meant to 'bleed'. For example: When the Bible talked about Jesus & his 'flock' was that literal for sheep?

Definition of FLOCK
1
: a group of animals (as birds or sheep) assembled or herded together
2
: a group under the guidance of a leader; especially : a church congregation

The Bible has many interpretations to different words & passages, that's why there are so many denominations.

Example : Some Christian faiths do not recognize 'torment' or 'lake of fire' 'fire & brimstone' as being a literal 'hell'...

True, but you seem to want to interpret the word "curse" to fit your agenda when the word throughout the Bible has never been interpreted in that manner.

And you want to interpret it, not to be what it means, to suits your agenda. To make her belly swell, her thighs rot & have a 'curse' bestowed upon her if she lay with another man, but if no curse is experienced, then she would be considered clean & can then take her husband's seed. (I'm paraphrasing)

Women were considered unclean during menstruation, where she would even have to remove herself during that time. I am not going to get into a long debate about Bible passages with you, but I will say reiterate:
'And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others', like I said at the beginning of this thread turn.

I used the Bible itself to explain how the word "curse" is used. I didn't offer up any sort of definition of my own.

I'm not sure why you're repeating yourself. No one here is praying. I did say I would pray for you and I shall when the time is right.

You posted Bible Psalms directed to me right after I said do not pray for me. Why? so other can see. I do suspect you will continue.

So others can see.

 

[Faun]

I don't want your prayers nor need your prayers & i am sure you feel the same about mine in regards to your controlling thought process'.

Psalms 139:13-16
For You formed my inward parts; You wove me in my mother's womb. I will give thanks to You, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made; Wonderful are Your works, And my soul knows it very well. My frame was not hidden from You, When I was made in secret, And skillfully wrought in the depths of the earth.

Psalms 127:3-5
Behold, children are a gift of the LORD, The fruit of the womb is a reward. Like arrows in the hand of a warrior, So are the children of one's youth. How blessed is the man whose quiver is full of them; They will not be ashamed When they speak with their enemies in the gate.

lol, I particularly like this one.

Matthew 6: 5-6 “And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. 6 But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.

& i'll throw in this little passage too, since the Bible does reference abortion, when it comes to just suspecting a woman was unfaithful, & God forbid possibly being impregnated by another man... then it was sanctioned & even had a priests involvement:

Numbers 5: 11-31
11 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,

12 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, If any man's wife go aside, and commit a trespass against him,

13 And a man lie with her carnally, and it be hid from the eyes of her husband, and be kept close, and she be defiled, and there be no witness against her, neither she be taken with the manner;

14 And the spirit of jealousy come upon him, and he be jealous of his wife, and she be defiled: or if the spirit of jealousy come upon him, and he be jealous of his wife, and she be not defiled:

15 Then shall the man bring his wife unto the priest, and he shall bring her offering for her, the tenth part of an ephah of barley meal; he shall pour no oil upon it, nor put frankincense thereon; for it is an offering of jealousy, an offering of memorial, bringing iniquity to remembrance.

16 And the priest shall bring her near, and set her before the LORD:

17 And the priest shall take holy water in an earthen vessel; and of the dust that is in the floor of the tabernacle the priest shall take, and put it into the water:

18 And the priest shall set the woman before the LORD, and uncover the woman's head, and put the offering of memorial in her hands, which is the jealousy offering: and the priest shall have in his hand the bitter water that causeth the curse:

19 And the priest shall charge her by an oath, and say unto the woman, If no man have lain with thee, and if thou hast not gone aside to uncleanness with another instead of thy husband, be thou free from this bitter water that causeth the curse:

20 But if thou hast gone aside to another instead of thy husband, and if thou be defiled, and some man have lain with thee beside thine husband:

21 Then the priest shall charge the woman with an oath of cursing, and the priest shall say unto the woman, The LORD make thee a curse and an oath among thy people, when the LORD doth make thy thigh to rot, and thy belly to swell;

22 And this water that causeth the curse shall go into thy bowels, to make thy belly to swell, and thy thigh to rot: And the woman shall say, Amen, amen.

23 And the priest shall write these curses in a book, and he shall blot them out with the bitter water:

24 And he shall cause the woman to drink the bitter water that causeth the curse: and the water that causeth the curse shall enter into her, and become bitter.

25 Then the priest shall take the jealousy offering out of the woman's hand, and shall wave the offering before the LORD, and offer it upon the altar:

26 And the priest shall take an handful of the offering, even the memorial thereof, and burn it upon the altar, and afterward shall cause the woman to drink the water.

27 And when he hath made her to drink the water, then it shall come to pass, that, if she be defiled, and have done trespass against her husband, that the water that causeth the curse shall enter into her, and become bitter, and her belly shall swell, and her thigh shall rot: and the woman shall be a curse among her people.

28 And if the woman be not defiled, but be clean; then she shall be free, and shall conceive seed.

29 This is the law of jealousies, when a wife goeth aside to another instead of her husband, and is defiled;

30 Or when the spirit of jealousy cometh upon him, and he be jealous over his wife, and shall set the woman before the LORD, and the priest shall execute upon her all this law.

31 Then shall the man be guiltless from iniquity, and this woman shall bear her iniquity.

Nice passage but nowhere does it say anything about the wife being pregnant, not even a hint of her being pregnant. If the wife was guilty of adultery, she would get sick and her belly would swell. If the wife was innocent, God would protect her from the effects of the concoction. There was nothing magical about the concoction. It was entirely a matter of God using the result to demonstrate whether a woman was innocent or guilty. No mention of abortion or even a miscarriage at all.

What do you think was meant by 'the curse'? That meant that she would bleed. Woman have used that term forever in regards to menstruation & that's where the expression originated from. That concoction would make her bleed & therefore miscarry.

Your definition of "curse" isn't the Bibles definition.

CURSE
kurs ('alah (Numbers 5:21,23,17, etc.), me'erah (Proverbs 3:33; Malachi 2:2, etc.), klalah (Genesis 27:12,13); katara (Galatians 3:10,13)):
This word as noun and verb renders different Hebrew words, some of them being more or less synonymous, differing only in degree of strength. It is often used in contrast with "bless" or "blessing" (Deuteronomy 11:29). When a curse is pronounced against any person, we are not to understand this as a mere wish, however violent, that disaster should overtake the person in question, any more than we are to understand that a corresponding "blessing" conveys simply a wish that prosperity should be the lot of the person on whom the blessing is invoked. A curse was considered to possess an inherent power of carrying itself into effect. Prayer has been defined as a wish referred to God. Curses (or blessings) were imprecations referred to supernatural beings in whose existence and power to do good or inflict harm primitive man believed. The use of magic and spells of all kinds is based on the belief that it is possible to enlist the support of the superhuman beings with whom the uerse abounds, and to persuade them to carry out the suppliant's wishes. It has been suggested that spells were written on pieces of parchment and cast to the winds in the belief that they would find their way to their proper destination--that some demoniac being would act as postman and deliver them at the proper address. In Zechariah 5:1-3 the "flying roll," with curses inscribed on it "goeth forth over the face of the whole land." It would find its way into the house of every thief and perjurer. But it was not always possible to commit curses to writing, it was enough to utter them aloud. Generally the name of some deity would be coupled with such imprecations, as Goliath cursed David by his gods (1 Samuel 17:43). Such curses once uttered possessed the power of self- realization. It was customary for heads of families in their declining years to bless their children, such a blessing being, not simply a paternal wish that their children should prosper in life, but a potent factor in determining their welfare (Genesis 9:25). in this case Jacob seeks his father's blessing, which was more than his father's good wishes for his future career. Such blessings and curses were independent of moraI considerations. Before moral distinctions played any part in molding theological conceptions it was not necessary, before a spell could be effectual, that the individual against whom the spell was pronounced should be deserving, on moral grounds, of the fate which was invoked on him. It was sufficient that he should be the foe of the author of the curse. We may assume that such curses signalized the commencement of a battle. But in process of time such indiscriminate imprecations would not satisfy enlightened moral judgment. In the dramatic situation depicted in Deuteronomy 11:29; 27:12 f the curse was placed on Mt. Ebal and the blessing. on Mr. Gerizim. But the curse was the penalty for disobedience, as the blessing was the reward for obedience. The Book of Proverbs 26:2 summarily dismisses the traditional belief--"the curse that is causeless alighteth not." "In the discourses of Jesus we find blessings and curses. They are however simply authoritative declarations of the eternal connection between right doing and happiness, wrong doing and misery" (Cheyne).
Whereas curses by ordinary persons were considered more or less efficacious--some god being always only too glad to speed them on their way to their destination--yet special persons--"holy" persons--in virtue of their special relation to Divine beings possessed special powers of pronouncing effectual curses on account of their powers of enlisting supernatural aid. Balaam, according to the narrative in Numbers 22, was an expert in the article Balak was convinced that Balaam's curse would bring about the defeat of the Israelites (see Gray, "Numbers," ICC).
The term--and the thing signified--plays an important part in Paul's interpretation of the cross. In the light of the law all men are guilty. There is no acquittal through appeal to a law that commands and never forgives--prohibits and never relents. The violator of the law is under a curse. His doom has been pronounced. Escape is impossible. But on the cross Jesus Christ endured the curse--for "cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree" (Galatians 3:10,13)--and a curse that has overtaken its victim is a spent force.
Curse - Definition and Meaning, Bible Dictionary

Nothing about "bleeding".

Fortunately, the meaning of, 'and her thigh shall rot,' has been interpreted into more modern times linguistics...

Numbers 5:27 New International Version (NIV)

27 If she has made herself impure and been unfaithful to her husband, this will be the result: When she is made to drink the water that brings a curse and causes bitter suffering, it will enter her, her abdomen will swell and her womb will miscarry, and she will become a curse.​

 

[Faun]

That once the baby is conceived it is no longer just her body for the next 9 months

Sent from my SM-G386T1 using Tapatalk

Bullshit. She doesn't give up her body just because she gets pregnant. You're fucking crazy.

She shares it with another human

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That human has no rights to it.

So you admit that some humans (white) are better then others

Sent from my SM-G386T1 using Tapatalk

????? What are you talking about?

Why are you asking him?? Even he doesn't know.​

 

[JOSweetHeart]

Another reason why I am not for abortion is because of the Lord's involvement every time that a baby is created. I believe that he had a hand in that baby's creation and I for one am not about to cheer lead the destroying of something that he himself had a hand in making. How would you like it if something that you made was completely destroyed by another person?

If anyone is selfish, it is you people who think that its okay to do away with a baby so that no one has to deal with it in any way as if its nothing but an inconvenience to everyone. If that isn't a sheer and severe act of selfishness, I have zero idea what is!

God bless you two always!!!

Holly

P.S. And one more thing, playtime. I mean the phrase "God bless you always!!!" every time that I say no matter how you look at it. Why do I say it? Because to me people like you for example only make it as clear as crystal glass that it needs to be said.

Not everyone believes the way you do. In this country, you are free to worship anyway you want, or not worship a higher being at all. To legislate based on religion goes against every principle America was built upon. That's why we have the Separation of Church & State. (the Establishment Clause) I suggest you read Jefferson's letter to the Danbury Baptists.

http://www.usconstitution.net/jeffwall.html

Oh well. There is still no change in where I stand. To me, abortion is a form of murder and it always will be no matter how long it remains legal.

God bless you always!!!

Holly

You're completely incapable of entertaining another point of view, listening to what others are telling you about the folly of your position, and most of all getting past the religious hogwash.

The same thing can be said for you and your ilk. I've read what y'all have had to say to me. Can the same thing be said about y'all? Its obvious that you have no desire to change your mind, so why should I change mine? Don't ask someone to do what you yourself are not willing to do which is why I stand where I stand. If I were in the girl's position, I would not do away with that baby. I would let it be born because I would believe that there is a reason why it came into the picture at all when a conception does not happen every time that a "roll in the hay" takes place.

Just because a person is raped does not give them the right to do something wrong as well by doing away with the baby. Just because one person does something wrong doesn't mean that you have to follow their lead. If you saw someone jump off a bridge, would you jump as well?

I don't have kids and I've never been pregnant because I have yet to jump off of a certain bench, but if my behind was pride loose from it in any way, I would not make the baby pay as well if one were to soon appear. Someone doing something wrong to me would not give me the right to do something wrong to someone else!

God bless you always!!!

Holly

Thoughts and questions on abortion:

WHY…..Do you people insist on pushing for an end to ALL legal abortion? Logic and common sense should tell you that it will not actually end abortion. I have to really wonder what you really believe in and what your true motives are. Is it to be able to claim moral superiority by saying that you are unequivocally against abortion, while being able to avoid responsibility for damage caused by illegal abortions as well as the suffering that results for having children who are unwanted? Or, is it about the control of women and their bodies? I have to suspect that it is, at least in part the later as evidenced by the degree of indifference and even hostility towards women’s needs including but not limited to birth control. You make no sense to me what so ever!
________________________________________________________________________________
I can understand that you believe in the sanctity of human life and that you believe that life begins at conception. You are certainly entitled to that belief, but others do not believe that it is a human life at conception, and they too are equally entitled to that belief. Here is a though. Don’t religious people also believe in the human soul? A spirit that comes from god and returns the heavens upon death? If so, then there really is no death. Can you look at abortion as a means of delaying the transformation of that soul into the physical body until it can make the transition into the world at a better time and in a better place

_____________________________________________________________________________________

Let’s be clear about something. Ending or overly restricting legal abortion will not end abortion and may not even significantly reduce the number of abortions. Rather, it will force the practice back under ground to be performed by the back ally butchers who will endanger women’s health and even their lives, and escape any restrictions on late term abortions which may well increase in numbers

Please understand this. Most people who are pro-choice are not callously pro-abortion. Regardless of ones beliefs about when life begins, we recognize that abortion is not a pleasant or desirable thing. I for one have no problem with overall policies that are aimed at making abortion rare-although I am adamant that they should still be available.

How do we do that? By supporting meaningful sex education and the availability of contraception for starters. Then, by ensuring that women and families are confident that they will have the help and support that they need if they choose to carry the child to term. That would include nutritional and financial assistance, affordable day care, early child hood education, and health care coverage for starters. How about we throw in tax policies that strengthen the middle class and promote job growth. The problem is that too many pro-life conservatives are against all or most of these things and there for they are really just pro fetus and pro birth.

I believe that most pro-choice people would, in turn agree to a ban on late term abortions that are not medically necessary and ensure that the woman is fully aware of all alternatives including adoption. And speaking of adoption, they need to get over the hysteria about allowing gays and lesbians to adopt. They are a valuable resource for children who might otherwise suffer at the hands of a parent who was not prepared to care for them, or languish in the foster care system.

Is it possible for conservative to get smart about this, or will they insist on clinging to absurd positions of just wanting abortion stopped, even in cases of rape, incest or a danger to the mother’s life.? Are you will to come out right now as being truly pro-life, pro women, pro-family and pro children ? If you cannot or will not, but continue to b staunchly anti abortion, you are displaying the very height of hypocrisy.

Another reason why I am not for abortion is because of the Lord's involvement every time that a baby is created. I believe that he had a hand in that baby's creation and I for one am not about to cheer lead the destroying of something that he himself had a hand in making. How would you like it if something that you made was completely destroyed by another person?

Just because a person is raped does not give them the right to do something wrong as well by doing away with the baby. Just because one person does something wrong doesn't mean that you have to follow their lead. If you saw someone jump off a bridge, would you jump as well?

I don't have kids and I've never been pregnant because I have yet to jump off of a certain bench, but if my behind was pride loose from it in any way, I would not make the baby pay as well if one were to soon appear. Someone doing something wrong to me would not give me the right to do something wrong to someone else!

God bless you always!!!

Holly

" Just because" <---- right there says it all. You have no real concern. And saying "God Bless" with every post means nothing when it's just automatic. People say that when someone sneezes.... no real intent behind it. And you can talk the talk of a Christian, but when it comes to walking that walk, you sound so very very selfish. LOL, Try reading a little Matthew 6: 5-6.

If anyone is selfish, it is you people who think that its okay to do away with a baby so that no one has to deal with it in any way as if its nothing but an inconvenience to everyone. If that isn't a sheer and severe act of selfishness, I have zero idea what is!

God bless you two always!!!

Holly

P.S. And one more thing, playtime. I mean the phrase "God bless you always!!!" every time that I say no matter how you look at it. Why do I say it? Because to me people like you for example only make it as clear as crystal glass that it needs to be said.

Not according the the bible. For the church, the fetus does not have a soul till after the third month and the bible does not place value till after the first month of birth.
Birth control and abortions are permitted in the bible.

Jesus did not teach the NT, but rather he was a jews that followed the OT.

You should have more respect for the girl/woman and not on the fetus that is not yet a separate human being. No child should have to go through what she did. Now she is a child caring for a child? How is that fair or logical, or compassionate?

It is still the beginning of another life even if the soul is not there yet and the baby can always be given to someone who wants it if the girl does not. Why should a perfectly good baby be discarded because of how it was created? Erasing it from the picture will not erase its conception from the picture.

^^^ Amen to this. Why should any child have to die because of the way that it was conceived? Pregnancies do not last forever anyways and any child that can be saved should be saved.

God bless you always!!!

Holly

Why should the 11 yr old be forced to risk death because she was raped by a step father?
Why should the spawn of a rapist have more value to any group than the life of the child that was raped? Infant was not conceived in love.
Now you have two tragic lives that should not have had to suffer.

What makes you think that the baby will suffer once its born? How do you know what it won't go to a set of parents that will make sure that it has a great life growing up? Also that girl who was raped could have been killed by her rapist after he was done having his way with her and if being pregnant at all no matter how a female got the way was a real threat to their lives. There would be an abortion every time they got pregnant which would then mean the end of mankind eventually. Also that baby may be a spawn of the rapist, but it is also a part of the girl too. She created it too whether she created it willingly or not. Why should a baby be killed because those who created it do not want it? What if someone else wanted it? Why can't they have it once its born? Its like someone cooking some kind of food that they for one reason or another can not eat for medical reasons. Should it be thrown away because they themselves can not have it? And that right there is just it. We are not talking about a plate of food here. We are talking about another life. Why should it go to waste because those who made it does not want it?

Just because a person is raped does not give them the right to do something wrong as well by doing away with the baby. Just because one person does something wrong doesn't mean that you have to follow their lead. If you saw someone jump off a bridge, would you jump as well?

I don't have kids and I've never been pregnant because I have yet to jump off of a certain bench, but if my behind was pride loose from it in any way, I would not make the baby pay as well if one were to soon appear. Someone doing something wrong to me would not give me the right to do something wrong to someone else!

God bless you always!!!

Holly

Thoughts and questions on abortion:

WHY…..Do you people insist on pushing for an end to ALL legal abortion? Logic and common sense should tell you that it will not actually end abortion. I have to really wonder what you really believe in and what your true motives are. Is it to be able to claim moral superiority by saying that you are unequivocally against abortion, while being able to avoid responsibility for damage caused by illegal abortions as well as the suffering that results for having children who are unwanted? Or, is it about the control of women and their bodies? I have to suspect that it is, at least in part the later as evidenced by the degree of indifference and even hostility towards women’s needs including but not limited to birth control. You make no sense to me what so ever!
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I can understand that you believe in the sanctity of human life and that you believe that life begins at conception. You are certainly entitled to that belief, but others do not believe that it is a human life at conception, and they too are equally entitled to that belief. Here is a though. Don’t religious people also believe in the human soul? A spirit that comes from god and returns the heavens upon death? If so, then there really is no death. Can you look at abortion as a means of delaying the transformation of that soul into the physical body until it can make the transition into the world at a better time and in a better place

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Let’s be clear about something. Ending or overly restricting legal abortion will not end abortion and may not even significantly reduce the number of abortions. Rather, it will force the practice back under ground to be performed by the back ally butchers who will endanger women’s health and even their lives, and escape any restrictions on late term abortions which may well increase in numbers

Please understand this. Most people who are pro-choice are not callously pro-abortion. Regardless of ones beliefs about when life begins, we recognize that abortion is not a pleasant or desirable thing. I for one have no problem with overall policies that are aimed at making abortion rare-although I am adamant that they should still be available.

How do we do that? By supporting meaningful sex education and the availability of contraception for starters. Then, by ensuring that women and families are confident that they will have the help and support that they need if they choose to carry the child to term. That would include nutritional and financial assistance, affordable day care, early child hood education, and health care coverage for starters. How about we throw in tax policies that strengthen the middle class and promote job growth. The problem is that too many pro-life conservatives are against all or most of these things and there for they are really just pro fetus and pro birth.

I believe that most pro-choice people would, in turn agree to a ban on late term abortions that are not medically necessary and ensure that the woman is fully aware of all alternatives including adoption. And speaking of adoption, they need to get over the hysteria about allowing gays and lesbians to adopt. They are a valuable resource for children who might otherwise suffer at the hands of a parent who was not prepared to care for them, or languish in the foster care system.

Is it possible for conservative to get smart about this, or will they insist on clinging to absurd positions of just wanting abortion stopped, even in cases of rape, incest or a danger to the mother’s life.? Are you will to come out right now as being truly pro-life, pro women, pro-family and pro children ? If you cannot or will not, but continue to b staunchly anti abortion, you are displaying the very height of hypocrisy.

Another reason why I am not for abortion is because of the Lord's involvement every time that a baby is created. I believe that he had a hand in that baby's creation and I for one am not about to cheer lead the destroying of something that he himself had a hand in making. How would you like it if something that you made was completely destroyed by another person?

Just how evil is your Lord that that you think he had a hand in a son-of-a-bitch raping his 10 year old step-daughter?

The Lord is the reason why the baby came into the picture, not the rape. A baby is not conceived every time that anyone has sex.

God bless you people and that girl always!!!

Holly

That's the beauty of choice. You get to choose not to have an abortion. What you don't get to do is make that choice for others.

I don't remember saying that I do get to make the choice for others.

Another reason why I am not for abortion is because of the Lord's involvement every time that a baby is created. I believe that he had a hand in that baby's creation and I for one am not about to cheer lead the destroying of something that he himself had a hand in making. How would you like it if something that you made was completely destroyed by another person?

Just how evil is your Lord that that you think he had a hand in a son-of-a-bitch raping his 10 year old step-daughter?

If anyone is selfish, it is you people who think that its okay to do away with a baby so that no one has to deal with it in any way as if its nothing but an inconvenience to everyone. If that isn't a sheer and severe act of selfishness, I have zero idea what is!

God bless you two always!!!

Holly

P.S. And one more thing, playtime. I mean the phrase "God bless you always!!!" every time that I say no matter how you look at it. Why do I say it? Because to me people like you for example only make it as clear as crystal glass that it needs to be said.

Bless your heart.

Let me get this right you want a innocent baby murdered and yet you think God is evil?

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She said she thinks the Lord had a hand in that girl getting raped, not me.

If you are referring to me, that is not what I said. I said that the Lord is the reason why the baby was created. A baby is not created every time that a rape or sex at all happens.

God bless you always!!!

Holly

Bless your heart. THAT baby was created as a result of a rape. If your Lord had a hand in it, he had a hand in the rape.

That may be but a baby is not always created when a rape act happens or when people have sex at all for whatever reason. It took my parents three years to have my older sister and ten years to have me. My mom did not get pregnant every time that she and my dad had their sexual moments together. I do have one question for you though. If how you currently think is how you are going to continue to think, do you think that God still has a hand in a rape act even if a baby is not conceived?

God bless you and my mom always!!!

Holly